Topic: OK her is the deal on GW5 contining!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[KBFLordKrueg]

WS,

when the SSCF was a large group, like they were for IDSL, they often were on their own voice comms.   This was their way no matter if they flew Fed or Klingon.

It was the mere FACT that they chose to fly against the federation and with the Klingons that should of been appreciated, not what comms they used as being on seperate voice comms was the norm for them.

I'm just stating a fact they chose not to interact whit the coallition.

They never chose to interact much with the Fed and alliance when they flew Fed.   There's no difference.   The point is that they offered the olive branch by playing Klingon, but because of other people not knowing how they handled their voice comm affairs, their gesture of good will went un-appreciated.

I guess it wasn't when one of them forfits his way up the map to make sure the Fed Mirak treaty doesn't get broken.

Dude, even if they poured sugar in your gas tank and raped you dog, why does it matter?  They don't play anymore

Because it helps to full the anomosity towards the "evil" Feds. It also helps to rationalise and justify continued poor behavior. A tit-for-tat arguement, unfortunatley directed at the wrong people.

The Alliance players that have shown up on the most recent servers had nothing to do with it, and shouldn't have been treated so shabably for trying to give at least a little good game, but it is easier to act unsportsman like if you villify your target. It isn't really necessary for the actual target to have actually done you a wrong for this type of rationalization to be effective and make the perpatrators feel their actions are justified though.

I brought this up because you said that Hooch only wanted to bring the D2 community closer. I'm just showing that they had there chance and took a pass.

About vilifying the Feds thats got to be a joke I cant think of one Fed I dislike. I can tell you I dislike the way you try to bate people in, and I dislike some of the post about unsportsmanship dishonorable acts just because we had a plan to take the Feds out of GW5 and it worked betten than we thought.

Well put, WS. 

[FPF-DieHard]

 . .  I cant think of one Fed I dislike.  . . .

That just means I need to try harder 

[Kroma BaSyl]

I brought this up because you said that Hooch only wanted to bring the D2 community closer. I'm just showing that they had there chance and took a pass.

But you didn't show any such thing. All you showed was that you had allowed your bias against the SSCF to allow you to assume, that a thing as innocent as wanting to use their own voice comms as had been their policy even within the Alliance camp, was some attempt to spite you.

About vilifying the Feds thats got to be a joke I cant think of one Fed I dislike. I can tell you I dislike the way you try to bate people in, and I dislike some of the post about unsportsmanship dishonorable acts just because we had a plan to take the Feds out of GW5 and it worked betten than we thought.

When I played baseball we usually had a plan or strategy. If it worked spectatularly, and the game was then nolonger in question we didn't continue to run up the score tin order to demoralize the opponent into quiting the game. I was taught that such actions were unsportsman like and dishonorable.

Your leader and one of your players without any baiting from me posted that this was the intent with taking all of Fed space. To demoralize the Alliance players and to convince them to give up. These were their words, not mine. I didn't trick them into admitting to this or take those statements out of context.

I have no problem with the numbers difference or losing the campaign. I do have a problem with players trying to make other players feel bad and quiet the game as there are to few left. Your RM and another player confirmed that this was the intent. What other conclusion can be drawn, other than that of unsportsman like behavior?

If you dislike what I post I can only assume you are feeling guilty about your own actions and the actions of your team, because their intentions were posted in their own words and are crystal clear, all I have done is point them out and stated my opinion of such behavior.

[KBF-Crim]

 

[WarSears]

I brought this up because you said that Hooch only wanted to bring the D2 community closer. I'm just showing that they had there chance and took a pass.

But you didn't show any such thing. All you showed was that you had allowed your bias against the SSCF to allow you to assume, that a thing as innocent as wanting to use their own voice comms as had been their policy even within the Alliance camp, was some attempt to spite you.

About vilifying the Feds thats got to be a joke I cant think of one Fed I dislike. I can tell you I dislike the way you try to bate people in, and I dislike some of the post about unsportsmanship dishonorable acts just because we had a plan to take the Feds out of GW5 and it worked betten than we thought.

