Topic: Campaign Movement --- / Old STOC corrupted files,. corrected.

[Skaren]

I know it is old history to you folks but I really wanted to get that corrupted Cyberboard gamebox file from the old STOC game.  That was quite the map and interesting ideal to handle turn based games.

I did some Cyber sluething and backtracked on that coinlich address and managed to get a hold of Ken Patterson (a fellow Mason, helped in him responding) and Kenneth Berry (Bear).

If anyone wants that file I now have the one that works.

S

[Lepton]

Thinkng of reviving the old game?  Still stuck on turn 24??

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Actually, thinking of starting a new one... probably use the SFB F&E tile set b/c it is already made and we have been given permission to use it.

[KBF-Crim]

Actually, thinking of starting a new one... probably use the SFB F&E tile set b/c it is already made and we have been given permission to use it.

You might get more peeps to play by posting the battle match-ups...letting people post up and commit to battles...play them and post the results....No teams...or have SMALL teams and let the rest of the players float....just play it out to see how many turns we can get out...if the vested interest is to see how far the game can go instead of simply winning...

I dunno if it would work or not....but I think it would accomidate more peeps in different time zones...

I miss the big meaty battles of a static campaign...

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Pretty much what I planned.

Racial CO's & XO's... then the rest can fly where they want to...

A few things to hash out... but that is assuming I get motivated enough to finish things...

[Skaren]

File is in the mail.

I have not really seen much interest in turn based games here, which actually surprises me.  I wonder why especially since I hear such good reviews of the games like STOC. 

The one thing I had a question on, in our campaigns we resolve the turn impulse by impulse with three impulses per full campaign turn, one hex of movement per impulse.  So the turn is kinda simultaneous movement for all players, everyone moves one, we check for battles, then we all move imp 2, check for battles, etc,...

In STOC was it like the old F&E where first one nation completely moves and then another and so on ?

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

No, all empires sent in moves & production at the same time.  Where forces met, there was battle.

Something simple needs to be added for 'reaction' movements just like F&E had.

Then the break down of battles.  Which was the biggest issue.

It would have a lot of elements of F&E, but some that just won't translate due to the limitations of SFC. (ie huge battles)

[Skaren]

For reaction movement we use PI patrol intercept for the plotted impulse.  If a fleet moves into sensor range 1 hex, two for scouts I give the guy a heads that has occurred.  He then has two days to decide to use it and move towards target, else he defaults to no move.

Here is where your going to run into the player limit wall that my games have.  How could you run a game with like 30-40 folks in it?   You gonna be calling them up and deciding on reactions/intercepts?

A possible solution I have toyed with but not yet done:

Simply do 1 hex of movement per campaign turn.  Rather than our current 3.  Turns will go fast.

By doing so you eliminate the need for reactionary movement, all movement is then reactionary. 

Battles:
What were the issues with battles that was a problem, and I will suggest how we have worked around it.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

The problem there is...

If fleet A is in XX.YY and moves to XX.YZ to intercept fleet B  what happens if fleet B moves? 

I can understand if fleet B moves 'back' a hex that no intercept occurs, but what if they move 'forward' a hex?  (ie a hex adjacent to the one that Fleet A started in)

[Skaren]

I am not sure I fully understand the issue but will take a stab.

First there is movement phase, then comes Patrol/Intercept movement.  Reactionary movement occurs in our games during the same impulse but right after regular movement.  It is after all in "response" to someone else's movement not concurrent with it.

Our campaign rules say that a PI (reactionary movement) occurs in response to a move not parallel with it.  So if someone moves next to you (into sensor range) on impulse 1,... then you have the option to enter that hex the same impulse but right after them by executing the PI, thereby triggering a battle on impulse 1 of the turn.

It also states that it you must close the distance in using a PI (similar to the Drone following rule of SFB), you cannot choose to move parallel.  It is not free movement anywhere. 

In our games scouts "see" two hexes and the PI covers quite the area then and they can guide the fleet they are stacked with, so Scouts kick ass !


Note:
In our current game the PI rule has a slight experimental change that we are looking at the ramifications of. 

We are allowing the reaction movement to also be to run away.  So if a single FF is on PI and it sees a 3 ship fleet move into sensor range one hex away, the Patrol/Intercept can also be used to high tail it away into any of the 3 hexes opposite where the attacker is.  We used to make you plot either PI or FB (fall back)  Now we are examining the combining of the two into a more flexable move for the players.  So far for this campaign, it is getting good reviews and working well.



The one area of movement that causes a chuckle in our crew is when two fleets are right next to each other and both plot to move at each other and attack.  What hex is the battle in?   We decided long ago that it is random, and now a days, use our online die roll generator to find out   

[Skaren]

There are a couple of different orders you can give a fleet in our games.

PUR, pursuit order.  A fleet is right next to you, range 1, in sensor range, you want to attack it but worry it will run.  You plot pursuit.  So if on the first impulse of movement the target fleet moves out of sensor range on impulse 1, then you move to its last known location on impulse 1, now your in sensor range again, if it moves again, same thing. 

Pursuit works where a Patrol/Intercept fails,
If you tried a PI in this example,.. when the target fleet moves for impulse 1 it is now at range 2 and you cannot see that hex so you would be prohibited from executing a PI/ (reactionary movement).

Gotta remember we have been running these for like 15 years (From SFB days) and I will say that players are bastards, if you leave one Freaking hole in the rules they WILL find a way to exploit it.  These various rules have developed over a long time of trial and error.  They are pretty tight now.

[Lepton]

Has anyone ever attempted to automate one of these campaigns via an online database and web interface?  Would that be helpful?  I am aware of a couple that have happened in the past, but none that I was really satisfied with and none that were like F&E.

[Skaren]

William Schramm over at Cuggs has done so and has run several successfull games, he is poised to run another after he finishes his latest changes in code.  It is called the ASCIII Automated Campaign System III.  I am looking forward to running in it when it rolls.  I hope I have time as he rolls his turns along like every three freaking days !!

I sure wish I had that level of skill to program like he or Bonk do.  Hand resolving movement is what prohibits me from having like 50 people play in it.

In some ways the games are nice for the small size though, and I bet they would lose the political elements that are found in ours, if like 50 people were in them. 

F&E had issues that did not go well either, it was side based movement, one side moved then another, and the range of movement was too much.  If I recall it was 6 hexes a turn using standard movement.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

In some ways the games are nice for the small size though, and I bet they would lose the political elements that are found in ours, if like 50 people were in them. 

As long as you keep only one person in charge of each race, the political developments can be more interesting....

And that would be great if a secure online interface can be had....

[Skaren]

We have always done one player, one race.  Our current game is the exception of only two teams all players must be either Fed or Klink. 

I have to admit after trying team play, it has its advantages.  Our next one will actually be a combination of teams and individuals based on the players level of involvement and commitment.  Low end players form teams, less game disruption if they cannot get a battle done,  The team mates help get it done.  Our crew abores (Josh is that spelled correctly?    any AI fights.

But agreed the politics are reduced to almost non existant, but I think that is more of there only being two teams.

Orders are always secure in our games.  They are mailed to the Ref,. and after 15+ years of ref'ing games I have earned the players respect and trust.