Topic: New SG7 Poll Rule Vote for Line ships

[Dizzy]

1. A line ship(s) is exempted from the disengagement penalty unless opposed by another line ship(s).

2. A line ship is worth no points if faced on a 1v1 by a BCH or larger ship.


If adopted, the Legendary Crew will be amended to allow for any CA/CC line ship to count rather than just count with CC kills. Due to the nature of the Legendary ships, this particular part will always be CA and this rule has no bearing on the above.

[KBFLordKrueg]

2. A line ship is worth no points if faced on a 1v1 by a DN or larger ship.

This part I agree with.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

1. A line ship is exempted from the disengagement penalty unless opposed by another line ship.

2. A line ship is worth no points if faced on a 1v1 by a DN or larger ship.


If adopted, the Legendary Crew will be amended to allow for any CA/CC line ship to count rather than just count with CC kills. Due to the nature of the Legendary ships, this particular part will always be CA and this rule has no bearing on the above.

I only like the rule if a line ship is free from diengagement period and I prefer the previous BCH level instead of the DN level for the second part, which I wouldn't accept even then if the first part had to be included.

I vote for the previous poll results or a new poll that has diffent options available.  This particular poll does not allow me to vote for what I think is best no matter which way I answer.

Futhermore this is NOT what was concluded in the discussion on the other thread:

Lepton wrote this:

If you are willing to entertain the idea of exempting line ships from disengagement rule, then I'd be willing to go with Chuut's language and idea.  Any line ship is not subject to the disengagement rule no matter the circumstance.  Period.  Stop.  End of sentence.  All other ships subject to disengagement rule.  For any potential last minute change like this, it would be best to keep it simple.  However, I can see that this might seem to go too far, but if put up to a vote, then at least people will have a chance to register their feelings on it and discuss.

The poll you put up is NOT of this idea that was being agreed upon there.

Therefore I put up a new poll on whether this poll should be deleted.

http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163374040.0.html

[Dizzy]

It was a typo. Supposed to be a BCH cuz that was what was leading in the other poll. I'll amend. But Line ships will face a disengagement penalty if faced with another line ship.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

It was a typo. Supposed to be a BCH cuz that was what was leading in the other poll. I'll amend. But Line ships will face a disengagement penalty if faced with another line ship.

You still need to work on the packaging of the options, and I think a line ship disengage vs a line ship not having to disengage would be the correct poll.

I think the BCH option was already has a poll of its own.

http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163374005.0.html

[Dizzy]

and I think a line ship disengage vs a line ship not having to disengage

What? Look, if two sides face off and each side has a line ship, then the disengage/destruction rule applies to those forced off. It's a 15 word rule that I'm sure I can cut down to 12 words mb. But it's pretty clear and it is what it is. No other options are necessary for this...

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

My problem with a line ship being able to be runout by another line ship is that lineship parity is not as close as the parity of non-line ships between the races. 

Also by having it where line ships we allow people to fly line ships of different kinds instead of having to fly the biggest and baddest line ships.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

What? Look, if two sides face off and each side has a line ship, then the disengage/destruction rule applies to those forced off. It's a 15 word rule that I'm sure I can cut down to 12 words mb. But it's pretty clear and it is what it is.

And I can write it in six.

Line ships don't suffer disengagement penalties.

Now its your right as an admin to make this ruling, but after you called it perfect before and seemed to agree to post that option as a poll, you have declined to do so.  That is why I am perplexed since the other thread seemed to have support of the idea, including yours.

No other options are necessary for this...

Youve bundled them such that you can have A and B, Neither A nor B, A but not B, but you have excluded B but not A.

Look at the very first response by none other than the Coalition RM

2. A line ship is worth no points if faced on a 1v1 by a DN or larger ship.

This part I agree with.

I'd say another option IS required.

[Dizzy]

Seems I engineered this to perfectly piss you off, heh. Sorry you dont like it chuut, but the lone line ship tying up a fleet of ships that sitting on an important hex isnt happening on my watch bro.

Take it or leave it but it's a huge step in the right direction to encourage line ships.

[KBF-Crim]

You know.....at this point...everyone could have their own custom ship...and it wouldnt matter...

Battledreadescortcarriers

Ohhhhh...That gives me an idea for a server....

berserker wars...

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Seems I engineered this to perfectly piss you off, heh. Sorry you dont like it chuut,  

Whatever would give me that idea?

Now if you really want to see serious line ship usage, then allow players forced off a hexto return to that area in lineships.

