Topic: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?  (Read 28726 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Hexx

  • Sexy Shoeless Lyran God Of War
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 6058
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #100 on: September 06, 2006, 04:20:38 pm »


Easy to do when you are at range... but not possible when you are engaged with lots of other expendable units on the board as in the last campaign.

(ie getting a mission with 4 enemy AI ..)

Maybe you just suck?

~ Hexx the helpful
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline Capt_Bearslayer_XC

  • "Sorry I haven't been around much lately. I'm easily distracted by shiney things."
  • XenoCorp® Member
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 9558
  • Gender: Male
  • Virtute non verbis
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #101 on: September 06, 2006, 04:24:50 pm »
Are the fed BCGf and BCFf the only casual BC's that have DV of 6? And that reminds me the FBCEf needs a 6 DC. Gonna ck to see if it has it.

F-BCGf  DC 6
F-BCJf   DC6
F-BCFf  DC6
F-BCS  DC 12
Political Correctness is really Political Censorship

A tax code should exist to procure the funds necessary for the operation of government, not to manipulate human or business behavior.

A nocens dies in loricatus est melior quam a bonus dies procul opus.

A bad peace is even worse than war."  --  Tacitus

"We thought we could resolve the system's problems by rationing services or injecting massive amounts of new money into it" -Claude Castonguay

Offline Capt_Bearslayer_XC

  • "Sorry I haven't been around much lately. I'm easily distracted by shiney things."
  • XenoCorp® Member
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 9558
  • Gender: Male
  • Virtute non verbis
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #102 on: September 06, 2006, 04:25:17 pm »


Easy to do when you are at range... but not possible when you are engaged with lots of other expendable units on the board as in the last campaign.

(ie getting a mission with 4 enemy AI ..)

Maybe you just suck?

~ Hexx the helpful

That IS a possiblity....
Political Correctness is really Political Censorship

A tax code should exist to procure the funds necessary for the operation of government, not to manipulate human or business behavior.

A nocens dies in loricatus est melior quam a bonus dies procul opus.

A bad peace is even worse than war."  --  Tacitus

"We thought we could resolve the system's problems by rationing services or injecting massive amounts of new money into it" -Claude Castonguay

Offline Father Ted

  • Starfleet Chaplain-Recalled to Active Duty
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1356
  • Next to Ted Williams in the freezer
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #103 on: September 06, 2006, 04:29:51 pm »

How is he acting like a 'paranoid lunatic'? He raises a valid point, that its difficult to define so called cheese as each person has their own interpretations of what a cheesey ship actually is. If you read this thread there are posts by some people who have stated what their opinion of what 'Cheese' is, and then when someone voices an opinion disagreeing with that, they get shot down.


Well "whiny bastard" is already reserved for t00l.
"stupid <expletive deleted>" is DH's moniker.
paranoid lunatic seemed to fit somehow.

And no- no offence to Ted, but hadn't raised a valid point.
He jumped into teh conversation ranting about DH being anti-Fed, which honestly given the cheeseypoof ships
for the Feds that DH & Dizzy have let into the list is absurd.

All I ever asked for was what exactly he wanted to see added/changed.
ie something to work with rather than accusations.

Of course anything changed screws something else over, the only question is does it screw someone over less than it balances the
origianl reason for the change.

If you bothered to read my reply, which it appears you didn't, you'd at least get an idea of where I'm coming from. All I'm asking for is a return of the original DNH, fix the BCG(like Dizzy will ever agree to that), and leave the DNL alone. I've always flown Fed, and I'll defend my ships from tinkering in the interest of "fairness" against anybody. "Fairness" is PC-speak for "Bend over and grab your ankles".

Captain: USS Majestik Moose NCC-1712


"Live as brave men; and if fortune is adverse, front its blows with brave hearts." -Cicero
"Superman wears Jack Bauer jammies."-Anonymous
"Better to fight for something than live for nothing." -George S. Patton

Offline Capt_Bearslayer_XC

  • "Sorry I haven't been around much lately. I'm easily distracted by shiney things."
  • XenoCorp® Member
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 9558
  • Gender: Male
  • Virtute non verbis
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #104 on: September 06, 2006, 04:43:48 pm »
This is all that has been done to these three ships:

F-DNH loses 1 AMD 12 (to compensate for bad G rack implementation) & has 6 DC (as it had in SFB)

F-BCG has 6 DC (as it had in SFB)

F-DNL YFA moves back a bit. (only a PROPOSED thing, no other change to ship) Current YFA 4.  Proposed YFA???

Exactly what is the screw job?  Moving the YFA is that bad?

And I am still waiting to see the stats on the F-BCH....
Political Correctness is really Political Censorship

A tax code should exist to procure the funds necessary for the operation of government, not to manipulate human or business behavior.

A nocens dies in loricatus est melior quam a bonus dies procul opus.

