Topic: new player wanting in on AOTK2  (Read 7705 times)

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Offline Seanner

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new player wanting in on AOTK2
« on: July 28, 2005, 11:52:11 am »
Hello, played single player SFC for a bit and read these forums for an equal bit, learned many people found copies of OP at Sam's.  So I went and now have my own (the cd-key worked fine).  Was hoping to join AOTK2 if it's not too late?  I'm not sure how everything works yet but of course I'll read the rules at least.

Also was wondering if recorded games work at all.  I had downloaded some from xenocorp and either they were a different patch version and wouldn't show up in the list, or the game would crash immediately upon loading the "film".  Was hoping to watch some of the best players duel it out, because playing vs. admiral AI I see no reason to maintain the high speed's everyone talks about unless vs. a missile or plasma ship.  I guess also vs a Lyran you may as well stay outside range 3.

But if I were a Fed vs Klingon, he's free to go speed 31 while I go 10 with overloads.  If he closes, he loses either the front shield or rear shield if I do a HET just before he hits me, at which point I switch to normal and possibly take some offline to maintain a good enough speed to keep on his weakened shield (and at 31 he clearly did not have full weapons himself, so he's in trouble at this point).  If he "saber dances" instead of closing then I just switch to proximities...they are roughly equivalent in damage over time to his disruptors at longer ranges, however my phaser 1s are better and my slower speed allows more ECM and shield reinforcement.  Either way he loses.  It seems for him to win he must stay for a knife-fight and make use of the maneuverability advantage and side-intersecting phaser arcs... basically he could always fire full weapons while presenting a new shield every time.  If I were to win in THIS situation I would have to sit there defensively and charge up while taking as little damage as possible, then try to go fast enough to get an angle on his weak shield, and finally if necessary an HET to get the firing solution.  Then he would try to speed up enough to avoid me getting that angle, possibly too fast to catch.  With similar power curves that means it's my phaser 1s vs his weak rear shield and his ph2s vs my weak front shield, and ph1s only get better as the range increases relative to 2s, so I'm happy to sit back and reinforce/ECM while this is happening.

As far as I can tell, the "minimax" strategy at work in a Fed vs Klingon frigate engagement is a knife fight where the Klingon goes JUST fast enough to keep his missing shield away after the initial engagement but slow enough to keep a turning fight.  If he's too slow my shields are stronger and I can HET, if he's too fast he's degrading his own weapons through range faster than mine AND without a strong rear shield!  So he has to run at an angle, not getting shot directly in the back but still staying close in order to fire all ph2s at reasonable range.

Perhaps HE could do the HET in the beginning and go for MY rear shield (in the initial pass he should present a forward-side shield), and just stay there forever on my tail with front shield reinforcement on a still-full front shield vs just my ph1s until my photons recharged, at which point he could have begun to open the distance once again to take minimal damage from those.  THAT is what I'm afraid of.  Not saber dancing!

Maybe this is the wrong forum for a tactics discussion, but nobody discusses these anywhere that I can fnid, except the barren tactics section of these same boards.  Given the lively discussions on any RTS game's boards, I was surprised that people don't seem to discuss SFC in detail that much :(

In any case, I look forward to joining you all online soon :)

Offline Sirgod

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2005, 11:56:14 am »
I'm sure you can jump right In. We have a pretty good group here.

as for tactics, One thing to consider, is most of the people have been here for over 5 years, and have perfected there own Tactics, that Pretty much has been used over the aforementioned time. Personaly, I always look forward to a Tactics discussion, But so many of us already know 99% of what each other knows.

It basicly comes down to who makes the first mistake with alot of the old timers. I hope this helps, and welcome to the boards.

Stephen
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Offline Hexx

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2005, 12:11:37 pm »
Is it odd that I always get terribly confused when someone tries to outline tactics?

