Topic: New Battlestar Galactica Episodes are HERE

[TheJudge]

And they are fracking awesome...the closing shots are sooooooooo perfect for this episode. 

[Sirgod]

Man I feel Bad, I feel asleep during SG, and completly missed Everything untill amazing stories started playing at 4. Hopefully, I can find the episodes online.

Stephen

[The_Joker]

Available at itunes right now, if you have a subscription.

[TheJudge]

Don't worry Stephen, the Tivo is burning a copy for you right now, and of course we'll burn copies for SG1 and Atlantis (they were both good episodes as well).

[Iceman]

Who makes a 3 part episode? I'll tell you who, people who want to make me SUFFER! I can't wait until this all comes to a sharp concentrated 30 seconds of pure televised goodness.

[Sirgod]

Don't worry Stephen, the Tivo is burning a copy for you right now, and of course we'll burn copies for SG1 and Atlantis (they were both good episodes as well).

Thanks Dan, My wife said you called me back, for the Address. Looing forward to seeing them.

Stephen

[Father Ted]

I wish Sci-Fi would do one of those marathons with "BSG" because it's simply a brilliant show. But more than than that, it would help me keep track of who's good and who's bad, Cylonwise and Colonial. If I can't have that, then give me two hours every Friday night.

[Death_Merchant]

You can buy an individual episode off iTunes for $1.99

That's cheaper than the DVD you'd be burning it to.....

[Rat Boy]

I find it quite humorous how hypocritical everyone on Galactica is concerning their behavior towards Pegasus.  The two guys from Galactica (hardly ever watch the show, so I don't know their names) murder the officer from Pegasus for attempting to torture the Boomer Cylon, but way back in season 1, the president ordered a male Cylon to be blown out an airlock.  In last night's episode, the president called what was about to happen to Boomer to be "disgusting," even though she ordered the summary execution of another Cylon.  Then there's the matter of the assassinations being ordered by both Cain and Adama.  The Galactica people had no moral grounding to claim that they are somehow better or more right than the Pegasus.  I sincerely hope Cain or someone else points this out to their counterparts in the next episode, or else Lloyd Bridges and Lorne Greene will be making a few more spins in their respective graves.

[Commander La'ra]

I sincerely hope Cain or someone else points this out to their counterparts in the next episode, or else Lloyd Bridges and Lorne Greene will be making a few more spins in their respective graves.

They've been spinning in their graves since the new BSG came out...

...simply because it's real drama with real characters and theirs was an attempt to cash in on the Star Wars frenzy with bad '70's outfits.

 

[TheJudge]

Fascape is famous for three-part episodes. 

As for Rat Boy's comments:

1.  Galactica, unlike Pegasus, did not strip a civilian fleet of ships of FTL drives, weapons, parts, food, fuel, and then attempt to split apart families when one of them had skills the Pegasus needed. Neither did the Galactica order those families shot when they refused. 

2.  The Caprica Boomer (who is the pregnant boomer we saw) betrayed the cylons by helping Starbuck and Helo escape Caprica.  She then led the Galactica crew across Kobol to the Tomb of Athena and the roadmap to Earth.  Following that, she was imprisoned in the improvised cell and not trusted much.  Even after that, she served the crew of the Galactica by disabling a computer virus before it killed the crew of the ship, and then she turned the virus on approaching cylon raiders, making them helpless while the Galactica's vipers blew them apart.  How you compare a traitor cylon who has repeatedly helped crew members of that ship, and saved the ship itself at least twice to cylons loyal to their cause and intent on destroying the colonials is beyond me.  They are apples and oranges.  Besides, she's pregnant.  Most people tend to be protective of pregnant women, whatever their race. 

Obviously you don't watch the show much otherwise you'd have known that...What still gets me are those people who hold up the original show on a pedestal and try to pretend the new show can't be nearly as good when the truth is that the new show is far better than the original could have ever dreamed of being.

[Sarek]

2.  The Caprica Boomer (who is the pregnant boomer we saw) betrayed the cylons by helping Starbuck and Helo escape Caprica.  She then led the Galactica crew across Kobol to the Tomb of Athena and the roadmap to Earth.  Following that, she was imprisoned in the improvised cell and not trusted much.  Even after that, she served the crew of the Galactica by disabling a computer virus before it killed the crew of the ship, and then she turned the virus on approaching cylon raiders, making them helpless while the Galactica's vipers blew them apart.  How you compare a traitor cylon who has repeatedly helped crew members of that ship, and saved the ship itself at least twice to cylons loyal to their cause and intent on destroying the colonials is beyond me.  They are apples and oranges.  Besides, she's pregnant.  Most people tend to be protective of pregnant women, whatever their race. 

Not to mention that they're both in love with her.

[Father Ted]

Well said, Judge. Having seen the original and the new series, I can say that the new one is far and away the better show.

[Rat Boy]

1.  Galactica, unlike Pegasus, did not strip a civilian fleet of ships of FTL drives, weapons, parts, food, fuel, and then attempt to split apart families when one of them had skills the Pegasus needed. Neither did the Galactica order those families shot when they refused.

And you trust Fisk's word completely?  You can't even completely believe the story he told about the last XO of Pegasus.  And isn't the plan that Kara presented to attack that Cylon ship essentially sacrificing several civilian ships, and didn't they already do that in another attack on the Cylons?  How do you think the people aboard them feel about giving up their "FTL drives, weapons, parts, food, fuel," to the military?  What happens if they refuse?

The only thing about Cain you can trust is that she's trying to "terminate" Adama's command, and considering how Adama's trying to do the same thing, I don't really blame her.  This is a complete breakdown in both the chain of command and the rule of law brought on by three people who've all been sipping the same insanity beer.

2.  The Caprica Boomer (who is the pregnant boomer we saw) betrayed the cylons by helping Starbuck and Helo escape Caprica.  She then led the Galactica crew across Kobol to the Tomb of Athena and the roadmap to Earth.  Following that, she was imprisoned in the improvised cell and not trusted much.  Even after that, she served the crew of the Galactica by disabling a computer virus before it killed the crew of the ship, and then she turned the virus on approaching cylon raiders, making them helpless while the Galactica's vipers blew them apart.  How you compare a traitor cylon who has repeatedly helped crew members of that ship, and saved the ship itself at least twice to cylons loyal to their cause and intent on destroying the colonials is beyond me.  They are apples and oranges.  Besides, she's pregnant.  Most people tend to be protective of pregnant women, whatever their race.

The other Boomer (the Galactica one) also helped out the Colonials, even (if I remember right) blew up a basestar before trying to kill Adama.  She even said that her breeding with what's his name was all part of an elaborate set-up, one that could be continuing.  Treating her as a partner or as something other than an enemy agent is laughable and dangerous.

And again, how does the summary execution of one Cylon make the Galactica group better than the Pegasus crew for torturing a Cylon?  Is it because there's some kind of doublestandard that because the main characters are doing it, it's one thing, but if the guest stars are doing it, then it must be wrong?

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

And again, how does the summary execution of one Cylon make the Galactica group better than the Pegasus crew for torturing a Cylon? Is it because there's some kind of doublestandard that because the main characters are doing it, it's one thing, but if the guest stars are doing it, then it must be wrong?

Torture is totally acceptable in my eyes, even killing them if fine.... but letting the crew take turns pulling a rape train on Pegasus Six is not.

What moral standing does anyone have for that?

[Rat Boy]

Torture is totally acceptable in my eyes, even killing them if fine.... but letting the crew take turns pulling a rape train on Pegasus Six is not.

Alright, let me put it to you another way: is there a doublestandard in regards to physical torture vs. sexual torture, let alone execution?  Shouldn't both the Galactica and the Pegasus crews be held to the same standard of contemptability?

[TheJudge]

Summary execution of a known enemy isn't nice and fluffy, but it is a far cry from torture.  Many people don't have a problem shooting a spy on discovery during a time of war, but torture and rape the same person and they begin to have major problems with the concept. 

Galactica Boomer and Caprica Boomer are two totally different animals.  The Galactica Boomer, because she didn't know she was a cylon to begin with had a very big handicap...conditioning that allowed the 'cylon' in her to wake up and take control.  She had no control over it at all.  Caprica Boomer has no such 'sleeper' programing and is there able to make a conscious choice about her loyalties.  Plus, Caprica Boomer isn't given the free run of the ship.  She's in a specially designed cell, constantly under guard, and the scene in the med bay is the first time she doesn't have the dog-catcher pole around her neck, and heavy shackles on whenever she's let out of that cell. 

She's being allowed to live for two reasons:  1)  She's pregnant with a colonial's baby and 2) She provides some use against the cylons.  If either one ends, so does her life. 

Starbuck's plan doesn't actually sacrifice those ships...they are just the bait.  They are pretending to have ftl problems, not actually having them.  The ability to get the hell out of dodge is still there for them.  Cain would screw up their FTL drives just to make sure they didn't get jumpy...

