Topic: SFC-Orion Pirates Weapons Data (Read 341572 times)

Corbomite · « **on:** January 04, 2005, 10:58:57 pm »

[This Topic is Under Reconstruction]

FPF-Wanderer · « **Reply #1 on:** January 05, 2005, 12:23:39 am »

You da man, Corbo!

Mace · « **Reply #2 on:** January 05, 2005, 08:17:13 am »

WOW!!! does the suicide fusion REALLY do that much damage?!?!?

yikes, thats a big-ole-bug. I know the max's in SFB were 13, 19, and 26. And I thought 26 points max was bad; 38 is just devastating.

Oh yeah, Thanks for putting this back up Corbo.

762_XC · « **Reply #3 on:** January 05, 2005, 10:08:23 pm »

I wouldn't sweat it. Suicide fusions NEVER get used. With 7 points each to arm and 4 to hold, you won't be able to catch your target if you try.

GDA-Agave · « **Reply #4 on:** February 10, 2005, 12:45:36 pm »

Thanks Corbo.

Its certainly make for a good read.

Dizzy · « **Reply #5 on:** February 20, 2005, 09:27:47 pm »

Corbomite · « **Reply #6 on:** April 02, 2005, 10:02:32 am »

For some reason the charts keep getting corrupted and out of line. I have fixed them twice now, but since it takes a lot of time I need to find a better format or find out why the forum software can't keep it aligned.

Bonk · « **Reply #7 on:** April 07, 2005, 05:38:41 am »

Quote from: Corbomite on April 02, 2005, 10:02:32 am

For some reason the charts keep getting corrupted and out of line. I have fixed them twice now, but since it takes a lot of time I need to find a better format or find out why the forum software can't keep it aligned.

Try tables...

Phaser IV:

NOTE: Except for mods, the Phaser IV will only be found on Bases, Planets and certain Monsters.

Range:	0-3	4-5	6	7	8	9	10	11-13	14-17	18-25	26-40	41-70	71-100
Max:	20	20	20	15	12




Min:

etc...

e.g.:
7Rx14C:

Code: [Select]


[table]

[tr]
[td]Range: [/td] [td]    0-3 [/td] [td]    4-5 [/td] [td]    6 [/td] [td]    7 [/td] [td]    8 [/td] [td]    9 [/td] [td]    10 [/td] [td]    11-13 [/td] [td]    14-17 [/td] [td]    18-25 [/td] [td]    26-40 [/td] [td]    41-70 [/td] [td]    71-100 [/td]
[/tr]

[tr]
[td]Max: [/td] [td]    20 [/td] [td]    20 [/td] [td]    20 [/td] [td]    15 [/td] [td]    12 [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td]
[/tr]

[tr]
[td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td]
[/tr]

[tr]
[td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td]
[/tr]

[tr]
[td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td]
[/tr]

[tr]
[td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td]
[/tr]

[tr]
[td]Min: [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td] [td] [/td]
[/tr]

[/table]

could use a few more leading spaces in each cell to space it out more but you get the idea...

Corbomite · « **Reply #8 on:** April 07, 2005, 10:15:15 am »

Cool. I'll have to experiment with that. Thanks Bonk.

Slick · « **Reply #9 on:** June 09, 2005, 10:28:10 am »

Great chart!

If I may humbly submit a correction, though:

Weapon probes do 6 damage, not 8 as listed.

Cheers,
Slick.

Corbomite · « **Reply #10 on:** June 09, 2005, 07:27:45 pm »

Quote from: Slick on June 09, 2005, 10:28:10 am

Great chart!

If I may humbly submit a correction, though:

Weapon probes do 6 damage, not 8 as listed.

Cheers,
Slick.

I noticed that too, but only against ships it seems. If you fire it at a planet it does 8. Not having the code to look at I must default to the listed damage it is supposed to do.

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #11 on:** April 08, 2007, 11:43:07 pm »

From my dusty memory: Range 16-22 Disruptors do 2 points of damage. Attack probes do only 2 damage to ships (but do 8 to shuttles and missiles).

Corbomite · « **Reply #12 on:** April 09, 2007, 09:03:51 pm »

Quote from: TarMinyatur on April 08, 2007, 11:43:07 pm

From my dusty memory: Range 16-22 Disruptors do 2 points of damage. Attack probes do only 2 damage to ships (but do 8 to shuttles and missiles).

