Topic: Is this game still played?

[FPF-DieHard]

back from the dead, well just visiting anyway.   Don't feel like reading a zillion old posts, somebody tell me in a nutshell what's going on with SFC.

[marstone]

In a nutshell. Lots.

[knightstorm]

Well, I guess the two biggest developments at the moment are the dynaverse.net marketplace, and the 4.1 shiplist.

[FoaS_XC]

Or what about the fact that EAW is being worked on?

[Roychipoqua_Mace]

Tholians (with working webs), plasma bolts, Orion option mounts, and a disable option for doubled internals have been added in the past couple weeks.



In the world of standard multiplayer skirmish players, most of the Gamespy Arcade players have moved over to GameRanger, which is a lot nicer. It looks like it might hold over GSA (I think it's been a couple months and people seem to be on it way more than GSA).

[LordSaxon]

Hey Diehard nice to see you.

[ShadowDiver]

Tholians (with working webs), plasma bolts, Orion option mounts, and a disable option for doubled internals have been added in the past couple weeks.



In the world of standard multiplayer skirmish players, most of the Gamespy Arcade players have moved over to GameRanger, which is a lot nicer. It looks like it might hold over GSA (I think it's been a couple months and people seem to be on it way more than GSA).

Also I might add a lot of folks are using TeamSpeak 3 more then ever...but IMHO if we could get them to use TS2 here on dynaverse we might just keep the whole package together...

[FPF-DieHard]

Well, I guess the two biggest developments at the moment are the dynaverse.net marketplace, and the 4.1 shiplist.

4.1  Shiplist?  Firesoul Sanctioned or something different?

[FPF-DieHard]

Or what about the fact that EAW is being worked on?

This has been worked on for well over a year, any real progress?

[Bonk]

Or what about the fact that EAW is being worked on?

This has been worked on for well over a year, any real progress?

Work started 2010-12-27. Not a day sooner. That is only three months ago. Not three years ago. I had nothing to do with the "SFC4" announcement and still push hard that we never use that name, partly for that reason. There is real progress, but no vista fix as yet - the vista problem has not been found. There is no single piece of the code that says, fix me!

You will be interested in some of the information released here: http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163391245.0.html

Worst case: we never identify the Vista issue. I have a solution for that. Browser based dyna - add hooks needed to launch meta missions from the command line as for tcp direct games and a result report mechanism, there done. (and you should see the new oci - slick) BUT I want to spend more time on trying to find the issue with the existing dynaverse client. Dave and I are digging for it tenaciously.

[Riskyllama]

4.1  Shiplist?  Firesoul Sanctioned or something different?

firesoul's thread http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163390750.0.html
bonk' has a team working on the EAW front and is sounding positive,
most of the diehards (pun intended) are still lurking about
and the store means that we aren't just shrinking anymore

[FPF-DieHard]

4.1  Shiplist?  Firesoul Sanctioned or something different?

firesoul's thread http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163390750.0.html
bonk' has a team working on the EAW front and is sounding positive,
most of the diehards (pun intended) are still lurking about
and the store means that we aren't just shrinking anymore

I read up on 4.1, could be interesting.

Where are the details on EAW?  The Vista/Windows 7 incompatibility killed this game more than any Fed/Kling flamewar ever could.

What's this store you speak of?

[knightstorm]

What's this store you speak of?

Legal copies of EAW and OP now available for purchase and download.

http://www.dynaverse.net/market

[Bonk]

Where are the details on EAW?

Here's the part you will be interested in (selected notes from Dave's revisions - though we are now trying to focus on vista as mentioned):

Code: [Select]

============================================

Bug fixes
---------

Fixed fighter bug where it would ignore other threats to
charge off and attack shuttles/fighters - now makes
decision based on relative ranges and threat

Dynaverse/vista compatibility improved somewhat
- currently improved stability, but not entirely reliable and not pvp tested

New features
------------

Added an sfc.ini setting to turn planet collisions OFF (collisions on by default)
- to set this, in sfc.ini file under the secion [UI] add this line:
PlanetCollision=0 to turn it **off**
(if set to 1 or the line is not present then planet collisions are on)
- means ships fly 'through' planets (rationalization is that you're
actually flying across the surface, though some of the camera
angles don't look that way)
- allows the planet to launch ftrs, pfs, drones, plasma
- also allows the planet to use transporters and short range weapons
against ships that are flying across it
****MULTIPLAYER WARNING****
***I still need to add the multiplayer/server versions of this setting***
(currently you need to trust that everyone you're playing with has it set the same)