When I played baseball we usually had a plan or strategy. If it worked spectatularly, and the game was then nolonger in question we didn't continue to run up the score tin order to demoralize the opponent into quiting the game. I was taught that such actions were unsportsman like and dishonorable.

Your leader and one of your players without any baiting from me posted that this was the intent with taking all of Fed space. To demoralize the Alliance players and to convince them to give up. These were their words, not mine. I didn't trick them into admitting to this or take those statements out of context.

I have no problem with the numbers difference or losing the campaign. I do have a problem with players trying to make other players feel bad and quiet the game as there are to few left. Your RM and another player confirmed that this was the intent. What other conclusion can be drawn, other than that of unsportsman like behavior?

If you dislike what I post I can only assume you are feeling guilty about your own actions and the actions of your team, because their intentions were posted in their own words and are crystal clear, all I have done is point them out and stated my opinion of such behavior.

Again I point out that they had there chance by interacting with the coalition they chose to keep to there self nothing wrong with that. The SSCF has never shown me that they wanted to bring the D2  community together.

I don't feel guilty about anything I do however feel bad about the the way some people reacted to us taking the last of Fed space. I feel bad that Kruge chose to use the word demoralize I do how ever believe that it was taken way to serious.

BTW
Kroma you know you love this stuff you told me your self so just admit it. So go ahead flame away but by doing so you just make more people feel bad.

[Capt Jeff]

WS...

You know that Moggy is coming for another visit this summer?

So, of course you'll have to come say hi. 

We'll laugh about this over a bottle of Blood wine OK?   

[WarSears]

WS...

You know that Moggy is coming for another visit this summer?

So, of course you'll have to come say hi. 

We'll laugh about this over a bottle of Blood wine OK?   

I cant wait. 

[Kroma BaSyl]

I brought this up because you said that Hooch only wanted to bring the D2 community closer. I'm just showing that they had there chance and took a pass.

But you didn't show any such thing. All you showed was that you had allowed your bias against the SSCF to allow you to assume, that a thing as innocent as wanting to use their own voice comms as had been their policy even within the Alliance camp, was some attempt to spite you.

About vilifying the Feds thats got to be a joke I cant think of one Fed I dislike. I can tell you I dislike the way you try to bate people in, and I dislike some of the post about unsportsmanship dishonorable acts just because we had a plan to take the Feds out of GW5 and it worked betten than we thought.

When I played baseball we usually had a plan or strategy. If it worked spectatularly, and the game was then nolonger in question we didn't continue to run up the score tin order to demoralize the opponent into quiting the game. I was taught that such actions were unsportsman like and dishonorable.

Your leader and one of your players without any baiting from me posted that this was the intent with taking all of Fed space. To demoralize the Alliance players and to convince them to give up. These were their words, not mine. I didn't trick them into admitting to this or take those statements out of context.

I have no problem with the numbers difference or losing the campaign. I do have a problem with players trying to make other players feel bad and quiet the game as there are to few left. Your RM and another player confirmed that this was the intent. What other conclusion can be drawn, other than that of unsportsman like behavior?

If you dislike what I post I can only assume you are feeling guilty about your own actions and the actions of your team, because their intentions were posted in their own words and are crystal clear, all I have done is point them out and stated my opinion of such behavior.

Again I point out that they had there chance by interacting with the coalition they chose to keep to there self nothing wrong with that. The SSCF has never shown me that they wanted to bring the D2  community together.

I don't feel guilty about anything I do however feel bad about the the way some people reacted to us taking the last of Fed space. I feel bad that Kruge chose to use the word demoralize I do how ever believe that it was taken way to serious.

BTW
Kroma you know you love this stuff you told me your self so just admit it. So go ahead flame away but by doing so you just make more people feel bad.

All just a bunch of rationalizations and no accountability for your own actions. In stead people project their own dark feeling on others and then claim that they were wronged. Some things never change.

I will admit it is probably more stupid short sightedness than premeditated malice. At least I would like to think so.

I do however hope that people that act this way feel bad, maybe if they do they will learn to behave better in the future.

