Topic: SFCX OP Campaign: Your Thoughts? (Polls) (Read 12157 times)

jdmckinney · « **on:** March 23, 2003, 10:04:26 pm »

I haven't discussed this with the rest of the SFCX crew yet, but we have been considering starting a campaign soon now that we seem to have a test server kit that improves hex defense value behavior. So, I thought I'd ask for some feedback before we get too far in our planning.

First, would people prefer to use the stock Taldren shiplist, or FireSoul's OP+ Shiplist?

Second, would you like victory conditions with points for territory growth and planet captures, or a simple non-VC invasion campaign?

Third, would you like teams or a free-for-all?

Any other feedback outside of these questions is welcomed.

Shiplist?
Taldren stock shiplist
FireSoul's OP Plus Shiplist

jdmckinney · « **Reply #1 on:** March 23, 2003, 10:04:47 pm »

jdmckinney · « **Reply #2 on:** March 23, 2003, 10:05:19 pm »

jdmckinney · « **Reply #3 on:** March 23, 2003, 10:08:03 pm »

Oh, here's one more question, though I think it will depend more upon what custom missions are ready when we roll out:

Should we use Taldren missions only, Taldren and "Evil Dave" missions, or "Evil Dave" missions only?

Dizzy · « **Reply #4 on:** March 23, 2003, 11:13:10 pm »

damnit jd, I KNEW you would pull this [censored].

Get in line and take a number.

FireSoul · « **Reply #5 on:** March 23, 2003, 11:39:01 pm »

Please note:

We want information on buggy Taldren missions!
.. playing with ED's missions will.. well.. obscure that a bit, non?

-- Luc

FPF_TraceyG · « **Reply #6 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:00:06 am »

Hey there JD, is this the series of mini-campaigns Mog was telling me about? Tides of War?

CptCastrin · « **Reply #7 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:11:00 am »

Quote:

damnit jd, I KNEW you would pull this [censored].

Get in line and take a number.

Diz, chill out.

We have no intention of introducing anything "in between" or durring the current scheduled SFC2 server campaigns. Nomad is only looking for input.

Geeeez.

FPF_TraceyG · « **Reply #10 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:32:10 am »

Regarding the SFC2 campaign schedule, the only reason why there aren't any OP campaigns listed, is because none were in the works. So, just to reassure you then, OP is not being ignored at all, and in fact, many are looking forward to a major OP campaign now that the patch is out.

Cleaven · « **Reply #11 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:49:13 am »

Sorry, I voted for stock plus ED missions, forgetting that you need info on stock missions. Best to stick with the stock missions. I think that an early shift to OP+ is a good idea though, and keep it as a standard, which is why I haven't tried the OP test server yet (I have to go back to stock ships).

As for the map, just keep minimal neutral hexes so we don't have to go stir crazy doing miles of solo hexes.

Fluf · « **Reply #14 on:** March 24, 2003, 01:06:10 am »

Go for it guys! We could use a good OP campaign. I was thinking of putting up one myself, but with all the D2 campaigns and working on the next LB3 for the D3, I dont think I could manage it right now. I voted for the Stock Taldren missions too, just for testing only to check the new server kit. Lets take baby steps with this thing. We can work the rest of the missions and shiplist in later. Lets find out what works right first. Then go from there.

FireSoul · « **Reply #15 on:** March 24, 2003, 01:10:04 am »

well.. me..
.. I just want to be able to help fix the damned thing.

-- Luc

ZTempest · « **Reply #19 on:** March 24, 2003, 01:26:28 am »

Dizzy, Dizzy, Dizzy.

At least you brought out a chuckle or two.

First off, YOU do not determine what does or does not happen in SFC D2. If someone wants to put up a D2 OP server, you can't stop them.

Secondly, stop with the profanity. I don't like it, never have. It is something that people have warned you about before. I don't appreciate it, and I don't want to see it. Take a deep breath, and if you can manage to make a post without the acronym vulgarity, then do so.

You are quickly pushing me into wondering if this game is worth playing anymore, if this is the attitude that characterizes your group, and the philosophy behind your campaign. Sorry. Had to say it. We are all ambassadors of goodwill and those of us who plan these campaigns do it for the benifit of the community, not to fight amongst one another.

The OP DV issue is workable. We need to test it some more...but our initial impressions (and most of us are in the testing group, incidently) have found that the DV might just be able to work correctly. The fixes have to take place in the map design phase from what I understand, and maybe some server side stuff as well. Nomad and Castrin are smarter on those sorts of issues in SFCX than I am.

In any case, get a grip, please.

Dizzy · « **Reply #20 on:** March 24, 2003, 01:31:05 am »

I see you are in san antonio TX as well.

Lets meet at Sarritas and settle this with an arm wrestle fight. Best 2 out of 3.

I'm very serious. If the OP D2 DV is fixed, I'll take SG3 there in a second. But its not so I wont.

