Topic: What thread is Corbo's PPD rule in?

[FPF-Bach]

Greywolf has a point about the Strike Carriers. Since no ISC Escort Variant has PPD"s I would say that Carrier groups are exempt from the rule (only one ship could have PPD's anyway).

Just as a clarification here:
I am not assuming this to be a voting thread, simply discussion.
I am still supporting the last vote of my Fleet Admiral...4PPD no matter what combination.  It is simple.  Start getting into strict restrictions with exceptions, wherefores, blah blah blah, it is way too complex for just one race...the rest of the PBR rules would not be so long.
I think there is restriction enough on ISC.  How many ISC carriers have been seen this cycle?  How many 4 PPD CL combos have been seen?  Your ideas about restricting ISC further need some merit before true consideration.  What's wrong with the 4 PPD rule?  Give some examples.

Have you ever seen what 4PPDs can do when concentrated on a single target?

[[ISC]GreyWolf]

Have you ever seen what 4PPDs can do when concentrated on a single target?

Have you ever seen 14 Hornet3 can do concentrated on a single target?
4 PPD at range 10 do about the same damage as 4 F-Plasmas in the face, assuming all hit...but the damage is spread over 3 shields...
And once the 4 ppds at range 10 are exhausted? Have you ever heard of a chase?

[762_XC]

I've seen what 14 Hornet-3 do to a speed 31 target: absolutely nothing.

I've also seen what happens when you try to chase down the PPD ship.

[Corbomite]

Have you ever seen what 4PPDs can do when concentrated on a single target?

Have you ever seen 14 Hornet3 can do concentrated on a single target?
4 PPD at range 10 do about the same damage as 4 F-Plasmas in the face, assuming all hit...but the damage is spread over 3 shields...
And once the 4 ppds at range 10 are exhausted? Have you ever heard of a chase?

4 PPD's at range 15 equal (if all pulses hit) the same firepower as 16 disruptors on the facing shield and 4 proximity photons on each adjacent shield.

[Toast]

  LOL

[[ISC]GreyWolf]

4 PPD's at range 15 equal (if all pulses hit) the same firepower as 16 disruptors on the facing shield and 4 proximity photons on each adjacent shield.

4 PPD = 16 Pulses at 15 range = 48 main shield and 16 per adjacent shield every other turn.
= 24/8/8 per turn or 40 point per turn.
12 Dizzy per turn = 36 at range 15.
12 Photons /2turns charge = 96/2= 48 points per turn
6 S-Plasma /3turns = 132/3 = 44 points per turn
12 Hbore /3turns = 120/4 = 30 per turn
30 Phaser 1 /turn = 30 avg per turn at 15

So the only advantage with a max of 4 PPD is that it has a better hit ratio then the other direct fire at 15.  But it cannot be fired at 4 or less, where all the others continue to get better..
PPD best chance is 83% at range 4-10.
Dizzy 100% 0 -- Damage is also increase 40% vs range 15.
Photon 100% 0-1
HBore 97% 0-1 -- Damage is also increase 100% vs range 15
30 Phaser1 increase damage to a possible 120-270/turn at range 0.

The numbers above are likely seen in a 3v3 game. Just FYI so everyone is included.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

The Hydran question was just to bring some perspective to this whole discussion.  Hydrans=Fighters...how many? when? where? no one cares if a 3v3 Hydran fleet can legally bring in 14 Horn3 with a ComVar and 2 unrestricteds...but PPD...hold on there cowboy...

The difference here is obvious. Fighters can be avoided.

Yeah, just drop a shuttle and watch the confusion reign.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

This league is becoming a joke now, i'm not sure what happened cause in cycle 1-2-3 at GZ matches were fun and the PPD bickering was at a min and if ya dont beleive me go look at the gz forums.Since we moved to d.net all the bickering has come from the d2 players and now its clear to me why 90% of your servers don't have ISC playable,yall just caint deal with the race (and i dont care what any of you say i know the truth the OSG4 server summed it up).
This will be ISC's last cycle as this has become a burden for me and my guys.....

Honestly?

Considering the sportsmanship I have seen out of you and your guys, I could care less if you leave.

[Corbomite]

Since we moved to d.net all the bickering has come from the d2 players and now its clear to me why 90% of your servers don't have ISC  playable,yall just caint deal with the race (and i dont care what any of you say i know the truth the OSG4 server summed it up).

BS. There is bickering because PBR is being used and rules interpretations from SFB to SFC are not always straight forward. Even the SFB material placed restrictions on PPD deployment. We are just trying to work out a reasonable interpretation for a league using those parameters. Look at an ISC tourney ship and see what is considered a "fair and balanced" ISC ship against the rest of the galaxy.