[WarSears]

I brought this up because you said that Hooch only wanted to bring the D2 community closer. I'm just showing that they had there chance and took a pass.

But you didn't show any such thing. All you showed was that you had allowed your bias against the SSCF to allow you to assume, that a thing as innocent as wanting to use their own voice comms as had been their policy even within the Alliance camp, was some attempt to spite you.

About vilifying the Feds thats got to be a joke I cant think of one Fed I dislike. I can tell you I dislike the way you try to bate people in, and I dislike some of the post about unsportsmanship dishonorable acts just because we had a plan to take the Feds out of GW5 and it worked betten than we thought.

When I played baseball we usually had a plan or strategy. If it worked spectatularly, and the game was then nolonger in question we didn't continue to run up the score tin order to demoralize the opponent into quiting the game. I was taught that such actions were unsportsman like and dishonorable.

Your leader and one of your players without any baiting from me posted that this was the intent with taking all of Fed space. To demoralize the Alliance players and to convince them to give up. These were their words, not mine. I didn't trick them into admitting to this or take those statements out of context.

I have no problem with the numbers difference or losing the campaign. I do have a problem with players trying to make other players feel bad and quiet the game as there are to few left. Your RM and another player confirmed that this was the intent. What other conclusion can be drawn, other than that of unsportsman like behavior?

If you dislike what I post I can only assume you are feeling guilty about your own actions and the actions of your team, because their intentions were posted in their own words and are crystal clear, all I have done is point them out and stated my opinion of such behavior.

Again I point out that they had there chance by interacting with the coalition they chose to keep to there self nothing wrong with that. The SSCF has never shown me that they wanted to bring the D2  community together.

I don't feel guilty about anything I do however feel bad about the the way some people reacted to us taking the last of Fed space. I feel bad that Kruge chose to use the word demoralize I do how ever believe that it was taken way to serious.

BTW
Kroma you know you love this stuff you told me your self so just admit it. So go ahead flame away but by doing so you just make more people feel bad.

All just a bunch of rationalizations and no accountability for your own actions. In stead people project their own dark feeling on others and then claim that they were wronged. Some things never change.

I will admit it is probably more stupid short sightedness than premeditated malice. At least I would like to think so.

I do however hope that people that act this way feel bad, maybe if they do they will learn to behave better in the future.

I knew you couldn't resist. I said this once and ill say it again some people need to look in the mirror.
go ahead and put what ever kind spin on this you want me and you both know its for you personal amusement.

[Kroma BaSyl]

I brought this up because you said that Hooch only wanted to bring the D2 community closer. I'm just showing that they had there chance and took a pass.

But you didn't show any such thing. All you showed was that you had allowed your bias against the SSCF to allow you to assume, that a thing as innocent as wanting to use their own voice comms as had been their policy even within the Alliance camp, was some attempt to spite you.

About vilifying the Feds thats got to be a joke I cant think of one Fed I dislike. I can tell you I dislike the way you try to bate people in, and I dislike some of the post about unsportsmanship dishonorable acts just because we had a plan to take the Feds out of GW5 and it worked betten than we thought.

When I played baseball we usually had a plan or strategy. If it worked spectatularly, and the game was then nolonger in question we didn't continue to run up the score tin order to demoralize the opponent into quiting the game. I was taught that such actions were unsportsman like and dishonorable.

Your leader and one of your players without any baiting from me posted that this was the intent with taking all of Fed space. To demoralize the Alliance players and to convince them to give up. These were their words, not mine. I didn't trick them into admitting to this or take those statements out of context.

I have no problem with the numbers difference or losing the campaign. I do have a problem with players trying to make other players feel bad and quiet the game as there are to few left. Your RM and another player confirmed that this was the intent. What other conclusion can be drawn, other than that of unsportsman like behavior?

If you dislike what I post I can only assume you are feeling guilty about your own actions and the actions of your team, because their intentions were posted in their own words and are crystal clear, all I have done is point them out and stated my opinion of such behavior.