And ya, ZT, I remember trading emails with you and our hydran RM roles on the RT servers, but you dont know why I'm taking this to the next level. And it isnt you.

ZTempest · « **Reply #24 on:** March 24, 2003, 02:01:59 am »

Heh.

Well, your position is stated quite well.

Look, I am not even sure what this issue is about anymore. Is it an EAW vs OP thing, or do you have a problem with Nomad testing the waters?

Read my last post, Dizzy. I am not the bad guy here. I even support SG3. If you choose not to host it, then so be it. Your choice. It is a free country. Getting a slot for JD's server by making you mad enough not to host SG3? LOL! How amusing! If there is an OP server put up....why does it have to revolve around whether or not there is an SG3?

I told you before....SG3 is not being threatened. Put your server up....we will all have fun on it. We might run a fun Op server as well. Is there anything wrong with that?

And who made you god of the D2? Anybody with a computer can run a server as far as I know. Shoot. I could even run a server if I wanted to. You do not have a monopoly on what does and does not happen there. I imagine that you want to run SG3 for the same reasons that other members of this community that take the time to design and run these campaigns -- because it is fun and sort of cool. It is not about power or control -- we do this for fun....or at least I do.

And, like most other senior NCOs...I take my coffee black, no sugar. Cream is for....heh. Almost broke my own rule.

Dizzy · « **Reply #25 on:** March 24, 2003, 02:07:18 am »

This thread has now possibly passed the point of comical, I hope, and real progress can now be made. Wait. What was that you said about my mother?

Mog · « **Reply #27 on:** March 24, 2003, 05:11:23 am »

Doug, Castrin, Zach, I've sent you all an email with my thoughts on what to try.

Dizzy, you don't feel threatened by a test server do you? What with this, and your petty little argument with Herr Burt about who decided to use Tholians first, it's becoming more and more obvious that you're on an ego trip here. If you want to boot me off your SG3 team for saying this then go right ahead.

As for whether OP D2 works or not, there's only one way to find out, and if the only players who help are the ones who only have OP, then so be it. Any who help will have my gratitude, as ever since OP was released it has been my favourite game of the series, and to hopefully have a resurgence in its popularity makes me happy.

Can-able · « **Reply #28 on:** March 24, 2003, 06:10:25 am »

Dizzy

I just feel that i have to say this to you ...... STFU you ego maniac !!!!!

I am amazed at how self inmportant you think you are...... For god sake grow up...

Please remove me access to you SG3 server team forum, i can't be arsed to ever read [censored] by you any more, i once though hay he is funny..... I liked the agro you caused people...But this is petty...and just you wanting to be self important.

You shore you are a grown adult or you a 5 year old kid....I am never shore with the way you act.

Also i have 2 Weeks of work and 3 spare servers to build...Hummm...Might just host at the same time as SG3

My point being is YOU could not stop me......

And if you keep shouting ya mouth and acting like you own the D2 i might just do it out of spite, becuse thats the kind of person i am.

GL with SG3 and have fun...just stope being a prick !!!

I read the thing about you thinking you where the first to use tholians as well and well No they where in SFB first, and every one has been trying to get them in to this game for ages, So you did NOT come up with the idea.......

EDIT : Thease are my thoughts NOT SFCX !!!! mine all mine

IndyShark · « **Reply #29 on:** March 24, 2003, 07:05:54 am »

I'd love to see a new OP campaign. Bring on the OP+ shiplist and EvilDave!

jdmckinney · « **Reply #30 on:** March 24, 2003, 08:07:16 am »

Wow. I post some polls to see if people would like certain things done in an SFCX OP server under a test kit, and it becomes a Dizzy hate thread? Thank you to all who actually discussed the topic.

Dizzy, I don't know why you seem to be dead set against the SFCX group even hosting a server. Even if you have a problem with me or one of our group members, why do you think it affects you if we host a server? Certainly, I'm not out to torpedo SG -- I'm not even aware of anything about it other than a name and that it seems to be in the final planning stages. Seriously, I don't read EAW campaign threads, and haven't for some time. I don't play EAW campaigns (not enough time), so I don't read threads about them. If someone asked me about SG, I'd guess it was an EAW campaign run by Dizzy that is due out "soon," though I would also have wondered why it's taking so long to get started, since it seems to have been in planning for some time now. I really don't know anything about it, and don't really care. I also have not even glanced at this supposed "schedule" that seems to exist (I didn't know about it until I read this thread).

"Coming soon" means "coming soon." There is no target date, though I generally like to get things done ASAP. In my experience, it tends to take between 2 weeks and 3 months to plan, test, and begin a campaign, depending on how complex the VCs and map design are. I even mentioned in an email to the SFCX crew we could conceivably get something running by the weekend -- but I didn't realistically expect to be able to roll out by then. We usually take a few weeks to get things done, due to people's schedules, time for planning/design/testing, etc.

