Topic: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels  (Read 13755 times)

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Herr Burt

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DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« on: March 10, 2003, 01:16:51 am »
Well, since people have started to notice my continued adivice for Romulans to practice in Hawk and Eagle hulls, I'd better explain the absence of Kestrels.  And I'd better don some asbestos.  I'll go hide in a vat of extinquisher foam now, and check back in a few days to see if it is safe.

THE STORY ON KESTRELS
In 2260 (13 years before the Day of the Eagle opens) the Klingons signed the Treaty of Smarba with the Romulans, and delivered a batch of D6's and F5s.  This was a clever move on the part of the Klingons to increase pressure on the Federation's eastern border, and thus keep the flatheads out of the Four Powers war.  The war didn't end as well as the Klingons had hoped, but the Treaty of Smarba did accomplish its chief goal:  The Feds stayed home.

The D6's and F5's were strictly second-rate ships to the Klingons, but represented a great leap forward in technology for the Romulans.  (Their Great Houses had been sabatoging each other's warp projects for years, more concerned with their own advancement than that of the Empire as a whole)  The Romulans converted these ships  to  KR's and K5R's.    Over the next couple of years they purchased several more batches of both cruisers and made many conversions of them later.  (The Klingons never sold any variants to the Roms; all Rom variants were converted from this original batch of KR's and K5R's and do not represent an expansion of the order of battle.)

In 2265 (8 years before the start of this game) the Klingons also sold three D7 hulls to the Romulans.  These were converted to K7R's, and then later into KCR's.  All other conversions of these D7 hulls are conjectural only, and were never in service.  No more than these three D7 hulls were ever sold.

By 2268 (5 years before the game starts), with the General war starting to heat up, the Romulans urgently requested the delivery of more D6 and F5 hulls to increase their number of warp-capable ships.  By now, however, the Klingons were at war and unwilling to part with any ships even remotely useful.  They refused any further sales.  The Romulans repeated their requests, and eventaully settled for a shipment of E4 escorts.  Even this was a raw deal.  The Romulans expected relatively new ships from Klingon mothballs, but the Klinks kept these for themselves and instead delivered only a batch of ancient E4's, worn out from years of patrols.  No more E4's were sold, and it is questionable as to whether the Roms would even have been interested.

By 2273 (the opening of the Day of the Eagle) it's thus been half a decade since the delivery of any Klink hulls.  Those kestrels still in the field are in the hands of capable starship commanders and not looking for a green captain.  The new starships rolling off the lines and waiting for new officers would be the Hawk and Eagle hulls.  A relatively young starship captain, full of promise (such as yourself) would be assigned to one of these vessels.

There are two exceptions to my above picture:

1) As part of the deal to convince the Romulans to go to war, the Klingon high command arranged the delivery of one C9 dreadnought to Romulus.  It enterred service in 2272 (a year before the game starts), and has a very experienced captain in charge.  He's not going anywhere until he goes down with his ship so you shouldn't even think about this command.

2)In the confused fighting of 2274 (a year after the game starts) three Romulan Sparrowhaks became cut off and forced to resupply at a Klingon base.  The Klingons then decided to keep them!  The Romulan Senate was enraged, and demanded the return of their ships.  The Klingons refused but agreed to transfer three D5's instead.  These became KDR's, which the Romulans found useful.  No more KDR's were ever delivered however, as the supply line between Romulas and Klinshai was soon after cut by a Tholian blockade.  The Romulans eventually found it impossible to keep these three KDR's in repair as they could no longer get spares from the Klinks and had no facilities to build any themselves.

Thus, the KDR will appear in the shipyards during 2274 only.  No more will appear in 2275 or later.  If you really want a KDR, be on the lookout during 2274 and then fight hard to keep it alive.  You break it you lose it.

The KCR was purely conjectural.  The Klinks never sold the Roms any C7's, and wouldn't have wanted to spare any.  Delivery would have been nearly impossible at this point in the war anyway as the Tholians/Feds had sealed their border quite tightly by then.

You may come across Kestrels in combat, but you will almost never see them in the shipyard.

And that's my story on Kestrels.  Fly the (refitted) Hawk.  Be the (refitted) Eagle.  You'll feel better.

