Topic: Star Trek : Insurrection.

[Sirgod]

I just popped the tape into the Vcr (thanks Stormbringer for theTape) , and I still like this Episode very much. I see this one as the most Poetic ST movie made. However alot of people didn't care for this one.

I'm just Interested in my friends View of this film.


Stephen

[E_Look]

It wasn't too bad.  I didn't like the equation of a shifty little Federation and Starfleet with the U.S. and its military.  Neat SF ideas it had.  Better plot if only it had.  But Herbert it is not.

[TheJudge]

I enjoyed the episode very much and the idea of the Son'a terrorists was cool.

[J. Carney]

I enjoyed the episode very much and the idea of the Son'a terrorists was cool.

I wasn't too fond of it. The movie had it's good points... but also it's bad ones.

*ALERT: SPOILER BELOW*

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I mean Riker flying the E with a pop-up joystick for God's sake?

PLEASE!!!

"It's time to use the Briar Patch like Briar Rabbit did..."

That's the cheesiest line in Trek.

[Commander La'ra]

The overall plotline I kinda liked.  Nice 'life is what you make of it' subtext, with the serpent in the garden of hatred and intolerance and lack of understanding.  It also showed that the Federation...or at least those that represent it...are as human as anyone else and can be tempted by the oppurtunity to take advantage of someone.  Most TNG stuff, the people are a little too benevolent for me.

The sequences when the Enterprise is being chased by the Son'a, however, irritated me.  What was wrong with standing and fighting the evil bad guys?  Why was there a joystick on the bridge?  Etc.  Taken with the parts of the movie I liked, it sort of implied they didn't think the innocents on the planet were worth getting loud and busy over.

Sure, it's out of character for Starfleet to attack the Son'a, but once they start shooting...shoot back.

I liked the movie, but there are parts I wished had been left in the editting room or, better yet, done differently to start with.

[Clark Kent]

I personally thought it was the best of the TNG films.  The opening was good, and it was nice to see the TNG crew finally doing what was right as compared with what was in the rules.  Agreed E shouldve shot back sooner, no  doubt.  The joystick, in concept, I think was a good idea, more intuitive than their little console things, but one lone joystick isn't enough to handle the complexities of a big space dogfight, so they kinda over simplified it, so I'd agree with the cheesy thought.
It's kinda a bummer, tho, since the TNG crew needed a teenage hormonal shot in the butt toact the way the good ol' TMP cast would have on their own in old age.  And even then, they didn't have the cohones of the orignal cast. 
I liked the action, but it seems to be a normal thing for picard to go on an away mission when the ship is in a big battle.  Except for nemesis, of course, where the ship was messed up as bad as the D was.
In the end I'd say it was a good movie, and give it a B, due to the lack of nudity.

[J. Carney]

Point #1) I personally thought it was the best of the TNG films.

Point #2) In the end I'd say it was a good movie, and give it a B, due to the lack of nudity.

Point #1) This is an oxymoron... there ARE no good TNG movies.

Point #2) If they had gotten them in movies before all the female leads had broken 40, nudity might have helped... this late- its lack of nudity was one of the few good points.

[Age]

   There is one good one First Contact ...

[J. Carney]

   There is one good one First Contact ...

Sorry, even Troi getting sloshed on rotgut Tequillia came 10 years too late for actually being able to have fun taking adventage of her.

It was better than the rest, but still not of the same caliber as the original TOS cast's movies.

[Age]

   There is one good one First Contact ...

Sorry, even Troi getting sloshed on rotgut Tequillia came 10 years too late for actually being able to have fun taking adventage of her.

It was better than the rest, but still not of the same caliber as the original TOS cast's movies.

There will be nothig that can out do the Original cast in TOS and TMP up till Star Trek 6 Undiscovered Country.I do agree with on this I would say ten years to early it would of been better if they waited but then there is the Data factor.

[GDA-S'Cipio]

   There is one good one First Contact ...

First Contact was in actuality two movies; one onboard the Enterprise and one on the surface of earth.

