Topic: Fed-Kzin Wars Info & Interest

[Hexx]

OK Before I actually start outting this together and have to start begging tech guys for favours
I'd like to gauge actual interest. Had a few people concerned that everyone will fly Kzin intead of fed
I'm personally more concerned about no one showing up.
Therefore- if I could ask a favour of you- if you'd like to fly on the server described (or a server basically like it) please put your name down and what race you'd fly.
If you have no interest in it please put that down as well.
This simply gives me some numbers, other than getting 20 people to sign up and assuming the rest want to play, when in fact no one does.

The Server
Planned for about 10 days (Yes I've learned my lesson)
Should launch on a Friday night, run until Sunday night of the following wekend.
If there's interest and a point, it will have the ability to run for another week after this.

Feds Vs Kzin
2273-2277
These years should be fairly well balanced, both sides are out of early, have many of their front line warships available, but ends before the super ships arrive.

VP's
VP's will be awarded for Holding major objectives, minor objectives, capital ship
destruction ratio, as well as some "raid" targets.
raid targets will be hexes/combination of hexes than can only be hit by DS (if you cna hit them normally you've already won the war so..), must be hit in a certain order, but don't have to be held- the raid is considered accomplished once the hexes are flipped the first time.

Major VP hexes will be on hte map and marked, minor VP hexes will be assigned by the owning side and are secret. A new "secret" objective hex will be revealed for each side on a predetermined basis, a side will then have X amount of time to take it out for bonus VP, of course it can always be capped normally for regular VP.

Shiplist
-Shiplist willbe centered around the Heavy Cruiser/ Heavy Command Cruiser
(if they're out, don't remember the dates offhand)
Some specialty ships will be available for general purchase, some of the "uber" ones will be assigned to accounts beforehand & will not be replacable.

~ and of course, any or all of this is subject to change as people find problems I may have missed.

So again- please put down which side you'd like to fly, or if you're not going to fly at all.

[762_XC]

Depends on the rules and setup.

Fed are a better PvP race, Kzin are a better flipping race. There's a fairly big disparity for both I think.

That's what you're going to have to try to balance.

[FPF-Tobin Dax]

Kzin

[Hexx]

Depends on the rules and setup.

Fed are a better PvP race, Kzin are a better flipping race. There's a fairly big disparity for both I think.

That's what you're going to have to try to balance.

Well nothing can really be done about the DF, again map VP setup would consist of enough hexes that both hex flippers nad fleets have a role to play.

As for PvP- is it that big a difference? I'll be the first to admit that I've never really flown Kzin ships, but on paper the  CCH seems to match up well enough to the CB
and the MCC+ seems close to the CLC. Kzin NCC seems better than Fed NCC ... carriers are about a draw, Fighters are perhaps slightly in favour f the Kzin, HAAS is marginally better than the F-18, while of course being inferior to the F-14's

[Hexx]

Kzin

Isn't it going to be embarrassing having me smack you around while flying Fed?

[762_XC]

The more you spread out VC's, the easier it will be for the flipper. If Bonk's DV thing works then fine, otherwise you will have use VC's to create choke points for PvP to have any effect.

The MCC+ is good, but not as good as the CLC. The CCH is not nearly as good as the CB.

Carriers should be close, except for those Feds which can field gatling fighters.

Maybe the CVS+ will be the balancing factor, since the Feds don't have an equivalent.

Also don't forget, the BCG is out in 77.

[Soreyes]

Therefore- if I could ask a favour of you- if you'd like to fly on the server described (or a server basically like it) please put your name down and what race you'd fly.

Your Kidding Right?

Feddy Fingers. The Other Other White Meat

[Hexx]

.... uhmm I was going to savagely Dax in a verbal smackdown for making false claims about my PVP skillz
but his post is gone..

How odd..

[TraumaTech]

i woul dhave no inteest

[FPF-Tobin Dax]

.... uhmm I was going to savagely Dax in a verbal smackdown for making false claims about my PVP skillz
but his post is gone..

How odd..

All those screenshots of you dying must be wrong.

 

[FPF-Paladin]

If I can fly it will be Fed

(I think I can... just not 100% sure when I'm getting home anymore, bleh)

[Bonk]

The more you spread out VC's, the easier it will be for the flipper. If Bonk's DV thing works then fine, otherwise you will have use VC's to create choke points for PvP to have any effect.

It won't be ready for this one. Work on it has been shelved for the moment till we get the MySQL stability issue sorted out, we're getting close. But I do intend to return to PvP DV shifts and get them working reliably.

