Topic: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS  (Read 12276 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

intermech

  • Guest
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #20 on: January 27, 2009, 12:31:08 pm »
Oh Yeah, I forgot about this one, I named this ship USS Tigershark in 1945, several years earlier than the other one! I have a solid case and photographic evidence to prove it!

Offline Panzergranate

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2911
  • Gender: Male
  • Aw!! Da big nasty Klingon L7 killed da kitty kat!!
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #21 on: January 27, 2009, 12:34:01 pm »
He may have problems as the US Navy might have first call on the name.... with a WW2 Submarine USS Tiger Shark.

Has he sent a E-mail to the Navy's registry claiming the rights to the name....  ::)

It's nice to know that folks with no grip on reality still exist out there in cyber space....  :laugh:

The Klingons have many ways to fry a cat. I prefer to use an L7 Fast Battlecruiser!!

Offline marstone

  • Because I can
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 3014
  • Gender: Male
  • G.E.C.K. - The best kit to have
    • Ramblings on the Q3, blog
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #22 on: January 27, 2009, 12:38:17 pm »
No US Navy ship has had the name Tigershark, yet.

Interesting, I searched the canadian copywrite office database, and didn't see a listing for USS TigerShark.  Gosh, think he is lying with that (c) on his website.

Found this one on the US coywrite office
The Tigershark.
Relevance:   
Type of Work: Motion Picture
Registration Number / Date: RE0000286517 / 1986-02-11 
 Renewal registration for: LP0000016560 / 1958-06-18 
Title: The Tigershark.
Series: Silent service, ser. 2, no. 19-16
Copyright Claimant: Twin Dolphins Productions, Inc. (PWH)
 
Names: Twin Dolphins Productions, Inc.
The smell of printer ink in the morning,
Tis the smell of programming.

Offline marstone

  • Because I can
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 3014
  • Gender: Male
  • G.E.C.K. - The best kit to have
    • Ramblings on the Q3, blog
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #23 on: January 27, 2009, 12:42:14 pm »
now what would be fun is to file a real copywrite on it, about $35 bucks at the US copywrite office if done online.
The smell of printer ink in the morning,
Tis the smell of programming.

intermech

  • Guest
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #24 on: January 27, 2009, 12:46:55 pm »
Some good info on copyrights from copyright.gov FAQ:
http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/

USS Tigershark USS Tigershark
« Last Edit: January 27, 2009, 12:59:24 pm by Interstellar Machine »

Offline Panzergranate

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2911
  • Gender: Male
  • Aw!! Da big nasty Klingon L7 killed da kitty kat!!
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #25 on: January 27, 2009, 12:59:00 pm »
There was a speed boat, out here in the local harbour, called "The Muff Diver", I kid you not, in very big wording down the sides.

The guy owning it always seemed to have a bevy of nubile girls on board whenever it was out....  ::)

He probally has copyright on the name though, so no USS Muff Diver will be possible....

The Klingons have many ways to fry a cat. I prefer to use an L7 Fast Battlecruiser!!

Offline Chrystoff

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Male
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #26 on: January 27, 2009, 02:24:49 pm »
A bit more info for 'ya! The name Tiger Shark or Tigershark has been used for years for fictional submarines. Not to mention the very real F-20 Tigershark supersonic jet fighter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-20_Tigershark
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Tiger_Shark
http://www.kitsune.addr.com/Rifts/Rifts-Pre-Rifts-Vehicles/United_States/US_SSN-888_Tigershark_Submarine.htm



Offline marstone

  • Because I can
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 3014
  • Gender: Male
  • G.E.C.K. - The best kit to have
    • Ramblings on the Q3, blog
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #27 on: January 27, 2009, 02:49:19 pm »
F-20 Tigershark, awesome little jet.
The smell of printer ink in the morning,
Tis the smell of programming.

Offline atheorhaven

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1802
    • Mare Imbrium Shipyards
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #28 on: January 27, 2009, 03:25:08 pm »
The main thing with this guy is that he's a Canadian in Canada saying that he owns the copyright to the name of a fictional starship based in a Paramount owned IP..

Unless I woke up in a different reality this morning, I don't believe that you can enforce a national copyright as an international one first of all, assuming that he somehow actually had the rights to it.  That's usually why MNC's go out and buy all these local copyrights in Canada, US, Mexico, Japan, etc.. to lock them up.

