Topic: Why not listen to the community? (Read 5609 times)

Bastie · « **on:** March 10, 2003, 04:13:30 pm »

It is a shame that Taldren can't ever finish what it starts or complete what it has promised. I have stuck with Starfleet command since the original version. I proceeded to buy sfc II, OP and sfc III. It's amazing to me that I never learn my lesson. Like a lamb to the slaughter I continue to shell out $50 a game for a half working pile of crap that will never produce the kind of gameplay that the company promises. As a long lasting member of the SFC community I have held onto the ideal that my opinions and ideas could help shape and mold the next version of SFC into a game which would have better playability. How does Taldren and the game developers repay die hard SFC fans and players? They choose to ignore and ban us so they can line their pockets with their dishonest profits. It is a shame that Players and testers such as EmeraldEdge and others have been treated so poorly after they have invested countless hours in helping to develop the SFC games. All many of us ask is for Taldren to finish what they started. Taldren, please stop killing the once great idea of Starfleet Command. Take the time to have integrity and make the SFC games all that you promised they would be. Please listen to the community and the testers when developing your games and don't make outrageous promises that your games can't keep. I am sure there are those people who are out there who are completely satisfied with what they have purchased and could care less that they recieved a product that is made substandard by the companies own promises of performance. For those people I'm glad your happy with what you recieved. There are many gamers though who continue to hold onto the hope that they will finally recieve what they have been promised. I'm sure Taldren will ignore this post as they have all the others or perhaps this post will never make the forum. I'll we ask Taldren is to give us what you promised. A Game that works like you said it would. Please take the time and correct the mistakes made with OP. I single that specific version out because I know that it has recieved the least attention and has the most potential.

The one and only,
Bastie

KBF-Dogmatix · « **Reply #1 on:** March 10, 2003, 04:45:40 pm »

Oof...there's some seriously harsh language in there. I think you go way over the top on your accusations.

jimmythehat · « **Reply #2 on:** March 10, 2003, 04:50:35 pm »

oh, this post is gonna get flamed. Before you respond, or anyone else posts something along a similar vein as this, I suggest you READ over the possibly hundreds of posts covering this topic.

On a personal note, I've purchased every SFC title since the beginning. Heck, i think i still might have the SFC1 demo on a hard drive somewhere. Taldren/ 14 East went through a lot of.... argh, getting so p*ssed i can't finish the thought.
All I gotta say is, the Taldren gang stood behind their products long after they had to, and I'm proud to say I stand behind them. Among the few things in this world i have faith in is Taldren.
flame away

3dot14 · « **Reply #3 on:** March 10, 2003, 05:14:24 pm »

However, on that note:

What DID happen to EmeraldEdge?
(notice he has disappeared from moderators list)

MrCue · « **Reply #4 on:** March 10, 2003, 06:26:19 pm »

Joking

jdmckinney · « **Reply #5 on:** March 11, 2003, 08:00:58 am »

Emerald was removed as a moderator. As for any other issues between him and any of the Taldren staff, they are not my place to discuss. However, I will point out that Emerald still has (to my knowledge) posting access in the open SFC forums. He could slam Taldren over whatever disagreements they have, but has chosen not to. I applaud anyone who stands up in his defense, though he certainly doesn't need others to fight his battles.

As for the statements made by Bastie, I imagine many people have felt the same at one point or another in their frustration with some major problems in the games, especially OP. While he probably crossed a line of civility, his opinions are perfectly valid. I know Taldren employees are often hurt by such posts, offended and angered, but when they lash out to ban or limit access to people who are at least as PASSIONATE about their games as they are, and who want to help make things better, I have to wonder if they want just yes-men and blind support in these forums, even if it means game-killing issues are left unresolved and untested.

I would prefer to see more cooperation and communication between Taldren and this community, with more open debate that does not degernate into harsh insults. On the other hand, that is the risk you run when you have an open forum where people express their strong feelings on a variety of subjects. Taldren has certainly supported their games beyond what many other developers would have done, but the fact remains there are game-breaking bugs with OP's D2 and other aspects of the SFC series. The less players hear directly from Taldren on the progress being made to fix them, the more likely they will speak up in frustration.