Added an sfc.ini setting to enable "SFB mode" (off by default):
- to set this, in sfc.ini file under the secion [UI] add this line:
SFBMode=1 to turn it on (if set to 0 or the line not present then SFBMode is off)
- uses SFB style internals - e.g. 12 internals now can
destroy 12 systems, not the SFC-style 12 'half hits'
- uses SFB seeking weapon speeds: 32 for plasma, 8/20/32 for drones
- uses SFB photon ranges/to-hits (no more magic photons)
- cuts shield regeneration to about 2/3 of current pace
- mines last up to 100 turns instead of 10
- dropped mines are invisible except to the person who dropped them
(mines placed by transporter are still visible to everyone)
- set the hardcoded years so early era starts in 2256 instead of 2263
(the year Kirk meets the Gorn and the Organians)
  Note: if you use this you should add 7 to the yfa/yla entries in your shiplist!
****MULTIPLAYER WARNING****
***I still need to add the multiplayer/server versions of this setting***
(currently you need to trust that everyone you're playing with has it set the same)

Numerous AI improvements
------------------------

When deciding to launch drones, the ai now considers
what direction the target is travelling - not just
what speed!

When deciding to launch plasma, the ai now estimates chance
of a hit on the actual plasma speed (used to assume plasma
travelled at speed 40, and figured launch was ok as long as
plasma at that speed would do at least 20% of its potential
damage - led to many wasted plasma shots)

When deciding to launch wild weasels ai now considers its speed,
facing, and the relative position of the seeking weapons it is
fleeing - less likely to weasel when it would probably outrun
the weapons anyway

Altered ai weapons fire so it is less likely to waste a weapon
beyond its effective range

Significantly increased chances ai would use its pseudo-plasma
if one were available

Added officer quality for ai officers
rookie 5%, junior 20%, senior 50%, veteran 24%, legendary 1%

Ai now less likely to overkill a target if weapons en route
already have high chance to kill it

Tweaked tbomb and hit-and-run officers to cut down on out-of-range strikes

Added some variability to when ai launches fighters

AI weapons officer should now place greater emphasis on hitting
weak or down shields rather than strong ones

Filled in the captain personalities - Taldren supplied a framework
but never implemented the personalities, now captains have a
bell-curved random personality defining anger, nervousness, resolve,
willingness to sacrifice ship, and aggression

When picking tactics and objectives the ai no longer single-mindedly
picks capture/destroy, now it looks at the mission objective,
the relative strengths of the ship/target, and the health of the
ship and target to pick between capture/destroy/defend/disengage,
and to pick between overrun/snipe/standard combat

When re-assessing offense/defense/navigation priorities and a desired
closing range, the ai now doesn't just randomly pick a close range,
it looks at racial armaments of itself and the opponent, the mission
objective, the relative strength and health of the ship and target,
and the personality of the captain

Greatly tightened up formation keeping - how close they'll
stay now depends on tightness of setting, but is always
much tighter than old defaults (where they figured they
were in formation if they were 30 hexes away!)

Ensured hit and run officer doesn't use marines if ship is getting
vulnerable to capture

Scripting improvements
----------------------

NW/ED scripts stripped down (many issues are now fixed more cleanly in the client,
so ugly/less stable hacks in the scripts are no longer needed)
Each is recompiled against the latest Sfc2 library builds, hopefully more stable

===============================================

The SFB mode is a BLAST to play - I've forgotten how utterly lethal weapons really were in SFB compared to SFC.

The AI is still dumb as a brick, but a less-dumb-brick than it was.

I've got a solution worked out for one more biggie, just haven't coded it yet:
  -  letting all races have both PFs and fighters


Next big fix on the to do list
==============================

This is a biggie that I've figured out how to fix, but haven't written the code yet...

