Topic: what class is the lyran dnd??

[TraumaTech]

i am unable to copy and paste this discription of the L-DND(lyran mountain lion)  but here is the driscription verbatim and why i say this ship shoul dbe classed as a support vessel.in the descriptions,there is no mention of the DND operating as a command varient.it explains it's only duties as homeworld defense,and as an escort

(R11-53)This was a unique ship resulting from a emergency situation.When a Kzinti counterattack caused serious concern.It became impossible to withdraw the Tiger-class heavy cruiser Golden Warrior from the front for conversion to a dn.The central section had already been built in preparation for this conversion.As no other Tiger was available,it was decided to deploy the core section as a separate ship by making minor internal modifications and adding two small wing sections with weapons.

           The resulting Golden Cub was used for local defense around the homeworld for several months,then was sent to the Kzinti front in january Y178,where it operated in various roles.The superb firing arcs made it  an excellent escort for carriers and other ships.The Federation gave it the code name"mountain Lion" to reflect its origin and stature.

            The Golden Cub was recalled to be used in a DN conversion in Y183 but was destroyed in action while completing its final assignment.

          The Mountain Lion is easily the most powerful destroyer in the game system.However,it remained unique because the center DN sections were to expensive and difficult to build in greater quantities and every Mountain Lion deployed would cost the Lyrans a dreadnaught.

            Refills:The power pack cannot be fitted to the DND.The ship always had mech links;players who want to delete them can reduce the BPV by two points.The ship never recieved a phaser refit(or indeed any refit) as it was intended as only a temporary use of the hull section until final assembly became possible.Since the side caps would have been discarded at that point,there was no reason to upgrade the systems installed in them.

                The disrupters were limited to range 30 because the DND was less stable as a firing platform than,the larger DN.


                  The DND retained the UIMs of the DN.
                   Designed by Stephen V Cole.
                   SSD and counter are in Module R5



 

as i said,i could not copy and past it here,however if anyone wants me to email it to them...here is my email address

traumatech2002@yahoo.ca

[TraumaTech]

Kroma and DH....FSD would like to here your opinion/ruling on this issue      ty

[762_XC]

I have no problem with the DND being support if LDR and WYN are excluded completely.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

This is the ship we are talking about?

Mountain Lion Destroyer
Designation: L-DND(F)
BPV: 90(112)
Crew: 25
Marines: 6
Shield 1: 20
Shield 2 & 6: 20
Shield 3 & 5: 20
Shield 4: 20
Total Shields: 120

Movement Cost: 0.5
Turn Mode: B
Total Warp Power: 15
Impulse Power: 6
Aux Power: 2
Total Engine Power: 21
Battery: 2

Transporters: 2
Tractors: 2
Mech Tractors: (2)
Shuttles: 2
Fighters: (2)

2x Disruptor 3
2x ESG
6x Phaser 1
4x Phaser 3

[FPF-DieHard]

It is a Destroyer built on a DN hull?  Anyone know what book it's from? 

I'll look in the "tomes" when I get a chance and get back with an informed opinion.

[KHH Jakle]

DH - TT's description is straight out of the R11 section for this ship - although admittedly my copy of is probably pre-revision, I doubt this unique ship's description changed with later revisions....

[FPF-Wanderer]

The Golden Cub is in Module R5 Battleships.  Desty Nova even made a model for it; http://members.aol.com/destynova02/ldnd.html

[Mutilator]

It is a Destroyer built on a DN hull?  Anyone know what book it's from? 

I'll look in the "tomes" when I get a chance and get back with an informed opinion.

It's a frigate.

[TraumaTech]

I have no problem with the DND being support if LDR and WYN are excluded completely.

i am afraid i can't agree with that.I have yet to see in regards to any other races ships being excepted if they give up some other ships available to that race.All this thread is,is to place in the proper category the L-DND.This ship is a frigate,built from the scrap metal of a DN or DN section(depending on how you want to look at it).The sfb material sent to me,by Jakel ,says it is a support ship.Neither in it's ship's designation(ie: L-DND) or in it's stated use from SFB literature,is it described as a command varient.The only two uses stated in this literature was for homeworld defense for a couple months,then as an escort for carriers and other ships.So we are requesting that it be placed in it's proper category,which is ......support

[TraumaTech]

This is the ship we are talking about?