-Welcome to the D2 (or wherever we be) Joining AOTK2 is easy, just DL everything and then choose
a side (sounds like you wan to fly Fed, well no accounting for taste ...)
Tactics are really (almost) to the point where they're vs a certain player as opposed to a race, still the best
way to learn is to get online and kick a few people around.
-Again most people tend to kick the Feds around since, well they're Feds,
KBF pilots are good ones to practice on though, they tend to get confused easily.
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline Kruk

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2005, 12:26:33 pm »
I found the best tactic for a fed vs a Klingon is Starcastling. Unless fighters are involved or the hull size is less then a cruiser or he as a drone ship. I sent you a personal message on the full tactic on doing it.

Now that tactic is mostly for a BCF vs a C7, but it can be applied with any other heavy cruiser hull and up.

Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2005, 12:27:06 pm »
Get on voice comms.

Do  Google for Teamspeak and download the Cient app for Windows.

Kitities and allaince are using this for comms.
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Seanner

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2005, 12:34:59 pm »
Quote
I'm sure you can jump right In. We have a pretty good group here.

as for tactics, One thing to consider, is most of the people have been here for over 5 years, and have perfected there own Tactics, that Pretty much has been used over the aforementioned time. Personaly, I always look forward to a Tactics discussion, But so many of us already know 99% of what each other knows.

It basicly comes down to who makes the first mistake with alot of the old timers. I hope this helps, and welcome to the boards.

Stephen

I see, but unforunately I cannot find any of these past discussions on tactics except for a few things that repeat the few things from every other site.  Plasma ballet, for example.  Does not explain why it works or why it doesn't work or why not to do this or that, just says "go fast shoot plasma".

Quote
Is it odd that I always get terribly confused when someone tries to outline tactics?

-Welcome to the D2 (or wherever we be) Joining AOTK2 is easy, just DL everything and then choose
a side (sounds like you wan to fly Fed, well no accounting for taste ...)
Tactics are really (almost) to the point where they're vs a certain player as opposed to a race, still the best
way to learn is to get online and kick a few people around.
-Again most people tend to kick the Feds around since, well they're Feds,
KBF pilots are good ones to practice on though, they tend to get confused easily.

Confused, why?  Certainly not because what I said was incorrect! ;)  What I said was meant as a proposition, hopefully to be countered by the resident expertl which from what I've read appears to be you.  Perhaps you could send some recorded games?  Or is it all top secret?

As for wanting to fly Fed, dunno yet.  As a still relatively new player I find all the races interesting.  Hopefully in SFC2:OP the Hydrans aren't as overpowered as in SFC1...I recall taking out an admiral AI Klingon dread with a Hydran frigate using suicide overloads and repairing them while going speed 31.  In fact maybe I'm not remembering correctly but I think I had 40 points of shield reinforcement, 6 ECM, EM, level 5 tractors, full defense tractors, and full overloads and phasers charging while going 31 and charging the battery with 2 excess power still... or something.  Good power either way.

Quote
I found the best tactic for a fed vs a Klingon is Starcastling. Unless fighters are involved or the hull size is less then a cruiser or he as a drone ship. I sent you a personal message on the full tactic on doing it.

Now that tactic is mostly for a BCF vs a C7, but it can be applied with any other heavy cruiser hull and up.
Thanks Kruk!

Quote
Get on voice comms.

Do  Google for Teamspeak and download the Cient app for Windows.

Kitities and allaince are using this for comms.

Affirmative, in fact I have Teamspeak from previous Counter-strike *shudders* experience.  Hopefully this game has a more mature audience :)

Offline Sirgod

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2005, 12:47:13 pm »
As far as the Mature audience, At first you may need to get used to our little Jokes at each others expense, but for the most part, we have alot of Professional workers/ Military minded peeps here. Some of our jokes may seem abit childish, but we don't do that whole 733t thingie. well except for Tool, but he's funny when he does It.

as far as fleets, I can't think of one, who doesn't support Personal honor over anything else. For the most part, Everyone tries there best to get along, and to Be Fair when addressing a situation.

as to the Tactic discussions, Most of them where on the old Taldren boards, and even the old Interplay boards. unfortuantly, they are long gone by know, save what Frey and Crew where able to salvage when we moved everything to the new site about a year ago. I'm sure there are alot of people here though who will help you out with tactics. Heck even get on Gamespy, and join a group with someone who's name you recognize here. they will be happy to bring you up to speed with what we are doing.