Personally, I'd like to see someone from the fan community try to enforce copyright on a name on a fictional starship based inside a Paramount owned IP, I could see really quick where that'd go.

I'm wondering how old this guy is.. I'm thinking late teens or early twenties.  Wonder if he's old enough to actually hold a "copyright" on his own without parents.  Hmmm..

..ooOOoo..totally useless information..ooOOoo..

Mare Imbrium Shipyards - http://mareimbrium.webhop.net

Don't bother checking out my website for the most recent updates, because I've
been too lazy to update it!  Check Battleclinic!

Offline Bonk

  • Commodore
  • *
  • Posts: 13298
  • You don't have to live like a refugee.
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #29 on: January 27, 2009, 03:47:15 pm »
IANAL, but I think this is a non-issue.

Regardless, I'll ask you guys to take the high road here, as we have a strong community reputation to uphold. So please, no name calling or smear campaigns. I'm not accusing you of it, I just don't want it to go there.

There is also the opportunity to make a friend.  How large is this fellows site? What are his technical requirements? Is it gaming related? (I'm thinking a request for Xenocorp hosting here...) I just had a look at the site, all static by the look of it, that would be a snap to host and we'd hardly notice. Jason has made an effort to make a tidy startrek themed site and I think he's done alright.

See, we had Canada West (now sfc2.net)... I'm in the process of founding Canada East (ok about 6 years late, but give me a break, we move slow here on the east coast), Why not Canada Central? I'm not there anymore and we don't see much of the Ottawa crew around anymore.

There are all kinds of things we could do to support each other's community. If any of Jason's buddies have never discovered SFB/SFC then I bet they'd love it.

I think you'll all get the idea of of where I'm going here. I know it sounds corny, but if life gives you lemons, then make lemonade. I'll be keeping an eye on this thread.

intermech

  • Guest
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #30 on: January 27, 2009, 04:08:31 pm »
Bonk, I really must applaud your attitude. Maybe someone could offer him some renders with the USS Tigershark registry on a Sovereign class. The more the merrier!

The only problem is, back in the late 1800's, I copyrighted the words USS Tigershark as seen by this original deguerrotype.

Offline atheorhaven

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1802
    • Mare Imbrium Shipyards
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #31 on: January 27, 2009, 05:25:28 pm »
Awesome.. :D

I agree with Bonk in that I don't believe that this will go as far as the gent has threatened, and if he does try to go there.. there is more than enough prior work out there to show any kind of case to be baseless.  "Tigershark" is a name attached to properties (including Mani's ship) long before this domain was registered, in one case, probably before most here were born.

Trying to copyright the name itself would be like trying to copyright "Enterprise" as a name.. it's not going to happen for various reasons.  I like the idea that Bonk had to contact and show him what we do, and there are enough people here that could help him create original art for his site using SFC or other models.  But I'd also rather not see Mani put up on a stake either.

Just found the Canadian Copyright site, which has this nugget in it..

"What is covered by copyright?

Copyright applies to all original literary, dramatic, musical and artistic works. Each of these general categories covers a wide range of creations. Here are just a few examples:

    * literary works: books, pamphlets, poems and other works consisting of text and computer programs;
    * dramatic works: films, videos, plays, screenplays and scripts;
    * musical works: compositions that consist of both words and music or music only (note that lyrics without music fall into the literary works category); and
    * artistic works: paintings, drawings, maps, photographs, sculptures and architectural works.

The word "original" is key in defining a work that qualifies for copyright protection. Naturally, you cannot obtain a copyright for someone else's creation."

A mesh is tricky.  It's in a computer program, but it's also computer generated sculpture. Mani isn't releasing his ship as original, he's using an Akira.  We know that the Akira appeared in ST: First Contact and was designed by ILM for Paramount.  Meaning that it's a Paramount property, free and clear, bought and paid for.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akira_class_starship

Mani did a "Fair Use" non-commercial not for profit fan release of a ship that was a Paramount IP.  Fair enough.  The "Tigershark" website uses Paramount property as well.. it's a Star Trek based (a Paramount property) website using design elements from LCARS (a Paramount property) depicting a fictious Soverign Class (Paramount again) ship.  To the point.. neither Mani or the website own the copyright on the name, neither own the designs they have.. everyone here is playing with Paramount property.  So noone could sue anyone here IMHO..
..ooOOoo..totally useless information..ooOOoo..

