Topic: Commercializing Space - with prize money or subsidies

[Nemesis]

Link to first full article

WASHINGTON — NASA intends to spend $500 million over the next four years subsidizing the development of commercial services for delivering cargo and possibly people to the international space station (ISS).

NASA hopes the investment will allow one or more firms to demonstrate by 2010 — if not sooner — that they are capable of delivering cargo and perhaps even crew members to the international space station. NASA would then competitively award flexible service contracts to the qualified firms to provide the services.

NASA kicked off the so-called Commercial Orbital Transportation Services Demonstration effort Dec. 5 with the release of a draft announcement spelling out how the competition will be structured. A final announcement is due out Jan. 9, with proposals due a month later on Feb. 10.

NASA expects to award one or more contracts in May.

Link to second full article

Ideal deal

An “ideal” HOV Challenge, according to the X Prize Foundation study made available today, would offer some $200 million to $300 million in total prize purses—divided into two tiers.

Tier One would offer $75 million in prizes for a non-reusable, two-to-three seat orbital vehicle that flies to low Earth Orbit and is recovered safely. The first place winner would snag $50 million. A second place winner would garner $25 million.

A Tier Two effort would tender $225 million in prizes for reusable, two-to-three seat orbital vehicle that is a high capacity craft that flies twice within 60 days. First place winner would receive $150 million, while second place is pegged at $75 million.

Teams vying for these prizes would be able to compete for both tiers, or may elect to compete only for one tier. Ideally, prize purses are tax free, explains the X Prize Foundation study.

Myself I think I prefer the prize money option. 

[Tus-XC]

I also like how nasa is putting out contracts, that i think will help out alot more than prizes, as anyone thinking long term would probably see getting a GOV contract a plus (and finacally good).  Plus what company wouldn't like having a nice little stamp say " we delivered our countries astronaugts to space x number of times" that like free advertising there

[Nemesis]

Unfortunately with the contract they seem to inflate the cost to uncommercially viable levels.  The contract becomes a money pit for the government.

With the prize you have motivation to keep the cost down.  Winning substantially less than you spent isn't a good option.  The exception of course being if having won you get further contracts (Spaceship One led to the deal with Bransen for Spaceship Two and a probable Spaceship Three) so the winnings are more to offset some of your costs while setting up for future business and get "free" advertising.

If done right the prize competitors know that they can also get a NASA contract but only if they win and are economically viable.  You could win the prize for getting people to the ISS but have the contract awarded to #2 who did it for 1/3 the cost 3 months later.

Of course the bonus to the taxpayer and NASA is the prize money is not handed out until the goal is achieved and then a fixed amount.  The prize can't be inflated by the winner merely because they overspent.

Faster, better, cheaper.

[prometheus]

 I can only pray that the times when "HADLEY CENTENARY CELEBRATIONS SPONOSORED BY COCA COLA" is embalzoned in big red neon letters on the slopes of Hadley Delta, with men in grey suits pretending that the spirit of Apollo is still alive, I'm going to have died of old age, and can content myself with turning in my grave...

[Dracho]

I can only pray that the times when "HADLEY CENTENARY CELEBRATIONS SPONOSORED BY COCA COLA" is embalzoned in big red neon letters on the slopes of Hadley Delta, with men in grey suits pretending that the spirit of Apollo is still alive, I'm going to have died of old age, and can content myself with turning in my grave...

Or realize the pioneers will be farther out, where the frontier has expanded to. 

The shores of Manhatten were a frontier once.  You must understand that if man goes there, it will develop.  If man goes there and never returns, it wasn't a frontier to begin with.

If it's the corporate or capitalist angle that bugs you, remember that a passing alien wouldn't know the difference between a statue of Lenin, Hitler, George Washington, or a Shoney's Big Boy.  They will simply see:  Humans are here.

[prometheus]

I can only pray that the times when "HADLEY CENTENARY CELEBRATIONS SPONOSORED BY COCA COLA" is embalzoned in big red neon letters on the slopes of Hadley Delta, with men in grey suits pretending that the spirit of Apollo is still alive, I'm going to have died of old age, and can content myself with turning in my grave...

Or realize the pioneers will be farther out, where the frontier has expanded to. 

The shores of Manhatten were a frontier once.  You must understand that if man goes there, it will develop.  If man goes there and never returns, it wasn't a frontier to begin with.