I believe you are correct in SFB, but I'm pretty sure Taldren adjusted their chart for DERFACS as a free bonus just like the UIM in the overload bracket.

Attack Probes do 6 points to ships and 8 to planets for sure, I tested it.

Its good to see you around here again Tar!

Corbomite · « **Reply #13 on:** February 14, 2008, 05:44:25 pm »

OK, its been a long time since I did any straightening out in here. Here is a list of changes, edits and additions:

1) New layout with Arming Rates and weapons grouped by type/function. Charts have been reorganized or replaced to (hopefully) fix the fun house mirror drifting problems.

2) New charts including: ECM/ECCM, Cloaking Device and Ship Explosion/Self Destruction.

3) Amended charts for accuracy: Phaser X, Fusion Suicide Overload and Attack Probes.

4) Amended/Expanded notes for accuracy including (but not limited to): Hellbores, Plasma and Attack Probes.

Enjoy!!

<------- My eyes after looking at this stuff for days and days...and days...

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #14 on:** May 02, 2008, 09:11:44 pm »

I seem to remember the AMD-12 taking 2 turns to reload, and the Plas-D 1.33 turns. The idea is that these devices can load 3 "spaces" of munitions per turn, AMD's being 1/2 space items and Plas-D as 1-space items.

Corbomite · « **Reply #15 on:** May 03, 2008, 07:42:54 am »

Quote from: TarMinyatur on May 02, 2008, 09:11:44 pm

I seem to remember the AMD-12 taking 2 turns to reload, and the Plas-D 1.33 turns. The idea is that these devices can load 3 "spaces" of munitions per turn, AMD's being 1/2 space items and Plas-D as 1-space items.

I didn't notice any significant differences in loading times for these items. I will slow down the clock and take a better look.

Thanks Tar!

Corbomite · « **Reply #16 on:** May 03, 2008, 08:57:04 am »

Confirmed: AMD6, AMD12 and Plasma D all rearm in one turn as soon as the entire Hardpoint is empty as compared to a PH-1, which is a known quantity. You will see them jump to a "Ready to Fire" state immediately (Hardpoint all filled in) if the weapon is not totally discharged after firing, but the slow "crawl" to reload definitely takes one turn.

Roychipoqua_Mace · « **Reply #17 on:** May 03, 2008, 09:29:00 am »

Hehe, giving this chart a thorough lookthru, now I see what they mean by "Magic Photons" with the 83-67-33% hit rates, instead of the 67-50-33% in the original manual.

I also noticed what Tar said about the R16-R22 disruptors. When I tried firing one shot at the AI in skirmish mode and then quit, the debriefing screen said total damage scored to enemy was 2. I can check it again, though, that was a little while ago.

Corbomite · « **Reply #18 on:** May 03, 2008, 09:43:20 am »

Testing fighter PH-2's right now. I will test Disruptors and get back to you.

Corbomite · « **Reply #19 on:** May 03, 2008, 10:00:07 am »

Confirmed: 16-22 Disruptor does 2 points of damage. Chart amended. I did that chart a long time ago. I must have read the ranges wrong in my test because I'm pretty sure I defended that call from my notes and never bothered to retest it. My bad!

Roychipoqua_Mace · « **Reply #20 on:** May 03, 2008, 10:51:11 am »

Hey, maybe it was like that in an older version. Great work on this chart, though, it's a good resource

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #21 on:** May 04, 2008, 10:22:31 am »

Quote from: Corbomite on May 03, 2008, 08:57:04 am

Confirmed: AMD6, AMD12 and Plasma D all rearm in one turn as soon as the entire Hardpoint is empty as compared to a PH-1, which is a known quantity. You will see them jump to a "Ready to Fire" state immediately (Hardpoint all filled in) if the weapon is not totally discharged after firing, but the slow "crawl" to reload definitely takes one turn.

I must be thinking of EAW. A few worthwhile changes never got into OP for unexplained reasons.

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #22 on:** May 04, 2008, 12:53:15 pm »

Hey Corbomite. Check out your info on plasma point defense.

From Khoromag.org:
"Phaser damage versus plasma was at a 8:1 ratio, meaning it took 8 points of damage to lower the plasma's damage potential by 1. In SFB the ratio is 2:1 however during playtesting we found this to be too unbalancing. We settled on 4:1 as a good ratio. It takes 4 points of damage to reduce the plasma warhead damage by 1."

