Topic: Sci Fi Poll 20: Khan vs Shakespear. (Read 6996 times)

Sirgod · « **on:** June 19, 2011, 12:29:21 am »

This one will be tough my friends, But what better way to vet out our trek films, than by putting the two best against each other early on.

Star Trek II: the Wrath of Khan (1982) http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0084726/


Star Trek 2: The Wrath of Khan Trailer

vs.

Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country (1991) http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0102975/


Star Trek VI - The Undiscovered Country - Trailer

Stephen

Lieutenant_Q · « **Reply #1 on:** June 19, 2011, 12:41:14 am »

Khan all the way. A Shakespeare quoting Klingon doesn't stand a chance.

762_XC · « **Reply #2 on:** June 19, 2011, 01:51:33 am »

ST VI was probably the second best of the lot. But ST II of course was the best.

FoaS_XC · « **Reply #3 on:** June 19, 2011, 02:50:23 am »

THIS is TOUGH!

my two favorite ST movies (nick meyers was the best thing to ever happen to Star Trek, I maintain).

I love where Khan went as a character. I love the sacrifice of spock (nevermind ST3, blech). I like that a lot of the characters started to feel old, even if they weren't quite there yet. Worn out would probably be a better term. I love how the end was a bit of a rebirth for Kirk "Young, I feel Young!". and who can forget the battle of the Mutara Nebula.

ST6, the characters weren't only feeling old, but they were actually old. Dignified, still, but old. I like that this film really hit home with the political ramifications of the crew's actions. It felt like the-larger-than-the-crew was at its largest. The humor wasn't over done, and added to the movie instead of distracted you from it: "1 day, 1 night, *skick* kobayiashi maru." But I feel like Kirk evolved as a character more in this film than in Wrath of Khan. Hate to faith is a bigger transformation than Feeling old to feeling young.

From a design and asthetic standpoint, neverminding that they were made a decade apart, I actually feel like that the biggest difference is in the design of the bridge set. In that biggest difference ST6 wins, hands down. As far as the rest of the sets? ST6 still wins: Compare the Regula station to the Qonos One's interior, for example.

From a perspective of impact of mythos. Personally, for my own version of Star Trek (cut out the useless fat!) - ST6 made a greater impact there, too.

It's very very close, but I gotta give it to ST6.

Brush Wolf · « **Reply #4 on:** June 19, 2011, 08:54:54 am »

ARRRGGGHHH! Where is the third option, both? Well, if I really have to make a choice I will go with VI. In VI we get a few glimpses of Sulu as a Captain. along with one of the better trek quotes.

Captain Hikaru Sulu: In range?
Helmsman Lojur: Not yet sir.
Captain Hikaru Sulu: Come on, come on.
Helmsman Lojur: She'll fly apart!
Captain Hikaru Sulu: *Fly her apart then!

Grand Master of Shadows NCC37385 · « **Reply #5 on:** June 19, 2011, 09:13:46 am »

Kaaaahhhhhhnnnnnn!!!! (I had to do it).

The best part of VI was the part where Kirk kicked the alien in the...knees. It still comes in second in my book. You have to take movies as a whole instead of claiming its greatness by a few one-liners.

Andromeda · « **Reply #6 on:** June 19, 2011, 09:56:31 am »

The third option? I can think of two. First, don't vote between them. Second, pick ST:IV as your favourite of the films.

I have to tell a Kadh story here. He went to se TWoK with friends and somehow one of them entirely missed the "Wrath of Kahn" part of the title. He describes the great dramatic moment of Kahn taking off his helmet and revealing himself to Kirk and Kirk gasps 'Kahn'. At the same time, in the same tone, the friend says the same line. Dramatic moment gone, the entire theatre broke out laughing.

I like both of these movies.
Kirk shows himself to be a great captain still in II. I remember hating that they killed Spock and saying that the third movie would have to find a way to bring him back. I liked the changes in Kahn from superman to madman, with a very good reason for it.
VI had a great new villain, but why did he have to quote Shakespeare instead of some great Klingon poet. Sulu as captain was awesome. I think he would have been the great basis for a series, in the vein of Picard later. VI really was their final hurrah and I think we all knew we were saying good-bye to them then. It was a fitting tribute.
In the end, I am more willing to sit and watch II again than VI. So I voted for Kahn.

Grand Master of Shadows NCC37385 · « **Reply #7 on:** June 19, 2011, 10:14:31 am »

taH pagh taHbe'!
[universal translator] My Hamlet sucks, must pay mother back for the money I wasted on acting lessons! [/universal translator]

TAnimaL · « **Reply #8 on:** June 19, 2011, 12:21:42 pm »

As noted, a very tough choice, but I second all of what FoaS said - in ST6 the crew was older, more evolved, more nuanced. They seemed like they had actually had lived their lives between films... Had to go wtih ST6 on this one

FPF-Tobin Dax · « **Reply #9 on:** June 19, 2011, 12:38:46 pm »

I went with Khan. Tough pick as mentioned. Why not seed the star trek movies like star wars was.( episode 1 vs 4)Week versus the strong. Pit star trek 2 versus 3, 4 versus 6. eliminate the pretenders first.

star trek 2 is my fav, then 6 and then first contact.

knightstorm · « **Reply #10 on:** June 19, 2011, 12:42:21 pm »

This is a really tough one. P. Diddy isn't going to try to kill me if I don't vote right?

