Topic: ---> WinXP After June 30th -- Quick Question

[weymoth]

Some articles say that OEM PCs with XP pre-installed will not be available after 6/30/08.

But I need a new XP PC after then I can still buy a no-OS machine and a shrink-wrapped copy of WinXP Home (or Pro), and MS will let me activate it, right?

I just want to be sure.  Thx.

[Pestalence_XC]

MS will have to let you activate for the next 100 years. They don't have to support the OS, but they do have to let you activate.

MS has several programs and possibly several businesses that will be using XP for many years to come. MS is going to have to allow activation or they may be court ordered to allow activation by big business suing them..

MS has no plans to end XP activation, they just plan on stopping support about a year or so after XPSP 3 comes out.

[Vipre]

I have a related question, I think.

Is there a way to get all the updates for XP and burn them to CD/DVD? Does MS stopping support include "Windows Update" no longer working?

[Pestalence_XC]

well, like Windows update can stop supporting the updates like they did Win 98, however they still have the updates for ME and support ended long ago. you can still get the last updates for ME using the Windows Update even though support ended 3 years ago.

I figure Windows XP updates will probably be taken offline around 2014..

However you can go to the Win Xp site and You can look around there for individual updates.. there should be a page on them... or you can wait for XPSP 3 an just burn that to a DVD-RW and then as updates come out after that, you can read the security bulletin and get the individual DL of the file and add to your Disk that has XPSP 3 on it.. that way yo will have all the latest updates in the event your system goes down... However probably by 2012, there won't be any software made for XP, it will all be made for Vista or Windows 7. You may upgrade before then.. I would probably keep XP for older software support though and Dual Boot your system like I am doing with Vista and XP.

[Nemesis]

MS will have to let you activate for the next 100 years. They don't have to support the OS, but they do have to let you activate.

MS has several programs and possibly several businesses that will be using XP for many years to come. MS is going to have to allow activation or they may be court ordered to allow activation by big business suing them..

MS has no plans to end XP activation, they just plan on stopping support about a year or so after XPSP 3 comes out.

I'm going to have to disagree with you.

1/ Big businesses will have volume license keys and don't need to worry about the activation servers being shut down.

2/ Consumers do .
   a/ Microsoft is turning off the DRM servers for MSN Music.  Link to full article

"As of August 31st, we will no longer be able to support the retrieval of license keys for the songs you purchased from MSN Music or the authorization of additional computers," Microsoft said in an e-mail that was sent Tuesday to former MSN Music customers.

That means consumers who purchased songs from MSN Music and who want to port their library to a new device -- in case of, say, a hardware failure or desire to upgrade -- won't be able to do so after the end of August.

   b/ This was discussed once before (link).  The site with this information no longer lists the quote below.

Will Microsoft use activation to force me to upgrade? In other words, will Microsoft ever stop giving out activation codes for any of the products that require activation?

No, Microsoft will not use activation as a tool to force people to upgrade. Activation is merely an anti-piracy tool, nothing else.

Microsoft will also support the activation of Windows XP throughout its life and will likely provide an update that turns activation off at the end of the product's lifecycle so users would no longer be required to activate the product.

That said I think it will be at least a few more years before they turn off the XP activation servers. 

With the dropping of the MSN Music DRM servers Microsoft has shown the fatal flaw of DRM by any name and the future of Windows XP and all other Microsft products that muse be activated.  Those who control the DRM can deny you the use of what you paid for at any time.

[Pestalence_XC]

MS will have to let you activate for the next 100 years. They don't have to support the OS, but they do have to let you activate.

MS has several programs and possibly several businesses that will be using XP for many years to come. MS is going to have to allow activation or they may be court ordered to allow activation by big business suing them..

MS has no plans to end XP activation, they just plan on stopping support about a year or so after XPSP 3 comes out.

I'm going to have to disagree with you.

1/ Big businesses will have volume license keys and don't need to worry about the activation servers being shut down.