[Rat Boy]

Summary execution of a known enemy isn't nice and fluffy, but it is a far cry from torture.  Many people don't have a problem shooting a spy on discovery during a time of war, but torture and rape the same person and they begin to have major problems with the concept.

Funny it'd be you of all people who'd come to that conclusion.  How is it that murder without a fair hearing of a prisoner of war somehow is better than abuse?
 

Galactica Boomer and Caprica Boomer are two totally different animals.

You're making an assumption.  How do you know that Boomer #2 won't turn on the Galacticacrats?  How do you know that once that hybrid thing is born she won't turn on everyone?  If memory serves, she only started to be "helpful" after she was found out as a Cylon.

Starbuck's plan doesn't actually sacrifice those ships...they are just the bait...

They're being conscripted for a military operation where there's no gurantee that they'll survive.  How much better is that than what the Pegasusans have allegedly done?

[Sarek]

What makes this show interesting is that it examines the moral abiguities and contradictions that appear when fighting for survival.  It's an allegory for our real world War on Terror where many of us find ourselves supporting measures which would have been abhorrent pre-9/11. 

[TheJudge]

What makes this show interesting is that it examines the moral abiguities and contradictions that appear when fighting for survival.  It's an allegory for our real world War on Terror where many of us find ourselves supporting measures which would have been abhorrent pre-9/11. 

I'd have to differ a little on that one...9/11 was nothing like what the characters of Galactica have been through. Around 3,000 people died on 9/11 (and when you really think about that number, you start to realize just how over-hyped this 'war on terror' really must be).  Out of nearly 300 million, that number is less than 1% of the population.  In Galactica, the civilations went from over 12 billion to less than 50,000 people in a matter of days. 


That would the same as the entire Planet of Earth going to about 30,000 in a matter of a week.  Given that level of death, and an enemy who not only desires your entire race dead, but has the means to carry it out as well, and things become a little different.  This is one of the reasons why I very rarely criticize Israel's dealings with the Arab states.  Their neighbors, and countries like Iran, will have little compuction about doing to Israel what the Cylons did to the Colonies.  (also, remember, I said 'rarely criticize' Israel, not 'never'.)

[Bonk]

Two comments:

1) iTunes is evil, pure evil. e.g.: http://www.pcworld.com/howto/article/0,aid,122937,00.asp

2) I just can't get into the new BattleStar Galactica its just too different from the original. Not even remotely related, kinda like SFC3 vs OP...

Bonk the kurmudgeon.

[EmeraldEdge]

I'm with ya Bonk.  I've tried a few times to get into the new BSG but I just can't.  I did get the original series on DVD for Christmas, though, and it had some very interesting stuff.  If it were made today, it would also be talked about as relating to 9/11.  I laughed when I watched the episode where they tried to take away power from Adama, because they didn't like his methods "and we haven't been attacked for sooooo long.  Surely we are safe now" type attitudes.  Then all of a sudden, where are they?  yep, the wishy washy politicians and diplomats walk right into the fire and who do they run to?  Yep, it's Adama.

I had forgotten how much the original series was an ongoing thing.  Stories building upon eachother, and such.  I wonder if they had continued, how much we would have seen Fred Astaire in the series?  Plus, it was good seeing those original Vipers, all dirty and battle worn.  The new ones just don't do them justice.  They are ok, I guess, but I like the old workhorses.

[Death_Merchant]

Interesting.....

I imagine no such thread would even be possible with the original BSG.

In the original, there was no moral ambiguity among the Colonial Warriors (Adama, Apollo, Starbuck, Tigh, etc.). They were simply good (Adama & Apollo = perfect, Starbuck = good rogue, Tigh = dimensionless good guy). The only potential troublemaker was Cain, and he was good-but simply too aggressive/reckless for Adama.

Contrast that with the new BGS.....

..and witness the arguing in this thread over the aspects of morality, torture, and executions in time of war.

This is EXACTLY why I like the new BSG, and why the original BSG now makes me fall asleep in my chair...


BTW Bonk: I've had exactly zero problems with iTunes. But then again, I run in on a Mac....
Ah ha! DM ID's your problem! Frakin' Cylon-virus-riddled PC !!!!

My Mac has Colonial Firewalls that are not targeted by Cylon (Microsoft) DLL's ! Plus: It's based on old 1984 tech, not networked with PC's, and has big-honking hand switches & submarine handsets!

[TheJudge]

EE, most of the Galactica's vipers are even more worn out than the original series' vipers (which were just the same shots shown over and over again in differing order).  


Now, as for Rat Boy's points...

There is a magnitude of difference between something like 9/11 and the Cylon invasion.  The colonials went from 12 billion to less than 50,000.  They are being chased by an enemy who has proven that they are 1) Intent on destroying them totally and 2) capable of doing so.

On 9/11, the worst day of this war on terror, we lost less than 3,000 out of over 290 million people.  Worst case scenarios of terrorist attacks, even with pre-9/11 watch levels, have a dirty bomb or similar going off in a major city.  The maximum amount of casualties for such an attack is less than a million (again out of 290 million).  With the backing of a nation-state (like maybe Iran), it might be possible for them to develop a biological agent that has a high mortality rate and a high air-borne infection rate, but in all reality we have a lot more likelihood of having the cylons attack our Earth before something like that happens.  So, the worst 'our' enemy can do to us is maybe hit a million people.  Certainly such an event would be tragic (and I daresay any who helped them achieve such an attack would be ground into dust by the full might of our nation), but it could never be enough to destroy our nation (unless we let them).  

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

On 9/11, the worst day of this war on terror, we lost less than 3,000 out of over 290 million people.  Worst case scenarios of terrorist attacks, even with pre-9/11 watch levels, have a dirty bomb or similar going off in a major city.  The maximum amount of casualties for such an attack is less than a million (again out of 290 million).  With the backing of a nation-state (like maybe Iran), it might be possible for them to develop a biological agent that has a high mortality rate and a high air-borne infection rate, but in all reality we have a lot more likelihood of having the cylons attack our Earth before something like that happens.  So, the worst 'our' enemy can do to us is maybe hit a million people.  Certainly such an event would be tragic (and I daresay any who helped them achieve such an attack would be ground into dust by the full might of our nation), but it could never be enough to destroy our nation (unless we let them). 

I would not be so blase about such a biological weapon being developed or even in existence..... in the contagion was persistant enough with a bit of an incubation period, it very well could wipe out a large portion of any populace targeted, possibly far beyond the range of desired effect of the group that launches it.

[TheJudge]

On 9/11, the worst day of this war on terror, we lost less than 3,000 out of over 290 million people.  Worst case scenarios of terrorist attacks, even with pre-9/11 watch levels, have a dirty bomb or similar going off in a major city.  The maximum amount of casualties for such an attack is less than a million (again out of 290 million).  With the backing of a nation-state (like maybe Iran), it might be possible for them to develop a biological agent that has a high mortality rate and a high air-borne infection rate, but in all reality we have a lot more likelihood of having the cylons attack our Earth before something like that happens.  So, the worst 'our' enemy can do to us is maybe hit a million people.  Certainly such an event would be tragic (and I daresay any who helped them achieve such an attack would be ground into dust by the full might of our nation), but it could never be enough to destroy our nation (unless we let them). 

I would not be so blase about such a biological weapon being developed or even in existence..... in the contagion was persistant enough with a bit of an incubation period, it very well could wipe out a large portion of any populace targeted, possibly far beyond the range of desired effect of the group that launches it.

Blase?  not really, but then it requires the support of a nation-state to make something like that, and facilities that can be tracked and monitored. Sure, some limited forms can be made in the back of a semi-trailer, but not the kind that's going to kill millions.  Creating a bug that kill with high mortality rates, and is easily spread by airborne pathogen is extremely difficult and requires resources not available to non-nations. 

if it were ever achieved, it would be awful, but we dont' even know if the US or Russia had achieved something like that...we just assume that they have.

[Sirgod]

Rat Boy, I think If you did what I did, you'ld like the show. I had to wait for SCI Fi to do a marathon, and seeing Them all in one afternoon, The show grew on me. Now I didn't care for the Rape story, But It did offer a Relationsip with the Viewer that you don't see on most TV shows these days.

Stephen

PS. Just got my mail today Dan, thanks again for the DVD's Bro.

[EmeraldEdge]

The vipers may be more worn out now in the new BSG, but they are different.  They altered it just enough that I like the older models better.  The turbine intakes on the new BSG vipers are kind of bean shaped, vs. the older round ones (how a bean shaped turbine works, I'm not sure ) and a few other things.  It's kind of like the difference between an old and a new car.  They are similar, and sure maybe sometimes the new ones are cool, but sometimes the old one is just too classic, and you miss the basic rugged lines.