Stephen
"You cannot exaggerate about the Marines. They are convinced to the point of arrogance, that they are the most ferocious fighters on earth - and the amusing thing about it is that they are."- Father Kevin Keaney, Chaplain, Korean War

Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2005, 12:57:44 pm »


Confused, why?  Certainly not because what I said was incorrect! ;)  What I said was meant as a proposition, hopefully to be countered by the resident expertl which from what I've read appears to be you.  Perhaps you could send some recorded games?  Or is it all top secret?


Quote

IU have some wonderful films of Hexx's Exploits  ;D
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Seanner

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2005, 01:20:13 pm »
Good to hear, Stephen, and of course I'm fine with that sort of joking :)

Yes it is too bad all those forums are gone now, that would explain the lack of tactics discussions.  I had forgotten about this, in fact I almost tried to register the game yesterday when I got it installed :)

To Die Hard: lol I don't recall seeing that quote in this thread anywhere.

Offline Sirgod

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2005, 01:23:43 pm »
that's good to hear, I think your going to fit in just fine around these parts.

Good Luck and Good Gaming.

Stephen

PS. See how easy It is to get new people into new friends?  ;D
"You cannot exaggerate about the Marines. They are convinced to the point of arrogance, that they are the most ferocious fighters on earth - and the amusing thing about it is that they are."- Father Kevin Keaney, Chaplain, Korean War

Offline KBF-Kurok

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #10 on: July 28, 2005, 01:29:08 pm »
Starcastling  aginst a c7 in a BCF is suicide. Any was welcome.Rember dont listen to any thing Hexx tells you.
DH has the pics tp prove it. Hopefully your on high speed so here is what you gonna need to get on to AOTK2.http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163351823.0.htmlgo here and dl the enhancment package from Pestelance.Here to get what you need for aotkhttp://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163358570.0.html. Dont worry about dl ed missions they are in the enhancment pack. Be sure to dl the TG mission pack tho. Follow the instructions in both threads.
If you have any problems just come back here and ask anything.Were all here to help and have fun.
GH and Hope to see you on the Battle field soon.
Kurok

Offline GDA-Agave

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2005, 01:31:21 pm »
Seanner,

You bring up some points for the Fed vs Klink battle.   We all have our preferences as to race as well as tactics we are more comfortable with.  With each race you will find additional websites for fleets that delve very deeply into the pros and cons of using certain tactics.   Your best bet is to contact some of the pilots whose race you are interested in playing and get the "inside scoop" on what tactics work against other live pilots.   Of course, nothing works better than the firsthand experience of flying against other pilots in Gamespy or especially here in a SFC:OP server.

You will find that starting a general tactical discussion here we will get opinions from pilots who fly all the races.   There are pros and cons to that as well.   :o

I look forward to flying with or against you on the AOTK2 server.

One last point, if you have any questions about ANYTHING, ask someone.   It is in our own best interest to keep all the pilots as informed as possible to maintain a good pilot base.    I, for one, will be very willing to help out at any opportunity.

Welcome,

Agave
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Offline Seanner

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #12 on: July 28, 2005, 01:36:56 pm »
Ok thanks all for the replies, I'm about to leave work so it's time to get started with online playing.

Now we have a debate going on proper BCH vs C7 tactics in the making, I suggest a duel between the two debatees :D

I'll play the loser to make him feel better.

While I'm thinking of it and before I leave, I would like to sadly point out that my local Blockbuster does not have ST IV: Whatever it's called, the one with the whale where they steal the Bird of Prey.  I love that one.

Offline Sirgod

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2005, 01:45:42 pm »
ST4: the voyage home.

A pretty good directorial Debute by Nemoy IMHO.

BTW, You need tom meet Dizzy if you want to fly Fed. He's a pretty good pilot IMHO. If not him then Die Hard can show you alot of the ropes. Just let us know how you want to fly, and we will Guide you in the right direction.  ;D

stephen
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Offline Kzinbane

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #14 on: July 28, 2005, 02:01:32 pm »
Ok thanks all for the replies, I'm about to leave work so it's time to get started with online playing.

Now we have a debate going on proper BCH vs C7 tactics in the making, I suggest a duel between the two debatees :D

I'll play the loser to make him feel better.