2/ Consumers do .
 a/ Microsoft is turning off the DRM servers for MSN Music. Link to full article

"As of August 31st, we will no longer be able to support the retrieval of license keys for the songs you purchased from MSN Music or the authorization of additional computers," Microsoft said in an e-mail that was sent Tuesday to former MSN Music customers.

That means consumers who purchased songs from MSN Music and who want to port their library to a new device -- in case of, say, a hardware failure or desire to upgrade -- won't be able to do so after the end of August.

 b/ This was discussed once before (link). The site with this information no longer lists the quote below.

Will Microsoft use activation to force me to upgrade? In other words, will Microsoft ever stop giving out activation codes for any of the products that require activation?

No, Microsoft will not use activation as a tool to force people to upgrade. Activation is merely an anti-piracy tool, nothing else.

Microsoft will also support the activation of Windows XP throughout its life and will likely provide an update that turns activation off at the end of the product's lifecycle so users would no longer be required to activate the product.

That said I think it will be at least a few more years before they turn off the XP activation servers.

With the dropping of the MSN Music DRM servers Microsoft has shown the fatal flaw of DRM by any name and the future of Windows XP and all other Microsft products that muse be activated. Those who control the DRM can deny you the use of what you paid for at any time.

I have to disagree with you on that.. Corporations and big businesses have a Corporate key that they use on their internal network that requires activation from the main system. Once the main system is activated, all the end terminals on the network will auto-activate from the main system. This is the function of Windows XP Corporate Edition

There are Installations of XP Professional that do not require activation that are used as educational tools in Computer Science labs across the nation in colleges. The XP Professional copy is the only version that has a Universal key distributed with it, however MS may be going to incorporate such a key by way of update for Home, MCE, and Corporate users to remove the need for Activation. Thus MS is providing a version of activation which will last for the next 100 years or more.

I have one such copy myself with a Universal key that does not require Activation.. I got it from the Computer Sciences professor at TLU in Seguin, TX. Original disk unopened. That is how I attempted the Dual boot on my Vista machine. TLU is now studying Vista Ultimate install process and update process. Their Vista edition needs no activation, the purpose and process of their study remains the same. Their class works with understanding how the OS operates the hardware and software environments from install onward. Since most computer labs do not have Internet Access, Microsoft provided them with Universal keys.

When the lifecycle is over, MS will only be producing systems and services for Vista, Win 2K3, Windows 7 and maybe Win 2K3.. XP will no longer receive updates. Since no more updates will be released, then the OS is declared dead and MS should have already release an update to remove activation.

With the Genuine Windows Validation Tool, Activation for XP should not be needed if they release a no activation update.. It may not stop all piracy, but it will keep is slow it as it checks for cracked kernel files.

The updates will remain online for 5 to 7 years after the lifecycle ends.. just like previous versions of Windows and as such, Anyone that is using XP should be able to operate it without incident. People who are smart will have all updates burned to disk anyway, including the one that removes the need for Activation.

As for the DRM in Windows, You can port the music from Windows Media to a WMA file and then burn to CD or convert to MP3 with various other software. DRM was a joke to begin with.. I have never came across a file that various codec packages could not play in Media Player (Klite) and I have always been able to find software all over the place to convert WMA to MP3 without a problem regardless of DRM. Heck, Real and Quicktime DRM does not work either with the Real Alternative and Quicktime Alternative installed into Media Player.

Once in an MP3 format, you can easily transfer to MP3 player or to I-Pod. Microsoft knows DRM is a joke which is why the service is ending.. Vista has DRM in it as well and does not work.. turning off DRM at the Microsoft site will just make it easier to get music files, it will not stop the end user at all, it will help them.

Microsoft is not going to shaft users of XP right away, Heck their Microsoft Update web service still updates Window ME if you need to reinstall it. Windows 98 users are SOL as the update files got removed 19 months ago, however if people were smart and burned the updates to CDs, then they should have no problem running Windows 98 right now.

