Topic: Cannon check  (Read 11011 times)

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Offline Scottish Andy

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #20 on: October 24, 2005, 08:11:42 am »
Sorry, AlchemistiD. *smile*

Getting the Star Trek Encyclopedia is a worthwhile investment if you're trying to canonise your stuff, even if only referring to actual episodes. It also includes a little of the background story for continuity errors. Even the last revised paperback version is about US$30 though. Which is CDN$46, f or some bizarre reason.

We really get the piss ripped out of us paying for books up here in the Great White North... *sigh*

Good job I bought it good ol' Blighty! *grin*
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Offline KBF-Kapact

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2005, 01:41:38 pm »


We really get the piss ripped out of us paying for books up here in the Great White North... *sigh*

Good job I bought it good ol' Blighty! *grin*


In New Zealand, we would have paid $100 for the same book. Crikey!


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Offline AlchemistiD

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #22 on: October 31, 2005, 01:52:29 pm »
Lend me your ears!  I could use some help on a few things.


First off, and this ones for those with the encyclopedia.  I need an unused NCC from just before the Constitution-Class' construction.


Second, again for those with the Encyclopedia.  It is ever established in canon whether or not Cpt. Terrell of the Reliant (ST2: WOK) had any children or siblings?


Third, this ones for the math wizards.  At maximum warp (Or whatever the maximum warp rating was during the Constellation's Heyday), how long would it take to cross 70 million light years?


And fourth, once again for those with the encyclopedia, I could use complete data on the Akula-Class.





Finally, and this really isn't a request for help, just some nifty facts.


NGC 1300 is a Barred Spiral Galaxy in the Constellation Eridanus. It's about 150,000 ly. across and 70 Million ly. (21 Mpc.) away. In 2005, Our Galaxy, the Milky Way Galaxy, is thought to look like this.

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Offline Jaeih t`Radaik

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #23 on: November 02, 2005, 06:01:02 am »
I'll get back to you on this one. At work.
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Offline AlchemistiD

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2005, 01:57:53 pm »
Doing design work on the Revere.  I've decided her registry will be NCC-1980.  I've dropped the Constellation-Class prototype schtick.  Mainly because someone's made a model which looks far more like a Constellation prototype than a souped up Akula.

A few things left on three of the races I'm creating for this.  I've designed a few Kasuran ships, a Frontier Yacht, A Light Galleon, and the Kasuran Super-heavy Cruiser.  The SHC being essentially a flying city.  It's not entirely nessesary to do this I admit, but I'm bored.  I'm finishing them up with modular sections that can be fitted on or off at any spacedock for combat.  Transforming the Kasuran "Frontier Yacht" into the Kasuran "Sloop-of-War" for example.

The design work on the revere has to do mostly with the Sidewarp engines.  I've been drawing different designs trying to see what will fit with the ship's overall shape and Starfleet appearance.

I'll post pics of some of the ships later today, and of the first three races soon.  The Kasurans, the Spriggan, and the Makannon.

::ALCHEMIC EDIT::

The Kasuran Frontier Yacht Aia Class, 90% finished.


The Kasuran Emera'Tera Class Super Heavy Cruiser.


And...

The Revere 1980



I have to post this, just for the hell of it.  The weirdest Revere concept.


 
« Last Edit: November 23, 2005, 09:05:59 pm by AlchemistiD »

Offline CaptJosh

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #25 on: November 24, 2005, 12:10:28 am »
I have to point out that, with Fed tech as we know it, there is no possible way to sustain maximum warp for 70 million lightyears. The Kelvans(original Star Trek ep "By Any Other Name") could alter the tech to do it, but clearly they never did, and what they did to the Enterprise's engines was never duplicated, or Starfleet's warp drives would work a lot better than they do in the 24th century.
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Offline AlchemistiD

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #26 on: November 24, 2005, 12:26:00 am »
...

But the REVERE is from the Constellation-Class era.  Twenty-two years AT LEAST before TNG.  And it's in another GALAXY.  So logically no one would know anything about the current fed tech in the milky way, hence 'contemporary' warp charts are meaningless.  What I want to know, is what the maximum warp rating was when the Constellation was launched, and how long it would take to cross 70 million ly.