[[ISC]Phaser]

Well corbo, if you go look at the gz forums the ppd issue was never an issue untill we came here i mean it was at first then we as a fleet realized it makes no difference, and really there was never this kind of BS about the rules and what not and using bugs to thwart off fighters i mean really, this is a chore now with 0 fun factor.The gz players never bitched about the ISC race and the rules were simple and clear, because of the different quality of flying that you d2 people are used to and yes the d2 vets are not in the same calliber as the vet league players in 3v3's, no offence intended you think that the ISC as a race needs further locking down and more restrictions to make it more balanced i say BS, trying to make this league follow sfb to the letter is killing it.. ask any gz fleet in cycle 1-3 before we moved here if it was more fun then then now!
www.gzleagues.com

p.s bearslayer i could care less about ur statments bro since your a new commer to our league...

[Toast]

Sportsmanship???? u mean like what i saw on the osg4, or are u speaking of sov vrs isc matches in general seems to me our matches have been mostly polite with sov and everyone else win or loss, our mission as a fleet has always been to include all our pilots in play no matter of skill level and have fun, it just so happens that we won a few cycles but i dont remember us dancing around jesting at others but now i see plenty dancing round at the thought of us leaving. We are mostly just a group of GSA players i dont feel we consider ourselves to be the best or unstoppable by any means we have been beaten and lost graciously and have won graciously, Is it the fact that we are a new fleet that has come and won? most here never paid any mind to most of our pilots before we came together and gave some old established fleets an eye opener. Rules have changed before and we have been able to adapted but I'm not getting a welcomed feeling here now and i dont feel its just the isc race so there for I for one do not feel the need to adapt to that enjoy............

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

p.s bearslayer i could care less about ur statments bro since your a new commer to our league...

If you didn't care, you wouldn't have commented now, would you?

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Sportsmanship???? u mean like what i saw on the osg4, or are u speaking of sov vrs isc matches in general seems to me our matches have been mostly polite with sov and everyone else win or loss, our mission as a fleet has always been to include all our pilots in play no matter of skill level and have fun, it just so happens that we won a few cycles but i dont remember us dancing around jesting at others but now i see plenty dancing round at the thought of us leaving. We are mostly just a group of GSA players i dont feel we consider ourselves to be the best or unstoppable by any means we have been beaten and lost graciously and have won graciously, Is it the fact that we are a new fleet that has come and won? most here never paid any mind to most of our pilots before we came together and gave some old established fleets an eye opener. Rules have changed before and we have been able to adapted but I'm not getting a welcomed feeling here now and i dont feel its just the isc race so there for I for one do not feel the need to adapt to that enjoy............

IF you call using bugs sporting... and not returning the 'gg' when you guys lose being good sports... sure...

But I don't see it that as being good sports.

You can go or you can stay, doesn't matter to me.

[Toast]

Never has a gg not been returned unless there was some kinda bs going on in game that was in need of being addressed  and there has been plenty of bs thrown are way thats for damn sure mostly from the so called elite honorable fleets, u can cry over a shuttle here and there but i remember the crying in gz when we used alot of ftrs in one particular game only to have it returned 10 fold in another by folks who were on the anti ftr band wagon against us but it was fine when it suited there needs, that lobby pissin contest i do remember slayer  i do recall a fleet refusing to finish a match once we got slammed for that to, in the battle of public opinion we cant get a fair shake so we save it for the matches and let the chips fall ,seems that's what's really bothering folks how the chips have fallen. A break next cycle or 2 is for certain now, btw i do remember another isc fleet in gz that folks got wins off of icop so i dont think its the race thats the issue really enjoy the paper championships.........

[Corbomite]

Well corbo, if you go look at the gz forums the ppd issue was never an issue untill we came here i mean it was at first then we as a fleet realized it makes no difference, and really there was never this kind of BS about the rules and what not and using bugs to thwart off fighters i mean really, this is a chore now with 0 fun factor.

Well let's see, you had PBR for one incomplete, defunct cycle before we came here so I can believe there were no problems because there was no rule to balance. This concept is rather new and it is inevitable that things will have to be worked out a bit. Besides, if you can't have any fun winning all your matches I don't know what to tell you.

The gz players never bitched about the ISC race and the rules were simple and clear...

Different league, different rules. Live with it or don't. PBR dictates that certain things be monitored and PPD is one of them.

...because of the different quality of flying that you d2 people are used to and yes the d2 vets are not in the same calliber as the vet league players in 3v3's

    I am sooooo going to remember you said that.

you think that the ISC as a race needs further locking down and more restrictions to make it more balanced i say BS, trying to make this league follow sfb to the letter is killing it.. ask any gz fleet in cycle 1-3 before we moved here if it was more fun then then now!

Is that why GZ is dead then, because it was so fun? Talk to Jakle about the format, it's his baby, not ours. We are just trying to work out some kinks. As far as balancing the ISC you are certainly entitled to your opinion, but in my opinion, your opinion sucks.