While I'm thinking of it and before I leave, I would like to sadly point out that my local Blockbuster does not have ST IV: Whatever it's called, the one with the whale where they steal the Bird of Prey.  I love that one.

Forget them both.  Fly Lyran, get a BCP+ and kill them both whether they starcastle or not.

Offline ShadowLord

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #15 on: July 28, 2005, 02:14:01 pm »
Hi and welcome...

Re C7 vs BCF -- Starcastle can work when properly done -- however it also limits your options should you make any mistakes..

I assume you like to fly FED?? if so look for any of the players already mentioned or I will add look up Tobin-Dax -- he will be one of the few players that can teach you just about everything you ever wanted to know about a BCF cs C7 matchup..

Remember the bottom line is to have fun..and even if your a new player dont get bummed out by having some guy pull tricks you have never seen before from the AI...

Things to keep in mind vs real players --
A) ignore stupid comments from players who want to boost their own egos..
B) find a group of guys that are friendly and fun to hang around with..I have been in the same fleet flying with the same players for over 6 years now..
C) watch out for some simple tricks from old pros -- such as -- trac n pac move -- (they put you in a hold and pull you into a scatter pac), or they take you rock mining  (they put you in a hold and tow you into an asteroid) ..needless to say some players like DH are very good at doing this tactic with black holes around where they push you into the gravity well -- esp if your going slow..
D)ecm/eccm is a CRITICAL issue to fully understand and use!!

Most players are a good bunch of guys willing to show you the ropes -- it will take a bit of time to learn ALL the little details but using Voice Comm programs such as Team Speak or Ventrillo will accelerate this learning curve in a big way..

Enjoy yourself

KHH_ShadowLord
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el-Karnak

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #16 on: July 28, 2005, 02:31:15 pm »
General Tactics 101:

Speed is Life!!

Not too many exceptions to this rule. ;D

Offline FPF-DieHard

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Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


el-Karnak

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #18 on: July 28, 2005, 03:34:01 pm »

Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #19 on: July 28, 2005, 03:47:17 pm »
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Hexx

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #20 on: July 28, 2005, 03:51:17 pm »
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline Hexx

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #21 on: July 28, 2005, 03:53:21 pm »
. If not him then Die Hard can show you alot of the ropes

"How to chuck drones over your shoulder while flying a DNH 101"
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #22 on: July 28, 2005, 03:59:06 pm »
. If not him then Die Hard can show you alot of the ropes


"How to chuck drones over your shoulder while flying a DNH 101"


"How to die to AI 102"

PS.  This picture NEVER will get old  ;D

Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


el-Karnak

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2005, 04:03:16 pm »
General Tactics 101:

Speed is Life!!

Not too many exceptions to this rule. ;D


Here are 3 exceptions :P

http://69.115.118.23:9000/images/films/Krueg_DWL.rec
http://69.115.118.23:9000/images/films/KBFTrajan_D5D.rec
http://69.115.118.23:9000/images/films/Kurok_D5D.rec


Not!! :P :P

bad night, lost a F-CC+ and an H-LB (I'm MasterBlaster).

Time to go Frog hunting tonight . . .





Still trying to avoid those speed 16 drones eh?


There's no need to get overly excited here!!

DO NOT PANIC!!

DO NOT HYPERVENTILATE!!

DO NOT WORRY ABOUT GETTING A CHUUT P0WNED PICTURE!!

cuz

My I-CA doesn't have any speed 16 drones. ;D

Although, I wish I had them now . . . :P

Offline Hexx

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #24 on: July 28, 2005, 04:05:49 pm »
I'm sorry, for me to teach the class the "How to die to AI" I'd have had to actually die to the AI

Unless you have a kill shot then I'm afraid I haven't  ;D
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline Hexx

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #25 on: July 28, 2005, 05:59:31 pm »
Anyway to sum up, as others have said
-No one can "tell" you tactics that work all hte time, some things will
work against some pilots and not against others. Some people fly well against some
pilots and not against others- Dizzy (for example) is generally considered a fairly capable pilot
though I (think) I've beaten him more times than he's beaten me. t00l is a pilot that some people don't
seem to have a hard time with, I think I'm like 3 and 200 or so against him

Really it's more about knowing the pilot then knowing the race they're flying.


