Topic: OP+ shiplist 1.21 released. (Read 33003 times)

DestinyCalling · « **Reply #220 on:** April 07, 2003, 06:14:44 pm »

Sorry, I wasn't being so accurate......

What I meant was, I CANT GET IT IN THE UK (Anywhere).......

Hey, I wonder if I can borrow a copy from someone????

Julin Eurthyr · « **Reply #221 on:** April 07, 2003, 06:16:50 pm »

On Drone reloads & Taldren Conversion:

From what I've gathered, all ships can have up to 5 reloads per rack. The "default" load, and the 4 purchaseable "reloads" in the shipyard. Due to being primarily Plasma, I can't recall the exact count.

The reason behind the doubled reloads is to counter the doubled internals.

On the shiplist, my understanding of the "rack informaion" (2xDro-A 1, 3xDroB-2), translates to:
# of racks on hardpoint, rack type, number of "free" reloads every mission.

So, for "doubled internals", giving a "2" for reloads = 2 free reloads (doubled the original "max" capacity of a one-reload rack), and giving a "4" for reloads = doubled the max capacity of a 2 reload rack. If there were a way to make the slow-> medium -> fast upgrade (for default drones) "free", and charge a lot (say 1000 pp) per rack reload, we could keep ships to their "SFB" reload count except for those wiling to pay an arm and a leg...

FireSoul · « **Reply #222 on:** April 07, 2003, 06:33:11 pm »

..
.. no.. I disagree.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #223 on:** April 07, 2003, 10:17:23 pm »

Quote:

Hey Nomad,

.. think it's acceptable to change the X-ships from G-racks to B-racks? The Xships have more drones per reload. As long as the ADDs are still present, it could do the trick. .. or how about a 3rd reload? (I'm not counting the last reload of ADDs only. That's taken up by the added ADD racks.)

-- Luc

Thanks for the clarifications -- I wasn't thinking straight about Plasma-D, or I would have realized it doesn't work the same as drones in SFC. I'm still fuzzy on actually using drone reloads from cargo in battle, having not actually played SFB in a long time. However, it is stated for the drone D-rack magazines that even while one magazine (of 3) per rack was being fired, the other ones could be reloaded. So, without actually READING the rules (yeah, that's too intelligent a thing to do!), I guess reloads are allowed as long as you're not firing that rack for a turn. Regardless, it just doesn't work the same here. The drone boats that actually had tons of reloads can't be given the same amounts in SFC, while the ones without the extra storage can have more than they deserve. I guess it balances out due to how well droners flip hexes in D2, but it's not much comfort for match play.

About the Xes and their drone racks, the actual racks are GXes. Since they hold more drones, the best approximation I've seen is a B-rack plus ADD12.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #224 on:** April 07, 2003, 10:26:42 pm »

I could almost buy the doubled internals requiring doubled reloads, but then the reloads can be purchased by ANY drone ship. A Klingon D7 with A-racks prior to Y175 can have 4 reloads even though it should only have 1 reload (loaded drones plus 1 reload). Even doubling the reloads, you get 1 base load plus 2 reloads. That means they can get between 2x and 4x the reload drones they should according to SFB.

So, since it is the way it is, added to the fact that in D2 buying reloads and supplies is a PRESTIGE TRANSACTION, not a BPV modifier (no way for the game to calculate adjusted BPV for mission matching -- it just looks at BPV, not BPV + reloads + better fighters + etc. -- the best that can be done is a reasonable approximation that stays standard across the board. At least SFB provides a guideline for that, even if it's not really applicable to the different platform. At the very least, fixing them all to SFB specs makes sure they only get the free reloads they should. The poor AI, on the other hand, can't buy reloads.

See? I said it was a jumble.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #227 on:** April 07, 2003, 10:40:06 pm »

The ADD rules from Captain's Basic Set (G-rack ADDs are different, as stated earlier):

E5.71 Reloads
All ships equipped with ADD racks have two complete sets of reloads for the rack ...

Also:

E5.74 Reloading
One, two, three, or four anti-drones can be loaded on each ADD rack each turn, but only if the rack is not fired during that turn ...

Similarly:

FD2.421 (subsection under Reloads)
Up to two spaces of drones can be loaded on a given rack during a single turn, provided that the rack is not fired during the entire turn.

FD2.43 Stockpile
All ships are presumed to carry one complete set of reloads ...

Oh, and in case anyone cares, there are also ADD-30s, which are used by starbases and battle stations. Any approximation of this approaching 30 rounds must be from multiple ADD racks, which means the bases can fire more ADDs at once, but won't have them for as long, since they are using them simultaneously.

The point is, though SFC is not SFB, as it is now the shiplist is not standardized. At least FS is making an attempt to do that by using SFB as a guideline.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #231 on:** April 08, 2003, 06:26:55 am »

OP D2 is actually working better now than ever before, using the latest server kit. Try out Badlands or, even better, check out RazalYllib's "Strife" server when it goes live.