I never asked if it could be sustained or if it was practical.  I just need the numbers to explain something in the story.

Offline Commander Maxillius

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #27 on: November 24, 2005, 10:18:41 am »
...

But the REVERE is from the Constellation-Class era.  Twenty-two years AT LEAST before TNG.  And it's in another GALAXY.  So logically no one would know anything about the current fed tech in the milky way, hence 'contemporary' warp charts are meaningless.  What I want to know, is what the maximum warp rating was when the Constellation was launched, and how long it would take to cross 70 million ly.

I never asked if it could be sustained or if it was practical.  I just need the numbers to explain something in the story.

It would take 68,355 years at Warp 8.  I know that's not maximum warp, but considering that the Revere isn't likely a top-of-the-line ship, it would be stressed to make 8.5 with engine modefications.  Note that in canon Trek that the Enterprise 1701's speed records stood well into the 24th century.
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Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: Canon check
« Reply #28 on: November 24, 2005, 01:27:29 pm »
Forgive me for intruding and probably going over stuff already discussed (mainly because I've fast-skimmed through the topic, only reading the first post carefully), but I wanted to provide suggestions in the form of revision.  I'll provide some corrections and state why after.  Corrections will be highlighted in red.

Quote
Revere Service History:

The USS Revere (NCC-509) was constructed during the period of conflict with the Klingon Empire during the mid 23rd century.  She was named for the USS Paul Revere (APA/LPA-248), a United States Amphibious Transport Ship, the first of such ships to recieve the Meritorious Unit Commendation.  Also, early Starfleet records indicate a neptune-class patrol cruiser was also named Revere.

The USS Revere (NCC-509) was a destroyer, typically filling out the role of a fast-response or escort frigate.  However, the USS Revere stands out from the Destroyer pack.  Her mission record includes 10 sucsessful engagements with Klingon D6 fleets, several deep-space rescue missions, and first contact with over 20 races, both within and out of the Milky Way galaxy, according to the mission logs of her master, Flag Admiral Will R. Barry (A Lt. Commander at the time of her maiden voyage).

The USS Revere (NCC-509) was retired shortly after the incident with the alien probe, and the court martial of Admiral James T. Kirk.  Most of the remaining crew, including freshly promoted 'Captain' Barry, would return to serve aboard the USS Revere (NCC-2509).  An Akula-class (refit) sharing much of it's  improved technology with the Enterprise-A, a new Constitution-class Starship and the first to use upgraded technology derived from the Excelsior-class.  Equipped with state of the art sensor technology, the Revere's primary mission was of peace in aiding the Klingon Empire after the Praxis disaster.  A stark contrast to her former assignment as a frontier cruiser patrolling the boundries of Federation space along the Klingon border.

The irony was not lost on Captain Barry, who found it difficult to trust his former adversaries, even when a Klingon ambassador joined the crew.  However, through the Revere's first five-year mission, and midways through her second, the captain learned to admire the Klingon's code of honor and loyalty, and even attended Klingon Ambassador Goh'dek's wedding, his son's birth, and tragically, his funeral.  When the Andromedans began their invasion of the Milky Way by attacking the Klingon world of E'kio, the colony world where he was born, and where his family lived. 

Captain Barry disobeyed Starfleet orders to return to federation space in order to rescue the Ambassador and his family.  Goh'dek's wife and son survived, and the Revere managed to defeat several fast Andromedan attack cruisers.  But the ship was left nearly crippled when an Andromedan mothership joined the battle.  The mothership was ultimately destroyed, but at the cost of the Ambassador's life and almost half of the Revere's crew.  Captain Barry faced a court-martial when the Revere limped back to federation space, but the Klingon High Council interceded on his behalf.

The Revere went on to play a significant role in the war against the Andromedan invaders, coordinating with Klingon and Hydran forces in key battles.  She also participated in the final battle of the war, the Battle of Edo, and was destroyed by her master inside the Andromedan Worldship, putting an end to the war, and an era.