DM, is there something wrong with good guys?  Especially when they represent us?  I'm not opposed to problems, but as much of the new BSG, a lot of the personal issues just seemed rather trumped up (poor acting helps this along) for the sake of having problems in a character.  Plus there is too much lame, corny, cliche sci-fi stuff in the new one for my taste.  Now, I can hear you saying "but, the old one was way more..." yeah, but it was a product of it's time.  I can excuse things in the viewing because of it.  I expect higher things of programs produced now, and I fully believe that a complex challenging sci-fi show could easily have been built around the structure of the old BSG and it's mythology.  Not only that, sometimes you need heroes.  Sometimes you just want to watch some "big damn heroes" kick some butt.  That's why I liked firefly.  They were heroes in the end, but they also had problems and issues.

I would also hardly say that the original BSG didn't have anything to discuss.  For it's time, it had a prostitute as a sympathetic main character.  There was the struggle between the more militaristic leaders and the career politicians, there was the whole angel thing.  Now, it had to be presented in a package that was broadcast material in 1978, but I just don't think you can say that there was nothing that could have been done with it and they had to just take the names and start from scratch. (btw, I think the cg cylons look rediculous)

I really wanted to like the new bsg, and I do give it a try every once in a while, but everytime I watch an episode I end up rolling my eyes at some lame plot point, or bad acting (although there are a couple of folks on there who are great actors), cheese ball effects, etc.  I sometimes wonder what show everyone else is watching.  But it's a personal taste thing I guess.  I'll probably go in trying it from time to time, just because I loved the original so much that I want more.  Such is life.

[Death_Merchant]

DM, is there something wrong with good guys?  Especially when they represent us? 

Not at all. I like a good "kick the bad guy's arse" show as much as the next guy. In fact, I loved the original BSG.

But that was what? 20 years ago? I'm just interested in something new & different. As you say, to each his own...

I would also hardly say that the original BSG didn't have anything to discuss.  For it's time, it had a prostitute as a sympathetic main character.  There was the struggle between the more militaristic leaders and the career politicians, there was the whole angel thing. 

True enough, and for its time the prostitute reference was edgy.  Unfortunately, other than some woman hissing at Cassie on a freighter in the pilot and some lines between her & Starbuck, this was not really explored. Richard Hatch is quoted as saying the show was intended to go darker if it had run longer. Perhaps. I doubt ABC would have wanted that.


My bottom line: I liked the original, I like the new.

[TheJudge]

Sometimes it's not enough to live...you also have to be worthy of living.



THAT is why this Battlestar Galactica is so much better than the first one...and why I believe it may earn a place in the pantheon of science fiction that might even eclipse Star Trek.  It is everything the original Star Trek was, and that the sequels to that great show never quite reached...

[Sirgod]

Let me just say, the assisination took me Completly by surprise.

Stephen

[Javora]

Let me just say, the assisination took me Completly by surprise.

Stephen

Yeah, I wasn't expecting that either which was sort of nice really.  Makes for a good season or two of plot lines.  It was a good episode.

[TheJudge]

Let me just say, the assisination took me Completly by surprise.

Stephen

Yeah, I wasn't expecting that either which was sort of nice really.  Makes for a good season or two of plot lines.  It was a good episode.

What I really enjoyed was that I didn't see the thing coming...at least from the direction that it came...oh and the KISS was most excellent.

[NJAntman]

Sometimes it's not enough to live...you also have to be worthy of living.



THAT is why this Battlestar Galactica is so much better than the first one...and why I believe it may earn a place in the pantheon of science fiction that might even eclipse Star Trek.  It is everything the original Star Trek was, and that the sequels to that great show never quite reached...

ACK!!! "might even eclipse Star Trek"!! Damn, your're gonna bring down a world of hurt on this thread!!


That aside, anyone else notice that none of the fleet seem to care or notice how much of a screw up Dr. Baltar is? He acts flakey. Screens the crew but misses cyclon Sharon? Allows Six to escape on his watch but doesn'e alert the Peagusus crew?

[Sirgod]

Let me just say, the assisination took me Completly by surprise.

Stephen

Yeah, I wasn't expecting that either which was sort of nice really.  Makes for a good season or two of plot lines.  It was a good episode.

What I really enjoyed was that I didn't see the thing coming...at least from the direction that it came...oh and the KISS was most excellent.

I noticed that also, and Adama was so Gentle also.

Stephen

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

augh!!!  I really need to get a new job.... one that gives me Friday evenings off so I can watch BSG without having everyone tell me about it first!!

[GDA-S'Cipio]

Funny it'd be you of all people who'd come to that conclusion.  How is it that murder without a fair hearing of a prisoner of war somehow is better than abuse?

Spies and saboteurs don't get fair hearings.  Summary execution of a spy or saboteour (i.e. anyone operating on behalf of the enemy and not in a uniform) is perfectly acceptable under the rules of war.   The president was A-OK to do this, at least according to our present-world rules of war.

As an often used example, after WWII we weren't even allowed to punish Nazis who had done this to US/UK agents during the war.

The real moral question of these episodes comes when Helo reminds the Pegasus XO that the man who died was preparing to rape a female prisoner.  The XO replied, "How can you rape a machine?"

There is the real question for you.   Regardless of what she's done or what she might do, Is Boomer anything more than a machine?  Does she deserve any sort of protections?

-S'Cipio

[TheJudge]

Funny it'd be you of all people who'd come to that conclusion.  How is it that murder without a fair hearing of a prisoner of war somehow is better than abuse?

Spies and saboteurs don't get fair hearings.  Summary execution of a spy or saboteour (i.e. anyone operating on behalf of the enemy and not in a uniform) is perfectly acceptable under the rules of war.   The president was A-OK to do this, at least according to our present-world rules of war.

As an often used example, after WWII we weren't even allowed to punish Nazis who had done this to US/UK agents during the war.

The real moral question of these episodes comes when Helo reminds the Pegasus XO that the man who died was preparing to rape a female prisoner.  The XO replied, "How can you rape a machine?"

There is the real question for you.   Regardless of what she's done or what she might do, Is Boomer anything more than a machine?  Does she deserve any sort of protections?

-S'Cipio

This point is so much the core of what I love about the series.  It inspires debate, it forces questioning of values, of determing for ourselves, as the viewers, what is right and what is wrong.  This series is doing exactly what the original star trek did...forcing us to look at the issues of today through the lens of excellent story telling and confronting our beliefs and our actions.

That is what the best science fiction has always done.

[Sarek]

Sometimes it's not enough to live...you also have to be worthy of living.



THAT is why this Battlestar Galactica is so much better than the first one...and why I believe it may earn a place in the pantheon of science fiction that might even eclipse Star Trek.  It is everything the original Star Trek was, and that the sequels to that great show never quite reached...

ACK!!! "might even eclipse Star Trek"!! Damn, your're gonna bring down a world of hurt on this thread!!


That aside, anyone else notice that none of the fleet seem to care or notice how much of a screw up Dr. Baltar is? He acts flakey. Screens the crew but misses cyclon Sharon? Allows Six to escape on his watch but doesn'e alert the Peagusus crew?

From the looks of President Roslin, it won't be long before Baltar becomes Commander-in-Chief.  I expect martial law to be declared soon after. 

[TheJudge]

One other thing about this last episode...the huge battle scene was played down by the knowledge of what MIGHT take place after the battle is over, and of course by Apollo's EVA experience, but it was extremely well done.  Seeing two Battlestars blasting away at a Base Star until it started to blow up while the 2nd Base Star maneuvered in for a shot at Pegasus was just fantastic.  Then the way the fighters attacked the Resurrection ship was just a wonderful sight to see...all those cylon bodies going out the shattered plexiglass windows was amazing. 

The whole 'combat' feel is so different from Star Trek that it is a joy to watch...

[Death_Merchant]

I've not seen an official announcement, and I avoid rumor sites...

but in his blog on scifi.com, Ron Moore talksabout having starting work on season 3.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

My only qualm with this episode now is this:

We have already seen that the Galactica has video surveillance of their bridge.... does the Peggy not have that?

B/c Baltar & Gina's little escape attempt should have been foiled by that....

[762_XC]

What I'm wondering is why did they not have one in Six's cell? You would think with the obsession they had with exctracting every possible bit of info from Six while abusing the crap out of her in the process, they would have had a fracking camera in there.

Of course maybe they did, and Baltar's in for a real bad day.

[Death_Merchant]

What I'm wondering is why did they not have one in Six's cell? You would think with the obsession they had with exctracting every possible bit of info from Six while abusing the crap out of her in the process, they would have had a fracking camera in there.

Ron Moore (after spending many years doing Trek) would likely respond thus:

Look, I'm sure we could write a few pages of technobabble to explain how she escaped. "bypass security protocols, Cylon virus, Baltar blacks out security while making it look like a Cylon virus remnant, etc." Who cares? It's not a part of the story. Let's not waste time on it.

Ironically, for those of you who are familiar with the original writer's bible: there was a passage warning writers about explaining the technology or happenings: In a police show, the cop doesn't have to explain why his gun just wounded the bad guy & he gets away. He just does...