A bad peace is even worse than war."  --  Tacitus

"We thought we could resolve the system's problems by rationing services or injecting massive amounts of new money into it" -Claude Castonguay

Offline Hexx

  • Sexy Shoeless Lyran God Of War
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 6058
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #105 on: September 06, 2006, 05:05:51 pm »
This is all that has been done to these three ships:

F-DNH loses 1 AMD 12 (to compensate for bad G rack implementation) & has 6 DC (as it had in SFB)



<ponders if "compensate" is a synonym for "balance" in this case  :P >
ponder ponder ponder
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline FPF-DieHard

  • DDO Junkie
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 9461
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #106 on: September 06, 2006, 05:30:00 pm »
"Fairness" is PC-speak for "Bend over and grab your ankles".

Fairness is not being a Race-whore and realizing somethings are poorly implemented in the game.  Removal of 1 AMD12 from the DNH does not remove its teeth, just makes it a little more Warm and Fuzzy.
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Dfly

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1735
  • Lyran Alliance Lives
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #107 on: September 06, 2006, 06:42:19 pm »
And as posted before, the Fed DNL has an overabundance of power compared to all other race DNL ship due to starting date.  I will post here the ship, and starting date as per power on the ships.  All these ships have 1.25 movement costs.  List as per SG06 mod.

Fed:     DNL            57 power,    2267                         DVL       55 power    2273

Klink:    C5(series)    55 power,    2267

Rom:    SHR            58 power,    2272(5 yrs after fed-klink)

Lyr:      DNL            53 power,    2268                         DNLPp    57 power    2270

Hyd:     HGE           52 power,    2268                         HGE+      56 power    2272(5 yrs after fed-klink)

Gorn:    DNL           56 power,    2272(5 yrs after fed-klink)

ISC:      DNL           55 power,    2283(16 yrs after fed-klink)

Mirak:    DNL           53 power,    2267


By looking at when they come out, and how powerful they are(not including weapons), the Feds get a rather big jump considering how long it takes for some races to even produce one.  THE ISC get their butts handed to them as by the time they actually build one nearly all the other Dreds are already in production.

The Roms have the most powerful, but only 5 years after the Feds, Klinks, and Mirak have one out, 4 years after the Hydrans and the Lyrans, and the same time as the Gorn.

Suggested to move the availability of the Fed DNL a tad later over changing the ship is what is being discussed.  I had suggested 2 years, making it 2269, but maybe even 1 year (2268), could make a difference.

Offline FPF-DieHard

  • DDO Junkie
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 9461
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #108 on: September 06, 2006, 06:47:23 pm »
Would anyone object to the F-DN+ FYA being changed to 2267 if the F-DNL is pushed back a year or 2?
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Dfly

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1735
  • Lyran Alliance Lives
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #109 on: September 06, 2006, 07:01:25 pm »
  The DN+ would  end up being moved earlier by 5 years if you move it to 2267.  Doing this, I would expect the DNL to maybe be moved at least 2 years, maybe 3?  If so, I have no objections, and I am not even a Fed pilot.  Perhaps some Fed pilots need reply.

Offline KAT Chuut-Ritt

  • Vice Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 26163
  • Gender: Male
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #110 on: September 06, 2006, 09:07:38 pm »
The LBCHT isnt too bad... those pfs suck balls.

The L-BCHT caused a lot of consternation among the frog players in SS2 cuz there was no matching ISC ship. Would need an I-CCZ with a couple PFs or 8 to 12 CAV-IIIs to compensate. 


Kinda like the CCZ causes lots of consteration to everyone else on every other server?   :P

Offline Father Ted

  • Starfleet Chaplain-Recalled to Active Duty
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1356
  • Next to Ted Williams in the freezer
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #111 on: September 06, 2006, 10:06:56 pm »
Would anyone object to the F-DN+ FYA being changed to 2267 if the F-DNL is pushed back a year or 2?


But, but, but that is NOT SFB!!!! You can't dare change the YFA if it isn't in the Holy Grail of all that is SFB/SFC! Fix the BCG and your 72 virgins won't look like this:




Captain: USS Majestik Moose NCC-1712


"Live as brave men; and if fortune is adverse, front its blows with brave hearts." -Cicero
"Superman wears Jack Bauer jammies."-Anonymous
"Better to fight for something than live for nothing." -George S. Patton

Offline FPF-DieHard

  • DDO Junkie
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 9461
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #112 on: September 06, 2006, 10:12:06 pm »
Would anyone object to the F-DN+ FYA being changed to 2267 if the F-DNL is pushed back a year or 2?


But, but, but that is NOT SFB!!!! You can't dare change the YFA if it isn't in the Holy Grail of all that is SFB/SFC! Fix the BCG and your 72 virgins won't look like this:






Listen NannerTed, Legacy comes out in few months, I'm sure it will be fune  :P
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Father Ted

  • Starfleet Chaplain-Recalled to Active Duty
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1356
  • Next to Ted Williams in the freezer
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #113 on: September 06, 2006, 10:15:22 pm »
Would anyone object to the F-DN+ FYA being changed to 2267 if the F-DNL is pushed back a year or 2?


