Topic: Microsoft hero or villain have your say. Also Windows vs Linux.

[prometheus]

How come nobody complains about MSPaint when Photohop is obviously a competing product? (In my opinion IE is to Mozilla what MSPaint is to Photoshop). What about Gimp?

I just do not have any problem at all with IE being present on my system, it is not my default browser, I do not enable web content on my desktop or the windows explorer, I do not use IE at all... it's pretty much irrelevant to me that it is still present. It does not do anything unless I ask it to.

I concur although I do agree that tieing IE into the operating system (as opposed to making it an optional part of the operating environment) gives MS a outrageously unfair and innovatively stultifying stranglehold on the market...

[Bonk]

I concur although I do agree that tieing IE into the operating system (as opposed to making it an optional part of the operating environment) gives MS a outrageously unfair and innovatively stultifying stranglehold on the market...

But, um, other browsers are free... what market? And IE is optional, I have my IE totally inactive, it does not do a thing. (unlike quicktime or realplayer which once installed insist on running all the time and updating and whatnot... I have not installed either since my last windows reinstall because of that...)

iexplore.exe does not appear in my processlist unless I use the start menu to start IE. (I do not enable web content in folders and use the windows classic desktop) Yes IE is still installed but it never runs, only rarely when I need to test a page display in it. (e.g. I just had to fix this page to display properly in IE: http://www.dynaverse.net/gslist.php)

[prometheus]

I concur although I do agree that tieing IE into the operating system (as opposed to making it an optional part of the operating environment) gives MS a outrageously unfair and innovatively stultifying stranglehold on the market...

But, um, other browsers are free... what market? And IE is optional, I have my IE totally inactive, it does not do a thing. (unlike quicktime or realplayer which once installed insist on running all the time and updating and whatnot... I have not installed either since my last windows reinstall because of that...)

iexplore.exe does not appear in my processlist unless I use the start menu to start IE. (I do not enable web content in folders and use the windows classic desktop) Yes IE is still installed but it never runs, only rarely when I need to test a page display in it. (e.g. I just had to fix this page to display properly in IE: http://www.dynaverse.net/gslist.php)

The whole windows explorer is tied in with IE...  Even if you were to have a totally different front end, it's still Explorer that's the driving forece behind it, no?

I use Firefox personally... I won't be using IE again...

But anyway, it's just an opinion of mine, I don't approve of the way XP is installed, run and licesned at all.  Take it or leave it, the choice is yours... 

[Bonk]

The whole windows explorer is tied in with IE...  Even if you were to have a totally different front end, it's still Explorer that's the driving forece behind it, no?

No.

I've been using firefox for ages now, ever since they started tabbed browsing. Used Mozilla before that. Gotta go back to windows 2000 when I was using IE. (I refused to run Win98... I went from 95b to 2K)

[prometheus]

The whole windows explorer is tied in with IE...  Even if you were to have a totally different front end, it's still Explorer that's the driving forece behind it, no?

No.

I've been using firefox for ages now, ever since they started tabbed browsing. Used Mozilla before that. Gotta go back to windows 2000 when I was suing IE. (I refused to run Win98... I went from 95b to 2K)

Well, everytime I've installed windows from 98 up, it's installed IE components as part of the front end whether at my behest or not...  I don't like it, I don't like Microsoft and I don't like closed source code...  I'm not saying that you shouldn't but you won't convince me that Microsoft are anything other than an albatross around the neck of the computer industry...

[Bonk]

There is no iexplore.exe in the attached process list (username edited out).

Yes, Windows since 98 has been defaulting to web content everywhere (part of why I hated 98), but once you are familiar with it, its not too hard to turn it all off.

[prometheus]

There is no iexplore.exe in the attached process list (username edited out).

Yes, Windows since 98 has been defaulting to web content everywhere (part of why I hated 98), but once you are familiar with it, its not too hard to turn it all off.

You do understand though that it is the default settings that I'm complaining about?  While you and I can switch the components off, Joe or Jane Public often cannot...  It's his or her corner I'm fighting in here...

[Bonk]

There is no iexplore.exe in the attached process list (username edited out).

Yes, Windows since 98 has been defaulting to web content everywhere (part of why I hated 98), but once you are familiar with it, its not too hard to turn it all off.

You do understand though that it is the default settings that I'm complaining about?  While you and I can switch the components off, Joe or Jane Public often cannot...  It's his or her corner I'm fighting in here...

I see an opportunity for a product here...  

[prometheus]

There is no iexplore.exe in the attached process list (username edited out).

Yes, Windows since 98 has been defaulting to web content everywhere (part of why I hated 98), but once you are familiar with it, its not too hard to turn it all off.

You do understand though that it is the default settings that I'm complaining about?  While you and I can switch the components off, Joe or Jane Public often cannot...  It's his or her corner I'm fighting in here...

I see an opportunity for a product here...  

You could be right...    It's all yours though... I haven't written a line of code in fifteen years...