Enable all races to use both fighters and pfs (without mucking with donor races etc)
- only catch is shiplist updates:
- ships that carry PFs MUST have their special role set to W,
ships that carry fighters MUST have their special role set to V
(otherwise they will be unable to resupply ftrs/pfs in supply dock)
- obviously someone needs to update the actual shiplist/fighter lists
with new pfs, fighters, carriers, and pfts
How it will work:
implement a new special role category for ships that carry pfs,
check it in supply dock to see if you need to populate fighter list with pfs
also in supply dock check for the 'v' to see if you need to populate fighter
list with fighters
add settings in Ship.h to specify if ship carries fighters/pfs
defaults to false for both
in reading spec list set to true based on special role flags
in saving to db file add setting to list of things to write
in loading from db file add setting to list of things to read
in shipsys\shuttlebay.cpp change the mGenerateFighter routine
to use that flag instead of the hardcoded gorn/rom/lyr


I have nearly completed a hackish update to the latest gamespy api as the one sfc uses is pretty old. But I have several other irons in the fire (market, website, oci, etc.) and a seemingly never ending featurelist request list for stuff from Frey (that's a good thing).

To be honest we're kind of lacking input from the likes of you and Dizzy and t00L at this point. If any of you guys want access to the beta forums and dont already have it, just let me know. I have a project management tool integrated with the forums which we may use to formalise feature requests and bug reports on a roadmap. Though the future of SMF (our forums software) is kind of up in the air right now; not in any critical way though, we'll be OK, it is just going to be a site design decision forced on us sooner than later. But you don't want to hear about all of that.

When I first read Dave's revisions I thought instantly of you and Dizzy. So...

[FPF-DieHard]

How much of the Engine is fixable though?  I'm not a programmer, I just know from playing other modern games (addicted to DDO still) that SFC was an old buggy piece of sh*t.  How much of that is even fixable?

[762_XC]

No more admin shuttles for you!

[Bonk]

That's the spirit! 

See now that we have the EAW source in hand, under control and building reliably there is now actually some point to all those "debates".

Once we have a Vista/7 solution resolved, I can't wait to start my own branch for cheeseomax experimentations. 

In theory, all the game engine components could be replaced (though painfully). We're starting relatively simple, and step-wise. Vista patch for the existing product if at all possible and then go from there.

I think a gampspy api update after that would make sense, the new features offer all kinds of stuff we have wanted for ages - stats, rankings, ladders... etc... built in, with control of the gamepsy interface for sfc I could put some sweet functionality on this website. (add that to the potential for digital goods on the market... + modern oci webapp etc.) Meanwhile we can debate on how exactly to proceed with a complete overhaul to the product. I think that is what everyone wants, but we really only now have the required infrastructure setup and at our disposal.

Right now I'm looking for the quick vista fix, a gamespy api update (insert re-commitment debate here), then to strip as much as the old cruft from the project as possible, replacing it with newer platform references, isolate the sfb logic if at all possible and then step back and consider the potential for replacing major engine components (2d,3d graphics or sound).

But really, we are only 12 weeks in, and while progress has been good and the potential exciting, we do not have a vista fix in hand. Until then I will be uneasy. I'm taking a bit of a rest as I have been busting my arse on this for the last while, but I am committed to making it work or finding the right people to help us do it.

[NuclearWessels]

...

To be honest we're kind of lacking input from the likes of you and Dizzy and t00L at this point. If any of you guys want access to the beta forums and dont already have it, just let me know. I have a project management tool integrated with the forums which we may use to formalise feature requests and bug reports on a roadmap. Though the future of SMF (our forums software) is kind of up in the air right now; not in any critical way though, we'll be OK, it is just going to be a site design decision forced on us sooner than later. But you don't want to hear about all of that.

When I first read Dave's revisions I thought instantly of you and Dizzy. So...

LOL, that's funny - I keep hearing DH in the back of my head when I'm thinking of what to try next 

The list of fixes posted is only part of the story - get in the beta and make some noise!

dave

[762_XC]

I have a long list aside from the Vista thing...the park-and-plink bug is near the top.

[FPF-DieHard]

I have a long list aside from the Vista thing...the park-and-plink bug is near the top.

What's this bug?

Vista is really what killed this game and if it's gonna make a revival it needs to work properly in modern OSs.

[Corbomite]

I have a long list aside from the Vista thing...the park-and-plink bug is near the top.