So, would I push to roll out a campaign during SG's run (or any other campaign, EAW or OP)? Yes, because we have been waiting for a usable OP D2 for a year, and we've waited long enough. This test server kit seems to give us workable DV changes for the first time since OP was released. We have a kick-butt custom shiplist the community enjoys. There are custom missions for OP now. With a working D2, what is left to test and wait for? Testing can basically happen during campaigns, as long as people understand that we might find more bugs.

Dizzy, you do what is best for you and your players -- if that means getting a copy of the OP test kit and making SG an OP campaign, then great! If it means sticking with a proven platform and running it on EAW, then that's great, too! I hope and expect you'll get a lot of players, except of course for those who hate you enough to avoid anything your name is attached to -- though I bet most people are indifferent and just want a good campaign.

I personally don't care how many people play on an SFCX server. If it's more than 1 per empire, then that would be cool. If not, at least we would have offered OP players something.

If someone could give me a clue as to how many players the EAW servers have been drawing at peak hours, I'd appreciate the insights. I really don't know if there are enough for even one campaign, or enough for a dozen. Are campaigns using a player limit of 32? 48? whatever? Are they getting filled at peak hours? Also, are there still more EAW diehards than people who would consider playing OP?

The bottom line for me is OP needs to be played, or it won't get further fixes -- there's no need to fix it if nobody will play it. SFCX has been wanting to do a number of OP campaigns for the past year and been unable to do so thanks to the D2 bugs. If someone asks us to wait, I'll tell them I'm sorry, but we won't let others dictate our schedule. We were more than giving in our delays when there were 3 competing OP campaigns, plus EAW ones, and we tended to get pushed back and back until there wasn't a game left to host. While I think schedules are a good thing, I don't think anyone or any group has the right to dictate when the other admins can or can't host a server, or what form it should take.

Dizzy, if you want to continue your flames, please start a new thread for it. Our plans don't revolve around you, and we don't answer to you. If you insist on seeing us as enemies or competition, then that's your problem. I'm more than willing to work with or talk to anyone who wants to see OP become the game it can be and serve the players.

One last thing: Castrin has said it before, and I think it's true: ALL servers should be "FUN" servers. Regardless of what level of VCs or rules are used, if they aren't fun, they're just a waste of time and effort. We'll make whatever sort of campaign we feel like making, and either people will have fun or they won't go there. "Fun" doesn't mean trivial, second-rate, or filler. At least, it doesn't to me.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #31 on:** March 24, 2003, 08:28:34 am »

So, with that out of the way, where were we?

Oh yes, the polls. So far, with just a dozen-ish people weighing in, it looks like folks want:

1. OP Plus Shiplist
2. Capture/expansion VCs
3. Teams of empires
4. Combination of Taldren and ED missions

Thanks for the feedback, and keep it coming.

Tracey, and anyone interested, here's my take on ToW. First, it's SFCX's grand campaign project that was originally devised to try to work around the OP D2 issues. We were going to have mini-campaigns that would reflect various theatres of war at different times, some running at the same time. This way, we could get a number of players for any given race/team represented by not having all empires available in every installment. We could also manage OOB and VCs better with many smaller-scale campaigns that contributed to the larger whole than with one giant open map campaign that runs for a month or more. Short, focused campaigns would keep the DB from getting too messy over time, would force people to concentrate on their VCs right away, and would allow us to squeeze minis in between larger campaigns if people wanted to participate in both.

We let that plan sit on the back burner due to the buggy OP D2 and the fact that many SFCXers were testing SFC3 last summer/fall.

We would like ToW to be a real SFB-type campaign, with its own custom shiplist based directly on SFB material (no invented ships, many corrections to stock shiplist errors, playable Tholians, Andromedans, WYN, and LDR depending on the mini theatre, etc.). The timeline would roughly use the SFB History of the General War as a guide to major events, but it would be allowed to take its own path independent of this history. Hopefully a couple or a few admins could participate by hosting some of the mini campaigns. Players would sign up for their teams, but be allowed to change empires within that team. Team leadership would help us install an order of battle. Volunteers would help police the rules/behavior. Tactical leaders would be free to take control of war plans, though they would also be responsible for reporting VCs or making sure their players do.

This is our current vision of a grand-scale OP campaign. We're not ready for it yet, but if OP holds up under the strain for a couple of campaigns, we could very well start ToW this summer if all the pieces fall into place. Then again, I said that last year, and we never got past the idea stage.

Can-able · « **Reply #35 on:** March 24, 2003, 09:21:22 am »

Firesoul

As long as the Real File name's of the SCR files (Mission names) are on a test server , then i can't see why you can do you script info gathering with ED missions as well , as long as people only know to only reports things relating to the Stock missions.

2 servers is a good idea though

EmeraldEdge · « **Reply #36 on:** March 24, 2003, 09:27:00 am »

Or perhaps a smaller scale campaign first, then once the data is collected, got with another that includes the ED missions.

