Topic: Quebecan Sepertists want to leave Canada and join the US.

[knightstorm]

Japan would have conquered China and most of the Pacific pretty much unopposed as only Britain and Holland would have been involved in any millitary resistance.

Without the US, Japan would never have received commodore Perry's convincing sales pitch, would have been opened to Western innovation, and it would have been conquered by European colonial powers.  You can speculate any scenario.

[Brush Wolf]

Japan would have conquered China and most of the Pacific pretty much unopposed as only Britain and Holland would have been involved in any millitary resistance.

Without the US, Japan would never have received commodore Perry's convincing sales pitch, would have been opened to Western innovation, and it would have been conquered by European colonial powers.  You can speculate any scenario.

I have doubts about Japan being conquered without Perry. Their staying in isolation would mean they would not be ready to defeat Russia at Tsushima.

[knightstorm]

Japan would have conquered China and most of the Pacific pretty much unopposed as only Britain and Holland would have been involved in any millitary resistance.

Without the US, Japan would never have received commodore Perry's convincing sales pitch, would have been opened to Western innovation, and it would have been conquered by European colonial powers.  You can speculate any scenario.

I have doubts about Japan being conquered without Perry. Their staying in isolation would mean they would not be ready to defeat Russia at Tsushima.

European powers spent the ninteenth century carving up the rest of Asia.  If Japan hadn't opened up and embraced the modern world the way it did, I have little doubt that it would have shared the same fate.  Either way, your post illustrates the real point I was trying to make which is that with a French victory in the French and Indian war, there were too many variables for us to really speculate.

[Brush Wolf]

Japan would have conquered China and most of the Pacific pretty much unopposed as only Britain and Holland would have been involved in any millitary resistance.

Without the US, Japan would never have received commodore Perry's convincing sales pitch, would have been opened to Western innovation, and it would have been conquered by European colonial powers.  You can speculate any scenario.

I have doubts about Japan being conquered without Perry. Their staying in isolation would mean they would not be ready to defeat Russia at Tsushima.

European powers spent the ninteenth century carving up the rest of Asia.  If Japan hadn't opened up and embraced the modern world the way it did, I have little doubt that it would have shared the same fate.  Either way, your post illustrates the real point I was trying to make which is that with a French victory in the French and Indian war, there were too many variables for us to really speculate.

I think there would still have been a United States but without a Louisiana Purchase. This would have limited expansion to a bit less than 1860. There would have been no 1st Minnesota to blunt the Confederate attack on Cemetery Ridge on July 2, 1863 giving much needed time for reserves to come up. Even after taking 83% casualties on the 2nd the 1st Minnesota was present for Pickett's Charge on the 3rd and captured the flag of the 28th Virginia Infantry. 

[Fedman NCC-3758]

I actually like the idea.   Ponder the possibilities.    It would make a great place to build liberal interment camps and being in Quebec, the libs wouldn't even notice.

They'd think they were in an enlightened socialist utopia.   

[knightstorm]

I think there would still have been a United States but without a Louisiana Purchase. This would have limited expansion to a bit less than 1860. There would have been no 1st Minnesota to blunt the Confederate attack on Cemetery Ridge on July 2, 1863 giving much needed time for reserves to come up. Even after taking 83% casualties on the 2nd the 1st Minnesota was present for Pickett's Charge on the 3rd and captured the flag of the 28th Virginia Infantry.

But if you remove the Louisiana purchase, you remove one of the major causes of the war, namely the dispute over the development of the territories.

[Don Karnage]

*Going back in time and changing the time line*

El fourreur (rbo)

 

[Brush Wolf]

I think there would still have been a United States but without a Louisiana Purchase. This would have limited expansion to a bit less than 1860. There would have been no 1st Minnesota to blunt the Confederate attack on Cemetery Ridge on July 2, 1863 giving much needed time for reserves to come up. Even after taking 83% casualties on the 2nd the 1st Minnesota was present for Pickett's Charge on the 3rd and captured the flag of the 28th Virginia Infantry.

But if you remove the Louisiana purchase, you remove one of the major causes of the war, namely the dispute over the development of the territories.

The slave/anti-slave issue would have blown up even without expansion. It just might have happened later.