On a lighter note, has anyone here played Freelancer? If not, I suggest you try it. The multiplayer is free, and I have not yet run into any gameplay bugs that prevent the game from working as it is meant to. The server directory and server app stability could use improvement, but overall it is a very satisfying and solid game. Hopefully Taldren's next release will learn from the successes of this and other games in the genre. I think they can build a killer if they learn from the community and the industry, and push the envelope on what can be done.

With respect,

Monty · « **Reply #6 on:** March 11, 2003, 08:55:16 am »

Quote:

As for the statements made by Bastie, I imagine many people have felt the same at one point or another in their frustration with some major problems in the games, especially OP. While he probably crossed a line of civility, his opinions are perfectly valid. I know Taldren employees are often hurt by such posts, offended and angered...

Taldren has certainly supported their games beyond what many other developers would have done...

Hopefully Taldren's next release will learn from the successes of this and other games in the genre. I think they can build a killer if they learn from the community and the industry, and push the envelope on what can be done.

I followed most of the 'drama' on the forums when i got the game about 3 months ago though only started posting recently. As someone studying software engineering I can certainly appreciate the lengths Taldren have gone to after their games were published... I can also appreciate how they would react to those posts that take away from their work and cross that line from criticism into insult. My understanding from reading previous threads is that alot of problems arose from 'miscommunication' with activision, although they have stated on these forums that those are now of the past and they look forward to better cooperation.

I would like to thank Taldren for their efforts on the patch and very much look forward to their next release.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #7 on:** March 11, 2003, 09:18:36 am »

Monty, you should also know that a lot of the angst and antagonization around here stems from past versions of the game. SFC3 certainly could be considered having the deck stacked against it based on the history of this board. In particular, Orion Pirates seems to be a continuing point of argument and frustration for all concerned.

TalonClaw · « **Reply #8 on:** March 11, 2003, 09:39:07 am »

Bastie you have a right to vent on your frustration but EAW is a very good game with the last patch. Very worth revisiting. I think it lives up to what was promised. OP I agree fell short but it is still being worked on. We are testing patches. The last patch for SFC3, although not official, is a very good patch.

Monty · « **Reply #9 on:** March 11, 2003, 12:53:13 pm »

jdmckinney, I was aware of the frustration that has built up for those of the community that have purchased every title in this range. I believe there is still a very active thread in this forum on the OP patch. In the threads started while everyone(including myself) was waiting for the, now released, patch to SFC3 it was quite evident.

I am not dismissing the feelings or experiences of other members. Everyone has the right to an opinion and to express it. I just wanted to state that i can understand how the people who actually work on this title- and might work on future(hopefully) releases- would feel, especially when a construcive criticism spills into an insult. I would consider myself an optimist at heart. I would like to think that most of the issues, if not all, will eventually be solved.

I realise that my post, made with a shortage of time on my hands, could come across as quite ignorant. I did not mean to slight anyone.

I owned, and still possess, Starfleet Command 1. My memories of it are a bit vague but i do recall enjoying it and liked playing a title that had the star trek license but was a 'real' game also. I passed on SFC2, though after reading the forums and hearing some of the experiences that players have had in the D2 I might some day soon purchase it and try my hand at it.

jdmckinney · « **Reply #10 on:** March 11, 2003, 02:16:38 pm »

Monty, I didn't mean to imply you weren't aware of other issues. I just wanted to point out how the evident frustrations were not only due to recent developments that came along with the release of SFC3, and that there are still unresolved issues that have people gnashing their teeth. Most people who read or post here, I would guess, feel Taldren has made valiant efforts to support and improve the series. In fact, the emotions are probably heightened simply because of Taldren's past history of support. It leaves those who want the products to live up to their potential wanting more, even expecting it. Unfortunately, the negativity occasionally outweighs the common goals we share, which is when things start to get ugly.

Harold Nez · « **Reply #12 on:** March 12, 2003, 05:48:34 am »

Here's an old boot camp saying for ya....Save the drama for your mama.
Peace.