[Bartok]

One other thing about this last episode...the huge battle scene was played down by the knowledge of what MIGHT take place after the battle is over, and of course by Apollo's EVA experience, but it was extremely well done.  Seeing two Battlestars blasting away at a Base Star until it started to blow up while the 2nd Base Star maneuvered in for a shot at Pegasus was just fantastic.  Then the way the fighters attacked the Resurrection ship was just a wonderful sight to see...all those cylon bodies going out the shattered plexiglass windows was amazing. 

The whole 'combat' feel is so different from Star Trek that it is a joy to watch...

I was definitely looking forward to the battle sequence too, and while it WAS played down by the assasination/coup possibilities it was AWESOME.  One thing I find really compelling and interesting in how they do battles is the lack of sound effects.  "In Space No One Can Hear You Scream" 

Seeing all that damage occur without the usual sound effects of Trek and other series is unique and refreshing in a lot of ways

[TheJudge]

Yeah, the only sound effects they usually use are what you might hear if you were inside one of the ships, something that I also appreciate. 

[GDA-S'Cipio]

One other thing about this last episode...the huge battle scene was played down by the knowledge of what MIGHT take place after the battle is over, and of course by Apollo's EVA experience, but it was extremely well done.  Seeing two Battlestars blasting away at a Base Star until it started to blow up while the 2nd Base Star maneuvered in for a shot at Pegasus was just fantastic.  Then the way the fighters attacked the Resurrection ship was just a wonderful sight to see...all those cylon bodies going out the shattered plexiglass windows was amazing. 

The whole 'combat' feel is so different from Star Trek that it is a joy to watch...

I concurr with your combat comments.  I was glad to have this one on tape, so I could just watch it straight through the first time for the story, then go back and replay bits to see the battle unfold.

As for the cylon bodies, that brought up another question in my mind that I should have already thought of.  All the bodies were human.

When humanoid Cylons are killed, their minds upload to the resurrection center and they get reborn in a new body.  (If they are in range.)  What happens to the toaster Cylons when they die?  I must assume that they are as intelligent and as self-aware as the humanoid Cylons, since the toasters built the humanoids.   Do they not care about death?

-S'Cipio

[Bartok]

I concurr with your combat comments.  I was glad to have this one on tape, so I could just watch it straight through the first time for the story, then go back and replay bits to see the battle unfold.

As for the cylon bodies, that brought up another question in my mind that I should have already thought of.  All the bodies were human.

When humanoid Cylons are killed, their minds upload to the resurrection center and they get reborn in a new body.  (If they are in range.)  What happens to the toaster Cylons when they die?  I must assume that they are as intelligent and as self-aware as the humanoid Cylons, since the toasters built the humanoids.   Do they not care about death?

-S'Cipio

Interesting Point.  I see the humanoids as the "evolved" higher order Cylong, hence = more valuable.  Since their goal seems to be to find an alternate means of "reproduction" by crossing w/humans they're more precious to the cylon community in the long run...

As emotions/love seem to be the missing link in achieving this the higher cognitive abilities -- the self awarenes may be limited to the humanoid versions?  Imagine how love can screw with your programming

No doubt the toasters retreated and evolved.  We know cylon computer programs are heuristic and advanced along a path in their isolation.  Perhaps the self awareness is a byproduct of early repeated replications??  A la, Heinleins Starship Troopers.  "A colony gets to a certain size and it makes the brain bug" so to speak. 

In a semi "Trek" way they may likely have some components which are "borglike"   I'm anticipating that (if more comes out of it) the raider craft (250+ on a basestar!!!) will be considered just another type of cylon.  Not having 3 pilots as in the original cheeze version.  To be sure, they have craft which carry the toasters, but when there's a need to do so, troop deployment, commando raids etc.

Just chiming in

[Death_Merchant]

As for the cylon bodies, that brought up another question in my mind that I should have already thought of.  All the bodies were human.

Possible explanation (from the twisted mind of DM)

1) Graphics guy at Zoic is asked to depict the "Ressurection Ship" going boom...
2) Graphics guy creates several mental images of concepts
3) Blow up robots?  See Naked Sixes?
4) Hmmmmmmm
Conclusion reached as the insidious effects of testosterone does its work....

NAKID SIX NAKID SIX NAKID SIX!!!!!

[TheJudge]

The graphics in this episode really were top-notch. 


Now this upcoming episode for tomorrow night really does look quite interesting.  The abortion story with the cylon/human baby will be interesting to watch, especially since I've stayed away from spoilers.  Also interesting will be how they show these 'cylon sympathizers'.

Maybe Fisk will shoot them all from the pegasus.


Back to the space battle, I thought it was really well done from a tactical point as well.  Galactica and Pegasus jumped in nearest one of the two basestars and both of them started hammering the cylon ship.  Then they launched vipers to go after the Resurrection ship (after it was disabled from FTL jump).  By the time the first base star was blowing up, the second had closed on Pegasus and was just starting to hammer her hard when the Resurrection ship blew up.  At that point, all the cylons jumped away, in retreat.  Not a bad battle at all...

[NJAntman]

As for the cylon bodies, that brought up another question in my mind that I should have already thought of.  All the bodies were human.

Possible explanation (from the twisted mind of DM)

1) Graphics guy at Zoic is asked to depict the "Ressurection Ship" going boom...
2) Graphics guy creates several mental images of concepts
3) Blow up robots?  See Naked Sixes?
4) Hmmmmmmm
Conclusion reached as the insidious effects of testosterone does its work....

NAKID SIX NAKID SIX NAKID SIX!!!!!

Are you saying there were naked Sixes in those shots?! Dammit, I didn't Tivo.

[TheJudge]

I tivo'd..and yes naked sixes.  Of course I tivod for the battle scenes and the jamie bamber floating in water scenes.  Hunk-a-licious!

[NJAntman]

Not my cup of tea, but still I raise my Tivo remote and salute you for your foresight. Try not to wear out the slow button.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

*sigh* getting my BSG fix before I go to work and miss another new episode....

Have to admit that Col Fisk was cool as hell saving Helo & the Chief's butt from the towelling.

Even though he did fall back on the 'can't rape a machine' thing to end it... such duality with every one.

Also love the talk between Boomer & Adama... "I mean 'hate' might not be the word...."

And Apollo should know better than to be doing anything more than watching where he is going in a combat situation....

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Oh yeah... you'd think the Colonials would have simple repair kits attached to either the suit or the ejection seat dontcha?

Do the colonials have duct tape?!?!?  After all... it binds the known universe together....

[TheJudge]

Starbuck had duct tape.

Tonight's is DAMN good as well.

[TheJudge]

GOD DAMN RON MOORE TO FRACKING HELL!


I expected a pure crap episode.  Instead we got a decent episode with one Fracking Hell of an ending!

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

LOL.... you're right.... good episode....

Loved the dream sequences and how Baltar & Six were so prominently seen in them. 

Should prove to be more interesting if they follow thru on those dreams....

[IAF Lyrkiller]

Can anyone here burn me copies of the second season of BSG?

Please, w/ a cherry on top.

[GDA-S'Cipio]

Oh yeah... you'd think the Colonials would have simple repair kits attached to either the suit or the ejection seat dontcha?

Do the colonials have duct tape?!?!?  After all... it binds the known universe together....

Maybe he did, maybe he didn't.  That wasn't the point.  He squezed the tear shut for a few seconds, then decided he *wanted* to die.  So any repair kits he had would not have been used.

Death Merchant:  I got a real laugh out of your analysis!      You might very well have nailed it on the head!

-S'Cipio

[Death_Merchant]

Death Merchant:  I got a real laugh out of your analysis!      You might very well have nailed it on the head!

-S'Cipio

huh huh huh... He said "nailed" huh huh huh

and for those who swing that way, or just like a techie explanation: Ron Moore says in his latest blog that the Centurions are not sentient and do not download their consciousness.

[GDA-S'Cipio]

and for those who swing that way, or just like a techie explanation: Ron Moore says in his latest blog that the Centurions are not sentient and do not download their consciousness.

Hmmm.... interesting:

I think I'm missing a few links in the Cylon evolutionary chain.

So, if the centurians we see now aren't sentient, how did they rebel from their human makers and form their own society?  How did they design the humanoid cylons?  If they didn't do these things, then who did?

I heard there was an "original" (70's TV-like) Cylon Centurian on display in a museum in the BSG miniseries, and someone said, "Cylons used to look like this."  Were these original Centurians smarter than the Centurians that we see now?  Did they lead the rebellion and develop the new Centurians as tools?  In other words, did they make their own machine slaves?