-Herr Burt the hiding    
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by Herr Burt »

LongTooth

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2003, 01:28:55 am »
Understand the resons why but I think Ill be very loney flying rom

TheMaverick

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2003, 02:29:57 am »
Alright boys I'll bait him with some chocolate chocodiles and when his head pops out we will grab him, drag him clear of his hiding spot, Spread peanut butter all over him and let the Targs go after him. Then when he is tender we will flame him like no lizard has been flamed before ( I hear Dizzy makes excellent Bar-B-Que Lizard )

Ok now that we have that taken care of... What are Kestrels and why was this reason to cook Unca Scippy
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by TheMaverick »

Marcus Smythe

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2003, 03:29:07 am »
Short Version-

Kestrels are the Refitted Klingon hulls that Romulan Pilots like better than their own.  The advantages of the Hawk Hulls (greater resilience, cheaper cloaking cost, and ability to consolidate plasma strikes more easily) matter less in SFC than in SFB, and the advantages of the Kestrel Hulls (greater agility, requent use of Plasma-D, greater ease of 'over the shoulder' heavy plasma shots) matter more in SFC than in SFB.

I could go on for probably four pages why these things matter relatively more, or less, but the short version is that whilst IN SFB a Hawk is generally preferable to a KR, in SFC the KR will be more desirable to the Romulan Pilot.

I honestly feel that if the Romulan pilots are denied the option, theyll discover that the Hawk hulls dont stink nearly as badly as they thought.  The real value of the KRs was always in dealing with the 'Western Powers' (Kzin and Hydran, espc) whose drone and fighter loads a Hawk hull isnt designed to deal with.  During DOE, the closest thing to that will be the Federation Eastern Fleet, and If I Recall Correctly, the Eastern Fleet was NOT home of massive attrition units and mind-numbing droneage, so all really should be well.

That said, for the Feds, theres at LEAST one CVA.. .though it may be non-player-controlled, and it has a date with destiny over Remus, anyway.  

TheMaverick

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2003, 03:33:41 am »
Wow I gotta read in on the history of ST... All of that sounds like it would be an awesome read....

Cleaven

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2003, 06:14:42 am »
Anybody care to weigh in on why the WE's and KE's are good too?  

J'inn

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2003, 08:08:20 am »
<runs in with cooler and chaise lounge.   Unfolds lounge and plops down.  Pull out martini mixer, gin, and vermouth.   Pour crushed ice and gin in mixer.  Touches mixer to the bottle of never opened vermouth and says Presto Chango!   Hands mixer to Tracey G and yells Shake it Baby!!   Stares.  Ogles.  Drools.  (at the mixer you sickos!)  Pours a glass that's so cold the glass frosts over.   Pulls out opera glasses and relaxes.>

Ah, yes nothing quite like watching Herr Burt get roasted.   Looks like this will be a good day after all.

And Cleaven:   ROFLMAO!!!   Erm, you were being sarcastic right???   Please tell me you were.  If not, I'll be scared.  

KRolling

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2003, 08:12:13 am »
Quote:

<runs in with cooler and chaise lounge.   Unfolds lounge and plops down.  Pull out martini mixer, gin, and vermouth.   Pour crushed ice and gin in mixer.  Touches mixer to the bottle of never opened vermouth and says Presto Chango!   Hands mixer to Tracey G and yells Shake it Baby!!   Stares.  Ogles.  Drools.  (at the mixer you sickos!)  Pours a glass that's so cold the glass frosts over.   Pulls out opera glasses and relaxes.>

Ah, yes nothing quite like watching Herr Burt get roasted.   Looks like this will be a good day after all.

And Cleaven:   ROFLMAO!!!   Erm, you were being sarcastic right???   Please tell me you were.  If not, I'll be scared.  





<reads post carefully><reads it again>


J'inn? Are you and Kroma the same person??

And, if TraceyG is mixing the drink, then she would be the mixer.


<runs away>
<runs back>

Oh, interesting history on the ship...

<runs away>

Mog

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2003, 08:24:26 am »
Herr Butt, "refiited" Hawks and Eagles - care to elaborate as I'm not aware of any refits for the larger Hawks, please ?

