Topic: Re: London

[Jaeih t`Radaik]

The Americans have been too nice.

Hunt them down.

Kill them all.

[Commander La'ra]

I know you're nowhere near the place, but I'm glad your okay just the same.

[Iceman]

The Americans have been too nice.

Hunt them down.

Kill them all.

*grabs rifle, knife, and flashlight*

Which way did they go boss?

[Scottish Andy]

Hear Hear. Rule Britiannia! Don't piss off a Brit, we'll send in the SAS.

I got the missus to go out and buy us a Union Jack and various British accourtrements today, as to my shame, I had no clothing with the British flag on it, only a black polo shirt with a small Scottish Saltire on the breast. I had kept meaning to get some, but never got round to it.

We did today.

The Jack is flying from my 10th floor balcony right now. I put it up myself after coming in from work. Never surrender, Never give up.

[Andromeda]

I was going to take my nieces to London next week.  Now my sister is a bit paranoid about the idea - I can't blame her - and it looks as if they will be staying home. 

[Jaeih t`Radaik]

Here's a quote from a book I read a couple of months ago. The story itself has nothing to do with the current situation in the world, but is appropriate to the past few years anyway. And isn't that the point of fiction anyway? To make you think about the world you live in?

*****

"West had thought that he had known better than they had. He thought he could have avoided the fights that they had fought and won. He had questioned their motives, their means, and their ends.

Now he saw that there were some fights that came to you whether you sought them or not, whether you were ready or not.

And no matter how much you wished to understand other people, some of those people did not want to understand you. Sometimes they just wanted you to die.

All you could do then was to fight your best fight and make whatever sacrifices you needed to make.

And hope that was enough."

*****

Tell me that isn't relevant. Or true.

[CaptJosh]

Someone is always gonna bring it on, no matter what. And yet there are still people who say that we need to stop what we're doing in Iraq. Right. I say that the terrorists could have given no better sign that they're scared that we're actually going to win. They wouldn't have bothered with this attack if they felt they were winning. They have proven that they are desperate and they are cowards, for in an age where total warfare is no longer acceptable in the civilized world, only desperate cowards attack civilians.

[Scottish Andy]

Well said.

[Jaeih t`Radaik]

CaptJosh, despite the fact you never seem to comment on my stories, I begin to like you. 

[Grim Reaper]

Problem is, there is no way in Hell we'll be able to stop them. It's not like we have a clear opponent to fight. May I refer to George Carlins' visio who claimed that all the current measures are doing is reducing our liberties and i agree. However, never think i disagree on exterminating the terrorists. I just don't see a good method. None that are being used now are effective.

Perhaps more drastic approaches are necessary (like threatening drop a nuke on Iran / Pakistan / Indonesia (muslim countries) for each attack) or perhaps educating those ppl and give them the oppertunity to evolve like we did so they won't think Islam offers the truth. We did that 500 years ago and it helps. (a little) 

I'm more in favour for the 1ste option because it's the quickest but even I don't think that'll work

[Sethan]

As long as there are muslims in a country, this sort of thing will happen there.

[Grim Reaper]

As long as there are fanatical muslims in a country[/b], this sort of thing will happen there.

...you mean. But true as long as the whole Muslim population of the world has not the access to the same resources and gets on the same intellectual level as we, we are bound to have trouble with orthodox muslims. However, it's good to remember all orthodox religous figures are potentially dangerous.

[Sethan]

As long as there are fanatical muslims in a country[/b], this sort of thing will happen there.

...you mean. But true as long as the whole Muslim population of the world has not the access to the same resources and gets on the same intellectual level as we, we are bound to have trouble with orthodox muslims. However, it's good to remember all orthodox religous figures are potentially dangerous.

Fanatical muslims go with the religion, just as fanatical Buddhists go with Buddhism and Fanatical Shintoists go with Shinto - New York City in the US has a large Orthodox Jewish population, and I'm pretty sure there has never been violence against non-Jews laid at their feet.  The difference is, fanatics of other religions don't make a regular practice of setting off bombs designed to kill innocents.  Islam encourages and justifies such behavior.  The four bombers that just hit Britain were born and raised in Britain - you can't blame them on insufficient resources in the third world - and I'd hazard a guess they weren't stupid.

[Grim Reaper]

The difference is, fanatics of other religions don't make a regular practice of setting off bombs designed to kill innocents.  Islam encourages and justifies such behavior.  The four bombers that just hit Britain were born and raised in Britain - you can't blame them on insufficient resources in the third world - and I'd hazard a guess they weren't stupid.

True. But then again, at least 2 of the bombers had a dimm future ahead of them. And christian fanatics in indonesia kill muslims regularly.

Never think I disagree that the Islamic community is very dangerous but I think they have approximatly 500 years disadvantage and many fail to cross the difference. Imagine the crusades with current day technology. Wouldn't that be frightening?

I'd say it's religion in general that's dangerous and needs to be exterminated. Not the people but the idea. On the other hand, mankind proved again and again their cubicle minds. Always labeling, putting gays / nigger / spicks / jews / muslims and all those other really nice words to create differences. Race, ethnic and national background, jobs, income, anything to seperate us from eachother.