FPF_TraceyG · « **Reply #37 on:** March 24, 2003, 09:28:42 am »

JD, I'm sure I speak for everyone in saying this. We ALL support OP. We all want to see it work. And furthermore, we all want to see some really good campaigns being played. However, we all have to get along, and I would ask you to reconsider your stance on ignoring everyone else's wishes. Please read the campaign schedule at the top of the D2 forum. The people who have been working on these campaigns have done so arduously and with great effort and time. It is unreasonable to undermine the playerbase and force people to choose between major campaigns as I have outlined in earlier posts. OP and EAW are virtually the same game and I see no reason for rivalry between the two. Cooperation is the key here and if we don't all get along, then we are shooting ourselves in the foot. I cannot stress this enough. Now that the OP patch is out, yes, we'd like to see some OP campaigns in that schedule. But work with the rest of us. Anything else is untenable and not only unfair to the players, but also to the server admins as well. Please don't bully your way and do what you like. I have already discussed with members of SFCX how best we can fit some OP campaigns into the schedule to benefit everyone for the greater good of the community. So please talk to them, in particular Moggie. We want to see everyone gets a fair go and equal treatment. Thankyou.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #39 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:05:48 am »

Tracey, I'm not trying to be advesarial about scheduling. Dizzy is acting like his usual self, and I wanted to lay out all my cards. I have no hidden agenda or desire to step on people's toes. However, I won't lie and say what's not true. Since the days of Rook's Tavern, SFC2.net has had a strong lineup of campaigns that, if we always deferred to them, or Slave Girls, or Triangle, or whatever, would have kept OP without an in-depth tactical campaign for a long, long time. We have tried to get into coordinating schedules in the past only to get put off indefinitely while others fall behind in their timeframes.

The fact is we've championed OP since day one, when most people badmouthed it or gave up. Even when we couldn't do all we wanted to, we still were working behind the scenes to keep OP alive. Why should we let someone else who wasn't there in the trenches with us dictate what we do? If we put up a server now, it will be to test the limits of the test kit while giving OP players a chance to play the game again. I don't see why that can't be done while other campaigns are happening, since ours would not be as intensive a VC campaign, and would not require the same level of commitment from players.

I'm tired of people inventing competition and conflict where there is none. If there are players for the servers, then shouldn't we give them choices? How is the community served by having only one "serious" campaign at a time? If someone doesn't like that campaign's format, they get left out in the cold.

As I said, I'm all for working with other admins, but I don't and won't promise to stick to someone else's schedule that has no input from us. That's just me. The rest of the SFCX crew will probably have more say in the design and running of any campaign we do than I will, and it will be up to the group when and how we run campaigns. If they all feel we can do our thing while working from a schedule that includes EAW and OP campaigns, then I'm all for it. I just don't want to put off what we want to do simply to keep the Dizzies of the world happy, because the truth is they won't be happy anyway.

Tracey, you don't know me, and I don't know you. All I want is to be taken at my word. I am not in competition with anyone here, and wholeheartedly endorse any campaign that comes along, because the more that are run, and the more players we have, the longer this game will survive and even flourish. I still have not looked at any schedules, and nobody from the SFCX group has mentioned any dates or proposals to me at this point. When they do, I will give my input and help the group with whatever it decides.

If you would like to discuss scheduling or plans for D2 in more detail, feel free to email me (if my profile doesn't have my address, let me know). Otherwise, I'd like to get this topic back on course and find out what the players' feedback is for anything we might or might not decide to do.

CptCastrin · « **Reply #41 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:07:16 am »

I'd just like to say that "comming soon" means nothing in terms of when we'd run a campaign. If anyone tries to read into the "comming soon" statement that we are going to try and userp a planed campaign's time slot they are saddly mistaken.

It's one of the founding tenants of SFCx that we are here to help (by hosting files, support tools, promote cooperation, orhelp coordinate) ALL campaigns that are in D2 (and to a degree D3) as best we can. Frell look at our site, most of the recent posts have been on EaW campaigns, and none of them ours.

Diz, your fear that a SFCx will try and take SG3 time slot can be put to rest. There is no intent to do so and if anything I will be sure that it doesn't happen (and I DO have that power). Certainly I'm sorry that you took Nomads "comming soon" statement out of context but you really should be less defensive about this. We are all here for one reason and that's to try and have some fun and make it fun for others in EaW and OP.

Now a quik note about those servers that are "listed" on SFCx:

Badlands - has been a non-serious campaign server and will continue to be. Yes, there were plans at one time to make it serious but those were moved to ToW (some what). Very soon the SFCx test server will be replaced with Badlands and it will use the OP+ shiplist and ED missions (when released).

Rook's Tavern 4 - in theory this is a major campaign but work on it was stopped because of the OP DV problems. There are no current plans to revive it but we hold the option open if we feel that it can be done justice to (considering the name and history of RT).

