Topic: Player feedback on current server missions

[Dizzy]

For the next server, post your thoughts about the missions you play on the current servers. I need to know the ones you like and those you dont. Remember to post the name of the mission and whatever other details u like.

this would help much.

Diz

[762_XC]

t00l's TG Patrol Wishlist

1) Smaller maps
2) Remove warping in

[FPF-Tobin Dax]

I miss running the occasion covoy escort and defence missions. I liked the missions that allowed control of your otherwise stupid AIs.(EEK missions?) Warping in was cool, but not with nebula/dust clouds in the way.

[KBF-Kurok]

To be honest  there arent to many i dont like. The one that are broke and wont let you draft  allies nw planet assult i think it is shouldnt be there. The pirate ones from Karnek are fun but time consuming. The warping in is cool unless your  the wing that ends up in the ion storm.
 I do miss the freighter one also but if i rember right it wont allow you to darf allies either but will allow you to draft multiple enemies.
 I honestly think we have a good pack at the moment, it does need work but is much better than what we started with years ago.
 

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Keep warping in, I think its cool.

no extra large maps and a variety of large medium and small ones.

Come up with something new, always good to have fresh variety if possible.

Always kinda like the surprise Reversed but I don't think its suitable for D2 play

[Hexx]

Actually like the current set..

Mission I'd like to see return is that.. was it called sabotage?

Basically your ship had no power at the start, had to sit there and pray you weren't facing a droner.

I'd like to see some missions that can throw different scenarios- weird crap at you , preferably that could be used
for PVP
Randomnly appearing Black Holes is another pet fantasy of mine..

[Dizzy]

Keep warping in, I think its cool.

I like it too. What's wrong with it?

no extra large maps and a variety of large medium and small ones.

No small and no large. Medium and large are ideal. One of traceys missions I got drafted by Kurok and Duck was way outclassed. It took me 3 minutes to travel to the edge at 31 to disengage. WAY too big here.

Always kinda like the surprise Reversed but I don't think its suitable for D2 play

Yeah, was just thinking about that last night. Always was a fun mission.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Just wondering, is it possible to have a mission map that isn't square?  A round or hexigonal or rectangular map might be interesting, not to mention an irregular one with oddly placed borders.  Imagine the effects of a map with open areas and bottle neck borders on combat.  Could be justified by radiation zones, borders of very powerful and hostile being etc.

[FPF-Tobin Dax]

Warping in is fine as long as you don't have a wing who gets left range 30+ behind, or you don't mind warping into an ion storm.

 No small maps ty.

[Dizzy]

How about a small binary star map? 

[FPF-Tobin Dax]

How about a small binary star map? 

Two suns after most of us died to just one sun a few nights ago? 

[Hexx]

Actually I think it would be cool (of course I've never managed to let a sun kill me..)
Kinda put a challenge on it to see who can /will stay in the hex longer with their ship.

[Dizzy]

On a small binary star map.. no one would stay long, haha.

[FPF-DieHard]

Keep the big maps.  There were several kills on AOTK2 that were the result of being able to chase down the opponen tbecaus ethey couldn't run away (Dlfy ).

Maybe give a "Warp off" option if there are no enemy's with 30 Clicks?

[Pojo92]

Thought the "warping in" was cool if we can keep everyone from being warped into the ion storm.

Put some of the Karnak missions in there.  Some of those are brutal (and fun.)  Also will second the vote for some convoy raids.

I liked the large maps, too.  More room to maneuver.

More variety than we had on AOTK2 would be nice.

[762_XC]

What Tobin said. Warping really doesn't add anything to the mission except more moving parts and more things that can go wrong.

Hell I've seen AI allies warp completely off the map. Too much silliness to keep it IMHO.

[GDA-S'Cipio]

I like the big maps.

I really like the warping in.  It is a nice gimmic, and its bugs added more spice to the game IMO.  There were a couple of times when I warped ahead of my allies and ended up close to the enemy.  I had to book it back out and form up with my allies.  There was once when I even warped *over* the enemy and ended up on the other side.  (Naturally, they got to fire as I flew over them......)

I know it's random and can put you in a bad spot, but I liked it.  This made it seem more like war, where sometimes you stumble upon the enemy or else he catches you out of formation.  Or vice versa.

-S'Cipio

[FPF-DieHard]

I like the big maps.

I really like the warping in.  It is a nice gimmic, and its bugs added more spice to the game IMO.  There were a couple of times when I warped ahead of my allies and ended up close to the enemy.  I had to book it back out and form up with my allies.  There was once when I even warped *over* the enemy and ended up on the other side.  (Naturally, they got to fire as I flew over them......)