Tumulorum Fossor · « **Reply #232 on:** April 08, 2003, 07:56:04 am »

I've moved off of EAW and firmly onto OP. FireSoul's shiplist accelerated that migration for me personally. I am encouraging some SFB friends of mine to do the same.

You should be able to get copies of OP for ~$10 at lots of places.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/stores/offering/list/-/B00005JD51/all/ref=dp_pb_a/002-4550448-5548830

or

http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?cgiurl=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Fws%2F&krd=1&from=R8&MfcISAPICommand=GetResult&ht=1&SortProperty=MetaEndSort&query=orion+pirates

Cheap. Readily available. Step up from EAW at this point, given stability of new D2 code, and more patches are on the way.

In FireSoul's words:
> > > > > > OP has some things EAW will never have.
> > > > > > 1- xships.
> > > > > > 2- Maulers
> > > > > > 3- More pirates, if that's important, and engine doubling.
> > > > > > 4- my shiplist.

> > > > > > 5- a better AI to play against.
> > > > > > 6- a more stable game platform (not counting the online D2)**

**and that D2 code has improved recently, and is expected to be further improved soon.

-TF

FireSoul · « **Reply #233 on:** April 08, 2003, 03:42:24 pm »

Someone once told me I wasn't the "savior of OP".
... well.. I'm not.

But I will do my damnedest to make this game as good as it gets.. It's the closest thing to an entertaining SFB-like game I have ever seen, and a lot of people WILL AGREE.

.. stay tuned.
-- Luc

Braxton · « **Reply #234 on:** April 08, 2003, 04:59:44 pm »

I love playing OP. It has those things that EAW will never have. You can play 16 differents Empires/Cartels. Plus with the EAW campaigns available for OP it makes everything better.

FireSoul · « **Reply #235 on:** April 09, 2003, 03:34:28 am »

For the interested, here is the compare.txt between shiplist 1.21 and the current unfinished work:

http://pet.dhs.org/~firesoul/sfc2/shiplist/compare_200304090430.txt

No ETA yet.
-- Luc

Tumulorum Fossor · « **Reply #236 on:** April 09, 2003, 06:52:41 pm »

Hmmm.... Luc, are you sure about the "being able to get drone reloads out of cargo mid-battle" thing?

I have to dig out my SFB stuff (yes, post Doomsday) to check, but as I recall, the cargo-based drone reloads were for playing a series of scenarios with the same ship. That is, to allow a ship to reload for another scenario after depleting its drones in a previous scenario, and that the rules explicitly state that those drones are inaccessible during a scenario.

But I could be VERY wrong here. That's just what I recall.

-TF

FireSoul · « **Reply #237 on:** April 10, 2003, 01:36:07 am »

Can someone find the rule?

Rod O'neal · « **Reply #238 on:** April 10, 2003, 01:54:19 am »

Ships in SFB can have extra drones in storage equal to the capacity of their drone racks including all reloads. These drones can be purchased as commander's options before the scenario starts. This "drone storage facility" is not on the SSD and does not take damage on the DAC. It is destroyed with the last excess damage hit. Drones are automatically loaded from there to the drone reload racks. If the ship has drones stored in cargo boxes, like drone ships and some carriers, then the "drone storage facility" is automatically replenished from the cargo boxes. So, in effect, all the drones are available during a scenario. Although the drones are transfered from these locations at different rates. The reason for all the semantics with where they are stored is because they are "explosive ordnance" and have special transfer rates and rules. I don't see any way to recreate this drone storage/cargo capabilities in SFC.
I don't know if it's already been mentioned or not, but I read where some differences in x-ships had been noted. I didn't notice anyone mentioning that x-batteries hold 3pts. of power each and x-ships also have a "natural" EW advantage +2pts. ECCM, and 2 het bonuses (Orions have 3). If it's already been mentioned sorry for repeating it.
Actually, almost every system on x-ships is different/improved. Most of which isn't reflected in SFC. Although, the BPV's are the same. This has always bugged me, but I don't want to rant

FireSoul · « **Reply #239 on:** April 10, 2003, 04:00:07 am »

I thought it didn't make much sense to state "drones cannot be reloaded from cargo" if they can be stored and reloaded from any part of the ship.

Thanks Rod.

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Topic: OP+ shiplist 1.21 released. (Read 33003 times) var addthis_config = {"data_track_clickback":true};

DestinyCalling

Julin Eurthyr

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jdmckinney

Julin Eurthyr

jimmi7769

jdmckinney

FireSoul

FireSoul

Scipio_66

jdmckinney

Tumulorum Fossor

FireSoul

Braxton

FireSoul

Tumulorum Fossor

FireSoul

Rod O'neal

FireSoul

Topic: OP+ shiplist 1.21 released. (Read 33003 times)