Personally I don't actually trust *any* pilot claiming to be new, to many bad experiences with Mog
and Skull (Halo..grrr I hates him I does) so I assume you're one of them in disguise.

Still hook up on voice coms, choose a side and join the madness. Most side have at least one or two people
who don't mind taking some time to wing with a new player and show them around.
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline Kruk

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #26 on: July 28, 2005, 06:12:06 pm »
I'll admit that starcastling is hard to do. Once mastered however, you can be pretty hard to beat.

I've beaten a I-CCZ in a F-DN+ before on GZ starcastling. However in Dynaverse, I don't think it's possible due to ships being load up.

BCF vs C7. I'll take the BCF anytime in the hand of a good pilot. Most Federation players on Dyna knows me as the starcastling king. (back when I played) But the real king is 3rd-Pheonix. The guy who thought me.

Offline Hexx

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #27 on: July 28, 2005, 06:20:52 pm »
There's a starcastling king?

I always assumed it was an anarcho-cynicalist commune type thing.
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline Dfly

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #28 on: July 28, 2005, 09:35:39 pm »
Welcome to our little group of misfits and knowitall pilots Dizzy, err, Seanner .  Hope you enjoy our style of humor and piloting.

762_XC

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #29 on: July 28, 2005, 10:37:34 pm »
Welcome aboard!

Offline GDA-S'Cipio

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #30 on: July 28, 2005, 11:55:20 pm »
There's a starcastling king?

I always assumed it was an anarcho-cynicalist commune type thing.


Your fooling yourself, mate.  We're living in a dictatorship.

-S'Cipio
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Offline KBF-Korgal

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #31 on: July 29, 2005, 04:53:25 am »
ST4: the voyage home.

A pretty good directorial Debute by Nemoy IMHO.


sure woulda been anyway, if he hadn't already directed Star Trek III  :)
FADM (ret.) KBF-Korgal, Black Fleet since 1999

Offline Sirgod

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #32 on: July 29, 2005, 07:57:46 am »
ST4: the voyage home.

A pretty good directorial Debute by Nemoy IMHO.


sure woulda been anyway, if he hadn't already directed Star Trek III  :)


DOH! your correct. I don't know where my mind was when I said that.

Thanks for the correction. actually, now that I think of It, didn't he do that three men and a baby also?

Stephen
"You cannot exaggerate about the Marines. They are convinced to the point of arrogance, that they are the most ferocious fighters on earth - and the amusing thing about it is that they are."- Father Kevin Keaney, Chaplain, Korean War

Offline Mog

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #33 on: July 29, 2005, 09:18:14 am »
Hexxypoos, I am not Seanner.
Merriment is All

Fear the Meow!

Offline GDA-S'Cipio

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #34 on: July 29, 2005, 01:04:52 pm »
I see, but unforunately I cannot find any of these past discussions on tactics except for a few things that repeat the few things from every other site.  Plasma ballet, for example.  Does not explain why it works or why it doesn't work or why not to do this or that, just says "go fast shoot plasma".

"Plasma Ballet" is how you describe two plasma ships fighting each other.   They move fast, zoom in and zoom out.  From a distance it must look as if they are twirling around each other.

Both ships have heavy weapons that have big crunch power up close, but which can be run out and have minimal damage at moderate ranges.  Thus both ships try to find an approach angle that lets them launch plasma while the enemy is approaching, yet allows them to be fleeing when the enemy launche his own plasma.

Does it work?  Well, it works in that it avoids the three things that *don't* work when fighting  with plasma ship.   First, you don't want to charge into his plasma, so overruns usually aren't a good idea.  Sedonc, you don't want to sit still, because you will run out of wild weasel shuttles long before he runs out of plasma torpedos.  And third, you don't want to fire plasma at a distant or fleeing enemy, since he will run it out and then turn on you when your tubes are recharging.

-S'Cipio 
"I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on the objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents."  - James Madison (chief author of the Constitution)

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Offline Hexx

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #35 on: July 29, 2005, 02:25:40 pm »
There's a starcastling king?