A year after the war, the U.S.S. Revere (NX-6590) was commisioned as a testbed for a possible replacement of the venerable Akula-Class, which proved it's mettle a hundred fold during the war.   Unfortunately, the Revere-Class ended after the construction of the Revere, and was never mass produced.  The Revere was granted a full commision ( her registry changed to NCC-6590[/i]), and she was sent off on another five year mission.  Captain Barry had been promoted to Admiral, however, and was reassigned to Starfleet Command's headquarters in San Francisco.   Commander Maya O'neill, who began her career as the helm officer of the U.S.S. Revere (NCC-509) just prior to the V'Ger incident, took command of the latest starship.  A few of the surviving senior crew returned as well.

Commander Oneill's first command was cut tragically short.  Three years after her shakedown cruise, the Revere disappeared with all hands, without a trace, in the nebulous region of space known as the Aries Expanse.


I'm not sure about the first alteration.  But my first thoughts are, "Well, is she a Destroyer or a Frigate?" or something among that.  Most of the other alterations were grammar or restatements or rephrasing...  The second was more of preference (Though I wonder if I should go for either D5 or D6), as I'm not much of an Enterprise fan.  I also conform to the idea (at least in recent times) that registry numbers ending in letter prefixes (NCC-####-A) should only be reserved for the legendary starships named Enterprise, each being the flagship of the Federation fleet, and to no other ship, which makes the ship stand out, that carries it to legendary status.  We've seen other starships carry the same name as previous ones yet with a different registry, and I figured the starships named Revere would fit as ships that each have different registry numbers.
Bringing up the Yamato's registry won't change my opinion; It's NCC-71807 anyhow according to canon.  If you bring up other things such as that "NCC-1305-E" was stated earlier and thus overwrites "NCC-71807", then why are you referencing Federation and not the UESPA?  It's just personal taste I guess, and for me this makes more sense.  I also half-thought about changing the first Revere's registry number as I'm more of a fan of SFM and figured that having a "509" registry would put her in the late-22nd-century/early-23rd-century or something, but since it's canonical due to TMP's diologue during the first scenes that were taking place around Epsilon IX, I figured, "Why not keep it?"

The last change was more of canonical correction, as Constellation-class Starships had been in service since the 2270s/2280s.  The U.S.S. Hathaway was a Constellation-class Starship (NCC-2593) that had been in service since 2285 (according to what Sirna Kolrami said about the Hathaway being an "eighty year-old Star Cruiser" in "Peak Performance" [TNG], a Season 2 TNG episode taking place in the year 2265).

I might take a whack at altering more of the backstory later on, I might not.  All I'm doing is just adjusting things here and there as a suggestion or two out of boredom, that's all.  I should read the rest of the posts, but I'm due for a speghetti dinner I'm making; I wasn't too fond of turkey, too dry.  Anyhow, apologies to anyone (Alchemist especially) if barging in here and suggesting things in the form of some revisions is insulting.  No offense intended.

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Offline CaptJosh

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #29 on: November 25, 2005, 12:52:12 am »
IIRC, there was at least some speculation that Constellation class ships were an experiment in giving an extended high warp cruising capability to a galactic survey cruiser. Specifically, the design was only supposed to run on two out of the 4 nacelles at a time, switching off between the two sets of two to avoid the kind of wear and tear mentioned in TNG in running ships above a maximum rated cruising speed, such as taking the Enterprise D up past warp factor 9.2 for an extended period of time. IIRC, top speed of the E-D was 9.6 for a maximum of 4 hours before a mandatory shutdown to avoid critical damage to the warp propulsion system.

Another theory was that the 4 nacelles also would allow for burst speeds much higher than normally would be expected for a ship with that kind of power curve, but I don't recall if either speculation was ever confirmed or denied.

However, the Revere clearly is not a Constellation class ship, so this doesn't matter much, does it?
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Offline Grim Reaper

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #30 on: November 25, 2005, 07:52:13 am »
Hey Chris, we'd like more new blood in this forum. Its a small but tightly knit bunch here but there is always room for one more...
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Offline Scottish Andy

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #31 on: November 25, 2005, 09:45:55 am »
I came up with this some time ago and had intended to have this and all my other warp-nacelle arrangement theories already up on my site's Databanks, but so far haven't managed to get round to it. Maybe I will now. Included will be my take on the single-nacelle destroyers and the three-nacelle dreadnoughts. But anyway, to the matter at hand.

