Topic: This is SPARTA!!! (My 300 Review)

[Mackie]

The movie is crap.  It's Iraq war propaganda.  A small Spartan group killing thousands of Persians?  At least Kingdom of Heaven had some moderate Muslims in it.  This movie is sheer fantasy-killing of brown people from an area of the world we fear.  Let me guess all the Spartans are really white-looking despite the fact that they are Greek.

While I agree that the propaganda value of the movie is obvious and somewhat unnerving as its so blatant (man, they could have called the persians orcs considering the way they were displayed), what is it with you and your anti-white sentiment? Spartans and Greeks in general were and are white europeans.
Ancient Persia was a mostly white nation (or perhaps I should rather say 'caucasian' when it comes to persians) as well until they were assimilated by the neighboring peoples.

Other than that, IMHO it was great, good action, gore and so forth

[S'Raek]

To me Kingdom of Heaven was crap because all the Muslims were moderate and the Christians were zealots.  Some of both on each side. 

[Mackie]

To me Kingdom of Heaven was crap because all the Muslims were moderate and the Christians were zealots.  Some of both on each side. 

And today, a whole lot of world is falling to the filth that is islam because muslims are zealots and christians moderate.
I liked the way muslims were treated in the movie, hell that should be the standard procedure.

[Dash Jones]

To me Kingdom of Heaven was crap because all the Muslims were moderate and the Christians were zealots. Some of both on each side.

And today, a whole lot of world is falling to the filth that is islam because muslims are zealots and christians moderate.
I liked the way muslims were treated in the movie, hell that should be the standard procedure.

That's a sentiment that circulates in some Europeans now, especially with the influx of Muslims into Europe and their attempts to override European society.  In many ways it's worse than what the U.S. complains about when talking about their own southern border problems and the illegals in their own nation.

However, if I recall from Kingdom of Heaven the Muslims did quite well and were treated quite well, even surrendered to after the Christians gave up Jerusalem.  I don't know if I want to have us quite follow that path.

[Mackie]

To me Kingdom of Heaven was crap because all the Muslims were moderate and the Christians were zealots. Some of both on each side.

And today, a whole lot of world is falling to the filth that is islam because muslims are zealots and christians moderate.
I liked the way muslims were treated in the movie, hell that should be the standard procedure.

That's a sentiment that circulates in some Europeans now, especially with the influx of Muslims into Europe and their attempts to override European society.  In many ways it's worse than what the U.S. complains about when talking about their own southern border problems and the illegals in their own nation.

However, if I recall from Kingdom of Heaven the Muslims did quite well and were treated quite well, even surrendered to after the Christians gave up Jerusalem.  I don't know if I want to have us quite follow that path.

Speaking of physical confrontation and fighting against them in general.

[Dash Jones]

Just like Americans complain about the illegals in their nations coming and ruining some things, there needs to be some actions against those who come and try to change the culture and neighborhoods, add to crime, and basically drive down the basic morals of society.

Ireland has taken some changes in who can be citizens and such, and some other nations have as well, but it's a growing problem.  Basically they need to change and become Europeans before Muslims instead of the other way around which is where the great difficulties are coming in some opinions.

[Alidar Jarok]

There are two problems with that.  First is that a lot of Europeans don't want them to become Europeans and really try to emphasize that fact, which leads to resentment where immigrants refuse to become European.  Second is that they get accepted into the country anyway, since, aside from a few places (Ireland being one of them), European birth rates are declining and need to rely on immigration to keep numbers up.

Generally speaking, second or third generation immigrants become just like everyone else in a stable society, but first generations usually do not.

[Mackie]

There are two problems with that.  First is that a lot of Europeans don't want them to become Europeans and really try to emphasize that fact, which leads to resentment where immigrants refuse to become European.  Second is that they get accepted into the country anyway, since, aside from a few places (Ireland being one of them), European birth rates are declining and need to rely on immigration to keep numbers up.

Generally speaking, second or third generation immigrants become just like everyone else in a stable society, but first generations usually do not.