Mountain Lion Destroyer
Designation: L-DND(F)
BPV: 90(112)
Crew: 25
Marines: 6
Shield 1: 20
Shield 2 & 6: 20
Shield 3 & 5: 20
Shield 4: 20
Total Shields: 120

Movement Cost: 0.5
Turn Mode: B
Total Warp Power: 15
Impulse Power: 6
Aux Power: 2
Total Engine Power: 21
Battery: 2

Transporters: 2
Tractors: 2
Mech Tractors: (2)
Shuttles: 2
Fighters: (2)

2x Disruptor 3
2x ESG
6x Phaser 1
4x Phaser 3

                          yes sir,it is

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Thanks for the confirmation on that, TT.

Seeing how this is a DD/FF, I don't really see a problem with this ship being just a support vessel.  Especially since there are better ships in the same BPV area.

Then again, I am not the one you need to convince. 

[FPF-DieHard]

Should it have a command rating?

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Mountain Lion Destroyer
Designation: L-DND(F)
BPV: 90(112)

OK, I do have one problem with the L-DNDF...

If you add 2 mech links (do these add to the BPV?) and a pair of L-INT's (38 BPV) to the ship, the DND only goes up 22 BPV?!?!?!?

[KHH Jakle]

As I understand it, the Mechlink essentially functions as an additional tractor, so if they were already there and they were turned into Mech Link's, you don't have to pay.

The PF's are another thing entirely.  I would think the BPV should go up 38 then.

[KHH Jakle]

Should it have a command rating?

All ships have a command rating.  Command Variants usually just have a higher one for their hull (F-CA's are 8, F-CC's are 9)

Would be interesting to see what the DND's command rating is.  If it was the same as a L-DD, I guess that would be one way of saying it's not a command.  If it was higher, that would be an indication in the other direction....

[KHH Jakle]

This ship is a frigate,

It's a destroyer.  There is a difference...

built from the scrap metal of a DN or DN section(depending on how you want to look at it).

The text doesn't say 'scrap' at all.  Scrap implies that it is a junker, which implies that it couldn't possibly be a command ship.  It was a command section, built for a specific purpose, that due to an emergency was prevented from being applied to that purpose - so the Lyrans modified it to produce a stand alone ship.  There isn't really any other way to look at it.

The sfb material sent to me,by Jakel ,says it is a support ship.

No it doesn't.  Nor does it say it's a command variant for that matter - but it certainly doesn't say it's a support ship

Niether...it's ship's designation(ie: L-DND) ...is it described as a command varient.

A ships designator is sometimes and indicator of a Command Variant - but it is not the rule

The only two uses stated in this literature was for homeworld defense for a couple months,then as an escort for carriers and other ships.

Correct....although it is not a true carrier escort and escorting a DN could also get assigned to a command variant (when using fleet sized S8 rules)

All that being said (I am in a contrary mood )....if the command rating of this thing is no different then a regular L-DD - it should probably get moved to support.

[FPF-Wanderer]

The command rating of the L-DD is 4.  The command rating of the L-DND is 5.

[Mutilator]

This ship is a frigate,

It's a destroyer.  There is a difference...

Frigate? Or is the ship selection option not accuracte?

http://img228.echo.cx/img228/9969/frigatednd3sp.jpg

[FPF-Wanderer]

This ship is a frigate,

It's a destroyer.  There is a difference...

Frigate? Or is the ship selection option not accuracte?

http://img228.echo.cx/img228/9969/frigatednd3sp.jpg

It is accurate.  The ship selection is broken down into four catagories; Frigates, Light Cruisers, Heavy Cruisers, Dreadnoughts.  All destroyers are placed in the Frigate section.

[KHH Jakle]

This ship is a frigate,

It's a destroyer.  There is a difference...

Frigate? Or is the ship selection option not accuracte?

http://img228.echo.cx/img228/9969/frigatednd3sp.jpg

It is accurate.  The ship selection is broken down into four catagories; Frigates, Light Cruisers, Heavy Cruisers, Dreadnoughts.  All destroyers are placed in the Frigate section.

I was just being contrary for the sake of it.  It's a semantics thing.  Frigates are very light hulls - the smallest that can be called an independant warship.  Destroyers are a notable step up from that and often came close to the firepower/capabilities of some light cruisers.

Does it really matter here?  Probably not.

You should take not of the Command Rating of the DND.  How does that compare to the L-CW?  The L-CWL?  That might grant a better feel for what it means.