I know it's random and can put you in a bad spot, but I liked it.  This made it seem more like war, where sometimes you stumble upon the enemy or else he catches you out of formation.  Or vice versa.

-S'Cipio

What Godzookie here says.   If a Gorn can live with the large maps . . .

[KBFLordKrueg]

Liked the Big maps...
Liked the warping in thing, although, warping into an Ion Cloud sucked. And the AI will ALWAYS blindly fly right through the Ion cloud. With a little finesse, you can kill the enemy AI merely by leading them through Ion clouds...hilarious...
I do miss the Convoy raid and escort mission, tho, for better or for worse...
Need something for mission variety...running the same 1 or 2 missions that you always seem to pull during a "Hex-Flipping" campaign (with map VCs only) can get monotonies.

[GDA-S'Cipio]

Liked the Big maps...
Liked the warping in thing, although, warping into an Ion Cloud sucked. And the AI will ALWAYS blindly fly right through the Ion cloud. With a little finesse, you can kill the enemy AI merely by leading them through Ion clouds...hilarious...

I did have a bit of an annoyance with the Ion Storm terrain.  Constantly having to fly around Ion Storms also got a little old.
 I was never unfortunate enough to warp into an ion storm, but the AI seemed to have absolutely no clue that it was there. 

The AI will avoid roks, it will avoid planets, it will avoid suns, and it will avoid black holes.  But as Krueg says, Ion Storms it will just run right through.   

I think the key here is careful map design.  Only use Ion Storms in a few, carefully selected hexs.  (Like, any Klink base hex that is supposed to be manned by Vudar, maybe.)  But don't make them general-use terrain features.

-S'Cipio

[Hexx]

Actually- kinda related topic-
Who's idea was it to put that Lyran base up near Rom space in the Neb on AOTK2?

Just kinda an odd place to put one (imho)..

[Riskyllama]

uh..wasn't me..i was only there for the ISC base in that neb hex

[Dfly]

Keep the big maps.  There were several kills on AOTK2 that were the result of being able to chase down the opponen tbecaus ethey couldn't run away (Dlfy ).

Maybe give a "Warp off" option if there are no enemy's with 30 Clicks?

LOL DH, considering I killed you 3 to my 1 death while you flew Hydran, I dont mind. 

[Julin Eurthyr]

Would still like to see some work done on mission matching...

I-FF (downgraded intentionally, I personally detest the I-DD), draws a I-POL and L-MP, squares off against a CA and 2 CLs...  in home space.  Kinda turned me off from the whole server...

I didn't see a general complaint about mission matching all server, so this could be a fluke (though I had similar odds with the I-DD), figure now's the time to mention it (when all's quiet and the scripters can make sure their anti-ISC coding is working perfectly... )

[FPF-DieHard]

Keep the big maps.  There were several kills on AOTK2 that were the result of being able to chase down the opponen tbecaus ethey couldn't run away (Dlfy ).

Maybe give a "Warp off" option if there are no enemy's with 30 Clicks?

LOL DH, considering I killed you 3 to my 1 death while you flew Hydran, I dont mind. 

I know, and one of those was a 2v1 that I would have gotten away on a smaller map.

See my point?

[Dfly]

so true, but had you just turned away and flew off, you woulda been off, whlie we never got close enough to hurt you.

[FPF-DieHard]

so true, but had you just turned away and flew off, you woulda been off, whlie we never got close enough to hurt you.

you can't get close enough on a Small map either

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

What Godzookie here says.   If a Gorn can live with the large maps . . .

I can't think of any plasma captain who wouldn't like them, kinda stating the obvious.  Same with drone races and small maps 

Personally I don't mind large maps too much, as long as they aren't every mission,......variety is good.

[GDA-S'Cipio]

What Godzookie here says.   If a Gorn can live with the large maps . . .

I can't think of any plasma captain who wouldn't like them, kinda stating the obvious.  Same with drone races and small maps 

Personally I don't mind large maps too much, as long as they aren't every mission,......variety is good.

Eh?  You kind of lost me here.  I thought the conventional wisdom was that plasma captains prefer smaller maps, because it gives them a map edge/corner to pin their enemy in.  We definitley had an eaiser time winning on GSA with smaller maps.  I can't think of any advantage that plasma gains from a bigger map.  If larger maps favor anyone, I think they'd favor the races with direct firepower.  They have plenty of room to outrun the plasma and use their advantage of long-range firepower.