Again I point out that they had there chance by interacting with the coalition they chose to keep to there self nothing wrong with that. The SSCF has never shown me that they wanted to bring the D2  community together.

I don't feel guilty about anything I do however feel bad about the the way some people reacted to us taking the last of Fed space. I feel bad that Kruge chose to use the word demoralize I do how ever believe that it was taken way to serious.

BTW
Kroma you know you love this stuff you told me your self so just admit it. So go ahead flame away but by doing so you just make more people feel bad.

All just a bunch of rationalizations and no accountability for your own actions. In stead people project their own dark feeling on others and then claim that they were wronged. Some things never change.

I will admit it is probably more stupid short sightedness than premeditated malice. At least I would like to think so.

I do however hope that people that act this way feel bad, maybe if they do they will learn to behave better in the future.

I knew you couldn't resist. I said this once and ill say it again some people need to look in the mirror.
go ahead and put what ever kind spin on this you want me and you both know its for you personal amusement.

Whatever Sears, ironic you should bring up looking in the mirror and spin. You have attempted to take 2 different gestures of friendship by the SSCF and tried to spin them as some sort slights, so as to rationalize the poor behavior that those olive branches were met with. I assume it makes you feel better about your own poor behavior and dark feelings to think that there must have been alterior motives to them. Tell me when the SSFC took the first step and played Klingon on IDSL, did you take the second and go over to their voice comms to welcome them? Or did you just assume that because they used their own comms they were being arrogant and standoffish?

[WarSears]

I brought this up because you said that Hooch only wanted to bring the D2 community closer. I'm just showing that they had there chance and took a pass.

But you didn't show any such thing. All you showed was that you had allowed your bias against the SSCF to allow you to assume, that a thing as innocent as wanting to use their own voice comms as had been their policy even within the Alliance camp, was some attempt to spite you.

About vilifying the Feds thats got to be a joke I cant think of one Fed I dislike. I can tell you I dislike the way you try to bate people in, and I dislike some of the post about unsportsmanship dishonorable acts just because we had a plan to take the Feds out of GW5 and it worked betten than we thought.

When I played baseball we usually had a plan or strategy. If it worked spectatularly, and the game was then nolonger in question we didn't continue to run up the score tin order to demoralize the opponent into quiting the game. I was taught that such actions were unsportsman like and dishonorable.

Your leader and one of your players without any baiting from me posted that this was the intent with taking all of Fed space. To demoralize the Alliance players and to convince them to give up. These were their words, not mine. I didn't trick them into admitting to this or take those statements out of context.

I have no problem with the numbers difference or losing the campaign. I do have a problem with players trying to make other players feel bad and quiet the game as there are to few left. Your RM and another player confirmed that this was the intent. What other conclusion can be drawn, other than that of unsportsman like behavior?

If you dislike what I post I can only assume you are feeling guilty about your own actions and the actions of your team, because their intentions were posted in their own words and are crystal clear, all I have done is point them out and stated my opinion of such behavior.

Again I point out that they had there chance by interacting with the coalition they chose to keep to there self nothing wrong with that. The SSCF has never shown me that they wanted to bring the D2  community together.

I don't feel guilty about anything I do however feel bad about the the way some people reacted to us taking the last of Fed space. I feel bad that Kruge chose to use the word demoralize I do how ever believe that it was taken way to serious.

BTW
Kroma you know you love this stuff you told me your self so just admit it. So go ahead flame away but by doing so you just make more people feel bad.

All just a bunch of rationalizations and no accountability for your own actions. In stead people project their own dark feeling on others and then claim that they were wronged. Some things never change.

I will admit it is probably more stupid short sightedness than premeditated malice. At least I would like to think so.

I do however hope that people that act this way feel bad, maybe if they do they will learn to behave better in the future.

I knew you couldn't resist. I said this once and ill say it again some people need to look in the mirror.
go ahead and put what ever kind spin on this you want me and you both know its for you personal amusement.