Onboard ship was a top-notch action movie with lots of danger, a scary villain, a coherent story, and even some character development.  The only downside was the rewroking of the Borg from a gestalt intelligence to worker bees with a queen, and giving them the ability to convert with a touch.  (Whereas on TV they had needed surgery.)  Put the hour that happened onbaord ship alongside all the TV episodes, and I'd rank it near the top.

The movie on the earth's surface, on the other hand, sucked.  It rewrote far too much of what had already been established on TOS (Sort of like what Enterprise did in its first three seasons.) and rewrote none of it for the better.  The earth that had avoided an apocolyptic WWIII (Omega Glory) was actually having an apocolyptic WWIII.  The already-existant pre-warp starfleet (Menagerie, Balance of Terror) wasn't existant as Cochrane had his breakthrough.  The Alpha-Centauran Cochrane (The Changling) was on earth.

When you intentionally make a movie based upon events already established in a previous series, what's so damn hard about watching the one or two relevant episodes to get the setting right?

(Rumor mill has it that the original script had Cochrane as a woman, and with a romantic interest in Picard.  When questioned about this, Berman and Braga reportedly said, "Don't worry; none of our audience remembers TOS."  Thank heaven that idea, at least, was shot down.)

-S'Cipio the ranter

[Alidar Jarok]

The movie on the earth's surface, on the other hand, sucked.  It rewrote far too much of what had already been established on TOS (Sort of like what Enterprise did in its first three seasons.) and rewrote none of it for the better.  The earth that had avoided an apocolyptic WWIII (Omega Glory) was actually having an apocolyptic WWIII.

Blaim Encounter at Farpoint

The already-existant pre-warp starfleet (Menagerie, Balance of Terror) wasn't existant as Cochrane had his breakthrough.

The Colombia only crashed 18 years before the Cage, but Cochrane died 150 years before Metamorphisis (so it wasn't a pre-warp fleet).  I have no idea what you mean by Balance of Terror.  You could make an argument for Space Seed (SS Botony Bay leaving in 1996), but it doesn't necessarily suggest a fleet, just that ships existed.

The Alpha-Centauran Cochrane (The Changling) was on earth.

Long before First Contact, people wondered how he got to Alpha Centauri without Warp Drive.  The Star Trek Chronology speculated that he went there after inventing warp drive.  That is what the writers of First Contact decided to go with.  Oh, Metamorphisis, btw, changling was the one with the Nomad Space Probe

[GDA-S'Cipio]

Blaim Encounter at Farpoint

Oh, I cursed at Q's little speech when it first aired in that one too.  Come on, Gene.  First episode out of the box for TNG.  At least act like you remember Omega Glory,  since you wrote it! 

The already-existant pre-warp starfleet (Menagerie, Balance of Terror) wasn't existant as Cochrane had his breakthrough.

The Colombia only crashed 18 years before the Cage, but Cochrane died 150 years before Metamorphosis (so it wasn't a pre-warp fleet). 

Yes, that is when they crashed.  But when did they launch?   Relativity does such nasty things.  (This is a nearly 50 year-old argument that I think is really explained by the fact that the series was completely revamped between "The Cage" and "Where No Man Has Gone Before", but it is still fun to speculate.)

I have no idea what you mean by Balance of Terror. 

I was thinking that the war referred to as 100 years ago in "Balance of Terror" must have used a pre-warp fleet, but you may have me with your better memory of "Metamorphosis".  I'd forgotten just how long ago Cochrane "died".

Long before First Contact, people wondered how he got to Alpha Centauri without Warp Drive. 

Parents or grandparents took 4+ relativistic years to get there on a Botany Bay class spaceship, then Cochrane was born there?

Good catch on the "Changling/Metamorphisis" error.

-S'Cipio

[14G_Tiger]

I was thinking that the war referred to as 100 years ago in "Balance of Terror" must have used a pre-warp fleet, but you may have me with your better memory of "Metamorphosis".  I'd forgotten just how long ago Cochrane "died".

First Contact---2063
TOS Balance of Terror-- approx. 2263 (the 22 is the one that matters)

100 years makes it 2160's..how does first contact invalidate the whole prewarp fleet idea with the romulans?

[Alidar Jarok]

Also, there's no way two pre-warp fleets fight each other unless they live in the same solar system (or possibly neighboring systems)