Topic: Excelsior based project: looking for input (Read 2491 times)

FPF-Paladin · « **on:** February 09, 2009, 03:02:47 pm »

I'm trying to modify this ship for an offline shiplist project. I know the immediate response is generally "It's crap" but I also know people like Dizzy have come up with modified ones that were semi workable.

I don't want an overpowered version, more what someone would expect a refit to be but keep it challenging to use. I figure why reinvent the wheel and ask for input on it instead. What has been attempted that seemed sensible without just adding things to it is kind of what I'm working at. I've actually found the original seems suited to fighting on a non drone based environment but why would the resources be put into a BC class ship that was so limited in terms of cost and build time...

Course that could be my answer but I'm stubborn enough to be trying anyway. Later era solutions seemed more oriented to taking existing ships and refitting them than creating new hulls, but I'm also trying to avoid obvious x1 type end results too. What would you do if you were a shipyard designer given this problem? I'm also very open and kind of leaning towards introducing handicaps to make it interesting or reasonable from a canon point of view.

FPF-Paladin · « **Reply #1 on:** February 09, 2009, 03:39:31 pm »

Maybe this is where I'm headed...

http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/excelsior-blueprints.php

Father Ted · « **Reply #2 on:** February 09, 2009, 07:46:34 pm »

If you want to modify a Fed-BC, forget about the Excelsior, nobody but Dizzy is crazy enough to fly that thing anyway. Do what I've been arguing for for years: give the Kirov class(i.e. BCG) 12 drone control like the C7 and Kzinti BCH.

FPF-Paladin · « **Reply #3 on:** February 09, 2009, 08:31:47 pm »

Well... I'm crazy enough to fly it too

My entire point is to have a photon based BC that makes sense compared to the other ones. Each to their own of course but I actually avoid drone based ships like the (blue) plague.

knightstorm · « **Reply #4 on:** February 09, 2009, 08:34:17 pm »

Quote from: Father Ted on February 09, 2009, 07:46:34 pm

If you want to modify a Fed-BC, forget about the Excelsior, nobody but Dizzy is crazy enough to fly that thing anyway. Do what I've been arguing for for years: give the Kirov class(i.e. BCG) 12 drone control like the C7 and Kzinti BCH.

Hence the reason he wants to mod it to make it flyable. Try lowering the movement cost, and adding amd. I might also give the rear torps an NCM type arc to grant greater flexibility.

Dizzy · « **Reply #5 on:** February 12, 2009, 10:18:55 am »

Truly, the SG7, or was it 8 version of the BCE is the best most balanced version ever. Its not over powered... but its problem lies in cheese. Once droned PF's are out, the BCE with it's lousy PD gets overwhelmed. Even carrying PF's it aint that hot with all the other/better cheese. The answer is to have the BCE come out earlier... And that's be a bad idea because the counterpart to the BCE is the KCR. The romulan front is the best operating front the BCE has because the klinks edge it with their fast drones.

The BCE has a niche in a fleet battle, although with fleeting rules, a small one and even smaller is the window of game time in years it is competitive before being outclassed. It's fun to fly, but without the cheese to take down AI fast, it's a slight liability for doing AI DV munching. However... for a short time... the BCE is a formidable opponent in 1v1 with the right captain. Unfortunately, few know how to fly it properly. It really is a neat ship, but to mod it anymore, you risk overlapping and over doing the other FBC variants.

I'm not sure what else an SG BCE can be without turning it into something it shouldnt be. But GL!

FPF-Paladin · « **Reply #6 on:** February 13, 2009, 07:08:35 pm »

Thanks.. I'm kind of thinking about your BCE version as a base actually. I know what you mean by the drone def capabilities. I think it maybe wasn't meant for the drone front and that's how I usually use it. I do agree, within a certain time frame it's nothing to laugh at. I could imagine it useful in a fleet setting with something running escort to it too.

I guess it's a case of a movie ship not cutting it in a sfb based environment. I wish a little more thought had been put into it, it's one of my favorite ships.. just not too useful in PvP.

Dizzy · « **Reply #7 on:** February 13, 2009, 09:44:57 pm »

Quote from: FPF-Paladin on February 13, 2009, 07:08:35 pm

I do agree, within a certain time frame it's nothing to laugh at.

Exactly. It's a great ship at the right time and place.

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I guess it's a case of a movie ship not cutting it in a sfb based environment.

That, but it is effective in a way simply because no one knows how to fight against it. So if you learn to use it well, it can be rather nasty.

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I wish a little more thought had been put into it, it's one of my favorite ships.

Well, I don't know of anyone who's put more thought into it than me... I mean, I redefined all the phaser arcs so it makes sense and even changed the warp move cost from 1.25 to 1.24 to solve the fractional power problem it had going 31. As far as variants are concerned, the BCE has it's niche. The other fed BC's are fleshed out with the sfb BC variants. I dont know what else you can do to it without upsetting balance.

I once thought of a web based OCI implementation where you could alter your ship. Change out a hardpoint for something else... ED's flatfile editor allows for each players ship to be totally customized, so I dont see why it cant be done using a UI OCI interface as well. But wouldnt it be nice to change those rear firing Photons to B racks for a mission and then later change them back?

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