Bastie · « **Reply #14 on:** March 12, 2003, 01:04:27 pm »

EmeraldEdge was banned for his opinions. He gave his time and effort to better the game and they banned him. I have not seen him in a while and the last I heard was that he was trying to get back but since we have lacked his presence on the forums I would assume that his attempts have not been successful. As for the harshness of my post I can only say it is frustration at for what the game was promised to be and what it could still be. I would like to appologize to anyone who feels this post is a personal attack. As we all know decissions usually come down to one or two people and the rest of us just do our jobs like we have been asked to do. I would like to thank all the techs and engineers who have made this game fun and have put in countless hours. I would like to thank those who have picked up the cause after the decision was made to move on to soemthing else and I would especially like to thank those people out there who have offered their time and energy to test the game and provide feedback. I am still amazed that so many people with so many different ideas and attitudes could come together and enjoy a game like SFC. I long for the days when we had several hundred people online playing together. SFC has had a great community and I would like to thank everyone for sticking with the game and making it a good experiance.

the one and only,

Bastie

DonKarnage · « **Reply #15 on:** March 12, 2003, 01:17:22 pm »

i have patch 2525 for op but there still a bug in it, if a mission involve romuland well there not present, not a missing mod but just not were there supose to be, like attacking a starbase and there no base present is anoying to see a good game having some problem like that,(beside the original mod that are just very basic and ugly), i dont know about sfc3 since there no demo for it and i will not pay around 50$/us for a game that i might not like but taldren should see what the game syas about the games and should try harder to make wort paying a big price on a game, i remember a few year back i was looking for patch for a game an saw around 10 patch for 1 game ans how much did the game cost well i dont know but for sure it was more that 20$/us for it, so a game should be check more before its available, sure there always a few bug that escape but there other basic stuff that should be check and fix insted of patching the game, or is a patch that is aivalable and later the will make the game for it?.

EmeraldEdge · « **Reply #16 on:** March 12, 2003, 04:30:40 pm »

OK, just to clarify. I was removed from the testers forum, for my "negative reminder traffic" in the general forums. So, in an attempt to cut down on such traffic they no longer desire my assistance in testing.

As for "trying to get back in", I just never think that stuff works. It's like sueing someone to get your job back, the environment is still the same, except the guy who fired you in the first place has got to be double chapped now, so it only makes things worse. I did write a few e-mails in the hopes that someone could finally get the ball rolling on the OP D2 matters, though.

I haven't posted, because I'm just burned out and what is there left to say. I kind of believe there was a sub-influence to the whole situation, but I don't even want to talk about. I would like to say, that when I post about OP, it is mainly to reiterate the situation, in a thread that someone else has started, asking about it's status. Generally in these threads, said person get's attacked and called and impatient whiner, and I feel that this is out of line, and say so. It has been a year and a half with no movement on the major issues afterall (oops, there I go again...)

As for SFC3, yes I was very disappointed in it. I don't believe it is wrong to state so, either. Are there good things in it? Yes, and I have said so, but overall I believe it is lacking. As for the reveiws of the game, I think if you read my posts on the matter, that I don't believe that people can't like the game, or are just shills for the company, but rather the reviews cannot be held up as evidence of the massive superiority of the game, because of the partial-false content of the reviews. Many clearly talk about elements of the game that are not even there (missiles, ecm, etc.).

Anyhow, that's the basics.

Toasty0 · « **Reply #17 on:** March 12, 2003, 04:45:15 pm »

Good to hear from you Emerald...just to let ya know, many of the testers miss your wit and insight.

Best,
Jerry

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Topic: Why not listen to the community? (Read 5609 times) var addthis_config = {"data_track_clickback":true};

Bastie

KBF-Dogmatix

jimmythehat

3dot14

MrCue

jdmckinney

Monty

jdmckinney

TalonClaw

Monty

jdmckinney

LongTooth

Harold Nez

Toasty0

Bastie

DonKarnage

EmeraldEdge

Toasty0

RogueJedi_XC

LongTooth

Topic: Why not listen to the community? (Read 5609 times)