I just like the bigger maps because it helps reduce the artificiality of a magical "map edge" in space.  There really shouldn't be any map edge at all.   If you got far enough away from the enemy, you should just get a message asking if you want to leave or not.

-S'Cipio

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

What Godzookie here says.   If a Gorn can live with the large maps . . .

I can't think of any plasma captain who wouldn't like them, kinda stating the obvious.  Same with drone races and small maps 

Personally I don't mind large maps too much, as long as they aren't every mission,......variety is good.

Eh?  You kind of lost me here.  I thought the conventional wisdom was that plasma captains prefer smaller maps, because it gives them a map edge/corner to pin their enemy in.  We definitley had an eaiser time winning on GSA with smaller maps.  I can't think of any advantage that plasma gains from a bigger map.  If larger maps favor anyone, I think they'd favor the races with direct firepower.  They have plenty of room to outrun the plasma and use their advantage of long-range firepower.

I just like the bigger maps because it helps reduce the artificiality of a magical "map edge" in space.  There really shouldn't be any map edge at all.   If you got far enough away from the enemy, you should just get a message asking if you want to leave or not.

-S'Cipio

Well when I fly plasma I like the big map as it gives plenty of room to run away while recharging.  Maybe vs a Fed with proxies it might work to your disadvantage, but vs a Kzin, Hydran or Lyran a big map would be an asset IMHO, as its usually these races trying to pin down the plasma chucker.  Not sure about a Klingon, likely good vs a droner bad vs a saber dancer.  Anyone who gets pinned in vs a single Plasma boat on any size map deserves it.  Now if your talking multiple ship combat and not a 1 v 1 I can see a smaller map helping plasma a bit more, but in a 1 v 1 I think the larger map is better by far.

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

Well, we have 27 different terrain types to play with. Only a few of them in the patrols had ion storms, it just so happens that those few were in places that saw heavy traffic.

Some of those terrain types can use medium or small maps, if that is desired. The warping into an ion storm thing is easily fixed, just move the ion storm.

Some of the maps were deliberately made treachorous and were designed to be used sparingly on a map.

Unfortunately maps have to be square, no other shapes possible.

Starting positions can be changed so that all players start on a map edge. The idea of being able to warp out when you get a certain distance from your enemies is very doable and has merit (especially if you are on a large map).

Mission variety is just a matter of finding all the bugs first so we dont end up with a whole bunch of missions that have bugs. Once this is done, I'll also be releasing the source code to all of the missions I write for the benefit of current and future scripters (so the wheel doesnt have to be reinvented every time).

[Dizzy]

Someone said they could just lure AI into the ION storms to kill em. It's faster to just head over and blow em up.

I love the ION storms. Very excellent strategic play and situational awareness arises from this terrain which is something few practice on open maps. Makes a match so much more interesting... If the ION storm could be moved so the AI doent warp into them, then the rest of the map is good to me.

Oh, and Tracey, what artifex terrain definition triggers ION storm maps?

[FPF-DieHard]

Well when I fly plasma I like the big map as it gives plenty of room to run away while recharging.  Maybe vs a Fed with proxies it might work to your disadvantage, but vs a Kzin, Hydran or Lyran a big map would be an asset IMHO, as its usually these races trying to pin down the plasma chucker.  Not sure about a Klingon, likely good vs a droner bad vs a saber dancer.  Anyone who gets pinned in vs a single Plasma boat on any size map deserves it.  Now if your talking multiple ship combat and not a 1 v 1 I can see a smaller map helping plasma a bit more, but in a 1 v 1 I think the larger map is better by far.

It isn't the 1v1 that are an issue.   in the 2v2 fights, the side with the most crunch can corner the other side too easily on the ED maps

[el-Karnak]

Can someone please summarize what is the most annoying feature in the missions, and what is the most liked feature in the missions.

[FPF-DieHard]

Can someone please summarize what is the most annoying feature in the missions, and what is the most liked feature in the missions.

Most annoying:  Drops, repeditiveness.

Like best:   Stability, uniformity.

[FPF-DieHard]

The idea of being able to warp out when you get a certain distance from your enemies is very doable and has merit (especially if you are on a large map).

 

[el-Karnak]

The idea of being able to warp out when you get a certain distance from your enemies is very doable and has merit (especially if you are on a large map).

 

It would be funny to see a player warp into a planet or some rock, by accident, hehe. 