If it's the corporate or capitalist angle that bugs you, remember that a passing alien wouldn't know the difference between a statue of Lenin, Hitler, George Washington, or a Shoney's Big Boy.  They will simply see:  Humans are here.

In my enthusiasm for space exploration, I had never thought of the fact that the moon and other places, will be cheapened by mankind the same way the Earth has...

[Dracho]

It is our nature to shape our universe, not to be shaped by it.

[prometheus]

It is our nature to shape our universe, not to be shaped by it.

"This is your stewardess speaking, and on your left, where the descent stage of Apollo 15 used to be, you'll see the infamous Palus Putredinis red light district, where you can buy sex from a disease ridden prostitute for ten bucks, but look out for all the thieves, junkies, muggers and murderers while you're in that area and don't walk around on your own after dark..."

It's the way we shape it that bothers me, not the fact that we can shape it...

[Dracho]

I concede we leave much to be desired, but thus far, we're the best nature has offered up, or we're the best we've encountered.  If nature should improve on us, well, we all know how those meetings turn out..

[prometheus]

I concede we leave much to be desired, but thus far, we're the best nature has offered up, or we're the best we've encountered.  If nature should improve on us, well, we all know how those meetings turn out..

We're the best spacefaring civilisation we've encountered because we are the only one...  But we aren't at the pinnacle of evolution, although we tend to like to think we are.  Rats have a vastly superior genome to humans and are far better at self moderating deliterious combinations of genes in reproduction than human's are...

[Dracho]

I concede we leave much to be desired, but thus far, we're the best nature has offered up, or we're the best we've encountered.  If nature should improve on us, well, we all know how those meetings turn out..

We're the best spacefaring civilisation we've encountered because we are the only one...  But we aren't at the pinnacle of evolution, although we tend to like to think we are.  Rats have a vastly superior genome to humans and are far better at self moderating deliterious combinations of genes in reproduction than human's are...

But they've done nothing with it.  That's the key. A dolphin may be smarter than I am, but nature did not afford him the opportunity to learn to light a fire, and thus invent a match, and then a rocket, and escape. 

Raw evolutionary power is like education.. it's worthless unless you actually use it to do something.

[prometheus]

I concede we leave much to be desired, but thus far, we're the best nature has offered up, or we're the best we've encountered.  If nature should improve on us, well, we all know how those meetings turn out..

We're the best spacefaring civilisation we've encountered because we are the only one...  But we aren't at the pinnacle of evolution, although we tend to like to think we are.  Rats have a vastly superior genome to humans and are far better at self moderating deliterious combinations of genes in reproduction than human's are...

But they've done nothing with it.  That's the key. A dolphin may be smarter than I am, but nature did not afford him the opportunity to learn to light a fire, and thus invent a match, and then a rocket, and escape. 

Raw evolutionary power is like education.. it's worthless unless you actually use it to do something.

But we haven't done anything either...  If the planet Earth was wiped out tomorrow, no one else in the Universe would even know we had existed...  All we have done is spread like a bacterial culture across a planet, and we aren't the only lifeform to have done that...

Okay, you don't find any ants on the Ross Ice Shelf, but you don't find any human's there either... 

[Dracho]

I concede we leave much to be desired, but thus far, we're the best nature has offered up, or we're the best we've encountered.  If nature should improve on us, well, we all know how those meetings turn out..

We're the best spacefaring civilisation we've encountered because we are the only one...  But we aren't at the pinnacle of evolution, although we tend to like to think we are.  Rats have a vastly superior genome to humans and are far better at self moderating deliterious combinations of genes in reproduction than human's are...

But they've done nothing with it.  That's the key. A dolphin may be smarter than I am, but nature did not afford him the opportunity to learn to light a fire, and thus invent a match, and then a rocket, and escape. 

Raw evolutionary power is like education.. it's worthless unless you actually use it to do something.

But we haven't done anything either...  If the planet Earth was wiped out tomorrow, no one else in the Universe would even know we existed...  All we have done is spread like a bacterial culture across a planet, and we aren't the only lifeform to have done that...

We're just waiting for a carrier.   

[prometheus]

I concede we leave much to be desired, but thus far, we're the best nature has offered up, or we're the best we've encountered.  If nature should improve on us, well, we all know how those meetings turn out..