That's what the rich do. Keep the middle class fighting with the lower class, so they can keep going to the bank.

So my conclusion is: Don't generalise. 4 Madmen ( + their helpers) attacked civilians. They and their accompiances should be burning in whatever Hell they believe in. Not muslims in general.

[Commander La'ra]

Plenty of people kill folks for reasons that are not religiously motivated.  There's politics, ideology, greed, etc, and the army of people who are just as fanatical about them as the 9-11 or London guys were about their faith.

Right now the Muslim extremists make the best copy and try to do things that keep them in the headlines, so we hear about them more.  May not be that way in ten years or even five.

[Sethan]

The difference is, fanatics of other religions don't make a regular practice of setting off bombs designed to kill innocents.  Islam encourages and justifies such behavior.  The four bombers that just hit Britain were born and raised in Britain - you can't blame them on insufficient resources in the third world - and I'd hazard a guess they weren't stupid.

True. But then again, at least 2 of the bombers had a dimm future ahead of them.

Again, no excuse.  Lots of fanatics in other religions have dim futures ahead of them.  They don't go about setting off bombs or shooting people because of it.  When was the last Christian Scientist suicide bombing?  Oh - never.

And christian fanatics in indonesia kill muslims regularly.

Christian fanatics in Indonesia?  I think you need to take a closer look at that one.  Specifically, look up the percentage of the population that was Christian in Indonesia and East Timor (which Indonesia invaded) 30 years ago, and then look at the percentages today.  Then look up what happened to them.

Never think I disagree that the Islamic community is very dangerous but I think they have approximatly 500 years disadvantage and many fail to cross the difference. Imagine the crusades with current day technology. Wouldn't that be frightening?

The aftereffects would be frightening.  The "crusade" would last about 30 minutes.

I'd say it's religion in general that's dangerous and needs to be exterminated. Not the people but the idea.

Lets start by eliminating the religions currently causing the most innocent deaths by violence.  I'm not talking about deaths from military action by nations that are majority single religion - I am talking about deaths where the religion is used as the justification.  In the last 30 years, the numbers directly attributable to Islam are in the millions.  Can any other religion come close? 

IOn the other hand, mankind proved again and again their cubicle minds. Always labeling, putting gays / nigger / spicks / jews / muslims and all those other really nice words to create differences. Race, ethnic and national background, jobs, income, anything to seperate us from eachother.

That's what the rich do. Keep the middle class fighting with the lower class, so they can keep going to the bank.

So my conclusion is: Don't generalise. 4 Madmen ( + their helpers) attacked civilians. They and their accompiances should be burning in whatever Hell they believe in. Not muslims in general.

As long as that point of view prevails, we will always be at the mercy of Islamic terrorists who hide among and are supported by the "muslims in general."

[Grim Reaper]

As long as that point of view prevails, we will always be at the mercy of Islamic terrorists who hide among and are supported by the "muslims in general."

true, my view isn't perfect. But then again, what would your view be? Should we exterminate the muslims? Seems to me we'd be no better than them. But let's call it quits after your reply? Agree to disagree? Cause I'm not convincing you nor really trying, and I'm not gonna be persuaded by your neither. Let's focus on the fanfiction.

Speaking about fanfiction, I vaguely remeber reading some of your writing. I rember liking it. Is it still somewhere? Or are you gonna repost it?

[Sethan]

As long as that point of view prevails, we will always be at the mercy of Islamic terrorists who hide among and are supported by the "muslims in general."

true, my view isn't perfect. But then again, what would your view be? Should we exterminate the muslims?  Seems to me we'd be no better than them.

Certainly expel them - unfortunately, even that won't protect us from smuggled nukes or bioweapons.

The Brits have already solved this type of problem once before, in India with the Thugees.  That sort of solution may be necessary here as well.

As to "no better than them" - we are in a war.  We didn't want it, and we didn't start it, but we are in it nonetheless.  Where there are no muslims, we don't have western terrorists blowing up civilians.  Where there are no westerners, we do have muslim terrorsts blowing up civilians (where there are no westerners or Jews to kill, they target other factions of Islam, or governments that aren't extreme enough).  When Islam is gone, the killing will stop.  If they were to win, and there were no more non-muslims, they could not say the same.

But let's call it quits after your reply? Agree to disagree? Cause I'm not convincing you nor really trying, and I'm not gonna be persuaded by your neither. Let's focus on the fanfiction.

Fair enough.  This is really more a topic for the Hot & Spicy Forum.

Speaking about fanfiction, I vaguely remeber reading some of your writing. I rember liking it. Is it still somewhere? Or are you gonna repost it?

Thank you for the compliment.  Surviving the Fire still is somewhere - on the hard drive of the computer on which I am typing right now, in fact.  I do intend to repost it, but not until I have finished it.

I was unemployed for the last 2-1/2 years, and had to scramble to make ends meet, so I had no opportunity to write.  The story has languished, half completed (though it is done in my head ).  I am hoping now that I finally have full time employment (with health benefits!) that I will be able to work on it again.

I have posted the thing three times now, but have never been able to finish it - which was frustrating for everyone.  I figure if I wait 'til I finish it to repost it, that will be less frustrating.

I did do a couple of shorts I might dig up, though.