Topic: Released  (Read 3190 times)

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Offline Kevlar

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Released
« on: April 30, 2009, 03:06:08 am »
well, the update to cleeve's vor'cha is done. IT would be better with a new texture suit but honestly, don't have the presence of mind to do that.

I've sent it to cleeve, so it might be downloaded at the www.staryards.com (eventually, cleeve wasn't updated the site recently)  and uploaded it at battleclinic.
Apart geometrical changes, I added a better hardpoint layout and some new interface images. The original breakmodel was odd also, so revamped it.


It is normal practise to display a "in game image" ,, well, I'm sorry  but for some reason  (I'm sure it is due to keyboard conflicts) SFC2/OP/3 refuse to zoom in... I can zoom out but never in....so this is the best IN GAME image I can present (and had to scale it )




Offline Klingon Fanatic

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Re: Released
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2009, 03:53:28 pm »
 ;D Thank you. I can't wait to see what you do next!

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Offline Kevlar

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Re: Released
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2009, 04:12:46 pm »
1.try to texture the second vor'cha variant.

2. model 3 things I always wanted , it was 4, now with vor'cha done, 3 are left:

The Achenar Imperial courier from elite II/ Frontier.

the SSF 51D Cutlass - I give a candy bar to the first that knows where this is from

the HMS Hood (k that one is going to take ages but still, I really want to try it)

Offline JohanobesusII

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Re: Released
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2009, 01:00:28 am »
According to Battleclinic is for SFC3 only.  Is it compatible with EAW/OP, and if not, how would one go about converting it?

Offline FoaS_XC

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Re: Released
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2009, 02:40:07 am »
SFC 3 models can work in SFC2, but the hardpoints are reversed: phasers fire from heavy-weapon hardpoints and heavy weapons fire from phaser hardpoints, and there's a possibility that some of the hardpoints would be inaccessible due to limitations with the ship UI system. If you have a copy of max or milkshape, I would say open it up and take a look at what hardpoints are there.
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Offline Kevlar

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Re: Released
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2009, 04:24:29 am »
According to Battleclinic is for SFC3 only.  Is it compatible with EAW/OP, and if not, how would one go about converting it?

it is like fury said. In theory it should work in sfc2/OP. The hardpoints/damage points will be reveresed.
If you plan to change the hardpoints with  Milkshape there will be a problem, since m3d will bug out when trying to import the model. I recomend 3DS or GMAX and....

errrrrrrr...  think i added around 20 or so hardpoints,,, hmmmm... i'm going to post a sfc2/OP hardpointed version in battleclinic . just Hold on a few minutes while i reverse the HP and damage points.


PS; Done & Done.

TO make things clear (since I already got someone with doubts, There is now a new release with an  added  folder named "SFC2&OP",  where there is a mod file hardpointed for the SFC2 family. Just copy the file in the SFC2&OP to the vorcha folder, replacing the existent mod file, and you now have the same model hardpointed for sfc2/OP.
 
« Last Edit: May 03, 2009, 05:57:36 am by Kevlar »

Offline JohanobesusII

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Re: Released
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2009, 02:49:10 pm »
So it doesn't have any of those glow things? 

The mesh is good, but like you said, the textures still need a bit of work.  I wonder how hard it would be to get Delekhan's blue textures on it.

Offline Kevlar

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Re: Released
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2009, 10:31:47 pm »
yes , you are right. I am learning to texture. 

the sfc3 version has some red glows. The glow data is independent of the mod fiile, and in fact stored in the vorcha.gf file. 
If you even want stronger glows, you can use the taldren model attribute editor to increase the glows, change  their color or even add more glows.
you can find the taldren attribute editor here: http://starfleetcommand3.filefront.com/file/Model_Tools;7945

it is pretty user friendly and easy to use.

ps: glows are only supported by sfc3.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2009, 11:20:10 pm by Kevlar »

Offline JohanobesusII

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Re: Released
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2009, 11:56:43 pm »
yes , you are right. I am learning to texture. 

the sfc3 version has some red glows. The glow data is independent of the mod fiile, and in fact stored in the vorcha.gf file. 
If you even want stronger glows, you can use the taldren model attribute editor to increase the glows, change  their color or even add more glows.
you can find the taldren attribute editor here: http://starfleetcommand3.filefront.com/file/Model_Tools;7945

it is pretty user friendly and easy to use.

ps: glows are only supported by sfc3.


If I had SFC3 I might.  As it is, I just want to be sure the model will work in OP. 

So the glow things are not part of the model but are in a different file, and the only real difference between the two game formats is the hardpoint layout?  I wish I had known that earlier.  I've passed up a lot of good looking models thinking that they would crash the game.  I guess I'll go  browse Battleclininc some more.