Tides of War - was and still is our "big" campaign that in theory will encompase several servers. It was originally intended to address the severe short commings of OP D2. I think that mostly our work will focus on this however I don't feel that we'd be ready for even a beta server for a few months and given the current schedule I don't see a need to hurry. I'd rather get it right then rush to get something up, especially when there is no immediate need.

There, all our current cards are on the table. Tracy feel free to contact me with any questions on times / dates (not that we have any right now) and I'll be sure to keep SFC2.net in the loop. Could you email me so I have your addy? Mine is linked above (cptcastrin[2]pegicorn.com) or is that below? Don't know anymore with this new board.

Thanks for all the input guys please add your comments or vote on / in the polls that Nomad put up.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #42 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:15:15 am »

One more thing: I can't "bully" people into doing anything. I don't host any campaigns on my own equipment. I don't even decide how SFCX chooses what it wants to do. I'm not in charge, and I am not in the business of insisting that it's my way or the highway. Please refrain from characterizing me as a bully or troublemaker when you don't know the story. If you want cooperation with people, I suggest treating them with respect.

Please understand that I've been in the business of keeping SFC going for a long time now, and I have the utmost respect for anyone who helps improve the games or host servers. Your contributions to the community have been above and beyond the call, and I thank you. Hopefully we will have a chance to work together in the future.

FPF_TraceyG · « **Reply #43 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:47:16 am »

Thanks JD, I agree with everything you've said there.
The server schedule doesnt actually belong to anyone, not SFC2.net or GFL or anyone in particular.
Its the product of a democratic process where many people discussed various issues and interests. Its not set in stone, and it certainly isnt held as a monopoly by anyone in particular and, anyone who wants put up a campaign has the right to do so. Its the beginning of an orderly process by which all of us can coordinate together to bring the best of campaigns to the D2. Now, with the OP patch out, we need to take that into consideration and start working in some OP campaigns. I am all for seeing a major OP campaign soon, its been too long between drinks as they say. The task then is not so much whether or not we can accomodate that, but how. I appreciate your past problems as you describe of campaigns being put off etc. and I'm sorry to hear things havent worked in the past. I'm confident, however, that we can overcome that and ensure everyone gets a fair deal. Personally, I don't want to see OP have to wait 6 months for a major campaign as the above schdule suggests, and various good ideas have been put forward on how we can get an OP campaign up soon, without stepping on toes, as you say. I might add, this democratic scheduling is something that we, as a community, are doing together, and that means all of us. No one is more important than anyone else, and we all have the same goal, to have fun playing a game we all love. There arent any bosses here, just indians. I kind of like that way... lol!!
Feel free to add me to your MSN contact list if you use MSN.

FPF_TraceyG · « **Reply #44 on:** March 24, 2003, 11:22:21 am »

JD, I apologise if I characterised you 'as a bully. My comments were reffering to actions only.
Castrin, Can-able (who I have on my MSN contact list), I agree with all there as well.
I think we're batting on the same team here, I dont see it as being a big problem to incorporate OP campaigns into the larger scope of things. All we have to do is sit down and work out how to do it.
Please dont give up and say its too hard. One thing everyone agrees upon is our playerbase needs to be accomadated for. I think, that with all our combined efforts, we might see that player base expand, however, all I'm asking is that we conduct things in an orderly fashion. Yes, we want an OP campaign up soon as possible, and I thank the SFCX team for all the hard work they are doing and plan to continue to do. No EAW campaign is going to undermine an OP campaign, and I'd like to think the converse is also true. Unto that end, we will find a way to accomodate the needs of both games, thanks to the legacy, as you say, left behind with us by Interplay. I, myself, am looking forward to playing on a major OP campaign, and I'm sure many others are as well.
So, lets return this thread to its original purpose, and get some feedback on what we'd like to see in an OP campaign and when we have an idea of how to implement that, we'll find a way to see it happen. I'm sure we can come up with something that we're all happy with. Again, please add me to your MSN contact lists, thankyou, chat is much easier medium to discuss things with.

Mog · « **Reply #45 on:** March 24, 2003, 11:58:34 am »

Now young lady, didn't I tell you to get to bed? Instead, you're still up, posting away. Well don't blame me for you being cranky at uni :P

FPF_TraceyG · « **Reply #46 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:00:15 pm »

LOL!!!

jdmckinney · « **Reply #47 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:32:36 pm »

Tracey, at this point I'll beg off adding you to a contact list -- my wife might kill me if she saw that sig and that I was chatting with you.

Seriously, I really just want feedback about what sort of campaign people might like to see as a first "return engagement" to OP from the SFCX team. ToW is down the road quite a long way. While testing the new kit is a prime concern, I want to see an OP campaign people can have fun with. Castrin has said Badlands will return as a non-VC server on OP. I think that may help serve as a testbed. Most of all, I'd like to see if a decent, if scaled back, OP campaign can survive under the new kit. I think it can, but before we pull out all the stops, a first run needs to happen.