[Father Ted]

Also don't forget, the BCG is out in 77.

T00L you bastard! That was supposed to be a secret!

[Julin Eurthyr]

What kind of shiplist are we talking here...

Remember, the Fed drone boats (CAD, NCD, their "escorts" for the Western front with 4+ dual-use G-racks and lots-'o-Gatlings, etc.) can flip hexes just as effectively as the Kzin DFs etc.

So, if we're talking a "more-or-less" stock shiplist with all these fancy ships, the hex-flipping issue will be equal.  Therefore, it'll come down to PvP ability (remember, Kzin vs. 4xAMD "drone boats" isn't the greatest thing), which the Feds will have more of (using the anti-Klingon ships).

[762_XC]

Remember, the Fed drone boats (CAD, NCD, their "escorts" for the Western front with 4+ dual-use G-racks and lots-'o-Gatlings, etc.) can flip hexes just as effectively as the Kzin DFs etc.

So, if we're talking a "more-or-less" stock shiplist with all these fancy ships, the hex-flipping issue will be equal.  Therefore, it'll come down to PvP ability (remember, Kzin vs. 4xAMD "drone boats" isn't the greatest thing), which the Feds will have more of (using the anti-Klingon ships).

Julin that is absolutely NOT true. Run 5 missions in a DF and 5 missions in an NCD or CAD. They are nowhere near equal.

P.S., The escorts were nerfed in DH's list.

[Julin Eurthyr]

Remember, the Fed drone boats (CAD, NCD, their "escorts" for the Western front with 4+ dual-use G-racks and lots-'o-Gatlings, etc.) can flip hexes just as effectively as the Kzin DFs etc.

So, if we're talking a "more-or-less" stock shiplist with all these fancy ships, the hex-flipping issue will be equal.  Therefore, it'll come down to PvP ability (remember, Kzin vs. 4xAMD "drone boats" isn't the greatest thing), which the Feds will have more of (using the anti-Klingon ships).

Julin that is absolutely NOT true. Run 5 missions in a DF and 5 missions in an NCD or CAD. They are nowhere near equal.

P.S., The escorts were nerfed in DH's list.

Then I was thinking Gatling-escorts.  I recall one server where I got an NAE or something like that (4xdrone, 4xGat, 2xPhot), and wiping ships in one pass, maybe needing a second gat shot or scatter to top off the bigger boats.  That, to me, is approx. the same speed DFs get.

And on the DH-itized escorts, hence my question as to what shiplist we're using...

[NuclearWessels]

What the hell - I sucked at Klingon but had fun on KCW anyway, I'm game to try (and suck at) Fed 
(Time flown would probably be similar to KCW - a couple of days per week)

dave

[Hexx]

Any of the escort ships with PhG's were deployed on the Rom front, they wouldn't be available
for any Western front Ops. You'd have to be insane to fly them in PVP anyway so..

And again- a NCD or CAD can run the same mission times *depending* on what the mission AI draws are.
It all depends on what the mission draws are, if a DF draws something with 3 or 4 AMD racks it's going to be slowing down as well.

AS for the shiplist- Yeah it'll be DH's, at least I think it will, everyone seems to ask him and I've just always assumed I can use it.. who know maybe DH has got J'inn on his way North as we speak..

[762_XC]

Any of the escort ships with PhG's were deployed on the Rom front, they wouldn't be available
for any Western front Ops.

Where'd you get that from? Totally not true. You're thinking of the DER and stuff. All Fed escorts have gats.

And again- a NCD or CAD can run the same mission times *depending* on what the mission AI draws are.
It all depends on what the mission draws are, if a DF draws something with 3 or 4 AMD racks it's going to be slowing down as well.

Well duh, that's the point. NCD's draw war and heavy cruisers (and can't HET), CADs draw almost exclusively heavies. DF's draw frigates, and if you're dragging him behind you at speed 31, you don't care if he has AMD.

All this theorizing about heavy droners being equivalent on paper is crap. Get in a DF and run five missions. 3 or 4 of those will be one-pass kills. Get in a CAD and try the same thing, and you''ll be lucky if you get any one-pass kills.

[Father Ted]

I have to go with T00L on this one. The mission draws in an NCA or NCE are way different from what you get in a Z-DF. It's a  simple question of mission time. A DF can end a mission in about a minute, while a Fed escort needs longer, due to the fact it draws bigger, and better ships.

On the other hand, you can't make it PvP-centric because that favors Fed ships.

It's a tricky equation, either way.