We're the best spacefaring civilisation we've encountered because we are the only one...  But we aren't at the pinnacle of evolution, although we tend to like to think we are.  Rats have a vastly superior genome to humans and are far better at self moderating deliterious combinations of genes in reproduction than human's are...

But they've done nothing with it.  That's the key. A dolphin may be smarter than I am, but nature did not afford him the opportunity to learn to light a fire, and thus invent a match, and then a rocket, and escape. 

Raw evolutionary power is like education.. it's worthless unless you actually use it to do something.

But we haven't done anything either...  If the planet Earth was wiped out tomorrow, no one else in the Universe would even know we existed...  All we have done is spread like a bacterial culture across a planet, and we aren't the only lifeform to have done that...

We're just waiting for a carrier.   

Well, I won't be holiding my breath...  I accepted by the time I was seven years old the life has no purpose...

[Dracho]

I concede we leave much to be desired, but thus far, we're the best nature has offered up, or we're the best we've encountered.  If nature should improve on us, well, we all know how those meetings turn out..

We're the best spacefaring civilisation we've encountered because we are the only one...  But we aren't at the pinnacle of evolution, although we tend to like to think we are.  Rats have a vastly superior genome to humans and are far better at self moderating deliterious combinations of genes in reproduction than human's are...

But they've done nothing with it.  That's the key. A dolphin may be smarter than I am, but nature did not afford him the opportunity to learn to light a fire, and thus invent a match, and then a rocket, and escape. 

Raw evolutionary power is like education.. it's worthless unless you actually use it to do something.

But we haven't done anything either...  If the planet Earth was wiped out tomorrow, no one else in the Universe would even know we existed...  All we have done is spread like a bacterial culture across a planet, and we aren't the only lifeform to have done that...

We're just waiting for a carrier.   

Well, I won't be holiding my breath...  I accepted by the time I was seven years old the life has no purpose...

Of course life doesn't have a purpose.  Life IS a purpose.

[prometheus]

Of course life doesn't have a purpose.  Life IS a purpose.

I must repectfully disagree...  Life is a mathematical probability...  A random convergence of cirmcumstances...  We're here but by the grace of pure blind luck, and if we survive another thousand years, or a million it will be for the same reason...

[Dracho]

Of course life doesn't have a purpose.  Life IS a purpose.

I must respectfully disagree...  Life is a mathematical probability...  A random convergence of circumstances...  We're here but by the grace of pure blind luck, and if we survive another thousand years, or a million it will be for the same reason...

I do not think it would strive as hard to continue and improve itself if it were merely a mathematical anomaly.  Life is striving to achieve... something..

[prometheus]

Of course life doesn't have a purpose.  Life IS a purpose.

I must respectfully disagree...  Life is a mathematical probability...  A random convergence of circumstances...  We're here but by the grace of pure blind luck, and if we survive another thousand years, or a million it will be for the same reason...

I do not think it would strive as hard to continue and improve itself if it were merely a mathematical anomaly.  Life is striving to achieve... something..

Really?  What?

[Dracho]

Of course life doesn't have a purpose.  Life IS a purpose.

I must respectfully disagree...  Life is a mathematical probability...  A random convergence of circumstances...  We're here but by the grace of pure blind luck, and if we survive another thousand years, or a million it will be for the same reason...

I do not think it would strive as hard to continue and improve itself if it were merely a mathematical anomaly.  Life is striving to achieve... something..

Really?  What?

That's really the $64,000 question.  It's also very difficult to ascertain, being part of the experiment and all.  It's very difficult to see outside of the parameters.

[prometheus]

Of course life doesn't have a purpose.  Life IS a purpose.

I must respectfully disagree...  Life is a mathematical probability...  A random convergence of circumstances...  We're here but by the grace of pure blind luck, and if we survive another thousand years, or a million it will be for the same reason...

I do not think it would strive as hard to continue and improve itself if it were merely a mathematical anomaly.  Life is striving to achieve... something..

Really?  What?

That's really the $64,000 question.  It's also very difficult to ascertain, being part of the experiment and all.  It's very difficult to see outside of the parameters.

Well, if you think life has a purpose and I don't, I dare say you're the one that's winning, so I'll stop trying to talk you out of it...