Topic: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!  (Read 2594 times)

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Offline Stormbringer

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Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« on: August 18, 2005, 03:41:06 am »
Rings Too Good for Saturn, Have Own Atmosphere
By Bjorn Carey
Space Staff Writer
posted: 17 August, 2005
2:20 pm ET
 

New data from the Cassini spacecraft indicates that Saturn’s trademark rings have their own atmosphere, separate from the gas around the planet they encircle.

 

During close fly-bys of the rings, instruments on Cassini detected that the environment around the rings is atmosphere-like. More interestingly, though, is that the ring atmosphere is made up of molecular oxygen – two atoms of oxygen bonded together – like that found in Earth’s atmosphere.

 

The ice that makes up Saturn’s rings is also the source of the oxygen that makes up this atmosphere.

 

“As water comes off the rings, it is split by sunlight; the resulting hydrogen and atomic oxygen are then lost, leaving molecular oxygen,” said Cassini investigator Andrew Coates of the Mullard Space Science Laboratory at University College London.

 

Saturn’s rings are made up mostly of water ice along with small amounts of dust and rocky bits. Ultraviolet rays from the Sun pry the water molecules loose from the rings and split them into their building blocks – hydrogen and the two forms of oxygen – by a process called photodissociation.

 

The ring atmosphere is probably kept in place by gravitational forces, Coates says. The check-and-balance between the loss of material from the ring system and a re-supply from the ring particles also helps.

 

Although the rings are about 155,343 miles (250,000 kilometers) in diameter, they are actually quite thin, less than a mile (1.5 kilometers). And even though the rings appear gigantic, there actually isn’t a whole lot to them. If all the rings were squeezed into one solid ring, it would be no more than 62 miles (100 kilometers) across.

 

Sky-watchers have gazed at Saturn’s rings for centuries, but the rings’ origin is still somewhat of a mystery. Initially, scientists thought that the rings formed from swirling clouds of cosmic gas around the same time as the planets about 4 billion years ago. The current belief, however, is that they are only a few hundred million years old.

 

Other theories suggest that the rings were formed by various asteroid collisions with Saturn’s moons or from broken-up comets.

 

The rings are not stable and are constantly regenerated, most likely from the break-up of Saturn’s satellites.

 

The ring system’s oxygen atmosphere differs drastically from the atmosphere of Saturn itself – Saturn’s atmosphere is 91 percent hydrogen by mass.

 

The instruments aboard Cassini that registered the rings’ atmosphere were the Ion and Neutral Mass Spectrometer – operated by the United States and Germany – and the Cassini Plasma Spectrometer, which is operated by the US, Finland, France, Hungary, Norway, and the United Kingdom.


Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2005, 12:36:51 pm »
Come on Guys! Stephen! Surely you are going to refernce Ring World?

Offline Dracho

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2005, 12:38:55 pm »
Well, I'm pretty sure if you are trying to breathe it  you'd would be a dead ringer... :P
The worst enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan.  - Karl von Clausewitz

Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2005, 12:42:50 pm »
Well, I'm pretty sure if you are trying to breathe it  you'd would be a dead ringer... :P

probably true. But Saturn is not the only ringed world out there. many of them are much larger than jupiter and their rings might be denser than Saturn.

Offline Dracho

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2005, 12:57:06 pm »
Well, I'm pretty sure if you are trying to breathe it  you'd would be a dead ringer... :P

probably true. But Saturn is not the only ringed world out there. many of them are much larger than jupiter and their rings might be denser than Saturn.

That's true.. and some of the Gas Behemoths (as opposed to Giant) that have been discovered in other solar systems are much closer in to their star than Saturn.. within the liquid water zone in fact.
The worst enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan.  - Karl von Clausewitz

Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2005, 12:59:05 pm »
Ring World!

Offline prometheus

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2005, 03:50:59 pm »
Well, I'm pretty sure if you are trying to breathe it  you'd would be a dead ringer... :P

probably true. But Saturn is not the only ringed world out there. many of them are much larger than jupiter and their rings might be denser than Saturn.

That's true.. and some of the Gas Behemoths (as opposed to Giant) that have been discovered in other solar systems are much closer in to their star than Saturn.. within the liquid water zone in fact.

Liquid water rings?  I would think they would evaporate into space...