I understand from Moggy that the player base really can't handle more than one big campaign at a time. While I hope that doesn't remain the case for too much longer, I know it means there will need to be some give-and-take to keep everyone somewhat approaching happy. I endorse any scheduling effort made, but I do want OP to be a part of the plan, and not an ugly cousin. It has the potential to be great, and I think the people who shelled out for OP and got shafted the past year and a half deserve a place to play. Let's work together to get the best possible playerbase we can for both platforms.

ZTempest · « **Reply #48 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:43:43 pm »

I will add my endorsement right next to Nomad's.

SFCX was founded on a basis of cooperation and goodwill -- we support all three games, incidently. We have even ran two major SFC3 campaigns (Assimilation and Praxis Redux) and have a presence in the D3 as well as the OP and EAW D2.

There is no wish to undercut anybody or any campaign in this game we all play, but as Doug said, many players shelled out money for OP, and they have been deprived of a decent place to play for over a year now. It is time to see if we can finally unleash some of these great plans we have on the burners.

And Tracey, I would like to also state that although I am a minor member of SFCX (I do planning, storyline, and some other stuff -- I don't run any of our servers) if you need something or think I can assist you or your group with an issue, feel free to contact me. I can't add you to my contact list either (my wife is INCREDIBLY jealous, and Koreans can have a nasty temper LOL

) but I can be contacted through any of the SFCX guys or here.

Regards,

Zach
"Tempest"

Maxillius · « **Reply #49 on:** March 24, 2003, 12:50:45 pm »

I used to only play OP. I only went back to EAW because of the RP threads for AotK. As for gameplay... ick, I wish I'd've stayed with OP. I just gave up on Herr Burt's server. I don't think things are going to change much as it's only supposed to go for 2 weeks. So, as far as any OP server goes, count me in!

FireSoul · « **Reply #50 on:** March 24, 2003, 01:59:44 pm »

http://klingon.stasis.ca/OP_plusrefit/

jdmckinney · « **Reply #53 on:** March 24, 2003, 03:05:19 pm »

FS, I'm sending you a question about a broken firing arc in OP (LWX). Forgive me if my ignorance is a waste of your time, but I wanted to ask how you dealt with it.

Now, back on topic, people still seem to want a fairly full-fledged VC campaign with teams, the OP+ list, and a combination of missions. Does anyone have a preference for teams (empires only)? I'm thinking a 3-team setup would be nice, splitting it so that each team has one drone and one plasma race, but then where do the Hydrans and Lyrans go? Frank opinions are welcomed, but don't expect the SFCX crew to follow the majority rule.

Also, it now looks as if Tempest, Mog, and Emerald Edge will be leading the charge to come up with a campaign design for our first full effort under the new patch. Castrin, Capt. Stumpy, Can-able, and I will all have our say, but those three guys seem to be putting forth the most effort right now. I'll leave it to Tempest to fill you all in when we have a story to tell.

Mog · « **Reply #55 on:** March 24, 2003, 04:00:10 pm »

Diz, you want to move it to OP, absolutley no problem with me. In fact, you'd save me a load of bother

jdmckinney · « **Reply #56 on:** March 24, 2003, 04:07:22 pm »

Diz, did you not get the gist of all the above posts? We want MORE servers, more admins, not fewer. The only reason SFCX appears to corner the market on OP D2 is because everyone else essentially gave up on it. JS had the Triangle there, plus you had SG, followed by another SG that several current SFCXers worked on to help Max Torps. Outside of those and RT, I'm not sure of any other regular recurring campaigns.

If other admins like you come back to the OP fold, then we wouldn't be hard pressed to push something out just to fill the void. By all means, take center stage. We have other things to do. But, that doesn't mean we won't put up campaigns just because you get your shorts in a bunch.

Really Diz, why do you seem to feel like we're all out to get you? Personally, I think you're quite valuable to the community, even if you leave a poor taste in most people's mouths.

Why don't you ask Taldren or a tester to get you the test server kit for 2.5.3.8? Then you can evaluate it for yourself while you still have time to change gears to OP.

Can-able · « **Reply #57 on:** March 24, 2003, 04:26:38 pm »

Dizzy

Stop taking Amphetamines they screw ya mind , make ya Paranoid !!!! Trust me i am a Doctor !!!

Cleaven · « **Reply #58 on:** March 24, 2003, 04:29:47 pm »

I assume that most people realise that OP-D2 is "still broke", just maybe not as much as before, but probably still unplayable in the EAW-D2 sense. Until the D2 patch appears I suspect that modifed missions may be the only way to get something happening on the devils own two layer map. But we need to see the results of stock mission tests first before letting the coders loose on the OP missions. Until then I don't see a campaign being possible.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #59 on:** March 24, 2003, 04:36:07 pm »

Cleaven, have you been on the SFCX test server under 2.5.3.8?

In short, it handles DVs much better, and does not seem to have nearly the amount of problems with the cartel/empire interaction. It may not be perfect, but we can at least see hexes boosting when they should and empires not actually hurting themselves when the cartel layer is neutral under their space.