Corbomite · « **Reply #23 on:** May 04, 2008, 01:30:01 pm »

Quote from: TarMinyatur on May 04, 2008, 12:53:15 pm

Hey Corbomite. Check out your info on plasma point defense.

From Khoromag.org:
"Phaser damage versus plasma was at a 8:1 ratio, meaning it took 8 points of damage to lower the plasma's damage potential by 1. In SFB the ratio is 2:1 however during playtesting we found this to be too unbalancing. We settled on 4:1 as a good ratio. It takes 4 points of damage to reduce the plasma warhead damage by 1."

That may be so as it says that in the patch Read Me, but it also says that ADD 12 arms in 2 turns and Plas D arms in 1.33 turns in there and I just checked those out and found otherwise. I will check them again and try to find a valid test for plasma. I vaguely remember Dave changing it and not documenting it, but I could be mistaken.

Corbomite · « **Reply #24 on:** May 04, 2008, 02:04:53 pm »

Confirmed: Phasers do 1/4 damage to plasma. Chart amended.

Reconfirmed: ADD 6, ADD12, and Plas D arm in one turn.

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #25 on:** May 04, 2008, 06:43:07 pm »

Corbomite, thanks for checking this stuff out. An entry, explaining that AMD's which hit fighters do 1 to 6 points of damage, might be helpful. Also stating that your AMD's will be 16% less accurate if they fire while your ship is using Erratic Maneuvers, might be good info, if it is true. I know that EAW had an EM penalty. OP might not have it.

The new table format is nice. Good work.

Corbomite · « **Reply #26 on:** May 04, 2008, 07:59:34 pm »

Quote from: TarMinyatur on May 04, 2008, 06:43:07 pm

Corbomite, thanks for checking this stuff out. An entry, explaining that AMD's which hit fighters do 1 to 6 points of damage, might be helpful. Also stating that your AMD's will be 16% less accurate if they fire while your ship is using Erratic Maneuvers, might be good info, if it is true. I know that EAW had an EM penalty. OP might not have it.

The new table format is nice. Good work.

Thanks for pointing out possible errors.

Since AMD will fire until empty or the target(s) are gone/out of range I didn't see the point of a damage chart for it. Plasma D has better range and decreasing damage so knowing if that fleeing fighter is within range is more important since if it was within range of a loaded AMD, it would probably already be dead.

I assume there is an EM penalty for all PD, but I can't think of an accurate way to test it.

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #27 on:** May 05, 2008, 12:10:20 am »

To test for an EM penalty, it helps to have some player's assistance. Fly a D5 erratically at speed 16 away from a pursuing D6D at a steady range of 3.9 on a large map, and keep track of AMD shots and number of slow missiles destroyed. A sample of 72 shots (thereby totally exhausting the D5's pair of AMD-12's) should be convenient and sufficient. 33 to 39 kills would indicate a penalty. 45 to 51 kills would indicate no penalty.

It will take about 10 minutes to do this experiment at game speed 8. The hard part may be finding someone interested in data collection...OP isn't installed on this computer.

Corbomite · « **Reply #28 on:** May 05, 2008, 06:15:56 am »

Quote from: TarMinyatur on May 05, 2008, 12:10:20 am

To test for an EM penalty, it helps to have some player's assistance. Fly a D5 erratically at speed 16 away from a pursuing D6D at a steady range of 3.9 on a large map, and keep track of AMD shots and number of slow missiles destroyed. A sample of 72 shots (thereby totally exhausting the D5's pair of AMD-12's) should be convenient and sufficient. 33 to 39 kills would indicate a penalty. 45 to 51 kills would indicate no penalty.

It will take about 10 minutes to do this experiment at game speed 8. The hard part may be finding someone interested in data collection...OP isn't installed on this computer.

Confirmed: EM causes a firing penalty for AMD. It killed exactly 54 drones out of 108 potential shots (50%) while performing EM, firing at range 3+. As a control I did a no EM run and killed 54 drones out of 72 potential shots (75% very lucky!) at the same range.

Added a new section for EM effects on weaponry and updated the notes for Plasma I's, Plasma D's and AMD.

Corbomite · « **Reply #29 on:** July 17, 2008, 10:34:58 am »

Updated Cloak notes. I had a detail wrong.