[Hexx]

Any of the escort ships with PhG's were deployed on the Rom front, they wouldn't be available
for any Western front Ops.

Where'd you get that from? Totally not true. You're thinking of the DER and stuff. All Fed escorts have gats.

I'm sure I remember reading it somewhere, 'sides who are you going to believe- me or you?

And again- a NCD or CAD can run the same mission times *depending* on what the mission AI draws are.
It all depends on what the mission draws are, if a DF draws something with 3 or 4 AMD racks it's going to be slowing down as well.

Well duh, that's the point. NCD's draw war and heavy cruisers (and can't HET), CADs draw almost exclusively heavies. DF's draw frigates, and if you're dragging him behind you at speed 31, you don't care if he has AMD.

All this theorizing about heavy droners being equivalent on paper is crap. Get in a DF and run five missions. 3 or 4 of those will be one-pass kills. Get in a CAD and try the same thing, and you''ll be lucky if you get any one-pass kills.

Don't think I ever said they were eqaul, but I do think the difference in mission time can be marginalized.

Anyway- I've realized that some of the ideas I want to try will have to be used in a slightly larger set up anyway, my original plan was to use them in a 2 race server
then see if it could be expanded.
I've come to the conclusion while writing the setup that of course they'll work with only two races, but can everything work with multiple races.

So
Main combatants are going to be Kzin vs Fed
Need one ally for each... was thinking Kzin/Hydran vs Fed/Lyran for something new.
Any other sugestions? (aside from the boring old- same sides as always)

[FPF-Tobin Dax]

"So
Main combatants are going to be Kzin vs Fed
Need one ally for each... was thinking Kzin/Hydran vs Fed/Lyran for something new."


Hmmm, now the dead pirate Hexx works on a way to be able to slip out of a fed ship into a lyran...stay tuned for further developments. (Likely about how he can land in that Lyran dred he's always running on about)

[Hexx]

"So
Main combatants are going to be Kzin vs Fed
Need one ally for each... was thinking Kzin/Hydran vs Fed/Lyran for something new."


Hmmm, now the dead pirate Hexx works on a way to be able to slip out of a fed ship into a lyran...stay tuned for further developments. (Likely about how he can land in that Lyran dred he's always running on about)

Any reports of a BCPP with photons or F-14's appearing on Lyran carriers is possibly almost completely sure to be false.

[FPF-DieHard]

This a a bad idea.   Most people simply hate flying Fed so you aren't going to get close to a balanced sides.

[Hexx]

This a a bad idea.   Most people simply hate flying Fed so you aren't going to get close to a balanced sides.

It's a great idea.
Some will fly Feds, hordes upon hordes will rejoice at their chance to fly Lyran for once in their misbegotten lives.
Kzin will be represented fairly well, and a few of the cheese mongers will go Hydran as always.

sides -if I put the Feds in people say "No one will fly Fed, not balanced'
If I put the Klinks in I get "to many people will fly Klink, not balanced"

Only other races are those deviant plasma chuckers.
And they frighten me.

[FPF-Tobin Dax]

This a a bad idea.   Most people simply hate flying Fed so you aren't going to get close to a balanced sides.

It's a great idea.
Some will fly Feds, hordes upon hordes will rejoice at their chance to fly Lyran for once in their misbegotten lives.
Kzin will be represented fairly well, and a few of the cheese mongers will go Hydran as always.

sides -if I put the Feds in people say "No one will fly Fed, not balanced'
If I put the Klinks in I get "to many people will fly Klink, not balanced"

Only other races are those deviant plasma chuckers.
And they frighten me.

If the 9th fleet were to turn out well, then the Feds would have a good chance.

[GDA-S'Cipio]

I'd fly as a Fed.

-S'Cipio

[Wraith 413]

 I'll fly FED.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Not really very interested, might make a guest appearance if I got bored that depending on the timing the shiplist, etc.  I really dislike flying Kzin in mid era unless it is against the Klingons,or Hydrans. and doubt I could see myself flying against them, although I have done it before.    The Kzin carriers aren't bad during mid at all, but I've never been a carrier jock. 

So put in in the 10-20% likely to fly non-nutter hours and 80% unlikely to fly category.  As for sides unknown as I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

One note: If you include fast cruisers (I reccomend you don't) you need to seriously rework the Kzin one. 

[IAF Lyrkiller]

I w/ chuut no interest.

[Soreyes]

Umm after thinking about it for awhile. Decided that as stated above. Not really interested. When about 7 out of 10 missions are against Escorts= not fun