Same goes for Win 2K at the end of the lifecycle, and Server 2K3, as it will be for XP.

As you stated...

Microsoft will also support the activation of Windows XP throughout its life and will likely provide an update that turns activation off at the end of the product's lifecycle so users would no longer be required to activate the product.

finally,

You can get the activation key from Microsoft. All volume-licensed versions of Vista (OEM), along with retail and OEM versions of Vista Business and Vista Ultimate, come with downgrade rights. That means you're entitled to an XP activation key from Microsoft or your PC maker. (Interestingly, you can downgrade even further if you wish: The license also entitles you to Windows 2000 Professional, Windows NT 4.0, Windows 98, or even Windows 95.)

[Pestalence_XC]

Also,

Users who reformat their hard drive and perform a clean installation of the operating system will find that they need to reactivate the product. But, as long as the new installation is on the same system and there won't be any hardware changes it is possible to transfer the existing product activation and skip having to go through the product activation process again. Follow the steps below to save the activation status information and restore it once your system is rebuilt:


1. Double-click My Computer
2. Double-click on the "C" drive
3. Go to the C:\Windows\System32 folder (you may have to click on the link that says "Show The contents of this folder")
4. Find the files "wpa.dbl" and "wpa.bak" and copy them to a safe location. You can copy them on a floppy drive or burn it onto a CD or DVD.
5. After you have reinstalled Windows XP on your reformatted hard drive, click "No" when asked if you want to go ahead and go through the activation process
6. Reboot your computer into SafeMode (you can either press F8 as Windows is booting up to see the Windows Advanced Options menu and select SAFEBOOT_OPTION=Minimal or follow the instructions in Starting Windows XP in SafeMode
7. Double-click My Computer
8. Double-click on the "C" drive
9. Go to the C:\Windows\System32 folder (you may have to click on the link that says "Show The contents of this folder")
10. Find the file "wpa.dbl" and "wpa.bak" (if it exists) and rename them to "wpadbl.new" and "wpabak.new"
11. Copy your original "wpa.dbl" and "wpa.bak" files from your floppy disk, CD or DVD into the C:\Windows\System32 folder
12. Restart your system (if you followed the directions in Starting Windows XP in SafeMode you may need to go back into MSCONFIG to turn off booting into SafeMode)

There is more than 1 way to skin Microsoft.

[Pestalence_XC]

For OEM versions of XP Pro and XP Tablet

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb457078.aspx

[Centurus]

For OEM versions of XP Pro and XP Tablet

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb457078.aspx

The keys provided in the link you posted are not valid.  I tried the keys several times once.  They all came back as non genuine when I tried to activate.

[Centurus]

I have a related question, I think.

Is there a way to get all the updates for XP and burn them to CD/DVD? Does MS stopping support include "Windows Update" no longer working?

All updates for Windows can be obtained through the following website.  All service packs, all hotfixes, all Windows updates, just about everything.

http://catalog.update.microsoft.com/v7/site/Home.aspx

You can use a program called nLite to integrate any and all Windows updates and service packs straight into an XP install disc.  You can even integrate your hardware drivers into the works.  Works pretty damn nice. 

You can also use the same program to modify the install process by removing Windows components that you don't need and even setting up an unattended install so you don't have to sit and wait for the XP install to require input from you. 

Once you're done making your modifications and slipstreaming your updates, the device can either create a bootable ISO for you, or actually burn you a new install disc, and you can use your existing CD Key.

You can get the program here:  http://www.nliteos.com/

I hope both Pesty and Nem are right, and Microsoft will issue some sort of update or fix or key that will bypass/disable activation for XP.  If it does, I will certainly be one happy camper.

[Pestalence_XC]

For OEM versions of XP Pro and XP Tablet

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb457078.aspx

The keys provided in the link you posted are not valid. I tried the keys several times once. They all came back as non genuine when I tried to activate.