Try it out.

kosh2000 · « **Reply #60 on:** March 24, 2003, 04:38:26 pm »

Not every one who has op has eaw vice verse so why should they have to wait. There is a soild op base just like eaw has a soild steady player base and i know a bunch pepole that would move back from sfc3 in a heart beat to play on the op d2 .As far as not having a enough pepole to go around start pushing the campaigns all over on sfu and here and other forums there will be more than enough to go around when i ran triangle 2.0 R.T 3.0 was in full swing and there was a eaw campaign going on to and i still had a soild 35 pepole on 75% of the time.

CptCastrin · « **Reply #66 on:** March 24, 2003, 08:35:30 pm »

Btw Diz, do you have the newer OP server kt? it was just ok'ed for general use by Dave and you can grab it here:

http://www.sfcx.org/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=viewdownloaddetails&lid=43&ttitle=SFC:OP_Dynaverse_Server_Kit

Try it out.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #67 on:** March 24, 2003, 09:09:13 pm »

I'll be deleting this thread tomorrow morning, because it obviously has become more about Dizzy's problems with me and others than about actually helping the community. In the meantime, I would like to say a few things.

First, Dizzy, nobody usurped Rook's Tavern from you. A number of people, mainly RMs, were told by Rook that he would be stepping away from hosting. Before he made that decision, some people were approached about helping him to design the next RT. Some of these people ended up on the RT3 team, others came into the team other ways. Specifically, Castrin had been hosting a server, and showed not only an interest in continuing the RT tradition, but a willingness to use his own equipment and resources to do so. Max Torps was also considering picking up the RT name. How Castrin inherited it I don't know -- I always thought Max preferred at the time to stick with his own plans, but you'd have to ask Max about that.

Regardless, Castrin ended up with Rook's OK to use the RT name, and some of us joined the team because we wanted RT3 to live up to Rook's reputation for groundbreaking campaigns. We very seriously considered inviting you, Dizzy, to join us. We discussed it looking very frankly at what good you could bring to the team vs. the flame wars that usually got attached to your name, whether you started them or not. In short, you were potentially more trouble than we thought you were worth to the team. Were we wrong? Maybe, but here we see that even after all this time, you hold unfounded grudges, tear into people with no concern for THEIR feelings, and generally attract a negative air to anything associated with you.

I'm sorry if our decision not to include you hurt you that much. I certainly didn't think you were so mortally wounded by it. In fact, I thought when you went on to do Slave Girls that your ideas were great strides forward in campaign design. I didn't agree with all of them, but you were among those admins who were trying new things to make the game better. We all learned from each others' experiments, or at least I hope we did.

I'll say again, and it's true, that I have not paid one bit of attention to the plans for the latest SG server. I had no knowledge of the schedule that people have been talking about. I simply wanted to get feedback from the players on what they might like to see from SFCX on OP, and suddenly the thread degenerated into fits and accusations.

I'll also say again that I would welcome a move to OP for SG. It's where SG started, and I think it should continue there.

For me, I'm only still here to try to make the OP D2 playable, fun, and deep. I think we are approaching the day when that will be true. The rest of the SFCX team shares that goal, that dream. Most, even all, of us would have given up on SFC at one point or another if it had not been for the rest of the group pushing us to keep going, to keep trying to find ways to earn the game the respect it can live up to given a chance.

Dizzy, you are a lightning rod, and that won't ever change. You DO leave a bad taste in some people's mouths, because they can't stomach your style and persona. You invoke bile, and sometimes it's pretty foul. You aren't the first person on these boards to cultivate a reputation for being harsh and even heartless toward others, only to then play the victim when you feel the least bit slighted. I'm sorry if our "snub" hurt you, and still does, but I can't do anything more to make things right with you. Someday you will have to forgive us for it, or you won't. It's your choice. If you want to move forward in goodwill, we will be there with you, despite our differences, for the good of the players and the game. If you prefer to turn your back on us and blame us for an old wound forever, then we can only go our separate ways and pay you no heed. We can't continue to be adversaries, because we just don't hate you that much. So, either we become allies, or we become indifferent towards you. Either way, we will continue to work on campaigns for the players.

Respectfully,
Douglas McKinney

PS to the SFCXers: I'm sorry if I spoke for you out of turn. Feel free to correct me if my reading of the group's feelings on this are wrong. Either way, I speak for myself, and I stand by my words and actions.

Cleaven · « **Reply #70 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:31:08 pm »

I also hope that an effort can be made to use DV steps of 1, and ownership of hexes changing at zero DV so that the D2 will work in a similar way to that experienced in EAW-D2. This gets rid of hex sniping rules etc.

Dizzy · « **Reply #71 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:32:10 pm »

already talking to castrin about it cleaven...

Kroma_BaSyl · « **Reply #72 on:** March 24, 2003, 10:38:03 pm »

Dizzy, Dizzy, Dizzy.....you can't seriously think I was trashing you with the "like stink on sh*t" thing.....your coffee and cream analogy was a Dean Martin straight line begging for a Jerry Louis comeback if I ever saw one.