-S'Cipio

[Sirgod]

Saw this earlier, and thought I'd share It with you all...

http://www.newsarama.com/forums/showthread.php?85e74f77a447cebe2cf0f8d0c1e4a010&threadid=57696

 DYNAMITE LANDS ORIGINAL BATTLESTAR GALACTICA RIGHTS

Tuesday, Dynamite Entertainment announced that in addition to their announced acquisition of the license to produce a comic book series [written by Greg Pak] based on the SCI FI original new Battlestar Galactica series, they’ve also acquired the license to produce comics based on the original Battlestar Galactica series, originally aired on ABC beginning in 1978 and currently airing on SCI-FI along with its new “cousin”.

No creative details were released. The following is the full text of Dynamiter’s press release…

Press Release

    Dynamite Entertainment announced today its agreement with Universal Studios Consumer Products Group to produce comics based on the classic Battlestar Galactica series. Recently Dynamite Entertainment signed a deal to launch a comic series based on the new SCI FI Channel Battlestar Galactica series. The comic series based on the new season of Battlestar Galactica is tentatively scheduled to launch 2nd Quarter 2006 with writer Greg Pak penning the ongoing series.

    “Battlestar is one of the classic and most beloved sci-fi TV shows of all time,” commented Dynamite Spokesperson J. Allen. “We are proud to bring new adventures of the classic cast to comic fans. The classic Battlestar line adds to some great creators and titles we have lined up for 2006. The opening lines of that show are still etched in my brain from childhood.”

    The company will be announcing creative teams, launch dates and marketing efforts for Classic Battlestar in the coming weeks.

    About Battlestar Galactica

    Originally produced by Universal Television and Glen A. Larson, the hit TV series, Battlestar Galactica, was first broadcast on ABC in September 1978. Starring Lorne Green, Richard Hatch, and Dirk Benedict, this epic space saga went on to become a veritable sci-fi classic. With just thirty-six episodes created, Battlestar Galactica has enjoyed syndication over the last two decades, most recently on the SCI FI Channel.

    With its compelling storyline, memorable characters and exciting visual effects, millions of fans tuned in every week to join Commander Adama, Apollo, Starbuck and the crew of the Galactica on their journey through the galaxy. Hunted by the diabolical Cylons, a mechanical race set out to destroy all humans, the crew of the Galactica and its ragtag fleet of survivors’ only hope was to find legendary planet Earth—believed to be the home of the missing Thirteenth Colony of Man.

    Inspired by the classic series, this extraordinary story was re-imagined by the SCI FI Channel and NBC Universal Television Studio in December of 2003 in the form of a 4-hour miniseries event. Capturing a new generation of fans, Battlestar Galactica became the most-watched cable miniseries of the year and led SCI FI to continue the saga through a one-hour weekly series.

    Redefining the space opera with its gritty realism, the new Galactica, executive produced by Ronald D. Moore and David Eick, has distinguished itself by the intensity and present day relevance of its stories and the command performances of its ensemble cast. Now one of television's most critically-lauded shows, Battlestar Galactica is currently in its second original season, airing on SCI FI Channel every Friday night at 10pm ET/PT, and has just been renewed for a third season of 28 additional original episodes.

    About Universal Studios Consumer Products Group

    Universal Studios Consumer Products Group is responsible for global licensing and retail strategies as well as building brand recognition of the extensive catalogue of NBC Universal properties. Universal Studios Consumer Products Group is a unit of NBC Universal, one of the world's leading media and entertainment companies in the development, production, and marketing of entertainment, news, and information to a global audience. Formed in May 2004 through the combining of NBC and Vivendi Universal Entertainment, NBC Universal owns and operates a valuable portfolio of news and entertainment networks, a premier motion picture company, significant television production operations, a leading television stations group, and world-renowned theme parks. NBC Universal is 80%-owned by General Electric, with 20% controlled by Vivendi Universal.

    About Dynamite Entertainment

    Dynamite Entertainment is a premier licensor and innovative publisher of the comic industry's key and most popular comics including the Army of Darkness, Jim Starlin's Cosmic Guard, The Re-Animator, Eduardo Risso's Borderline, Fulu, Parquee Chas, Lectures Macabre, Joe Quesada and Jimmy Palmiotti’s Painkiller Jane, Battlestar Galactica, Classic Battlestar Galactica, Xena, and the #1 selling title in April of '05, Red Sonja. More information about the company can be found online at www.dynamiteentertainment.com. Dynamite Entertainment is a subsidiary of Dynamic Forces, Inc.

------------------------------------

Stephen

[Villa64]

Hey, tonight they avoided the cliches about the "get the super ace" plotline

I figured that the rookie would get him (ala blacksheep)

or

Starbuck would get him, in a psychological battle.

Great episode all around.

[Iceman]

my friend and I just watched it, and I also really enjoyed it.  It was nice to see Starbuck grow up a bit and take the "higher" road and let Kat have her day.

[TheJudge]

Once again BSG showed why it's the best television on the air right now.  This episode could so easily have fallen into cliche, but it didn't.  Instead it stayed tight and showed a little of how real people might be reacting in situations that are difficult beyond belief.  There were so many moments that I felt were just fantastic.

The Apollo/Starbuck almost fling was quite good...his pulling back because he wanted more than just a tumble was perfect.  The whole Kat/Starbuck competition, and especially its resolution were fantastic.  Starbuck pulling back from the edge and doing the 'smart' thing instead of the 'gutsy' thing really shows how she's progressed from the beginning of the show.

Another thing I really liked was her growing friendship with Helo.  They really bonded AS FRIENDS during their time on Caprica and that has created a special link between them where they understand each other better than most of their other shipmates.  I really hope to see more of that friendship continue.

Another thing I liked was the glimpse of how the fleet is operating with two operational battlestars.  The Pegasus was off with the rest of the fleet, protecting them while the Galactica stayed in the forward zone and protected the mining ship.  It's nice seeing them deal with supplies/resource issues on a continual basis instead of just once or twice.  This time they were harvesting minerals and metals necessary to build fighters instead of just fuel, and the cylons were there harrassing them instead of a straightforward attack...also a side-effect of the recent major colonial victory. 

All in all, a good, tight episode. 

[Villa64]

SPOILER!!

























Oh, man!  They offed Billy!

Sheesh.

[NJAntman]

!!SPOILER ALERT FOR YOU FOLKS WEST OF EST!!
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They offed Billy?! WTF! He's like the little brother side-kick. He must of pissed in the producers coffee cup or something.

And just when I was starting to suspect he was a cyclon agent.

[Father Ted]

And we thought Mary McDonnell's character had attitude when she recovered from cancer! Now that they've killed the closest thing she had to family, whoa nellie!

[Bartok]

And we thought Mary McDonnell's character had attitude when she recovered from cancer! Now that they've killed the closest thing she had to family, whoa nellie!

I concur! -- I really love her character, she's brought a talent to it that's undeniable.  For the longest while I  couldn't remember where else I'd seen her, "Dances with Wolves" was a long while ago.  I know she's played other strong women, but can't remember where....

Anyhow - Will be interesting to see how her vengeance manifests itself in upcoming episodes.

Bartok

[Lieutenant_Q]

Independence Day...shes the Wife of the President.  Honestly...can't stand her.

[762_XC]

Kind of a crappy role for the lovely Dana Delaney. I was all excited to see her in the beginning, until I realized she was just a damn terrorist and wouldn't live out the episode.

She is starting to show her age a bit but is still teh hawt at 49.

[Father Ted]

Dana Delaney has always been one of my crushes. Much more talented, and IMO, better looking than Kim Delaney... I liked her in just about everything she appeared in from "BSG" to "Tombstone". Tis a shame that they had to kill her off, because she's such a good actress.

[762_XC]

Well there's always "Exit to Eden", just remember to skip past you-know-who's scenes. 

[GDA-S'Cipio]

And just when I was starting to suspect he was a cyclon agent.

My wife has been calling him a Cylon for months!  LOL.

Of course, if he shows up again, we'll know you two were right!

-S'Cipio

[Father Ted]

Well there's always "Exit to Eden", just remember to skip past you-know-who's scenes. 

Ack! She who's name shall not be spoken has appeared in a conversation! Must go clean guns and make sure they're in working order....

[Sarek]

Well there's always "Exit to Eden", just remember to skip past you-know-who's scenes. 

Ack! She who's name shall not be spoken has appeared in a conversation! Must go clean guns and make sure they're in working order....

Ugh!  Never saw the film and had no idea what you were talking about but a quick check of the cast made it all clear.  You may need an elephant gun!

[Villa64]

I wonder if the bumped off Billy because he was the only character that everyone can agree that they like.

[TheJudge]

Actually it was more of the...too many main characters and he had the least involved story line, plus it provides a good plot device to make the President even more...vicious than she has been (c'mon...she's ordered the death of Admiral Cain, the abortion of the cylon/human fetus - speaking of which how do y'all like that fracking-cool commercial sci-fi is running featuring that baby?).

[762_XC]

Well there's always "Exit to Eden", just remember to skip past you-know-who's scenes. 