I had used them with XPSP 1.. good to know that they are invalid with XPSP 2 and 3

[Centurus]

I found a website with a walkthrough process on how to deactivate the Windows activation in XP, and as long as you're using your own genuine key, any and all of Microsoft's validation methods to date will perceive the install as genuine and activated, and allow you full access to Microsoft Update.

[Nemesis]

I have to disagree with you on that.. Corporations and big businesses have a Corporate key that they use on their internal network that requires activation from the main system. Once the main system is activated, all the end terminals on the network will auto-activate from the main system. This is the function of Windows XP Corporate Edition

Which is what I already said.

When the lifecycle is over, MS will only be producing systems and services for Vista, Win 2K3, Windows 7 and maybe Win 2K3.. XP will no longer receive updates. Since no more updates will be released, then the OS is declared dead and MS should have already release an update to remove activation.

With the Genuine Windows Validation Tool, Activation for XP should not be needed if they release a no activation update.. It may not stop all piracy, but it will keep is slow it as it checks for cracked kernel files.

Beside a belief that Microsoft will do the right thing do you have anything from Microsoft like a legally binding commitment to do this?

As for the DRM in Windows, You can port the music from Windows Media to a WMA file and then burn to CD or convert to MP3 with various other software. DRM was a joke to begin with.. I have never came across a file that various codec packages could not play in Media Player (Klite) and I have always been able to find software all over the place to convert WMA to MP3 without a problem regardless of DRM. Heck, Real and Quicktime DRM does not work either with the Real Alternative and Quicktime Alternative installed into Media Player.

Once in an MP3 format, you can easily transfer to MP3 player or to I-Pod. Microsoft knows DRM is a joke which is why the service is ending.. Vista has DRM in it as well and does not work.. turning off DRM at the Microsoft site will just make it easier to get music files, it will not stop the end user at all, it will help them.

Which not everyone will know how to do.  In addition some people won't even hear of this until after they have lost access to their music collection.  Not everyone follows computer news and is computer literate enough to have a clue of how to do these things.

Microsoft is not going to shaft users of XP right away, Heck their Microsoft Update web service still updates Window ME if you need to reinstall it. Windows 98 users are SOL as the update files got removed 19 months ago, however if people were smart and burned the updates to CDs, then they should have no problem running Windows 98 right now.

Same goes for Win 2K at the end of the lifecycle, and Server 2K3, as it will be for XP.

As you stated...

Microsoft will also support the activation of Windows XP throughout its life and will likely provide an update that turns activation off at the end of the product's lifecycle so users would no longer be required to activate the product.

finally,

You can get the activation key from Microsoft. All volume-licensed versions of Vista (OEM), along with retail and OEM versions of Vista Business and Vista Ultimate, come with downgrade rights. That means you're entitled to an XP activation key from Microsoft or your PC maker. (Interestingly, you can downgrade even further if you wish: The license also entitles you to Windows 2000 Professional, Windows NT 4.0, Windows 98, or even Windows 95.)

Don't forget that Microsofts idea of the "lifecycle" of the product has already orphaned users of many older systems.  There are still a lot of Windows 98 and Windows NT systems running out there that Microsoft has cut off as they are past the "lifecyle" of that product.  I can't see a reason for a belief that they won't do the same to Windows XP.  They don't exactly have a past history of doing this.

I am still looking for that legally binding commitment from Microsoft to do this.  I have never seen one and don't see anything from Microsoft that indicates a past practice of doing this type of thing.  If they were handling the MSN Music issue by updating media player to handle these music files without the DRM server that would be a positive indicator but they don't seem to be. 

[magnusson_3]

Dude...get a dell

http://www.cnet.com/8301-13554_1-9928619-33.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1023_3-0-5

[magnusson_3]

lol...or not:

http://consumerist.com/382573/dell-decent-customer-service-is-going-to-cost-extra

 

I saw this article immediately after posting Dell installing XP after June 30.