I always assumed it was an anarcho-cynicalist commune type thing.


Your fooling yourself, mate.  We're living in a dictatorship.

-S'Cipio

I still don't remember voting for him
Courageously Protesting "Lyran Pelt Day"

Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #36 on: July 29, 2005, 02:38:59 pm »
King of the Twats, what an interesting concept . . .
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Capt_Bearslayer_XC

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #37 on: July 29, 2005, 02:41:39 pm »
Starcastling Twats.
Political Correctness is really Political Censorship

A tax code should exist to procure the funds necessary for the operation of government, not to manipulate human or business behavior.

A nocens dies in loricatus est melior quam a bonus dies procul opus.

A bad peace is even worse than war."  --  Tacitus

"We thought we could resolve the system's problems by rationing services or injecting massive amounts of new money into it" -Claude Castonguay

Offline KBF-Kurok

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #38 on: July 29, 2005, 05:53:08 pm »
Starcastling Twats.
you said it not me  :P

Offline Seanner

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #39 on: July 31, 2005, 12:00:44 pm »
Hello again and thanks for all the continued welcomes!

My stupid internet has been down again over the weekend, just came back up today...I wasn't ignoring everyone :)

response to my plasma ballet question:
Quote
Does it work?  Well, it works in that it avoids the three things that *don't* work when fighting  with plasma ship.   First, you don't want to charge into his plasma, so overruns usually aren't a good idea.  Sedonc, you don't want to sit still, because you will run out of wild weasel shuttles long before he runs out of plasma torpedos.  And third, you don't want to fire plasma at a distant or fleeing enemy, since he will run it out and then turn on you when your tubes are recharging.

Alright then, but what if it's Romulan vs. Gorn?  Gorns only disadvantage here is lack of turning, which they don't need to do anyway because of their arcs.  The only thing the Romulans have on Gorn is the ability to cloak, which everybody is down on for some reason.  It's not a good idea to sit around on speed zero I agree, but what it does do is largely negate plasmas.  Eventually everyone will be out of weasels, but the Romulan can still cloak.  Meaning he can do a semi-overrun and get a solid launch off and cloak away any counter launch...this of course leaves him somewhat exposed to return phaser fire upon uncloaking or if remaining cloaked but that's why you keep one plasma in reserve.

In any case, it seems a very hard battle for both sides.
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Well the decision is made, flying Fed.  In response to the suggestion of flying Lyran, I very much like them.  In fact I like all the races.  If it were allowed I would fly every faction/cartel/whatever in this campaign.

Offline GDA-S'Cipio

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #40 on: July 31, 2005, 01:38:01 pm »

Alright then, but what if it's Romulan vs. Gorn? 

Romulan vs. Gorn was the birthplace of the plasma ballet.  (When the game started, they were the only two plasma powers.)  Both sides want to keep up their speed, and "twirl" enough so that somehow they have a better approach angle than their opponent.

Cloak can save you from the odd torpedo, and I like it a lot now that it has been fixed to near SFB standards.  I have beaten bigger Gorn ships than me by carefully and prudently using the cloak.

But you don't want to rely upon cloak as your main plasma defense.  It slows you down.  Eventually, your enemy will flash you with a T-bomb, hit you with tractors, unload a full plasma alpha strike into you, and you won't be able to fire back.  (Cause you're still "cloaked", even in his tractor beam.)

Then he'll drop the tractor and be gone before you finish uncloaking.

-S'Cipio
"I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on the objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents."  - James Madison (chief author of the Constitution)

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Offline Seanner

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #41 on: July 31, 2005, 02:38:39 pm »
Ahh I see most excellent, tractoring after T-bombing.. a new trick is learned.

Offline Mr.Bad151

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #42 on: July 31, 2005, 10:45:19 pm »
because he is cloaked and probably moving less than 4.. you have to drop the T-bomb then run into it yourself to flash him.. at which time your tracktor locks on and you give him your best shot.

