Topic: Ancient astronomical device thrills scholars

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Ancient astronomical device thrills scholars

http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/space/11/30/astronomy.calculator.reut/index.html

LONDON, England (Reuters) -- An ancient astronomical calculator made at the end of the 2nd century BC was amazingly accurate and more complex than any instrument for the next 1,000 years, scientists said on Wednesday.

The Antikythera Mechanism is the earliest known device to contain an intricate set of gear wheels. It was retrieved from a shipwreck off the Greek island of Antikythera in 1901 but until now what it was used for has been a mystery.

Although the remains are fragmented in 82 brass pieces, scientists from Britain, Greece and the United States have reconstructed a model of it using high-resolution X-ray tomography.

They believe their findings could force a rethink of the technological potential of the ancient Greeks.

"It could be described as the first known calculator," said Professor Mike Edmunds, a professor of astrophysics at Cardiff University in Wales.

"Our recent work has applied very modern techniques that we believe have now revealed what its actual functions were."

The calculator could add, multiply, divide and subtract. It was also able to align the number of lunar months with years and display where the sun and the moon were in the zodiac.

Edmunds and his colleagues discovered it had a dial that predicted when there was likely to be a lunar or solar eclipse. It also took into account the elliptical orbit of the moon.

"The actual astronomy is perfect for the period," Edmunds told Reuters.

"What is extraordinary about the thing is that they were able to make such a sophisticated technological device and to be able to put that into metal," he added.

The model of the calculator shows 37 gear wheels housed in a wooden case with inscriptions on the cover that related to the planetary movements.

Francois Charette, of the Ludwig-Maximilians University in Munich, Germany, said the findings, reported in the journal Nature, provide a wealth of data for future research.

"Newly deciphered inscriptions that relate to the planetary movements make it plausible that the mechanism originally also had gearings to predict the motion of the planets," he said in a commentary.

Edmunds described the instrument as unique, saying there is nothing like it in the history of astronomy. Similar complicated mechanisms were not seen until the appearance of medieval cathedral clocks much later.

"What was not quite so apparent before was quite how beautifully designed this was," he said. "That beauty of design in this mechanical thing forces you to say 'Well gosh, if they can do that what else could they do?' "

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Pretty amazing.

[S'Raek]

Must have been a gift from those aliens, after they were done helping the Egyptians build the pyramids of course. 

Pretty cool stuff. 

[RazalYllib]

My vote is for stranded time travelers

[AlchemistiD]

They never found an ancient greek neuralizer?

[Nemesis]

Its the DHD.

[Lepton]

You guys are nuts.  If there is anything that ancient civilizations had a handle on it was astronomy as it was not only a major portion of their religious practices, but also a vital indicator of agricultural activities.  There are any number of examples of ancient monuments and markers aligning with major yearly astronomical events.  The phenomenon's regularity and easy of observation made it the obvious choice of the science of the age and of the attention of curious human beings.

What I find most amazing is that no one is seeing this as the first analog computer.  It's practically Gibbage's Difference Engine.  I've heard it passed off as a "calculator" or a kind of amusement.  This is major piece of technology for its time which is naturally why it is being discussed, yet those same experts are seemingly downplaying its importance.  Hard to believe.

[Commander Maxillius]

Actually it's pretty easy for me to believe.  It's the same mindset that the Spainish Conquistadors had.  "If we didn't think of it or if we have to change our minds to believe what we're seeing, then obviously you're wrong and all evidence must be burned."

What surprises me is that the device was actually studied with any resourses or seriousness.  The only saving grace was that it is Greek in origin.  If there was anything like that in the Mayan Kingdom we'll never know because the Conquistadors destroyed everything.  Considering what we see of Mayan intelligence that's carved in the rock, they very likely had machines like the Greek one.

[Nemesis]

You guys are nuts. 

Either that or we are joking around.

On a serious note I've read other articles that claim that bronze was valuable enough that little bronzework survives unchanged from that era as subsequent civilizations and conquerers melted down most of the existing bronze that they couldn't directly use.  That would explain why this item is unique in archaeology.  Not many would be lost at sea then subsequently recovered.  Hopefully somewhere there are intact units still to be rediscovered. 

It does show just how much was lost at various periods of history. 

There are many things that were had that were lost.  Romans had water proof cement.  A Roman emperor according to legend had a "magic gem" that he could hold to his eye to see better (a corrective lens?).  Roman coins have inscriptions that can't be read with the naked eye - did the Roman mints use magnifying glasses to detect counterfeits?  The Egyptions had a steam engine (as a nobles toy).

How many secrets were held by individuals or small groups and then not passed on to the future when that group died out?

[S'Raek]

Good post Nemesis, I was joking at least.  It is amazing the things that have been lost and then rediscovered throughout history.  This is an amazing discovery, not for what it does but in the way it does it. 

Now if us modern folks could just get that cold fusion thing to work! 

[Sirgod]

There was a three page article in Network World magazine about just this thing. One of the facininating parts of the article, was how many characters and letters, that was on the Device, and how they are still translating them today. I'll try and find an online version of the article for you all.

Stephen

[Nemesis]

There was a three page article in Network World magazine about just this thing.

Stephen

Link to the article I believe Stephen was citing.

[Sirgod]

Yep that was it Nemesis. I just looked it up and was getting ready to post it here. a friend had started a thread over at the Hannity boards about this same thing, and I think there is alot more Information in the NWW article.

Thanks Bro. I think I'm going to keep an eye out for articles that John Cox rights, as this story really does peak my intrest.

Stephen

[Dracho]

Actually, if you read a book titled "In Plain Sight" by Gloria Farley, she makes a pretty darned good case the Maya had contact with the Iberian Celts and Phoenicians.