Ack! She who's name shall not be spoken has appeared in a conversation! Must go clean guns and make sure they're in working order....

Ugh!  Never saw the film and had no idea what you were talking about but a quick check of the cast made it all clear.  You may need an elephant gun!

Four words my friend.

DANA DELANEY FULL FRONTAL

nuf said.

[Death_Merchant]

I wonder if the bumped off Billy because he was the only character that everyone can agree that they like.

According to the podcast, the actor was written out to free him for other offers.

[NJAntman]

Wow, another kick-ass episode. I love the way they're weaving so many plots into each show. No spoilers this time, this one deserves to be seen raw so it can hit ya all at once.

[TheJudge]

It's recorded on Tivo so I'll be watching it as soon as I get done cooking dinner.  Only worked ten hours today...it's pretty bad when four months before the damn election I'm thinking a ten hour day is a short one...

[TheJudge]

Holy FRACK! Holy FRACK!  Holy by the Lords of Kobol FRACK!


This really IS the Star Trek of the twenty-first century.  They tackled the big A, big CL, and lost another over at the Beast all in one fracking episode, plus Baltar declared!

Everything was fracking awesome tonight...I especially loved Pegasus firing her bow cannons...I mean wow. 

[KBF-Crim]

Damn...I missed the last two weeks

[Sirgod]

I missed last nights also. Had the family show up for the weekend, well, most of them, to spend time For Dennies Birthday.

oh Judge, dear friend... 

Stephen

[Commander La'ra]

This really IS the Star Trek of the twenty-first century.

Ya' know, I think you're right.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Those of you who are just realizing this are a bit late...

I loved the ending talk between Adama & Apollo....

"Off the record, what was Garner's flaw?"

"He was used to working with machines, command is about people" (or something close to that)

Indeed!!

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Also... a BIG WOOT!!! on seeing the Peggy's big guns! 

[TheJudge]

Those of you who are just realizing this are a bit late...

I loved the ending talk between Adama & Apollo....

"Off the record, what was Garner's flaw?"

"He was used to working with machines, command is about people" (or something close to that)

Indeed!!

Earlier I've said it might be, now I know for certain that it truly deserves that title.  BSG really does claim the champion title when it comes to good science fiction, as science fiction has always been at its best:  A study on the moralities of the day set in the future/other worlds. 

I really think this is the right line of work for Commander Adama (the new one, the son).  He is much more command material than the brash pilot like Starbuck, and even Starbuck is maturing a bit, fitting into a better role when given half a chance (the old Pegasus commander didn't get that). 

Next week's episode is one I've been waiting for a lot (and that's a gay man saying that about an episode that revolves almost exclusively around three women). 

[Villa64]

DAMN THE TORPEDOES, FULL SPEED AHEAD!! --- sorry, Apollo, that one has already been done.

I thought that the Pegasus commanders decision to go to engineering was a good one, and probably better than in some other movies I have seen where the captain is on the bridge on the intercom saying "get the engines on line dammit!"  The commander went to where he could make his weight most felt in the battle.  That made sense.  The illogical part was he should have ordered some flunky into the compartment. 

However... I think the Pegasus is poisoned.  Under peacetime conditions, you would have to wait until the command and crew rotated in order to have any chance at all at solving the operating atmosphere problems aboard that ship.  In wartime, the ship is destined for disaster.  I hope it doesnt take Apollo with it.

Frack the recon, we are getting our men?!  Get the scouts out front, and never never never go in blind.

Villa

[The_Joker]

I may have missed something here, but I'm not sure I agree with the decision to give Lee command.  I think he can handle it, and I also think that this is definately the time for a battlefield promotion, but two in less than two months?  And skipping a rank, also?  It seems to me that, technically, the command should have went to Tigh, though he's probably not the best man for the job, and lee should have been made XO.

That said, the better choice was made, as Tigh isn't exactly fit for command, but he's a decent enough XO.  Thing is, the wife's gonna have a fit, and he's going to end up on the sauce worse than ever.  If this isn't the case, I'll be surprised and also greatly think the wrong decision was made.  If Tigh is man enough to see that he's not ready, it could point to the fact that now he is.....

I don't know...

[Villa64]

Joker you got it, bro.  Sink or swim, Tigh was the right choice.  The other choice basically torpedoes both Tigh (aboard Glactica:  hey, what up with that drunk?), and Apollo (aboard Pegasus:  daddy's pick) as far as credibility go.  Getting Tigh over to Pegasus would have given Tigh a fresh start, and he already demonstrated command ability when Adama went down.  Didnt like it, but that's the breaks.

[TheJudge]

I think you folks are selling Lee Adama short on several levels:


1.  Commander Lee Adam has repeatedly shown his independent thinking from his father's several times since the destruction of the colonies.  On the day of the attack itself, he defied his father and supported the goals of the new President.  When then Commander (now Admiral) Adama ordered the President arrested, Lee Adama refused to carry out the order and was arrested by Colonel Tigh.  You better believe the scuttlebutt about those events in the fleet are well known and people know that Lee Adama is not a 'yes man' for his father, but rather has his own mind and is capable of making his own decisions in his own right.

2.  As the XO of the Pegasus, even if only for a short time, he showed that he knew what he was doing far better than the Chief Engineer-turned Commander.  Apollo knew it was a trap based on the intel pieced together by Starbuck.  He told the Commander that, and told that to the Admiral.  He was removed from the bridge by the old Commander because he refused to back down from that position.  When the three basestars jumped in, he was proven right.  You better believe the command crew in the CIC during that event are telling everyone they know on board that Apollo was right all along...

3.  Thanks to the efforts of the Commander who never should have left engineering, the Pegasus was able to get out of the mess, but it was their new commander's fighting tactics that kept them alive long enough for the engines to be fixed. 

4.  When the old Commander left the ship in Apollo's hands, that left a legitimacy to his presence, much like the legitimacy of the Engineer having been a part of the Pegasus's command structure under Cain.  Tigh would be seen as nothing but Adama's flunky sitting on their bridge.  Apollos is his own man, as he's proven over and over again, and he was there when the dung hit the fan, and he got them out of the jam they were in.  That will count for a lot to any crew.

5.  Tigh would be the worst possible choice.  First of all, you know damn well the fleet hasn't forgotten his martial law at the first part of the season, no one has forgotten his drinking, and his power-hungry wife.  Beyond that, he isn't a good Commander, and he knows it, admits it, and reiterates it any chance he gets.  He is a good XO, a good right hand man, but he knows the command is not for him and doesn't want it. 

[The_Joker]

My main point was this.  If I'm correctly understanding the rank structure.  It goes Captain, Major, Colonel, Commander.  So..basically what we've got here is a guy who jumps from O-3 to O-6 in less than two months.  I just don't see this as extremely realistic, even in a time of war. 

Had it been me, I'd have given the nod to Tigh, promoted Apollo to Colonel and made him permament XO of Pegasus (as a counterbalance to Tigh), and found a new XO for Galactica.  You've got to remember that Pegusus is coming off of a basically inept commander, a corrupt one, and a possibly half insane one.  Tigh's drinking problem would be kids play to these guys.  I personally think Tigh's problem with command at the time is that it was thrust upon him at the worst possible time and he buckled under the pressure.  With Admiral Adama there to offer counsel and Lee Adama as an XO, I think he'd be able to handle it, provided somebody put a bullet in his good for nothing wife.

[762_XC]

Joker, I disagree with you about Tigh. Garner was promoted because he was next in line. Admiral Adama acknowledged his error in doing so - he promoted Garner based on rank and seniority, even though his skill set was totally inadequate to the position.

Adama knows Tigh's weaknesses better than anybody. Aside from the drinking and the wife, Tigh's command style is direct and almost always along military lines, with almost no out of the box thinking. While he undoubtedly would have been more competent than Garner from a military perspective, Lee has consistently shown more imagination and initiative when faced with complex problems.

Adama learned from his mistake - promoting the wrong person for the right reason. He knew Lee was the right person, even if it defied military protocol.

[TheJudge]

I am so fracking pissed.  Our cable company shut off our advanced channels last night saying we hadn't paid the bill (boy are they eating crow this morning when a very pissed off yours truly went down there and had a little chat. I ended up on the phone with the idiot frack-head who had the advanced cable channels shut off, and managed to let her know exactly how upset I am.  The fact that the show is repeated on Monday doesn't mean one Gods-Damned thing.

I still missed Friday's episode and I have so been looking forward to it...

Cable's back on now, and with a credit for the inconvenience...I just asked if they could arrange to re-show BSG for me before Monday.  No such luck. 

[Sirgod]

I am so fracking pissed.  Our cable company shut off our advanced channels last night saying we hadn't paid the bill (boy are they eating crow this morning when a very pissed off yours truly went down there and had a little chat. I ended up on the phone with the idiot frack-head who had the advanced cable channels shut off, and managed to let her know exactly how upset I am.  The fact that the show is repeated on Monday doesn't mean one Gods-Damned thing.