I'm of the opinion that the Constellation-class engines are for ordinary use--all 4 at the same time. My theory is this:

The Constitution (refit) and Miranda classes have two horizontally-paired nacelles mounted vertically, each of which generate an asymmetric warp field which 'rubs off' of each other down the vertical fore-to-aft centreline--on the xz-plane--of the ship, to produce a forward motive force. The orientation of the force generated is perpendicular to the plane of the ecliptic of our galaxy.
(To help visualise this in case it's not yet clear, think of the "wet-navy ship at sea" orientation with the warp force basically pushing the ship as the wind in her sails.)

If you look at the nacelle arangement on the Constellation, you see that the upper and lower nacelles are mounted horizontally, not vertically, and opposed to each other--i.e. bottom-to-bottom--when compared to the classes above. So, it is my opinion that the nacelles are paired vertically.

These vertically-paired nacelles then produce the same field as above to create two asymmetrical warp fields along the ship's lateral fore-to-aft centreline, in the xy-plane. With only one set of vertically-paired nacelles, this would force our hypothetical sailing ship to be on her side with respect to the galactic (xy) plane, flying on the edge of her saucer.
(Like Lt. Andie has the Illustrious do in the gas giant rings in Jaeih's 'First Steps'.)

These two xy-plane warp fields then 'rub off' of each other and produce forward warp force on the ship's vertical fore-to-aft centreline, back on the xz-plane, which is the correct "sailing ship at sea" orientation.
This is because the poles of each set of vertically-paired nacelles are diametrically opposite each other, so they cancel each other out and allow the ordinary, normal orientation that the horizontally-paired nacelles of the Constitution and Miranda classes have.

Let me know what you think of my theory, such as any refinements or "But wait a minute!"s you may have. I'm definitely interested in your responses to this one.

PS. Wow, it is really hard to describe this! I just spent over half an hour on this post, trying to be as clear as I can. Yikes! I wish I had a scanner to illustrate this...

Okay... (and apologies to those of you who actually understand this, I'm just trying to get it straight in my own head)

The x-axis runs directly from ahead of you to directly behind you.

The y-axis runs directly from the left of you to the right of you, horizontally at right angles to the x-axis.

This creates the the xy-plane. It is the ground you walk on.

The z-axis runs directly from above you to directly below you. The height of the sky to the depths of the sea.

Therefore when we walk (or crawl or move in any way), we are moving (on flat ground anyway) on the xy-plane, and our motive force propels us forward in the xz-plane. This is what gravity does for us. We are only capable of propelled 3D motion when our feet leave the ground and we defy gravity, however briefly.

Heh.
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Offline AlchemistiD

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #32 on: November 25, 2005, 07:37:49 pm »
Quote
However, the Revere clearly is not a Constellation class ship, so this doesn't matter much, does it?

Not much, I just need the numbers to explain stuff.  Technical exposition.

Offline Jaeih t`Radaik

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2005, 10:39:04 am »
First of all, my apologies for not getting back to you with the tech details you wanted. I forgot.

But my compliments on the sketches on the Katuran ships. They are really cool!
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Offline AlchemistiD

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #34 on: December 06, 2005, 10:47:34 pm »
Work is progressing steadily, though I've hit a bump in the road because of finals. 

I've been designing stuff in my spaCORE MEMORY DUMP IN PROGRESS>>ACCESS TO TERMINAL CR0760>>
<<RESUMING STRING>>re time.  Coming up with alien races is alot harder than it looks at first blanch, especially when you go into the culture.  Well, I'll post another update soon.  It WILL be finished eventually...dammit.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2005, 11:01:14 pm by AlchemistiD »

Offline Jaeih t`Radaik

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #35 on: December 07, 2005, 09:30:01 am »
Really excellent work on that distress call! I know how much time and effort goes into creating the small details that add an air of authenticity to a story. Good work!
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Offline AlchemistiD

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Re: Cannon check
« Reply #36 on: December 07, 2005, 12:26:10 pm »
Um, thaMEMORY DUMP in progress>>ACCESS TO CR0760
<<RESUMING STRING>>nks Jaeih.

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« Last Edit: December 07, 2005, 01:42:23 pm by AlchemistiD »