Whatever Sears, ironic you should bring up looking in the mirror and spin. You have attempted to take 2 different gestures of friendship by the SSCF and tried to spin them as some sort slights, so as to rationalize the poor behavior that those olive branches were met with. I assume it makes you feel better about your own poor behavior and dark feelings to think that there must have been alterior motives to them. Tell me when the SSFC took the first step and played Klingon on IDSL, did you take the second and go over to their voice comms to welcome them? Or did you just assume that because they used their own comms they were being arrogant and standoffish?

No Kroma I cant say that I did of corse they never gave us the info need it.

Now about poor behavior you have told me that I was insane paranoia
You have also said that I had anomosity towards the "evil" Feds
and then there is always I do however hope that people that act this way feel bad
If this isn't poor behavior I don't know what is.

BTW
I still think you should make that 2nd account we talked about so you can argue with your self intill you turn blue.

[KBF-Crim]

Are we done yet?

[WarSears]

Are we done yet?

No Kroma will have to get the last word in.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

          

[Kroma BaSyl]

No Kroma I cant say that I did of corse they never gave us the info need it.

Did you ask. Or just allow you anomosity to assume they wouldn't want to talk with you?

Now about poor behavior you have told me that I was insane paranoia
You have also said that I had anomosity towards the "evil" Feds
and then there is always I do however hope that people that act this way feel bad
If this isn't poor behavior I don't know what is.

Pointing out your poor behavior and parinoia, as displayed right here shows pretty clearly that you are still not capible of recognizing it. You see it in the innocent acts of others but not in yourself.

So far everything you have said is to justify why it was ok for you and your team to act the way you have and continue to do, without even denying or chanllengeing why your own actions were not actually poor behavior. You then turn and blame others for pointing out your behavior.

Fact is if you can't let go of the hate then nothing will change and the game will grind to a halt. Hope you realize it before it is to late.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

    

[WarSears]

No Kroma I cant say that I did of corse they never gave us the info need it.

Did you ask. Or just allow you anomosity to assume they wouldn't want to talk with you?

Now about poor behavior you have told me that I was insane paranoia
You have also said that I had anomosity towards the "evil" Feds
and then there is always I do however hope that people that act this way feel bad
If this isn't poor behavior I don't know what is.

Pointing out your poor behavior and parinoia, as displayed right here shows pretty clearly that you are still not capible of recognizing it. You see it in the innocent acts of others but not in yourself.

So far everything you have said is to justify why it was ok for you and your team to act the way you have and continue to do, without even denying or chanllengeing why your own actions were not actually poor behavior. You then turn and blame others for pointing out your behavior.

Fact is if you can't let go of the hate then nothing will change and the game will grind to a halt. Hope you realize it before it is to late.

The only reason I even brought the SSCF in to this was because you were saying that Hooch was try to breing the D2 community together. I stated the facts why I dident belive this to be true and all  you do is call me name and put your spin on it.

You say that I cant let go of the hate I find that kind of funny I heat no one. Tell me Kroma what did me and my team do that was so bad. Was it takeing out the Feds That was are goal  to take out the side we thought could hurt us the most.

I'm going to quote part of a post LordKruge made in the KBF forums.

Real Empires did not fall, no one really died, no real civilazations were wiped out. So why such real anger and harsh words? In the next game we may be soundly defeated. But, I won't be posting similiar statements like those that are being posted now. Instead, it'll be "GG", just like I posted after the last two servers where the Coalition was defeated. After all, it's a game and it made no difference in my real life.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Sears,  let me say a word about Hooch's intent.  I talked with him as he was developing the concept for KCW, and he did have a major goal of attempting to create more unity within the D2 community, particularly between the Federation and Klingon players with  this server.  If you were not aware of this, I see no reason to blame you for not being aware, no reason you should have been.  I do ask you to simply except my statement that this was true at face value.  Hopefully that will put an end to that issue.


As for the GW5 conquest of Federation space.  I think the fact that the Coalition was seen as "villians" in this instace by some is rather distressing.  They made a strategy, it worked and they stuck to it.  Perhaps it might have been more "sportsmanlike" if they had shifted to other targets at some point, however the bile they received for their actions of following their own strategy while playing 100% in accordance with the rules was undeserved .  If they had broken any rules set forth by the admins it would be one thing, but to play fairly and be given the level of criticism that they received and in the tones it was delivered was really the epitome of poor sportsmanship in my book.