Offline Kevlar

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Re: Released
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2009, 12:44:47 am »
well, in  a simplistic way, yes.
the only difference I have made between the sfc3 and sfc2/OP models is the hardpoint placement.
all the glows are independant of the mod file.

Still, if we want to dig deeper, there is actually 2  structural differences between sfc3 and previous SFC releases, and that is called dynamic level of detail or LOD and texture formats.

What does the LOD means to the player?
In a sense that in sfc2/OP mod files there is information relative not to one but normally 3 different variations of the same model, each one more complex. For ease, and using my model as an example, in a pure SFC2/OP release there should be a vorcha with very low poly count, that would be displayed at distances where it is almost impossible to see any detail apart basic form, a medium detailed vorcha, that would be displayed by the game and medium distances, and finally a high/complex vorcha, that would be the one seen when the player is controlling the ship or almost at blank range.

In sfc3 nevertheless, there is only 1 model, and the game engine itself controls how the details are displayed.

so now the fundamental question is, how all this affects you... honestly  I have no idea.  It might be possible that mod files with only 1 geometrical model (Sfc3 planned) can slow your game down, or at least some years ago they would, but current computers can probably deal with that also.

as for the textures part, sfc3 has the ability to use textures in bmp, jpeg, targa and DDS formats (and a couple more I guess). SFC2/OP doesn't. So if anyone releases a model using either Targa or DDS based textures, you might have a problem... not of the game crashing I reckon, but displaying a flat shaded (non textured model).
Eventually my next release (i hope) will use textures in DDS format.

it is possible to bypass this texture problem  converting the textures formats to bmp , using shareware/free programs like yannick leons dds converter 2.x , Paint.net or , a favourite of mine due to it's simplificated batch based conversion, fastStone Image viewer.
Yet, if someone used, for example targa layered based textures to give transparency effects, those will be loss when converting to bmp format, and the sfc2/OP model will look worse than the sfc3 version, even if the geometry is equal.

Personally I preffer SFC3 (talking about the modelling aspect, even tho I also end preffering sfc3, it is better graphically, has a rela cloak system,  and I hate almost all the TOS aesthetics and the heavy drone based concept, but that is another story) since it has more potential to be explored due to glows, more complex textures etc.
and yes I know all the criticism about sfc3 vs previous ones, some I agree with,  some I don't. If OP had the same graphical aspect as sfc3 I would probably would preffer OP. But it doesn't, and for me looks pretty dated in graphical terms.

so in short, yes, you can use most sfc3 models in OP without problems, except perharps having ships firing from the wrong places. An easy solution is to import a standard/stock  model  that looks somewhat close to the sfc3 model you download, in something like milkshape 3d, deleting everything except the joints, save that as ms3d format, importing the sfc3 model, delete all the joints, merge the model with the previously saved stock joints and it is done ( you might have to tweak the hardpoint placements if you want a perfect job).

In my case I used cleeve's original hardpoint placement for sfc2/op , with a little tweaking to compensate geometrical changes. If I didn't had cleeve's original hardpoint, would have probably imported the hardpoint of a KCA or KDN model.

Hope this helps somewhat.

ps: would be grateful if you can point me out the blue textures you mentioned. thanks.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2009, 01:43:37 am by Kevlar »

Offline JohanobesusII

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Re: Released
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2009, 12:17:00 am »
I've messed with lots of ships' hardpoints.  That isn't a problem. 

I can't find the version I have online.  Battleclinic has one, but it has green textures.  His readme describes my version as updated, so presumably they have his "old version."  The web address given in the readme still works, but none of his SFC or Baldur's Gate mods are there; all it has is a persistent world and a few scripts for NWN1, and the last update was in 2005.  Hs readme has very liberal permissions, so if you give me your email address I will send you the copy I have.  Of course, the textures are mapped completely differently, so trying to copy one to the other would be difficult, or at least tedious.

Offline Kevlar

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Re: Released
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2009, 02:48:20 am »
Email adress sent.
Yes, I know, tried to find it and ended up on the same pages you were. So thank you very much for your offer to send it.

Offline JohanobesusII

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Re: Released
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2009, 08:43:31 am »
Email adress sent.
Yes, I know, tried to find it and ended up on the same pages you were. So thank you very much for your offer to send it.

Forgive me, but did you send the message with the subject "hi" from Portugal?  I'm not exactly a computer expert, so I'm downright paranoid about only opening messages if I'm positive about the sender, and I'm not sure that one is yours.

Offline Kevlar

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Re: Released
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2009, 11:42:02 am »
correct