Jonnan · « **Reply #30 on:** July 12, 2009, 04:23:38 am »

Lets try this again - <G>
I converted the listings here to a TiddlyWiki file, which allows crossreferencing and so on. It does require Javascript, and while editting/saving changes works flawlessly in Firefox, any other browser I've had to tweak the settings a bit. But viewing should be fine in any browser.

Hopefully people will find this useful - I find it's a nice format for referencing stuff in.

Thanks - Jonnan

TAnimaL · « **Reply #31 on:** July 12, 2009, 01:11:39 pm »

Dude, that is totally WICKED! I love it! Fast, efficient, easy to use... I will definitely be using this. Thanks a whole bunch!

tiny, tiny, minuscule comment - how hard would it be to add the T/R beams (heavy and light)? I know they're not used by most, but the mod I'm working on with a friend uses them as limited-use heavy weapons. Just curious.

Again, great work!

Jonnan · « **Reply #32 on:** July 12, 2009, 11:50:34 pm »

Quote from: TAnimaL on July 12, 2009, 01:11:39 pm

Dude, that is totally WICKED! I love it! Fast, efficient, easy to use... I will definitely be using this. Thanks a whole bunch!

tiny, tiny, minuscule comment - how hard would it be to add the T/R beams (heavy and light)? I know they're not used by most, but the mod I'm working on with a friend uses them as limited-use heavy weapons. Just curious.

Again, great work!

?? I feel stupid - I'm not familiar with the TR Beam (I mean, I know them from SFB/Andromedans, but I didn't recall them being in SFC.)

That said - you should be able to add them yourself (I added basic help files in it, because I can't remember stuff - top left hand side has a link) just find the section you want them in (I'm guessing hit or miss weapons?) and click 'new here' - it will start a new entry tagged for that section, and automatically show up under the Table of Contents listing there. If you want to distinguish it from the regular entries change the username 'table of contents' to something like 'Andromedan Invasion Mod' or some such - I just used 'Table of Contents' so there would be a quick link back to there in every entry. Make sure you can save before you spend 15 minutes editing - Firefox works great (Asks for permissions, then works fine), other browsers are hit or miss.

For reference purposes, the baseline product here is TiddlyWiki (http://www.tiddlywiki.com/), and whats not in that is in the http://mptw.tiddlyspot.com wiki, minus the parts I ripped out because they were more than I needed. I use it for things like searchable references, game faqs, occasional storywriting and stuff - <G>.

Anyway, glad you liked it.

Jonnan

marstone · « **Reply #33 on:** July 13, 2009, 06:18:35 am »

don't feel bad TR beams were unfinished, there are references in the code to andro's and tholians but they never made the cut fully into the game.

Jonnan · « **Reply #34 on:** July 13, 2009, 08:33:55 am »

Ah - sad that they didn't make the cut, but good to know I'm not going completely senile either.

I was definitely having a "I'm *sure* I would have remembered *that*?!?!" moment - <G>

Jonnan

Roychipoqua_Mace · « **Reply #35 on:** July 13, 2009, 10:31:02 am »

Quote from: marstone on July 13, 2009, 06:18:35 am

don't feel bad TR beams were unfinished, there are references in the code to andro's and tholians but they never made the cut fully into the game.

That's interesting, I didn't know they had any Tholian progress in the game, even if it was unfinished.

marstone · « **Reply #36 on:** July 13, 2009, 02:52:10 pm »

Quote from: Roychipoqua_Mace on July 13, 2009, 10:31:02 am

Quote from: marstone on July 13, 2009, 06:18:35 am
don't feel bad TR beams were unfinished, there are references in the code to andro's and tholians but they never made the cut fully into the game.

That's interesting, I didn't know they had any Tholian progress in the game, even if it was unfinished.

There is even mention of the Jindarians

Corbomite · « **Reply #37 on:** July 14, 2009, 04:18:46 am »

TR Beams are in the game and work (they are a Range of Effect weapon). The graphic was never finished and they come out as a plain blue line. There are mods where folks have overlaid new/other weapons textures so I'm sure it would be possible for someone to "finish" them by creating a graphic or simply swapping out one we already have. I always thought the Heavy Phaser graphics would be a good choice: Phaser B for the TRH and Phaser A for TRL. I can create a chart for them if there is enough desire for one or if we fully incorporate them into the game.

