Topic: Just to make Larry's head explode...

[Scottish Andy]

IMPORTANT EDIT: As per Hsta's reply below, I should have made this poll "front line Starfleet ships". Tankers, freighters, transports, police ships and such support or second-line ships are not included.

No in-depth analysis one on this, as my "explanations" invariably end up just clouding the issue. Plus, It'll be fun to imagine Larry rubbing his head and sighing as he reads this...     

Feel free to contribute any thoughts, and reasons for voting the way you do.

I'm also trying to make the forum more lively by having people respond to various polls whose results do interest me. Feel free to join this trend, from deeply important Trek topics like I go for ( ) to silly ones!

[Hstaphath_XC]

Given the options, I voted for #3.  However, by far, the winner should be support vessels.  Supply carriers, tankers, part fabrication ships, troop transports... all the masses of virtually nameless vessels that keep the fleets and bases supplied and fully functional.

EDIT:  Also, I'm assuming the HORDES of cheap police frigates that patrol internal systems fall under option 3.

[Scottish Andy]

Um, actually no Hsta. I was kinda meaning front-line vessels. Tankers and fuel carriers and freighters and transports I consider to be Star Fleet Auxiliaries. I see them as being civilian contractors for the most part as well, using standard ships for the transport of standard cargoes like deuterium, ores, gases and such. Only high priotiry or security sensitive cargoes ot those with with military applications (like antimatter) would get put on Starfleet freighters. The Federation has the strongest economy of the galactic powers (we're told) and that is based on merchant fleets. It would be silly to have duplicate fleets when the UFP Council can have tanker firms haul that stuff around.

As for "hordes of cheap police frigates", I see them as being Federation Police ships as opposed to Starfleet, as per SFB.

Basically, the two categories you mentioned I did not include in my poll.   Vote for only what I mention! 

[Hstaphath_XC]

Um, actually no Hsta. I was kinda meaning front-line vessels.

Hmmm... then perhaps you should have phrased that along the lines of "Question: Which is the largest of the following division of ships in Starfleet?"   

... It would be silly to have duplicate fleets when the UFP Council can have tanker firms haul that stuff around.

On the contrary, the military (and each branch at that!) likes to haul their own stuff whenever possible... that is why the US Army had the largest fleet in the world by the end of WWII.

Having to rely on civilians with their own priorities and obscene rate charges infuriates the military.  I just can't imagine it being any different for Starfleet.

As for "hordes of cheap police frigates", I see them as being Federation Police ships as opposed to Starfleet, as per SFB.

This is news to me!   

Basically, the two categories you mentioned I did not include in my poll.   Vote for only what I mention!

Hehe... even so, my vote stands were it should then.

[Governor Ronjar]

We've had this discussion. While it's quite easy to believe that Starfleet would have [and shown in DS9's period WAS SHOWN TO HAVE] a large percentage of cruisers, there is no arguing the usefulness of the smaller ship design. I lump all policing, patrol and such craft under the term 'escort'. They're a small vessel that can be everywhere because they're cheap, respond to most any problem, and if they can't fix the situation, they can radio in bigger help. If they don't survive, then you've lost little in terms of personnel and materiel.

I still hold by my 60/40 split for the Rogverse, and might even argue for a 50/50 split by TNG's time. If I included such craft as the really small craft, runabouts and little defense ships... might even skew that more towards escorts by 10-20%.

--thu guv!

[Governor Ronjar]

And in regards to the actual title of this page, I am all for coming up with a way to make La'ra's head explode. I've been working on a formula for years, but all it does is make his hair fall out.

Sorry Larry, it wasn't just genetics... *shrugs...*

--guv agin

[Commander La'ra]

[kirk]

RONNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN'JJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[/kirk]

[Vipre]

What, no echo? 

Went with three. It makes sense that the bigger you go shipwise the fewer you'll have.

[kadh2000]

Peacetime US military ships as of 2001

Dates        11/16/01
Battleships             -
Carriers            12
Cruisers            27
Destroyers         54
Frigates                35
Submarines        54
SSBNs                  18
Mine Warfare          27
Patrol                      13
Amphibious        39
Auxiliary             58

[kadh2000]

For Comparison: as of 12/31/1944  Note the difference in fleet size.  Over 6000 ships then and under 350 now.

Battleships                    23
Carriers, Fleet        25
Carriers, Escort        65
Cruisers        61
Destroyers       367
Frigates        376
Submarines        230
SSBNs        -
Command Ships        -
Mine Warfare        614
Patrol        1183
Amphibious        2147
Auxiliary        993

[Vipre]

I was looking all over trying to find out what the current Carrier groups were made up of, any idea?

This is why I went with option three...Destroyers 54 / 2 = Cruisers 27 / 2 = Carriers 12. Bigger the ship smaller the number.

[kadh2000]

Modern carrier strike groups are formed and disbanded based on mission requirements.  So there isn't a standard group anymore.  If there were, it would be something like this:

Carrier
Guided Missile Cruiser
Two Guided Missile Destroyers
Attack Submarine
Logistic Support Ship

[Scottish Andy]

Ah, the traditional navy model will out. Flies in the face of what we see on-screen, but very well! Looks like I'm on my own for this one (apart from the mysterious other who voted with me...)

Maybe I will swing more towards my "destroyer plus" concept as Larry wanted...