Rationale, disengagement rulw would be due to the empire not wanting to lose rare fleet assets, line ships aren't rare so they are thrown at the enemy instead to fight a war of attrition.

Perfect.

 

but the lone line ship tying up a fleet of ships that sitting on an important hex isnt happening on my watch bro.

Now that is a vaild point, and I can understand the reasoning, but on the other hand it encourages more 1v1 action, and additionally you dont know what kind of mission you will get when you jump into a hex, it might not draft everyone.

That being said I don't fault you for making an admin descision. but you kinda sprung it without annoucement and seemed to go against what you had previusly agreed to put in your poll.

Take it or leave it but it's a huge step in the right direction to encourage line ships.

Again, I have no problem with you making an admin ruling.  As far as a huge step forward we will see.  Its a good intention, but i don't think it will achieve very much, honestly. 

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

As it stands now (which isnt the way it was when the poll started, so results could be skewed already) with a BCH instead of a DN I vote for 2 but not 1.

Which isn't an option 

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

If adopted, the Legendary Crew will be amended to allow for any CA/CC line ship to count rather than just count with CC kills. Due to the nature of the Legendary ships, this particular part will always be CA and this rule has no bearing on the above.

BTW if you really want to encourage the lineships more you could drop the CC and only allow the legendaries for the CA hulls or other line ship hulls.  If someone could get a legendary CC hull why would they want to even consider pursuing a CA legendary instead?

[Dizzy]

If someone could get a legendary CC hull why would they want to even consider pursuing a CA legendary instead?

Mb u misunderstand. To get a legendary ship... your crew can use either a CC or CA hull line ship or command ship. That helps tie in line ships along with the line ship disengagement idea...

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

If someone could get a legendary CC hull why would they want to even consider pursuing a CA legendary instead?

Mb u misunderstand. To get a legendary ship... your crew can use either a CC or CA hull line ship or command ship. That helps tie in line ships along with the line ship disengagement idea...

Dont quite follow you, are you saying that line ship CA kills count towards the total for a legendary CC crew?

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

but the lone line ship tying up a fleet of ships that sitting on an important hex isnt happening on my watch bro.

Solution:  Make line ships not suffer disengagement penalties for destruction vs non-lineships, but make them suffer them for disengagement. If you want to continually harrass fleets your going to lose not only the hexflip but also some prestige and will have to wait for another ship if you don't like the one your in, not to mention travel time back. 

Rationale:  Your cannon fodder, Your High Command wants the enemy slowed down and is willing to sacrife you and your crew, if you run you are deemed ineffective and not returned having shown no stomach to sacrifice yourself for the greater cause.

What this prevents:  Lineships tying up fleet units then disengaging only to redraft.  Lineships dogging DNs, Carriers, etc., in non vital space drafting them every mission and disengaging after a few passes.  Line ships from prevent Heavy iron from "sitting rock"

What this allows:  Pilots really wanting to stay on a front to do so, at price of their ship.

[Lieutenant_Q]

Ok this bears asking.  What did we decide constitutes a Line Ship?

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Anyship not of a specialty variant such as Command, drone, commando, mauler, carreir, pf tender, etc.  I assume pirate ships, X- variants, heavy war destroyers,  or any ships not normally found in a races shiplist are as well are  considered specialty but Dizzy need to clarify here.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Dizzy also needs to clarify if he intends the disengagement exemptions in the poll related to combats between more than one ship on a side. 

For example if 1 line and one non-line ship are vs a non-line ship?

3 line ships vs 1 non-line ship?

etc.

Right now I'm reading it as all line ships no matter what combo.

[Dizzy]

Dizzy also needs to clarify if he intends the disengagement exemptions in the poll related to combats between more than one ship on a side. 

For example if 1 line and one non-line ship are vs a non-line ship?

3 line ships vs 1 non-line ship?

etc.

Right now I'm reading it as all line ships no matter what combo.

I clarified it by adding the '(s)' to the end of ships in 1st post. Any line ship(s) on one side forces the losers in any line ship(s) off for the disengagement/destruction duration no matter how many line ships are on either side. The mere presence of one... Dont make it complicated. Sheesh. Im finished messing with.

Line ships: http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163374003.msg1122794793.html#msg1122794793

[Farfarer]

How about "No one can ever disengage." ?

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

How about "No one can ever disengage." ?

How about Dizzy can never disengage?   

[KBF MalaK]

I came, I saw, I didn't vote again.