Topic: Wondering if this can be done/Server idea  (Read 1571 times)

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Offline ShadowLord

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Wondering if this can be done/Server idea
« on: June 08, 2006, 07:00:30 am »
Look I don't have any background idea what sort of stats are available from running the server.  Obviously a lot is as Herr Burt was able to do daily pts totals based on map situations..

So here is my idea/question -- does the database allow you to determine what planet hexes have changed hands? Not just at the end of the nightly cycle but say during the day?

Why?

I think that in a territory/pvp war two things should happen...

First off as Hexx is proposing for one of his upcoming servers -- Limited OOB ships that once they are taken out are NOT subject to being replaced (well I guess unless they factor in shiprate production)

Secondly -- map issues -- what I would like to see and I know the game can't do it so it would have to be manual for the admins.. is planet hexes that change hands loose part of their econ value (permanently) every single time they change hands. Think of it this way -- A key planet is attacked many times and changes hands over the course of a server many times -- each of those battles would lower the economic production of the planet as the production facilities become damaged.
Planet A -- Fed planet Econ value 50
Klingons take it over -- now max econ value is only 45
Feds recapture however now max econ value is only 40
Roms jump in and capture planet now max econ value is only 35..

Changes what a planet is worth -- and perhaps the way you attack it as well.
Not sure if its a good idea or bad -- but seems to be a valid concept.
(maybe we would just post times of when planets fall and the admins do the math and adjust the data base ? Again I don't know what can or cannot be done)

ShadowLord

By the end of a server you may wind up with scorched planets -- and deep strikes (esp with no retreat allowed) become worth looking at in terms of economic instruments of war -- GO CHUTT GO

Offline Hexx

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Re: Wondering if this can be done/Server idea
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2006, 08:57:01 am »
I believe the hex's can be edited DB wise- in fact I *think* HB has done so
That being said however- it's far,far beyond my understanding of how to do so.

Actually I believe HB may be the only one left who knows what he's doing DB edit wise.

I'm actually attemting to set something up like the idea for Katfight, but it will admittedly pale in comparison to the idea
you suggested. (Basically it's a sliding VP scale, the more a planet's hit, the less it's worth VP wise at the end of the server)
I've got a (sort of) workable formula atm, just trying to figure out how to balance it off vs deepstrikers with disposable ships.
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Offline Mazeppa

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Re: Wondering if this can be done/Server idea
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2006, 11:44:05 am »
Excellent idea! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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Offline GDA-S'Cipio

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Re: Wondering if this can be done/Server idea
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2006, 02:19:46 pm »

All my comments are for the flatfile database.   I have no experience with running an SQL campaign.  Perhaps Bonk will weigh in with addition SQL abilities.


Quote
So here is my idea/question -- does the database allow you to determine what planet hexes have changed hands? Not just at the end of the nightly cycle but say during the day?

No, it doesn't.   The database simply does not store that data.  HOWEVER!  The logfile (a text file that is created as the game is run) does record where battles have been fought.  We have had web maps that read this file and shade the various hexes based upon how many battles had been fought there in the last 12 hours.  This data is useful for planning strategy, but is not accessible in-game nor is it useable by the game engine.

Quote
I think that in a territory/pvp war two things should happen...

First off as Hexx is proposing for one of his upcoming servers -- Limited OOB ships that once they are taken out are NOT subject to being replaced (well I guess unless they factor in shiprate production)

I agree this is a good idea.  Create a number of accounts before the game begins and fill them with ships that the yard will not produce.   Once they are gone, they are gone.

Quote
Secondly -- map issues -- what I would like to see and I know the game can't do it so it would have to be manual for the admins.. is planet hexes that change hands loose part of their econ value (permanently) every single time they change hands. Think of it this way -- A key planet is attacked many times and changes hands over the course of a server many times -- each of those battles would lower the economic production of the planet as the production facilities become damaged.

By the end of a server you may wind up with scorched planets -- and deep strikes (esp with no retreat allowed) become worth looking at in terms of economic instruments of war -- GO CHUTT GO

It's a good idea, and worth a try.    I had the concept of Raids in Economic War, which would zero out a planet's economy for a number of days, but no raids were conducted.   I probably made the concept to hard to use.  If I do it again, I'll probably just say that you can pillage any planet you currently own; getting an economic payoff added to your daily total but reducing the economic value of the planet to zero for a number of days.

Federation and Empire uses this concept in a limited format.   In order to conquer a system, you must both destroy all it defenses and devastate it.  Devastation reduces the economic value of a planet to half.  (There is no need to devastate a devastated planet to retake it.)  The catch is that if the original owner ever retakes the system, they can invest in its infrastructure and return its economic value to full.   A conquering power, however, cannot do this and must get by with half value.

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Offline GDA-S'Cipio

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Re: Wondering if this can be done/Server idea
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2006, 02:28:48 pm »
I believe the hex's can be edited DB wise- in fact I *think* HB has done so
That being said however- it's far,far beyond my understanding of how to do so.

Actually I believe HB may be the only one left who knows what he's doing DB edit wise.

With my DB editing program, anyone can edit the hexes of a flatfile database.  I've also got one that lets you edit character information, though that one isn't in the easiest form to use at the moment.  (You have to cycle through all the characters, in order, until you come to the one you want.   I was just trying to get something up quick and dirty for Econ War at the time, and will now need to polish it for others to use.)

Evil Dave also has a new version of his editor out that does several things mine don't (yet!) including swapping out a character's ship.

Given the full set of these tools, there is very little contained in the flatfile database that you cannot edit.  The catch is, you have to take the server down to edit the flatfile database!  This is why map values and prestige points could only be alterred during the nightly editing sessions during Econ War.

I haven't got time to search for them right now, but I'll dig up some links this evening if anyone is interested.

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"I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on the objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents."  - James Madison (chief author of the Constitution)

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Offline NuclearWessels

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Re: Wondering if this can be done/Server idea
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2006, 07:36:08 pm »
Look I don't have any background idea what sort of stats are available from running the server.  Obviously a lot is as Herr Burt was able to do daily pts totals based on map situations..

So here is my idea/question -- does the database allow you to determine what planet hexes have changed hands? Not just at the end of the nightly cycle but say during the day?
...


Cool ideas!

Right now the flatfile db won't support automatically tracking planets or hexes changing hands - it should be managable with the SQL version (haven't played with that though).

Manual edits are certainly possible, provided you have masochistic dedicated admins like S'ip

dave