[KBF-Butcher]

The Hydran question was just to bring some perspective to this whole discussion.  Hydrans=Fighters...how many? when? where? no one cares if a 3v3 Hydran fleet can legally bring in 14 Horn3 with a ComVar and 2 unrestricteds...but PPD...hold on there cowboy...

The difference here is obvious. Fighters can be avoided.

That means that ppd cant be avoided? lol
whining whining whining

IF you call using bugs sporting... and not returning the 'gg' when you guys lose being good sports... sure...

But I don't see it that as being good sports.

You can go or you can stay, doesn't matter to me.

ah? what?Thats BS! ISC r ALWAYS returning the gg
As for your good sportmanship i would like to remind u what u had reply me in OSG4 when i challenged u to meet me for 1v1:"U better go fight an AI"
That was good sportmanship yeah!
Good sport was also when the Alliance refused to fight against ISC players (luckily thx to Vader and 2tone we managed to hf playing some pvp vs Feds)
Good sportmanship was the really good welcome to league players by some of the dyna veterans  by being rude to them and blame them that theydont know the rules.
Good sportmanship was when a hydran player didnt ever returned the gg when i killed him in the GFZ!
One short look at the OSG4 threads u can understand from what people the bickering comes from  in the dyna servers as well.


bad sportmanship ,whining bickering whining bickering ....and whining is what some of u guys only provide ...U have prooved it many times
Luckily the majority of the dynaverse people isnt like the few of u...luckily


Phaser is right this league has became really boring with all these crap.
When this league had fleets like Icop and GT(Real Hydran fleet)... it really worth it.
I quit from now and i dont give a sh*t if u bearslayer or any other gonna care or not!
I play to hf u play only to win and if this isnot possible there comes the whine.
im sick of these sh*t.

p.sHail to FSD cause if there is a race that had the right to complain here about the rules is Lyran.But those guys only trying to hf here staying out of these sh*t 

p.s As for u Alliance lawyer 2face Corbo u had a different view of things talking about races at your postings on the ISC group. 

[762_XC]

That means that ppd cant be avoided? lol
whining whining whining

YOU are going to complain about whining?

 

[[ISC]Phaser]

again ur miss informed corbomite, there were 3 cycles before we came here and jakle was the reason for shutting down gz as he said he no longer had the time to run it ,the only defunct cycle is this one because of you and ur BS, butcher is right your opinion was very different on the bozobits forum about the other d2 players and their lack of balls to enguage ISC players,all i can say bro is u better bring ur best game, oh wait there wont be any AI's FOR U TO KILL...

[Corbomite]

Phaser & Butcher,

WTF does the D2 have to do with balancing a competitive league? My attitude about the D2 has absolutely no bearing on this part of the game. I've been saying the same thing here since the beginning. Try to stay on topic. We are trying to discuss the merits of PPD limitations in the PBR League, not how the ISC get screwed on the D2.

If you think calling me names or questioning my motives will sway my opinion you are wrong. The fact is I've been playing this game longer than you and I've actually had a small hand in shaping this game (you can thank me for your double duty, non-broken I-Torps). I've seen what good pilots are and what they can do and I would agree that many players around now could use some training and practice. That doesn't mean we shape our rules set around what people are doing, but what they can potentially do in the hopes that they will improve.

GreyWolf has got me thinking about the Light Strike Cruisers/Carriers and the unbalancing effect of the uber proxy photons as well. A more streamlined rule would fix the complexity issue (no need for an exception) and address the 12 photon NCL fleets the Feds can produce (and yes everyone I have to balance against the Feds because the source material is based that way). It would look like this:



If the largest ship in the fleet is of CL(CM) class, then two PPD's are allowed for a fleet of three.
If the largest ship in the fleet is of CA(CC) class, then three PPD's are allowed for a fleet of three.
If the largest ship in the fleet is of DN(BB) class, then four PPD's are allowed for a fleet of three.



As for this little gem...

all i can say bro is u better bring ur best game, oh wait there wont be any AI's FOR U TO KILL...

I lost no ships in PVP the entire server and only ran from one fight when I was out classed by three hull sizes and damaged beyond futher ability to fight. I wish I could same the same for your boys. They lost several of our best ships in questionable matchups that they should have won or at least been able to disengage. Shall I bring up the kill list from SGO4 and count how many VC's your crack squad of pilots lost us?

[KHH Jakle]

If the largest ship in the fleet is of CL(CM) class, then two PPD's are allowed for a fleet of three.
If the largest ship in the fleet is of CA(CC) class, then three PPD's are allowed for a fleet of three.
If the largest ship in the fleet is of DN(BB) class, then four PPD's are allowed for a fleet of three.

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