EschelonOfJudgemnt · « **Reply #11 on:** June 19, 2011, 02:04:51 pm »

Both of these movies were directed by Nicholas Meyer. Coincidence???

He also wrote the screenplay for Star Trek IV...
(Thanks Knightstorm!)

This is a very close one for me also. I'm already on record as saying I like VI more, but STII brought us the phaser buzzsaw effect that hasn't been seen since. It needs to be!

Both of these movies had some nice plot twists, although I think II had the more interesting ones. VI had some truly classic one liners, though...
"What IS it with you, anyways?!?"
"If I were human I believe my response would be 'go to hell.'... If I were human. "
"I've been dead before."
"I'm going to sleep this off. Please let me know if there's some other way we can screw up tonight."

Not to mention that dude I consider as the most outstanding looking Klingon... whom doesn't seem to have many pics via google...

http://www.digitalheroes.com/StarTrek/Movies/Quotable/default.asp?itemName=Quotable+Trek+Movies

Nicholas Meyer also brought us Invasion Of The Bee Girls, but I think we can forgive him for that...
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070222/

knightstorm · « **Reply #12 on:** June 19, 2011, 02:11:56 pm »

Quote from: EschelonOfJudgemnt on June 19, 2011, 02:04:51 pm

Both of these movies were directed by Nicholas Meyer. Coincidence???

He also directed Star Trek IV...

No. He wrote the screenplay for ST IV, Leonard Nimoy directed it.

Nemesis · « **Reply #13 on:** June 19, 2011, 04:52:36 pm »

No question of it. Khan for the win.

Kreeargh · « **Reply #14 on:** June 19, 2011, 10:48:07 pm »

I see Trek in 2 ways NBC trek and the orignal. Trek2 Khan is to me NBC trek fist fight battle . I vote Trek Shakespear not for the content but for the internal battle Kirk has to deal with.

FCM_SFHQ_XC · « **Reply #15 on:** June 20, 2011, 12:16:06 am »

Evil! This is a tough one, they almost tie... ST II for a slight edge but no doubt both are spectacular.

Age · « **Reply #16 on:** June 20, 2011, 02:32:29 am »

It is deadlock for me as I like them both actually I like all of the TMP of the Kirk era.

FoaS_XC · « **Reply #17 on:** June 20, 2011, 03:20:49 am »

V didn't bug me as much as it seems to have bugged others. Technical stuff aside, it actually gave me a bit of interesting perspective in my early years.

Lono · « **Reply #18 on:** June 20, 2011, 04:37:43 pm »

Quote from: Nemesis on June 19, 2011, 04:52:36 pm

No question of it. Khan for the win.

This!

I could watch this movie every day for the rest of my life and STILL love it.

"I've done far worse than kill you, I've hurt you. And I wish to go on... hurting you..."

- My favorite taunt sound file substitution ;-)

Age · « **Reply #19 on:** June 20, 2011, 08:01:43 pm »

Quote from: Captain Adam on June 20, 2011, 02:43:23 am

I agree with Age, all the TMPs are great, with the exception of STV, that was just plain ole awful...

Adam

I actually liked it because it shows great shots of the Enterprise-As interior and the ship it self.

Julin Eurthyr · « **Reply #20 on:** June 20, 2011, 10:38:53 pm »

I'll say this...

VI is probably the better movie when you go looking for all the different "movie" things...
II is probably the best ever 2 hour "episode" of TOS...

Since I fell in love with the episodes first, movies second, I picked II...

EschelonOfJudgemnt · « **Reply #21 on:** June 21, 2011, 01:31:33 pm »

Slightly off topic here, but I've been watching B5 again over the last few days, and have come to a conclusion.

Walter Koenig was massively underutilized in the Trek Franchise. Of course, with Shatner & Nimoy getting most of the attention, that was bound to happen.

Koenig's potrayal of Bester in B5 was dead on IMHO...

Not suprised to see TWOK edging out TUC. Both films were brilliant. I wish that the further adventures of Captain Sulu had went somewhere, though...

Sirgod · « **Reply #22 on:** June 21, 2011, 01:47:36 pm »

When I was younger, Chekov was one of my Favorite cast members also. If you get the chance, check out Shatners "Raw Nerve" with Koenig as his guest. It is a real eye opener.

Stephen

Nemesis · « **Reply #23 on:** June 21, 2011, 04:30:42 pm »

Quote from: EschelonOfJudgemnt on June 21, 2011, 01:31:33 pm

Walter Koenig was massively underutilized in the Trek Franchise. Of course, with Shatner & Nimoy getting most of the attention, that was bound to happen.

Koenig's potrayal of Bester in B5 was dead on IMHO...

I'm quite fond of Koenig's portrayal of Bester myself but remember as Chekov in the 1960s he was relatively new to acting. As Bester add 30 years of seasoning and he should be better.

762_XC · « **Reply #24 on:** June 21, 2011, 11:47:21 pm »

Slightly OT, does anyone know why they dubbed Star Wars blaster SFX in for the phaser shots in the TWOK trailer?

(And why phaser is not a word in our forum spellchecker?)

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Topic: Sci Fi Poll 20: Khan vs Shakespear. (Read 6996 times) var addthis_config = {"data_track_clickback":true};

Topic: Sci Fi Poll 20: Khan vs Shakespear. (Read 6996 times)