Mare Imbrium Shipyards - http://mareimbrium.webhop.net

Don't bother checking out my website for the most recent updates, because I've
been too lazy to update it!  Check Battleclinic!

Offline manitoba1073

  • FLEET ADMIRAL OF THE YARDS
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1119
  • Gender: Male
    • manitobashipyards
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #32 on: January 27, 2009, 05:50:33 pm »
Bonk,

 There is no smearing going on from me. I posted about what he is trying to do was BS. Feel free to contact him his contact info is there in the first post. But i was keeping the community aware of what was going on. But bring him in, though I do believe he may be already aware of the community.



Offline Age

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2690
  • Gender: Male
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #33 on: January 27, 2009, 06:36:45 pm »
Paramount  doesn't  own  the  rights to  Star Trek CBS  does  as  CBS  owns  Paramount.This  is  what  Mr. Redstone  did when  he  split  Viacom  up.I would  just  ask if  he  registered  the  domian and I am getting  a badgateway error  from that  site.I didn't  think you  had  site  named  that Mani as I thought  it  was  always Outlance Shipyards.The  person to  contact at  CBS  in Leslie  Moonvies.

This  the  reason  at  the  end of say  CSI even  the  new  version of  Star Trek you  see  CBS/Paramount.Paramount is  just  production  studio for  CBS.To summon it  up CBS  owns  Star Trek this  was annouced  in 2006.It  was  on  the  frontpage  of  STG.This is  why Harry doesn't  work for Paramount  Interactive  Entertianment  as  he  moved  to  new  position in Paramount.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2009, 06:57:12 pm by Age »

Offline manitoba1073

  • FLEET ADMIRAL OF THE YARDS
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1119
  • Gender: Male
    • manitobashipyards
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #34 on: January 28, 2009, 06:42:48 am »
Got another Email from the Retard yes thats what he is. Here is why. I am done with him. Feel free to do what ever you guys want with him. Because if I do it I will not reply nicely.

 I'm done trying to be nice. I tried to negotiate peacefully with you, but you seem to be unwilling
to compromise at all. And seeing how I'm not asking for much at all - just a simple renaming of
a starship on your page - you are quite the stubborn, ignorant fool.
 
You will hear from me soon after I confer and determine what course of action will come next.
 
Also.....you say you go "far back" with legal experience and whatnot. It seems that nowhere
on your site is there a disclaimer about non-profit usage of Paramount's property and legal
rights. I wonder how your experience is going to protect you from the legal machine seeing as
how I have informed Paramount already about the copyright infringement on your site.
 
It seems your at the disadvantage now.
 
"To be, or not to be. That, is the question....."
 
 
-J.Buchholz
President/Captain, USS Tigershark Fan Club



Offline Star Dragon

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 306
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #35 on: January 28, 2009, 09:10:57 am »
Ok... So what exactly is this Jackholes problem?

He's got a set of fan based pages for a Sovvy and his forum is on a very mixed site. BFD.

I couldn't even find it in google, till I tried this from that last post...

[USS TIGERSHARK (c) 2009 Jason Buchholz]


So how is your page directing traffic away from him? I don't remember your page mentioning Tigershark in it...?

IS there a link to the page in question?
I didn't see it in Google either...


Unless I totally don't get it, he merely has the right to use the DOMAIN NAME as he pays for it to go to his site, THAT's ALL!

I seriously doubt this person has the money it would take to copyright a name (He ain't DISNEY!!!).


In short, I will have to name a mesh called USS Tigershark and also mention another one in my fanfic at some point in the future just to cheese him off... :)

Lets see him do something about that!


Oh and his Forum section has ZERO posts. He's the admin and the only post there is the standard "don't be a troll or you will be removed, crap."

Almost felt like registering just to tell him he's an idiot, but its not worth it...


[EDIT]  I just noticed that I.M.  -   posted the link in question.

THAT's what he's complaning about? A Model entry???  <Retard>

Tell him to learn the words "Original Authorship" and until he does, go away and suck a big fat one because the adults don't like it when he wastes their time...


Wow I looked specificly for "Canadian Copyright" Star Trek  and found THIS!

http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html

Here is the most relevant (and damaging part): Canadian is Bilateral, means US Law applies as well.


6) "If I make up my own stories, but base them on another work, my new work belongs to me."
    False. U.S. Copyright law is quite explicit that the making of what are called "derivative works" -- works based or derived from another copyrighted work -- is the exclusive province of the owner of the original work. This is true even though the making of these new works is a highly creative process. If you write a story using settings or characters from somebody else's work, you need that author's permission.