J'inn, where's my chaise longue? And my big mug of tea? Not to mention complete lack of edible crumpet

jimmi7769

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2003, 08:39:39 am »
I guess I'm not so upset about running Fed for this campaign then....then again I haven't seen their ship choices yet.....Bruce anyone????

KBF-Dogmatix

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2003, 09:11:51 am »
Quote:

I guess I'm not so upset about running Fed for this campaign then....then again I haven't seen their ship choices yet.....Bruce anyone????  





You'll feel bad enough when your KBF brothers are wacking you out in their sub-standard WEs and KEs, petaQ!  


 

KBF-Dogmatix

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2003, 09:15:25 am »
Geez...a window of one game year to get my favorite (aside from the KCR) Romulan ship?  I guess we'll see about those Hawk hulls.  I've flown a few of them, but definitely prefer the KDR over anything Romulan up until the KCR is able to be had...heheh.


I hope the other sides' shiplist isn't anything to write home about, either.  






 

KBF-Dogmatix

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2003, 09:26:14 am »
Quote:

Anybody care to weigh in on why the WE's and KE's are good too?  





Do tell, Cleaven.


When's your battle clinic?



 

jimmi7769

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2003, 09:29:10 am »
Quote:

Quote:

I guess I'm not so upset about running Fed for this campaign then....then again I haven't seen their ship choices yet.....Bruce anyone????  





You'll feel bad enough when your KBF brothers are wacking you out in their sub-standard WEs and KEs, petaQ!  


 




I'll be gald to give you a nice warm Photonic enema DogBoy!!!

Herr Burt

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2003, 09:39:18 am »
Quote:

Herr Butt, "refiited" Hawks and Eagles - care to elaborate as I'm not aware of any refits for the larger Hawks, please ?




I'm referring to things like the SPA+ instead of the SPA, and the WER instead of the WE.  And later, of course, the FHK instead of the FHA.  And there are a few "B" upgrades that supplant the "A" versions of the larger Hawk hulls.

The shiplist opens with the latest production, and as new models come out the older ones are removed. Usually there is one year where both older and newer versions of any hull are available at the same time.  (Except where the refit ocurred before the start of this game.)  I've done this for all three fleets.   In other words, I've cleaned out all the riff-raff.

Oh dear!  <ducks>  I've been spotted!  Back to the foam pit.

-Herr Burt the hider

Bob Graham

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2003, 09:46:21 am »
Phweeew!  Boy, am I glad that racial predudice kept me from trying out those Klink hulls while practicing for DOE.  Ive been sticking to the newer hulls, and I think I will appreciate it now.

Mog

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2003, 09:46:31 am »
OK so nothing I didn't actually know of then, hmm apart from B refits ? Klingonesque B refits or the B modules fitted?

Kroma_BaSyl

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Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2003, 09:56:54 am »
Quote:

 The "mixer" is the polished metal flask in which a proper martini is shaken. NEVER stirred.    




Just another example of Romulan/Kzin war crimes. Bruising poor defenseless Gin. Oh the humanity!

LongTooth

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2003, 10:44:09 am »
Quote:

Quote:

Herr Butt, "refiited" Hawks and Eagles - care to elaborate as I'm not aware of any refits for the larger Hawks, please ?




I'm referring to things like the SPA+ instead of the SPA, and the WER instead of the WE.  And later, of course, the FHK instead of the FHA.  And there are a few "B" upgrades that supplant the "A" versions of the larger Hawk hulls.

The shiplist opens with the latest production, and as new models come out the older ones are removed. Usually there is one year where both older and newer versions of any hull are available at the same time.  (Except where the refit ocurred before the start of this game.)  I've done this for all three fleets.   In other words, I've cleaned out all the riff-raff.

Oh dear!  <ducks>  I've been spotted!  Back to the foam pit.

-Herr Burt the hider  




When you say B upgrades you do meen b rack upgrades right

KRolling

  • Guest
Re: DOE Flame thread #1: Kestrels
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2003, 10:55:59 am »
I'm telling you, J'inn, you and Kroma are either the same person, or you are adopting his writing style!!