TAnimaL · « **Reply #38 on:** July 14, 2009, 10:20:45 pm »

sorry I didn't make it clearer in my post that the TR beams are "broken but working" in the game; in my mod we're currently using them as "Neutron Blasters" (a nod to Blake's 7 fans) on a R-D7B, 2 T/R-H and 2 T/R-L with FA arcs. It's a mean little sucker...

Corbomite, which texture gets modified to override the T/R blue? Last time I think I tried fx0 and fx1.bmp to no avail.

Jonnan, I'm going to try loading them into the tiddlywink now, but it's my first attemp, so we'll see how that goes...

Corbomite · « **Reply #39 on:** July 15, 2009, 08:29:18 am »

I don't know how to do it myself and I can't even find phaser textures of any kind in the Textures file. They might be part of the Sprites file in which case we can't do what I proposed. Chris Jones was the one I remember changing out weapons textures for his UAW mod I think.

marstone · « **Reply #40 on:** July 15, 2009, 09:18:39 am »

Quote from: FCM-Corbomite-XC on July 15, 2009, 08:29:18 am

I don't know how to do it myself and I can't even find phaser textures of any kind in the Textures file. They might be part of the Sprites file in which case we can't do what I proposed. Chris Jones was the one I remember changing out weapons textures for his UAW mod I think.

Weapon textures are not in the Sprite file. The UI image for them are tho.

Roychipoqua_Mace · « **Reply #41 on:** July 15, 2009, 10:40:55 am »

Quote from: FCM-Corbomite-XC on July 15, 2009, 08:29:18 am

I don't know how to do it myself and I can't even find phaser textures of any kind in the Textures file. They might be part of the Sprites file in which case we can't do what I proposed. Chris Jones was the one I remember changing out weapons textures for his UAW mod I think.

The heavy phaser textures (both A and B) are the same as the other phasers, in the FX1.BMP file -- the white rectangle below and between the blue and red rings. To be sure, I scribbled a bunch of black over the white texture and tried firing the heavy phasers in the game. They appeared all broken up (actually kind of like the phaser bursts in ST2).

The problem with the phaser textures is that changing the color changes the color for every different type of phaser, and that is for all races. It would be awesome to have different color beams across the races but maybe that is possible later on.

Corbomite · « **Reply #42 on:** July 15, 2009, 04:23:27 pm »

Ahh I see. That's why the Mauler textures are the same except for the beam width and definition. Well, we wouldn't need to change the texture/color of the Heavy Phasers, just direct the game to use that texture for TR Beams as well as Heavy Phasers. The file may have to be copied and renamed to do that.

TAnimaL · « **Reply #43 on:** July 17, 2009, 10:13:20 pm »

For anyone who is interested, here is the OP Weapons Tiddlywiki by Jonnan with the Tractor-Repulsor Beam info added in.

Jonnan · « **Reply #44 on:** August 06, 2009, 08:10:39 pm »

TiddlyWiki has evidently updated a few bug-fixes, and I updated a couple of GUI decisions in my modification - This is all the same Info as before (And thank you for the Tractor/Repulsor info BTW) in a slightly more configurable wrapper.

Enjoy

Jonnan

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #45 on:** January 01, 2012, 12:16:03 am »

Thanks for this handy browser-based weapon info.

TAnimaL · « **Reply #46 on:** November 21, 2015, 03:20:56 pm »

After all these years, an update on this wiki: the range charts on the Ph-A & Ph-B were in error in the above versions.

Fixed here:

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #47 on:** November 21, 2015, 07:06:30 pm »

We can update the Cloaking Device info in the wiki. A cloaked ship that is tractored in Orion Pirates does not lose its misery chart protection: 33% normal damage, 33% half damage, 33% quarter damage.

The 67% normal damage, 33% half damage row in the wiki is maybe from Commander's Edition or for some optional rule(?)

TarMinyatur · « **Reply #48 on:** January 15, 2019, 03:05:33 pm »

Type-IV MIRV data is incorrect in the wiki. That's how the weapon should work, but it doesn't.

http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163396728.msg1123055848.html#msg1123055848

Feedback damage values for overloaded Heavy Photon and Heavy Disruptor are the same as plain overloaded Photon(4) and Disruptor(2).

The SFC_Editor can adjust feedback. It can't fix the large MIRV.

News:

Topic: SFC-Orion Pirates Weapons Data (Read 341572 times) var addthis_config = {"data_track_clickback":true};

762_XC

Topic: SFC-Orion Pirates Weapons Data (Read 341572 times)