Maybe because one either is or is not an european. you dont become one.
I'd like to continue this discussion and especially the laughable american point of view of it, but I think that would get the thread moved to a another forum which only a few see :p
Just to let you know and not to let you hanging.

[Dash Jones]

There are two problems with that. First is that a lot of Europeans don't want them to become Europeans and really try to emphasize that fact, which leads to resentment where immigrants refuse to become European. Second is that they get accepted into the country anyway, since, aside from a few places (Ireland being one of them), European birth rates are declining and need to rely on immigration to keep numbers up.

Generally speaking, second or third generation immigrants become just like everyone else in a stable society, but first generations usually do not.

I don't really think they are getting accepted too much, more like annoying the populace, but I digress.

[Panzergranate]

The battle monument, errected after the battle, starts with the lines, "Go tell the Spartans we who lie here died for them!!"

For 300 well placed men to hold out against an Army of thousands was good millitary strategy in play.

Also, in another battle, 4 carpenters managed to hold a bridge over a deep gorge long enough to destroy it with axes. They held out against thousands as well but the enmy could only advance two abreast and fell victim to the massive bronze axes of the carpenters.

As for Xerxes, within a year of the defeat by the Greeks, he had been assinated and internal conflicts started to errode the Persian Empire over the power vaccuum created.

The war with the Persian Empire had caused the various Greek tribes to forget their petty differences and unite together. This was the begining of a united Greece, which, in turn, led to Plato's Republic.... The start of Democracy.

[Alidar Jarok]

Actually, the war with Persia led Athens to emphasize the need for security over Democracy and opress the members of the Ionian and Aegean Poli by forcing them to pay tribute to the Delian League.  It led Sparta to go from isolationist to a power that formed its own alliance to confront the Delian League.  This led to one of the most brutal, devistating wars imaginable.  In the end, although Sparta was declared the victor, they couldn't hold onto power (having alienated their Greek allies by turning to the Persians for help and giving them back control of the Ionian cities that had gained their freedom because of the war with Persia).  It also led a series of wars and shifting alliances that left the Greek city states too weak to stop a barbarian monarchy from taking over and conquering them all (Phillip of Macedon).

Of course, democracy would have been crushed earlier had Xerxes won and the Delian League was the golden age of Athens (so, by extension, democracy flurished in the city itself).  But the Persian War didn't lead to the start of Democracy or a unified Greece.

[Panzergranate]

The Native Americans had an immigration problem a few hundred years ago. They had lax border controls, especially on the East Coast.

The immagrants first arrived in small number, but gradually,over the decades, their numbers increases as more flooded in.

The country's morals declined, crime increased, polution increased, envioronmental damage increased, and, eventually the immagrants took over control of everything!!

The Persians were not Muslim, as this faith was not founded until 800 AD. The Persian Wars were over a mellienia before then.

The Spartans aren't the only small body of men to hold up a vast army in history.

In 1941, 6 men in a KV2 "Land Dreadnaught" heavy tank , sat on a hill and held up 2 German divisions for 3 days. It took seven 88mm. gun hits to finish them,as previosu attempts with 50mm. and 37mm. anti-tank and tank guns over the previous days had failed to even scratch the armour.

Ironically, if they'd held out just another 4 hours, the Russian would have been able to defeat the German invasions throughca counter attack from a strong position. however the Germans occupied this position and the attack never happened.

The event was in the first few days of the invasion. We were taught this as an example, in the Army,  of how sometimes, idividuals or a small group, realising that they are in a key position, can change the course of a war if they make the right informed decissions.

These 6 men nearly came close to changing history by just 4 hours!!

I remember the old 1960's Spartan film. The traitor led some of the Persians, via a mountain pass, to attack the Spartans from behind, cuttingv off their escape route.

[Commander La'ra]

The Free French also stalled the Germans at Bir Hakeim long enough for El Alamein to happen.

[Panzergranate]

History is full of instances where small bodies of people, seeing the big picture, realising that they are in the position to make the crucial difference by buying time for others, will make the supreme sacrafice for the common good.