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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2005, 03:54:41 pm »
 if the gravity of saturn keeps diatomic oxygen confined to the torus then water molecules would not be that much harder to keep trapped. particularly if it was clustered in packets as is waters wont to do.

Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2005, 04:00:40 pm »
aslso i had the right author but wrong book. It was

The setting of Niven's 1984 novel The Integral Trees was striking and imaginative, even for this acclaimed world builder; it's well worth the second visit made in this sequel. Around a neutron star an envelope of gas holds a breathable atmosphere and a strange profusion of plant and animal life, all floating in free-fall. Five hundred years after the crew of the Earth ship Discipline mutinied and deserted to this paradise, their descendants are still watched over by the ship's unbalanced computer mind. The machine is busy manipulating its one small contact group into exploring the larger city they have been avoiding for years. Aspects of this society are intriguingfor instance, the disdain of the better-adapted taller, thinner people for the "dwarfish" throwbacks, even though only the short can fit into the scientific relics of the old ship. As usual with Niven, character and story are just an excuse for working out the properties of his wonderful imaginary world, where people can fly like birds and ponds full of fish hang in midair. Unfortunately, in this book he fails to marshal the visual and dramatic flair needed to show it off to best effect.
Copyright 1987 Reed Business Information, Inc.--This text refers to an out of print or unavailable edition of this title.

Book Description
In the free-fall environment of the Smoke Ring, the descendants of the crew of the Discipline no longer remembered their Earth roots -- or the existence of Sharls Davis Kendy, the computer-program despot of the ship. Until Kendy initiated contact once more.

Fourteen years later, only Jeffer, the Citizens Tree Scientist, knew that Kendy was still watching -- and waiting. Then the Citizens Tree people rescued a family of loggers and learned for the first time of the Admiralty, a large society living in free fall amid the floating debris called the Clump. And it was likely that the Admiralty had maintained, intact, Discipline's original computer library.

Exploration was a temptation neither Jeffer nor Kendy could resist, and neither Citizens Tree nor Sharls Davis Kendy would ever be the same again...

Offline prometheus

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2005, 04:12:57 pm »
if the gravity of saturn keeps diatomic oxygen confined to the torus then water molecules would not be that much harder to keep trapped. particularly if it was clustered in packets as is waters wont to do.

Roger that, but keeping steam trapped in orbit is not going to be particularly conducive to the evolution of life...


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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2005, 04:18:52 pm »
well that depends on the distance from the heat source and the shadow of the primary and many other factors.

Offline RazalYllib

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2005, 06:00:03 pm »
Yup, someone beat me to it.

The "Smoke Ring" is the setting for the two very good novels written by Niven.
A gas Tourus (donut shaped) was formed from the remains of a Gas Giant ripped apart when it drifted too close and got caught in the gravity well of a small neutron star which is in orbit around another star.

Very good read, highly recommended.

Wish he would pen another...sorta off topic, but picked up and comsumed Barsoom project (3 day power read) and I really want another Dream Park novel.  I cannot find my California Voodoo Game copy (last Dream Park novel) and really want to visit that place again. 

If I were some manner of infinite supreme being or had one wish, makeing Dream Park a reality would be it
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Offline Just plain old Punisher

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2005, 06:21:01 pm »
Interesting....but without protection from an electromagnetic field I doubt very much life could exist in such a condition.

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Offline Bonk

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2005, 06:41:07 pm »
Ring World!

I loved that book...  :thumbsup:


WRT to the posted news: I'm thinking FUEL STOP!
Now if they had a western and fries there too, we'd be all set!  ;D

Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2005, 07:42:37 pm »
Yes indeed. fuel stop it is. hydrogen from the primary, O2 from the ring and even free water if ya dont want to combine 'em and go snow ball huntin' instead.

Offline prometheus

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Re: Saturn's Rings have their own oxygen atmosphere!
« Reply #15 on: August 19, 2005, 06:50:58 am »
well that depends on the distance from the heat source and the shadow of the primary and many other factors.

True...  the rings could freeze on the nightside and evaporate on the day side...  I hate to sound, yet again, like I don't want to find life anywhere else in the Universe, but this sounds even less propitious for life...  In many ways, life did not just adapt to living on Earth, over the aeons it adapted Earth to it as well, The Oxygen rich atmosphere is a good example of this...  The Earth would be a very different planet now if there had never been any life on it... 

I think you're gonna find that all life in the Universe is going to be on planets pretty similar to ours...


To make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the Universe!