Since you said it was a new trick for you, thought I better explain it.. first time I heard about it I just dropped the T-bomb under the cloaked rom (who was sitting still at the time) and thought to myself.. "I'm either doing something wrong (which I was) or this is a worthless tactic..."  You of course are probably a lot smarter than I am, and probably didn't need the explanation.. but I'm old and its helps my fading memory to rehash old tactics.
"As the radius of my knowledge increases, so does the circumference of my ignorance"

Offline Braxton_RIP

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #43 on: August 01, 2005, 07:21:08 am »
If you have a DN or other some other but extremely heavy ship, you can always just go to range 0 and pound on him.  I find that this works nicely with a DN, simply because I don't have to waste a T-Bomb on something as stupid as a cloaker dumb enough to cloak  ;D
Braxton,
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Offline GDA-S'Cipio

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #44 on: August 01, 2005, 09:04:18 am »
because he is cloaked and probably moving less than 4.. you have to drop the T-bomb then run into it yourself to flash him.. at which time your tracktor locks on and you give him your best shot.

Since you said it was a new trick for you, thought I better explain it.. first time I heard about it I just dropped the T-bomb under the cloaked rom (who was sitting still at the time) and thought to myself.. "I'm either doing something wrong (which I was) or this is a worthless tactic..."  You of course are probably a lot smarter than I am, and probably didn't need the explanation.. but I'm old and its helps my fading memory to rehash old tactics.

MrBad151 is completely correct in stating that you may need something to set off the mine.  Often this something is your #1 shield.  (If you transported the mine out in front of you, make sure the shield is back up before you hit the mine.   The painters back at drydock are most particular about that.)

One final thing you should note, however, is that while most ships can only go speed four without setting off a mine, a cloaked ship can go speed six without setting off a mine.

Keep this in mind when you are deciding whether or not you need to go tap the mine yourself.

-S'Cipio
"I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on the objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents."  - James Madison (chief author of the Constitution)

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Offline Kzinbane

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #45 on: August 01, 2005, 10:05:03 am »
The cloak is very good at keeping Lyran ships fron hurting you too.  You should always cloak when fighting Lyrans.  ;)

Offline GDA-S'Cipio

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #46 on: August 01, 2005, 10:15:35 am »
There's a starcastling king?

I always assumed it was an anarcho-cynicalist commune type thing.


Your fooling yourself, mate.  We're living in a dictatorship.

-S'Cipio

I still don't remember voting for him

You don't vote for a king!  The lady of our group, her e-mails filled with the purest scripts, gave her missions to DH, thus proving that he was the rightful dictator of the dynaverse for AOTKII.

-S'Cipio
"I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on the objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents."  - James Madison (chief author of the Constitution)

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Coulda' used a little more cowbell
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Offline Seanner

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Re: new player wanting in on AOTK2
« Reply #47 on: August 01, 2005, 11:15:53 am »
Quote
The cloak is very good at keeping Lyran ships fron hurting you too.  You should always cloak when fighting Lyrans. ;)

Ha!  You can't fool me!  I may be new to online play, and may have never played SFB, and may be awful, and so on, BUT I know the rules of the game... ESGs automatically hit cloaked targets, which is perfectly logical seeing as it's an energy field which doesn't need to detect objects to smash into.  Of course, your wink implies you weren't seriously trying to fool me but those shifty Lyrans have done worse.  Oh and if you didn't know, a special mod in AOTKII allows ESGs to block photons.

Quote
You of course are probably a lot smarter than I am, and probably didn't need the explanation.. but I'm old and its helps my fading memory to rehash old tactics.

I dunno, I've managed to tractor myself into an asteroid more than once in SFC1's techincals.  It turns out that when the target dies, you immediately accelerate to the requested speed...  I've managed to feedback myself to death resulting in a lovely draw.  It turns out plasmas also have a feedback range...  I've managed to smash directly into a planet with no prompting because it it turns out the graphics do not coincide with the real range...  And finally, my most favorite of all: they put the stupid cloak key RIGHT NEXT to the stupid max defensive tractors key, causing NUMEROUS deaths to inappropriate cloaking vs. a point blank scatter pack.  You'd think I'd just change the keys around.

Speaking of the technicals, one of the cruiser ones for Fed was impossible on Admiral level, you can only kill like 2-3.