[Dizzy]

Can someone please summarize what is the most annoying feature in the missions, and what is the most liked feature in the missions.

rANDOM MAP OBJECTS.

[el-Karnak]

Can someone please summarize what is the most annoying feature in the missions, and what is the most liked feature in the missions.

rANDOM MAP OBJECTS.

Oh, I luv them. They are staying.

[FPF-DieHard]

The idea of being able to warp out when you get a certain distance from your enemies is very doable and has merit (especially if you are on a large map).

 

It would be funny to see a player warp into a planet or some rock, by accident, hehe. 

I'm kinda counting on it   

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

Someone said they could just lure AI into the ION storms to kill em. It's faster to just head over and blow em up.

I love the ION storms. Very excellent strategic play and situational awareness arises from this terrain which is something few practice on open maps. Makes a match so much more interesting... If the ION storm could be moved so the AI doent warp into them, then the rest of the map is good to me.

Oh, and Tracey, what artifex terrain definition triggers ION storm maps?

I think I put ion storms into Nebula 6, Asteroids 6 and Open Space 6.

[Hexx]

All I really want is to be chasing t00l around the map when this big black hole opens up
right in front of him and in he goes.
Since Kroma's left though I need scripters to do it.

(Wasn't there a mission that had a star or something explode- you had x number of minutes to find something?)

[FPF-DieHard]

All I really want is to be chasing t00l around the map when this big black hole opens up
right in front of him and in he goes.
Since Kroma's left though I need scripters to do it.

(Wasn't there a mission that had a star or something explode- you had x number of minutes to find something?)

I think that was Star Trek: Generations

[Riskyllama]

what about the old SFC1 map black hole mania?

edit: instead of throwing a whole nother box under kzin (cause he's right)
he's right about that terrain...the only thing that i ever had to fly around was the ion storm... I'd much rather have to dodge asteroids, fly around a planet to find out what my opponet was flying etc...

[Kzinbane]

About the terrain -  I liked the variety but more often than not the place whrere the opposing ships actually meet is empty space a ways away from any of the "scenery" so it hardly mattered.  Obviously if it's P vs P you could run  toward the rocks or planet or whatever or use the ion storm but mostly you fought in empty space areas.
What I'd like to see is have the  cetner of the map as the area where the planet, moon, thick asteroids, whatever is at - so it impacted more on play. 

I found P vs P to be fun, but I always like smaller ships and the trend with SFC has always been for people to generally go for the biggest and best they can afford.  Usually it turns into BC fest 0r DN fest unless they are restricted.. if they are then droner fest, carrier fest.. etc starts.  To make these more interesting for small ship fliers you almost have to have the convoy attacks, convoy escorts, ateroid base defense, etc.  A DD can win vs a BC at times in these as the goal is to do something besides just kill the other ship.  A lot more strategy can be used in keeping the asteroid base alive for example and having it use it's fire power to protect you from the big meany ship.

Anyhow I for one miss the variety - patrol after patrol after patrol gets old.

Kzinbane

[Dizzy]

What about like a really big rock with a hole in it you could fly thru? Donut run.

[Corbomite]

I have a whole list of terrain maps that would be cool. Listed them in the DIP, gave them to DH and Tracey. No one seems interested though.

[el-Karnak]

I have a whole list of terrain maps that would be cool. Listed them in the DIP, gave them to DH and Tracey. No one seems interested though.

A year ago, I did randomized map terrain based some of your ideas in the current EEK mission packs.

I definitely think randomized map terrain is a must to take off  a little of the boredom factors.

Plus, you can watch players crash into planets and rocks and things.  That Black planet in the shiplist is soooo baaaadddd.   

[GDA-S'Cipio]

I found P vs P to be fun, but I always like smaller ships and the trend with SFC has always been for people to generally go for the biggest and best they can afford.  Usually it turns into BC fest 0r DN fest unless they are restricted.. if they are then droner fest, carrier fest.. etc starts.  To make these more interesting for small ship fliers you almost have to have the convoy attacks, convoy escorts, ateroid base defense, etc.  A DD can win vs a BC at times in these as the goal is to do something besides just kill the other ship.  A lot more strategy can be used in keeping the asteroid base alive for example and having it use it's fire power to protect you from the big meany ship.

Anyhow I for one miss the variety - patrol after patrol after patrol gets old.

Kzinbane

I agree.  Patrols are the most boring missions and yet make up 90% of all missions flown.  (Of course, a lot of that is our own fault.  We tak them because they are also the shortest!)   A wider variety of missions would be great and I have faith that our scriptors will get to this in good time once the basic patrols are completely debugged.  