What's this bug?

Vista is really what killed this game and if it's gonna make a revival it needs to work properly in modern OSs.

I think he means the bug we found with shield reenforcement while testing. I believe it has been fixed.

[FPF-DieHard]

I have a long list aside from the Vista thing...the park-and-plink bug is near the top.

What's this bug?

Vista is really what killed this game and if it's gonna make a revival it needs to work properly in modern OSs.

I think he means the bug we found with shield reenforcement while testing. I believe it has been fixed.

Ahhh, the one where the player doesn't appear to himself to be taking any damage yet the ship gets wrecked on everyone else's screen.

[Grand Master of Shadows NCC37385]

What's this store you speak of?

Legal copies of EAW and OP now available for purchase and download.

http://www.dynaverse.net/market

Which one was the one that came with TNG era ships? Is that available for purchase?

[Bonk]

I believe that would be SFC III, which we are not currently authorised to distribute. Though I expect our demonstration of responsibility and reliability in running the SFC3 Dynaverse directory servers as well might count on that front in future.

Though there are plenty of TNG style mods available for EAW and OP. Try OP with Chris Jones's UAW mod. It's a blast.

[762_XC]

It's been fixed? Where did I miss that post?

[Corbomite]

It's been fixed? Where did I miss that post?

You didn't. It was inside knowledge.

[FA Frey XC]

DH, we're very aware of the Vista / Win 7 issue, and that's our top priority. By allowing the programmers to wade through the code at their own pace gives us several things, all of which are good.

Welcome back, now stop bitching and get involved !



Regards,

[762_XC]

DH? Stop bitching?

 

[FPF-DieHard]

DH? Stop bitching?

 

I don't "bitch," I "nerd-rage."  Though playing a PvE game for 18 months has made me soft.

[Corbomite]

DH? Stop bitching?

 

I don't "bitch," I "nerd-rage."  Though playing a PvE game for 18 months has made me soft.

Truely! He even apologizes now! 

[FCM_SFHQ_XC]

I think even if the earth was destroyed by alien invaders this game would still be played somewhere in another galaxy or alternate reality

[KBF-Crim]

I think even if the earth was destroyed by alien invaders this game would still be played somewhere in another galaxy or alternate reality

Are you kidding...after years of running sims?

All we need are the ships now and we can boot stomp the galaxy...

[FPF-AJTK]

I play with myself all the time you blue bastage. And OP as well 

Id given up on online play again. Perhaps there is hope.

Just make sure to put in re-ver-se 

MY SIG IS GONE?! Sigh

[Dizzy]

We also just fixed the hardpoints on the planets where point defense wont fire at drones. Now they will. Pretty sure FS will put it into 4.1

[KBF-Nail]

DH

What server do you play DDO on? Was thinking of trying it out. Want some company?

[FPF-DieHard]

DH

What server do you play DDO on? Was thinking of trying it out. Want some company?

Myself, Corbo, Chuut, hexx and a few others play on Ghallanda.  DDO's a great game but it's just not the same as SFC was, nothing ever will be.

[Kruk]

You know I don't read these threads often anymore (except the Bewbies one) and I haven't played the game since the last slave girl (2007) I beleive. But whatever happens with this. I got to handed to you guys for continuing this. And if a new game or a new patch fixes most of this game, I will definatly buy it.

[FPF-DieHard]

You know I don't read these threads often anymore (except the Bewbies one) and I haven't played the game since the last slave girl (2007) I beleive. But whatever happens with this. I got to handed to you guys for continuing this. And if a new game or a new patch fixes most of this game, I will definatly buy it.

I think if this combat engine were on a MODERN platform that was stable and could support say 12v12 engagements it could be the greatest game ever. 

[Dizzy]

You know I don't read these threads often anymore (except the Bewbies one) and I haven't played the game since the last slave girl (2007) I beleive. But whatever happens with this. I got to handed to you guys for continuing this. And if a new game or a new patch fixes most of this game, I will definatly buy it.

I think if this combat engine were on a MODERN platform that was stable and could support say 12v12 engagements it could be the greatest game ever.

lol, 6vs6 would also totally rock, and yeah, if you could get just 12 to reliably hold in a mission, yes it would be the greatest game ever...