[knightstorm]

Most Northerners at the time of the civil war really didn't support emancipation.  The war really arose from a dispute over whether to develop the territories as cash crop based/slavery economies which were more favorable to Southern interests or food crop based economies which were more favorable to Northern ones.  There was also the issue of the South which had been the most powerful section of the country experiencing a decline in its influence as the massive influx of immigration which disproportionally affected the North caused them to fall behind in the house of representatives, while most of the new territories not being particularly favorable to cash crop agriculture caused them to fall behind in the senate.  The last straw was the 1860s presidential election where Abraham Lincoln was elected without any Southern votes.

[Age]

If Quebec became independant from Canada what would happen to Nova Scotia though?? They would have to travel through the seperated Quebec province to reach the rest of Canada.

Would Quebec revert to its original name before the 7 Year War of "New France"??

If George Washington hadn't started what became the 7 Years War and if the 25 minute long "Battle Of Quebec" had gone the other way so that the British lost a whole more more than General Wolfe and 40 other casulties (French casulties were in the thousands due to the British using of cannister shells and rapid fire well aimed double shot musket volleys into the charging and subsequently fleeing French troops), The United Staes would never have existed as France would have subsequently been in a very strong position to annex the English colonies there.

North America would have been a large French speaking country, most likely called "Greater France".

World history would have been a whole lot more different.

Britain would have most likely sided with German in the 1st World War. The Nazis would never have existed and millions of lives would not have been lost in World War 2 as it would not have happened.

Japan would have conquered China and most of the Pacific pretty much unopposed as only Britain and Holland would have been involved in any millitary resistance.

The Soviet Union would have easily annexed a larger part of Europe or all of it.

The United States has had such a major part in shaping world history that having it replaced by a weaker enitity would have changed everything in a detremental way.

This is probally giving Fedman and a few others nightmares....

The problem is that Quebec doesn't speak the same dialect as France does it is more Anglo than anything else even peoples names are different  for eg. Mario Lemieux and Guy Lafleur are both Anglosized names.You wouldn't find them in France.

[Panzergranate]

The same could be said of the differences between the original Castillian Spanish and the Latin Spanish in South America or the differences between American English and the original English (with the correct spellings).

English itself is an everchanging conglomeration of various languages. Mainly it comprises of mainly 70% Saxon, 10% Gaelic, 10% French (thanks to the Viking invasion from Normandy via William the Conquerer in 1066) and a 10% mixture of other languages including Nordic, Hindi, Chinese,Spanish, Italian and Latin.

Unlike other languages, English tend to readily adopt more useful words from other cultures and languages, including grammar occasionally. It does make it more difficult to learn because of the numerous and strange grammar exceptions to the rules.

It lacks the handicap of pointless "male" and "female" nouns and verbs that plague some other languages due to English's ancient Gaelic foundations.
 
English is the only language that uses the very useful concept nouns of "It", "That" and "Thing". Try completing a day without using any of these words to realise just how useful they really are in preventing longwindedness in simple conversations....

American "Wilsonised" English with its simplified "bad" spellings does address some of learning barriers but also annoys the hell out of us true English speakers.

The two explainations / excuses I've heard are that (A) it was revised in order to make English easier to teach to children and non English speaking immigrants or (B) the US didn't want any written or printed words that looked French hence the dropping of the letter "U" and the reversing of all ""RE" ended words to "ER" or (C) it was to annoy the British.

[knightstorm]

Actually, the differences in British and American English really date back to the revolution.  Noah Webster wrote spellers which were used in American schools in the late eighteenth and early nineteenth century.  Eventually he wrote his great dictionary of American English.  He was a devoted nationalist, who viewed many of the spelling conventions of British English as tools of the old world aristocracy.  As a result, we speak the true English, while you continue to speak the slave tongue thrust upon you by the nobles.

[Hstaphath_XC]

“English doesn't borrow from other languages. English follows other languages down dark alleys, knocks them over and goes through their pockets for loose grammar.”  ― James Nicoll

 

[Mentat Jon]

I guess our freinds in Quebec have not been watching the news lately,why would they wish to hook their wagon to a nation who is but a whisper from becoming the next Western Roman Empire? stay with Canada,stay with the Queen,you will be better off..