In the meantime, get thy butt onto Squadron Commander.  All those old missions are there, and the ships are small!

-S'Cipio

[el-Karnak]

I have faith that our scriptors will get to this in good time once the basic patrols are completely debugged.

???

You already have EEK patrols the work pretty good and they even have randomized map terrain to alleviate patrol mission boredom.  Check out The Forge server.

U should modify that sentence to:

I have faith that  the scriptor will get to this in good time once her basic patrols are completely debugged.

You don't have much to complain about on the boredom factor if you don't fully utilize all the mission packs available.

[Dizzy]

I want a bunch of moving asteroids... Now that would be a REAL asteroid field. Screw that spinning in one spot crap.

And corbo, Karnak and I worked hard to get random terrain done. There's more to do with it tho.... SQL missions I think would take random terrain to the next level. But it is the damned coolest thing. Breaks up the monotony of those 90% quickie boringish patrols we get all the time.

[762_XC]

No towable rocks please.

[FPF-DieHard]

No towable rocks please.

We can fiz that in the shiplist, give rocks a move cost of 10 

[SkyFlyer]

No towable rocks please.

LOL  maybe an occassional one.

[Seanner]

I found P vs P to be fun, but I always like smaller ships and the trend with SFC has always been for people to generally go for the biggest and best they can afford.  Usually it turns into BC fest 0r DN fest unless they are restricted.. if they are then droner fest, carrier fest.. etc starts.  To make these more interesting for small ship fliers you almost have to have the convoy attacks, convoy escorts, ateroid base defense, etc.  A DD can win vs a BC at times in these as the goal is to do something besides just kill the other ship.  A lot more strategy can be used in keeping the asteroid base alive for example and having it use it's fire power to protect you from the big meany ship.

Anyhow I for one miss the variety - patrol after patrol after patrol gets old.

Kzinbane

I agree.  Patrols are the most boring missions and yet make up 90% of all missions flown.  (Of course, a lot of that is our own fault.  We tak them because they are also the shortest!)   A wider variety of missions would be great and I have faith that our scriptors will get to this in good time once the basic patrols are completely debugged.  

In the meantime, get thy butt onto Squadron Commander.  All those old missions are there, and the ships are small!

-S'Cipio

Can it be programmed so that the prestige and hex changing value is directly proportional to the average mission time?  So in effect you get the same amount over time as long as you keep winning missions?  By "hex changing value" I mean in the hex flipping wars it seems to change by one... is there a way to edit those values?

By the way, how the .... do you beat "epicenter", everytime I try it all the ships die immediately.

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

I have a whole list of terrain maps that would be cool. Listed them in the DIP, gave them to DH and Tracey. No one seems interested though.

Not at all, Corb, I implemented some of your ideas in the current maps being used.

[Corbomite]

I have a whole list of terrain maps that would be cool. Listed them in the DIP, gave them to DH and Tracey. No one seems interested though.

Not at all, Corb, I implemented some of your ideas in the current maps being used.

I DL'd your missions and played them in single player. I hadn't commented because I know they are a work in progress. If it is alright with you I'd like to get together when the missions are at the point where the whipped cream and cherry are ready to be added ( I'll bring the whipped cream and you bring the cherries  ) and discuss what types of maps are feasible, desired and able to be implemented in a way that make repetitive missions a thing of the past.

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

I have a whole list of terrain maps that would be cool. Listed them in the DIP, gave them to DH and Tracey. No one seems interested though.

Not at all, Corb, I implemented some of your ideas in the current maps being used.

I DL'd your missions and played them in single player. I hadn't commented because I know they are a work in progress. If it is alright with you I'd like to get together when the missions are at the point where the whipped cream and cherry are ready to be added ( I'll bring the whipped cream and you bring the cherries  ) and discuss what types of maps are feasible, desired and able to be implemented in a way that make repetitive missions a thing of the past.

By all means... 

[CaptJosh]

Can it be programmed so that the prestige and hex changing value is directly proportional to the average mission time?  So in effect you get the same amount over time as long as you keep winning missions?  By "hex changing value" I mean in the hex flipping wars it seems to change by one... is there a way to edit those values?

By the way, how the .... do you beat "epicenter", everytime I try it all the ships die immediately.

Odd. I've never had that problem. It's a pain in the butt to beat, but I can beat it, and have beaten it on more than one occasion. I don't like it, though. Don't like it at all.