    Yes, that means almost all "fan fiction" is arguably a copyright violation. If you want to publish a story about Jim Kirk and Mr. Spock, you need Paramount's permission, plain and simple. Now, as it turns out, many, but not all holders of popular copyrights turn a blind eye to "fan fiction" or even subtly encourage it because it helps them. Make no mistake, however, that it is entirely up to them whether to do that.

    There is a major exception -- criticism and
parody. The fair use provision says that if you want to make fun of something like Star Trek, you don't need their permission to include Mr. Spock. This is not a loophole; you can't just take a non-parody and claim it is one on a technicality. The way "fair use" works is you get sued for copyright infringement, and you admit you did copy, but that your copying was a fair use. A subjective judgment on, among other things, your goals, is then made.

However, it's also worth noting that a court has never ruled on this issue, because fan fiction cases always get settled quickly when the defendant is a fan of limited means sued by a powerful publishing company. Some argue that completely non-commercial fan fiction might be declared a fair use if courts get to decide.


So:

 A) The name USS Tigershark Is free for ANYONE. (Whoever he sent his "money" to  took him for a sucker...)

 B) Most of his site is a "Derivitive Work", all references, images, or sounds that are already copyrighted to "Trek" has to be removed in order for him to "own it" (that means no Sovvy for you AHOLE).


So Paramount/CBS will be all up in the guy.


PS, since it's in reference to a SFC series model, does this mean that TALDREN can get a piece of this jerk as well?  :)
« Last Edit: January 28, 2009, 09:55:46 am by Star Dragon »

Offline Raven Night

  • Modeler
  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 670
  • Gender: Male
  • Models - Textures
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #36 on: January 28, 2009, 10:49:08 am »
No ship of the United States Navy has ever borne the name USS Tiger Shark or Tigershark, though the name is popular for fictional submarines. (The Australian Navy, however, once had a submarine that was called the HMAS Tigershark, built for World War II, although it never saw action.)

The popularity of the name may derive from the use of tigershark-like markings painted on many Allied fighters in the East Asian theater during World War II, particularly the American-piloted "Flying Tigers" of the Chinese air force.

    * The title "character" of the 1959 sci-fi movie The Atomic Submarine is named Tiger Shark.

    * USS Tiger Shark is the setting for the 2002 suspense/horror movie Below.

    * USS Tigershark is the setting for an episode of the television series JAG.


Copied from Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Tiger_Shark

Claiming copyright would be a tough one. Reporting you for copyright infringement might be tough, but not a stretch. If your usage or kitbashing rules are strict Paramount might lean on you.
Never let your ego think or act for you..........me.


Offline Age

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2690
  • Gender: Male
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #37 on: January 28, 2009, 04:18:15 pm »
Mani.Put it in  your junk mail folder  and  ignore  this  guy  as  Paramount  won't  do a thing  as you  aren't  using  the name Star Trek.I wouldn't  worry about  this as  yours is modeling  site  name  Outlance.This  guy  sure  does't  know  what  is  going  on as  Paramount  doesn't  hold  the  rights  anymore.What  this  means  is  if CBS sold  Paramount  they  wouldn't  own  the  rights  to  Star Trek. 

Offline knightstorm

  • His Imperial Highness, Norton II, Emperor of the United States and Protector of Mexico
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2107
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #38 on: January 28, 2009, 05:20:38 pm »
1. This idiot does not own the name USS Tigershark, its too generic.  He may have copyrighted it, but that copyright would never withstand a legal challenge.
2. If paramount was inclined to crack down on the modding community, they would have done so by now.  The bottom line is that you guys are providing them with a free service which improves the saleability of paramount licensed games.

Edit: BTW, I've been google searching this since the first post.  Over the past few days, his site seems to have climbed up the google listings.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2009, 06:01:57 pm by knightstorm »

Offline Major A Payne

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 296
  • Gender: Male
Re: Funny how someones trying to pull some BS
« Reply #39 on: January 29, 2009, 03:02:01 am »
Just as a side note Mani. The name Tigershark is also referenced to a Wing Commander based fighter that  appeared in the 1997 pc game Wing Commander: Prophecy (and again in 2004 for the GBA) ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wing_Commander:_Prophecy )