I still missed Friday's episode and I have so been looking forward to it...

Cable's back on now, and with a credit for the inconvenience...I just asked if they could arrange to re-show BSG for me before Monday.  No such luck. 

I might be able to Pay ya Back Judge... I watched It via the whole all in wonder thingie on my PC. If It saved, I'll send you the cd.

Stephen

[Villa64]

SPOILER!!



















Baltar is in #6's head?

Is there a third power here that we dont know about?
Or is Baltar a Cylon?

AAAAAAUUGH!

[762_XC]

I love that role reversal!

I don't think Baltar is IN her head so much as a manifestation of her guilty conscience.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

OMG, I am loving this show!!!! 

Judge... time to DL it.

I wonder how many guest appearances Lucy Lawless is going to make....

Doc Cottle rulz!1111!!11!!   He is starting to replace Doctor McCoy as my most favorite SciFi doc ever.....

I am surprised that there has been nothing else about the upcoming elections so far....

Why am I getting "King Arthur" feelings for this cylon child?

I am writing this as I am watching the episode....

I am wondering if 'Caprica Six' & Sharon Valerii are going to join the resistance?  Abandon the Cylons?

Love the cut outs to the resistance.... very glad they are bringing them back...

a little nod to Stalag 17 with the old cigarette timer trick? (will have to dl the podcast)

Adama cracks me up... 'If it is good for the them, it's bad for us'

The Six-Baltar two way street is great.... his commentary to her when her & Sharon are talking have me rolling!

Once thing.... it has been nearly a year since the destruction of the colonies.... who is still producing cigarettes?!?!?!?!?

Anyone notice the 3 headlights on the car?

Jeez... Rosyln is becoming a biatch!

Anders, Anders, Anders.... a catalyst

Anders trapped with 3 hotties.... under different circumstances that would be awesome.

This show is AWESOME!!!

[Bartok]

I am wondering if 'Caprica Six' & Sharon Valerii are going to join the resistance?  Abandon the Cylons?

That would be so cool - and it seems likely (somehow).  Will they work from within the Cylons, or join the direct opposition.  Will be cool to see how they work this out....

Anyone notice the 3 headlights on the car?

Yeah - the occupants of that garage were cool old cars.  The 3 headlighted car was a Citroen from at least the early 70's if not 60's.

My wife got me the Pilot and Season 1 DVD's - I watched them all over this past week.  Really is the best Drama on TV!

[NJAntman]

There is only one little itsy bitsy part of that episode I didn't like. When Sharon reaches in and touches the "dead cyclon baby", she couldn't tell the difference? And its gone from being a premature needing an oxygen tent to wrapped in swaddling clothes and out and about?

I think I've crossed the line from just outright enjoyment to catching plot flaws. I must be getting old and cranky.

[Villa64]

I felt that they didnt explain the motivation to keep the Cylon baby alive, vice shooting it out the airlock.

- All of the viable points went to terminating the baby-Cylon.

- What will happen with this baby-Cylon is by definition unpredictable

- Adama is right.. "If the Cylons want it, it's bad for us."

- The Cylon baby will become a factor later on.

- Everyone thinks they killed it, so dealing with the reaction remains.  For the trouble that their chosen course of action will cause, they should have gotten the benefits as well.  Now they have problems with both.  Boomer will certainly flip out, and she knows how to beguile, then hurt them.

So with all that said, I think they should have spent more time  showing why Rosalyn chose the way she did.

Villa

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

I think that down the road, Doc Cottle will (un?)intentionally let Boomer or Helo know that the child is alive...

Also, I would say that the reason for faking the baby's 'death' is a legitmate reason.

The Cylons have gone to a LOT of trouble to do this...  What do they want from the mating?

[The_Joker]

From a purely villianous, clinical, detached point of view......the cyborg(can you get any closer to the definition of cyborg than this kid?--half human, half machine) has this deal with her blood that's worth keeping her around.  At least they gave her to a family instead of locking her up somewhere and putting needles in her.....

I'm starting to get a real River Tam vibe about the cylon baby, anyway.

[Commander La'ra]

I loved the expression of utter distaste and dissatisfaction on Cottle's face with Roslyn is telling him the deceoption was a 'good thing'.  The Doc is rapidly becoming my favorite character, much more fiercely moral, in his own cranky way, than almost anyone else on the series.

[Father Ted]

Best show on TV? Hmmm, "24" gives it a run in that department, though I will say that comparing the latest entries from both shows, Galactica wins hands down, especially with Baltar getting into Six's head.

[Sirgod]

Best show on TV? Hmmm, "24" gives it a run in that department, though I will say that comparing the latest entries from both shows, Galactica wins hands down, especially with Baltar getting into Six's head.

Hell I'm still watching Re-runs of that Red Curry Dwarf thingie show. Best stuff I've seen in awhile.

Stephen

[TheJudge]

I finally got to see this episode and nearly fell out of my chair when Baltar showed up at Six's awakening party.  Holy Fracking Cylon Goo that was unbelievably wonderful to see.  The diametric opposition of the two real and two imaginary characters is quite wonderful.  Lucy Lawless did a wonderful job as a devout Cylon while Tricia Hefer and Grace Park showed just how capable they are as actors.  Seeing Starbuck's beau was nice, and I look forward to seeing him in even more episodes.

Doc Cottle really is the moral center of the show in a lot of ways no other character can match.  I'd have just ditched the baby out of the airlock, but then I'm not as kind-hearted as the rest of them are...


This episode delivers on just about everything one could want from a sci-fi episode...They cylon centurion going to pick up that cigarrette was just spectacular graphically...

[Father Ted]

Best show on TV? Hmmm, "24" gives it a run in that department, though I will say that comparing the latest entries from both shows, Galactica wins hands down, especially with Baltar getting into Six's head.

Hell I'm still watching Re-runs of that Red Curry Dwarf thingie show. Best stuff I've seen in awhile.

Stephen

Rimmer!

[Villa64]

Excerpt from the Raptor operators manual:

"5.41.  Continued flight following an interstellar jump which terminates inside a mountain is not recommended."

I thought the episode was a little slow, but maybe because they are setting up for the following episode, the season finale.

...and my wife thinks that the priest (Dean Stockwell) is a Cylon.  Paranoia will destroy ya...

[Rat Boy]

Happened to catch part of it last night and I was struck by a couple things: 1.) how the election seems like a parrallel to the 2004 election, with Roslin as Bush and Baltar, as, well, someone the liberals would not doubt take exception to being likened to, being how he's in bed with the enemy and all that & 2.) how much Richard Hatch's character resembled a calmer, Just For Men using Howard Dean in that getup he was wearing.

[762_XC]

Stockwell just gets better with age.

[762_XC]

Oh, by the way.

HOW HOT is Roslyn's new aide!

[Javora]

Stockwell just gets better with age.

He must have been happy to do an entire episode and not hear "Oh Boy".   

[TheJudge]

First off...Javora I love that sig.  Recently ordered a license plate for my motorcycle that says "Frell U"


This episode was a good one with a little bit of everything in it to make things nice.  I for one am thinking that Baltar's days are numbered.  First of all, Roslyn remembers seeing him kissing #6 on Caprica and must strongly suspect he let the Cylons into the defense grid.  More than likely, Anders & Co. got info out of that revived Six and Boomer that Baltar did indeed betray the colonies...so what we'll see in the end is Baltar elected President, revealed as the great betrayer, he runs from the fleet and assumes the mantle as a Cylon Leader while Zarek assumes the Presidency or at least tries to while Adama(s) backs Roslyn retaking the office.

Meanwhile...I like the short glimpse of Lee Adama as Commander so far.  He was easy going, friendly, yet still in-charge and did you also notice that it was his ship on which the briefing for the rescue mission was given, and from which it was launched?  You know he probably had a heck of a lot to do with it getting the 'go' from his father. 

[jayvt3]

first let me say i signed up for iTunes and have d/l episodes 11 through 19 of the second season.  just gotta find a new place to live since i spent my rent money on BSG episodes.
I am glad that the lords of kobol haven't nixxed the pegasus like the did in the original series...but then again it is supposed to die and this one deserves a bloody bloody end.

[Commander La'ra]

HOW HOT is Roslyn's new aide!

The character leaves me feeling...uneasy...

...the actress, well...that's a different story.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

first let me say i signed up for iTunes and have d/l episodes 11 through 19 of the second season.  just gotta find a new place to live since i spent my rent money on BSG episodes.
I am glad that the lords of kobol haven't nixxed the pegasus like the did in the original series...but then again it is supposed to die and this one deserves a bloody bloody end.

IIRC, Glen Larson was planning on having the Peggy survive its battle with 2 Basestars to reappear later on.... unfortunately, the cancelling of the show sort of nixed that....