I wasn't even sure you where serious about all this crap (and the whole Tholian thing), but couldn't for the life of me figure out why you were being so hardcore about the whole thing. That is until you explained yourself, and now while I understand you were serious I find it hard to sympathize. One reaps what one sows.

Having gotten to know you a little better corresponding about SG3 I have continued to note your improved attitude as of late, but you have to realize that just because you have decided to clean up your act as of late you can't expect everyone to forget your past just like that. Heck anyone whose tag line is STFU ought to realize that he is going to have a bit of baggage to carry around even if he is truly reformed. It's just going to take a while through continued good behavior before you undo the poor first impressions that have been made.

I for one commend you for trying to mend the fences and think the best thing you could do to undo others impressions of you is to bring out a fun server that is free of flames instigated by you (Let me a DH handle that), Besides the whole idea of being worried about who is going when seems kind of ridiculous considering all the dead time that usually ends up between servers, since they inevitably run in to various delays getting off the ground. Thus I would think that reasonable adults should be able to find a way to get them all scheduled in a timely fashion.

Sleep on it and comeback with a cooler head tomorrow, as I would sure hate to see SG3 sh*t canned cause it is looking to be a way cool server EAW or OP.

Love,
Kroma

PS, If you do leave can I have STFU? I would henceforth then be known as "STFU Kroma".....hmmmm....that doesn't sound as good out loud as it did in my head. Sounds too much like my old ladies pillow talk.

Dizzy · « **Reply #75 on:** March 25, 2003, 12:59:21 am »

Until I am apologized to, they wont hear an apology from me.

FireSoul · « **Reply #76 on:** March 25, 2003, 03:22:16 am »

Enough.

I don't want to hear any apologies. I want the matter to be dropped.
Commenting further is pointless.

.. IT'S JUST A GAME. .. and all the work we ALL have done has been for JUST A GAME.

Get some perspective:
I'm currently recovering from stress and depression, away from work.
My father's body can no longer recover from his heart attacks. He visits (via ambulance) the hospital 3 times a week to stabilize him.
My Grandmother is slowly deteriorating via cancer.
My SO, the mother of my month-old son, said this to someone ELSE on irc:
"Sleep well my love..sweet dreams. Ack! 2am...I should go to bed..docs appt tomorrow"
The landlord is coming by with inspectors tomorrow (today). She decided that she's gonna sell the place.
I'm not collecting enough insurance money to pay for rent and eat. I have to beg off of other people.
It's 4:30am.

GET OVER IT.

-- Luc
FireSoul

Can-able · « **Reply #77 on:** March 25, 2003, 03:22:27 am »

Dizzy

I will be the first then ....I AM SORRY for telling you to STFU

Also i belive you should be the first to say sorry to Doug, espesilly Doug there is not need for the way that you have attacked him.

So please do not verbaly attack my friends, i m very protectve over them

Also thy don't have a lead long enough to keep me under control

And i just want you to know that SFCX is not just the RT3 team, orignalley when we first formed it was the SG2 team and the RT3 team and Kosh as well (He was invited

) So don't blame SFCX, And don't blame the individules, for the past....Becuse i can throw things at you about you actions as well mate.

And Dizzy I always belive what you did with SG was amazing......I allways did

I thought you did a grate job in the develpoment.

News:

Topic: SFCX OP Campaign: Your Thoughts? (Polls) (Read 12157 times) var addthis_config = {"data_track_clickback":true};

jdmckinney

jdmckinney

jdmckinney

jdmckinney

Dizzy

FireSoul

FPF_TraceyG

CptCastrin

CptCastrin

ZTempest

FPF_TraceyG

Cleaven

ZTempest

Dizzy

Fluf

FireSoul

ZTempest

Dizzy

FPF_TraceyG

ZTempest

Dizzy

ZTempest

Dizzy

Dizzy

ZTempest

Dizzy

Cleaven

Mog

Can-able

IndyShark

jdmckinney

jdmckinney

FireSoul

FireSoul

jimmi7769

Can-able

EmeraldEdge

FPF_TraceyG

Kroma_BaSyl

jdmckinney

Can-able

CptCastrin

jdmckinney

FPF_TraceyG

FPF_TraceyG

Mog

FPF_TraceyG

jdmckinney

ZTempest

Maxillius

FireSoul

Kroma_BaSyl

FireSoul

jdmckinney

Dizzy

Mog

jdmckinney

Can-able

Cleaven

jdmckinney

kosh2000

Corbomite

Cleaven

CptCastrin

Dizzy

CptCastrin

CptCastrin

jdmckinney

Dizzy

Dizzy

Cleaven

Dizzy

Kroma_BaSyl

ZTempest

Topic: SFCX OP Campaign: Your Thoughts? (Polls) (Read 12157 times)