[Corbomite]

Look, the simple fact is that some players play mainly for fun and camaraderie and others see it more as a challenge to be overcome/insurmountable odds/play to win what-have-you. This is not to say that seeking fun is not challenging and seeking challenge is not fun, they are just the types of players I have seen over the years and most people fall into these two categories.

The problem is that they are like oil and water; they will never mix well. The challenge seekers will invariably be more organized and determined to control the map and will see it as the normal course of play. The fun seekers just get on and hope someone has a plan so they can get out there and fly with their friends and blow some stuff up and see it as the normal course of play. When there were even numbers of these types on each side, there were no problems like we had on GW5 as the hardcore group would hold the fort when the fun team signed off.

Now it seems that one type has gravitated to one "side" and the other to the other "side". This means that when the fun seekers stop having fun and sign off, the challenge seekers eat up the map. They don't like that there is no one to fight, but their style of play demands that they keep pushing because in the past servers have been won by late influxes of enemy players after weeks of pathetic showings.

Now all this being valid, it still brings up the fact that after a point (when the last Fed planet was taken) the Feds were no threat to the Romulans (there was going to be no magical influx of late players to the Feds, it was pretty obvious), yet the Romulans kept on not only knocking the Feds down, but kicking them repeatedly in the groin, teeth and stomach, even after several pleas from Fed players to stop and just please let them play (may we please have the privilege of playing on your server sir?). All this was met with either indifference or derisiveness and then scorn when people actually gave up after being fairly beaten.

Now I was on the server last night and I have a question: There is one Fed planet deep in Gorn space. If the Romulan strategy demands that it be eliminated, why did I see no progress towards taking it away? There should be a tunnel 10 hexes deep by now into Gorn space to rid you of this serious danger to the empire. This is the plan isn't it and you are sticking to it right?

[Kroma BaSyl]

The only reason I even brought the SSCF in to this was because you were saying that Hooch was try to breing the D2 community together. I stated the facts why I dident belive this to be true and all  you do is call me name and put your spin on it.

You say that I cant let go of the hate I find that kind of funny I heat no one. Tell me Kroma what did me and my team do that was so bad. Was it takeing out the Feds That was are goal  to take out the side we thought could hurt us the most.

All you did was show us that you didn't believe it to be true with regard to KCW because you had misinterpreted the fact that SSCF used their own voice comms on a server that happened over 3 years ago. In anycase most of those individuals don't even play the game anymore. So even if they did slight you way back then why hold a grudge against your current opponents.

You'll say you have no grudge, and maybe you personnally don't, however, a player on your team (Butcher) indicated that it was the Coalition's plan was to get the Alliance to quit and feel outnumbered. Krueg then confirmed that by saying:

"And it worked perfectly.  Grin
Demoralization of the enemy is as important as killing them in any war."

You can change the word "Demoralize" to whatever effimism you like but the intent and motivation behind it are clear. Your plan from the get go was to hit your opponents in a way that caused them to give up and quiet. Fine I guess I can almost see the logic when you were expecting to be heavily out numbered yourselves. I will assume also that this wasn't thought up out of malice toward your opponents, but once the number situation and server outcome had become clear, and was nolonger in question as to who would win, why was it necessary to pursue a course that would create a situation were the few good pilots and people that were hanging in there trying to give you at least some decent PvP and fun, wold quiet and become demoralized? Why deny them the ability to play the race they signed up for? Why runup the score on them?

So far your answer to these questions is that because Hooch tried to screw the KBF with his change of heart on the draft, which when it was pointed out to you that he did this because he wished to get people to get to know their opponents, you say you doubted that becasue of some preceived slight on a server 3 years prior. In any case, Hooch and the SSCF aren't even the people you have been attempting to drive off and demoralize. So why did you bring up those incidence as justification for your current behavior on this server?