But, but, but that is NOT SFB!!!! You can't dare change the YFA if it isn't in the Holy Grail of all that is SFB/SFC! Fix the BCG and your 72 virgins won't look like this:






Listen NannerTed, Legacy comes out in few months, I'm sure it will be fune  :P


Not sure I want to have fune. But I'm having a blast poking fun at your pretzel logic.

NannerTed

Captain: USS Majestik Moose NCC-1712


"Live as brave men; and if fortune is adverse, front its blows with brave hearts." -Cicero
"Superman wears Jack Bauer jammies."-Anonymous
"Better to fight for something than live for nothing." -George S. Patton

Offline FPF-DieHard

  • DDO Junkie
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 9461
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #114 on: September 06, 2006, 10:16:39 pm »
Would anyone object to the F-DN+ FYA being changed to 2267 if the F-DNL is pushed back a year or 2?


But, but, but that is NOT SFB!!!! You can't dare change the YFA if it isn't in the Holy Grail of all that is SFB/SFC! Fix the BCG and your 72 virgins won't look like this:






Listen NannerTed, Legacy comes out in few months, I'm sure it will be fune  :P


Not sure I want to have fune. But I'm having a blast poking fun at your pretzel logic.

NannerTed


You expect logic?   I spend most of my time debating minutia with t00l and Hexx!
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Father Ted

  • Starfleet Chaplain-Recalled to Active Duty
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1356
  • Next to Ted Williams in the freezer
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #115 on: September 06, 2006, 10:42:11 pm »
My God, I'm sorry. If I'd known what you were up against, I wouldn't have been so hard on you. T00L is one thing but Hexx! You poor thing!  ;)

Captain: USS Majestik Moose NCC-1712


"Live as brave men; and if fortune is adverse, front its blows with brave hearts." -Cicero
"Superman wears Jack Bauer jammies."-Anonymous
"Better to fight for something than live for nothing." -George S. Patton

Offline Hexx

  • Sexy Shoeless Lyran God Of War
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 6058
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #116 on: September 06, 2006, 10:44:10 pm »



Quote

You expect logic?   I spend most of my time debating minutia with t00l and Hexx!

Such a very odd thing to say since in all of our debates I'm the only one using any sort of logic,
or intelligence for that matter.
~ Of course I find that is also a (slightly worrying) truth with pretty much any of you here.

Perhaps if we stripped all ships right back down to their SFB stats, with nothing added to any of them
to "balance" any differences we believe exist between the two systems...  :P
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline Father Ted

  • Starfleet Chaplain-Recalled to Active Duty
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1356
  • Next to Ted Williams in the freezer
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #117 on: September 06, 2006, 10:58:17 pm »
Back off! The poor soul is exhausted from debating minutia with you! Since I have a direct pipeline to the Almighty, would you prefer to spend eternity with this?



Or this?



I can arrange it either way, but since you're a contrarian, I'll tell God you want option 2 which is fine with me, as I'll take Miss O'Dell. ;)
« Last Edit: September 06, 2006, 11:09:26 pm by Father Ted »

Captain: USS Majestik Moose NCC-1712


"Live as brave men; and if fortune is adverse, front its blows with brave hearts." -Cicero
"Superman wears Jack Bauer jammies."-Anonymous
"Better to fight for something than live for nothing." -George S. Patton

Offline Hexx

  • Sexy Shoeless Lyran God Of War
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 6058
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #118 on: September 06, 2006, 11:26:07 pm »
Sure we can shift the debate to the theological if you'd prefer

Let me ask you though- since the last time I walked into a church the priest warned the congregation
to watch out for lighting strikes (true story- the moral is never go to a church where one of your best friends has become a priest)
I'm not as familiar with the dogma (so to speak) as I should be.

Now-assuming that Miss O'Dell is allowed into the heavenly eternity (as I'm not sure if actors or politicans are)
-are you permitted to have crazy naked sex with her?
Because (obviously) if you're not, then it's actually more along the lines of an eternity of torment,
but if you are-isn't that like breaking some rule or something?
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline Father Ted

  • Starfleet Chaplain-Recalled to Active Duty
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1356
  • Next to Ted Williams in the freezer
Re: DNLs: Besides the Fed, which ones are OTT?
« Reply #119 on: September 06, 2006, 11:31:05 pm »
Vows of chastity only apply here on God's green Earth. Jennifer O'Dell is my reward in the hereafter, in the world according to Ted.

Sorry, you're stuck with Barbra.  :P

Captain: USS Majestik Moose NCC-1712


"Live as brave men; and if fortune is adverse, front its blows with brave hearts." -Cicero
"Superman wears Jack Bauer jammies."-Anonymous
"Better to fight for something than live for nothing." -George S. Patton