It was pointed out when discussion of what was found on the planet of Count Iblis was thought to have been the wreckage of the Peggy. (why some people think Apollo told Sheba not to look in the wreckage)

So having the Peggy hanging around isn't all that far fetched.

[Iceman]

Besides, think of all the flex room it gives the writers.

[TheJudge]

Putting Apollo as commander of the Pegusus is a good hint that she might be around for a while...

[jayvt3]

well the good jay says it is good to have the Pegasus around.  the "bucket" and the "beast".  father and son together til the end fighting the good fight.

now the bad jay :flame:says baltar will win the presidency and transfer his flag to the Pegasus.  leaving Roslyn the colonial one.  the Pegasus will be taken over by the replica of Caprica six and the cylon peacenik bastards using the nuke baltar gave them.  they will flee back to the planet that was found by the lost raptor and establish a colony only to be wiped out by an enemy that make the cylons look like girlscouts.

[TheJudge]

We'll find out starting in a few hours...I'm really looking forward to this night's episode with a lot of anticipation...gotta love Sci Fi Friday!

[TheJudge]

Okay, big fracking problem here...BSG is on RIGHT NOW but my partner who likes the show as much as I do is still at work.  We have TiVO, but he wants me to wait until he gets home to watch it...what the frack do I do?

[Iceman]

Watch it together so you can both complain to each other.


Frack I'm pissed.

[762_XC]

OCTOBER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OCTOBER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FRACK !!!!!!!!!!!

[TheJudge]

FRACK!  THEY CAN'T DO THIS TO US!  OCTOBER!  FRACK FRACK FRACK FRACK....OH FRACK...THE 'JUMP' AFTER THE FIRST HOUR...OH FRACK..."I'm Gaius Baltar"  "I know who you are Gaius."


OH FRACK

[Commander La'ra]

Well...

....that wasn't at all what I was expecting.

Which is, of course, one of the biggest reasons I love that show.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

"I TOLD YOU I'M NOT A CYLON!! Oh.... well then.... ok..."



Just a bit perplexed over the whole 'we have made a mistake thing'....

Then one year later... we have the start of a Nazi Concentration camp....

Should be interesting to see where it goes from here....

What will become of Adama and the cowardice (?) of running without even putting up a fight?

[jayvt3]

he did the smart thing.  it would have been suicide to fight and that was what the cylons wanted.  both ships down to skelcrews?
the civilians got what they deserved they wanted to stay when the they should have tightened their belts and kept their boots on.

it used to be said that we, as humans, are at are best when times are at their worst.   that is a bold face lie.  one thing that i have been impressed with BSG is that these guys show true human quality.  noone is "perfect" and only some, really just a few, truly do their best to help others and look out for the common good.

[762_XC]

So who else said "Castillo's back!!!!" when they saw Adama's new moustache? 

[Sarek]

I suspect that a show or two into the new season this will turn out to be Baltar dreaming, too much of it doesn't make sense.   

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

I suspect that a show or two into the new season this will turn out to be Baltar dreaming, too much of it doesn't make sense.   

I doubt we will set a Galactic Reset Button pushed.... 

I hope not at least.... that would ruin it for me...

[Rat Boy]

One Year Later?  Holy DC Comics stunt, Batman!

[762_XC]

I suspect that a show or two into the new season this will turn out to be Baltar dreaming, too much of it doesn't make sense.   

That would be jumping the shark.

[Villa64]

At the end of the episode, was the teaser for next season:

"We are going to take care of the humans now".

And Starbucks comment:

"We are going to fight them until we cant"

I think next season will be more commentary on the state of events in Iraq today, where the good guy human insurgents are attacking the evil cylon occupiers, who are just trying to fix what they broke.

On the whole, I didnt really like the episde.  I thought it was a little boring.  And also thought that they pretty much resolved the EPISODE, but set up the whole next season.

Didnt really care for the Atlantis cliffhanger either.

The Stargate cliffhanger had some neat elements:
- I liked the future version of "Ensign Gay" watching the big battle from her space suit.  Did that at the beginning of the season of galactica, and thought it was neat then.
- I liked the clue searching they were doing with Merlins library, but then it got cut off into the predictable hopeless space battle.

I am kind of bummed that I was disappointed with all three.

Oh yeah... Stockwells character was great.  The quote when he got caught... right on.
Villa

[Sarek]

I suspect that a show or two into the new season this will turn out to be Baltar dreaming, too much of it doesn't make sense.   

That would be jumping the shark.

It may already have done so, after the last 20 minutes of Friday's episode I fear it will become Galactica 2006.   

[Iceman]

Words cannot describe how disappointed I am in Galactica's writers.

It's like, ok, they torched the fleet.
Then realized they couldn't get themselves out of it legitmately, so they skipped a year in between. Yeah, nice work guys.
SOOO mad.

[Father Ted]

I suspect that a show or two into the new season this will turn out to be Baltar dreaming, too much of it doesn't make sense.   

That would be jumping the shark.

Another Bobby Ewing dream season? That would be the shark jumping the boat.

[Sirgod]

I suspect that a show or two into the new season this will turn out to be Baltar dreaming, too much of it doesn't make sense.   

That would be jumping the shark.

It may already have done so, after the last 20 minutes of Friday's episode I fear it will become Galactica 2006.   

12 episodes of Super Scouts time traveling to stop Nazi bomb tests. Oh boy. 

Stephen

[Villa64]

Now I am really confused.

Before I felt bad about the episode.

Then I felt bad that I felt bad about the episode.

Now I feel good that I felt bad about feeling bad because others agree.

But with more reflection, I feel bad because I feel good about feeling bad about feeling bad.

I was because someone brought up a reference to Galactica 1980.

You should be ashamed. 

 

[Sarek]

After reading this interview with producer Ron Moore about season 3 I feel a little better.  Still, seeing Adama sprout cheesy facial hair gives me a disconcerting feeling of déjà vu.   

[Iceman]

After reading this interview with producer Ron Moore about season 3 I feel a little better.  Still, seeing Adama sprout cheesy facial hair gives me a disconcerting feeling of déjà vu.   

I am deeply comforted after reading that. Thank you.

[benbean]

Off on a little bit of a tangent here...

For fans of the show who also play Battlefield 2...

http://www.riseofkobol.com/

I'm in no way involved in this mod, but I can't wait to fly a raptor/raider

[Rat Boy]

Still, seeing Adama sprout cheesy facial hair gives me a disconcerting feeling of déjà vu.

You think the could have picked a different style other than the 'stache EJO had when he was in Blade Runner.

[Father Ted]

So who else said "Castillo's back!!!!" when they saw Adama's new moustache? 

I started to break out my penny loafers, mauve outfit, and ditch the socks, because with my two-day stubble, I kinda look like Crockett.

[Tirus]

The last show of the BSG season left me with whiplash.

My brain synapses fired in the following sequence...

FRACK! The writers are pulling a J.R. dream sequence! Must...shoot...the...writers!!!!!!

ARRRGH! The number crunchers have taken control of the fleet and have decided to save money by shooting the entire next season in the woods outside of Vancouver.

October...OCTober???? OCTOBER!!!!!!! 

Nooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!

[TheJudge]

I'm just waiting for all the fanfiction to start up about what happened in that year of looking at Baltar's hair...

[Commander La'ra]

I'm just waiting for all the fanfiction to start up about what happened in that year of looking at Baltar's hair...

You just wanna read a 'creative' piece on how Gaeda became his 'aide'.

 

[TheJudge]

Actually, was hoping for a Chief Tyrol and Helo hookup while Cali is pregnant...


Helo looked damn good in that officer's uniform...

[Commander La'ra]

I'd be able to live with that only if we got a nice, long, extended scene of Roslyn's new aide soaping herself up in the shower or perhaps a Sapphic romp involving her and Lucy Lawless' Cylon as a consession to the hetero audience.

[TheJudge]

I'd be able to live with that only if we got a nice, long, extended scene of Roslyn's new aide soaping herself up in the shower or perhaps a Sapphic romp involving her and Lucy Lawless' Cylon as a consession to the hetero audience.

Done!  I have tivo so I can fast-forward your part and then slow-motion my part...Too bad Billy is dead now...I'd have liked to watch a Billy/Apollo scene...

[NJAntman]

I'm just waiting for all the fanfiction to start up about what happened in that year of looking at Baltar's hair...

You just wanna read a 'creative' piece on how Gaeda became his 'aide'.

 

What's up with that? Gaeda creeps me out. Still think he is a cyclon. As an aide he'd be the perfect mole till the cyclon fleet arived.

[762_XC]

I'd be able to live with that only if we got a nice, long, extended scene of Roslyn's new aide soaping herself up in the shower or perhaps a Sapphic romp involving her and Lucy Lawless' Cylon as a consession to the hetero audience.

NOW yer talkin! Man I hope that chick doesn't pull a vanishing act now that Roslin is back to being a teacher.

[Commander La'ra]

Done!

Now if only we had some form of creative control...*ponder*