Topic: Running up the post count- 2 Best (current ) Fed pilots?

[Hexx]

While my ongoing attempt to completely dominate these forums with my posts continues, who are (likely)  the
two best PVP Fed pilots, still actuve that participate in these forums?

I'm assuming DH is #1, but who's his best match ?

[F9thRyker]

Corbomite or DrAzteca, but there are a lot of pother excellent pilots who would be interchanged...

[madelf]

#1 best fed, MadElf, #2, who cares?   

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Wanna find out have them fly a tourney......

[KBF-Nail]

Yes! i THINK WE SHOULD HAVE ANOTHER TOURNEY. i POSTED on another forum about it. But no one seems like they want too do it.


So Is anyone interested in doing this?

[Bob Graham]

im down, lets roll with this.

[Dizzy]

Fed to Fed, corbo would be the only one of the above names mentioned that'd give me trouble.

[FPF-DieHard]

Honestly, Fed versus Fed  I would likely get my ass kicked.   I've never played ladder with the exception of half a PBR GZ cycle and you don't have fights like that in D2.

[WarSears]

Wanna find out have them fly a tourney......

What a great Ideal Chuut!!!! Nail why didn't you think of that. he he

[Age]

   Fed vs Fed uumm.There could be a lot of them in the lobby rooms that we don't see or hear of .This bring up an idea of Federation Civil War uumm nah it would never happen or would it.There could simply be revolt in one of the many Federation planets. I will  let you decide it if it is worth pursing for Campaign.

[Commander Maxillius]

With all the ideas of OoB and CnC rules circulating for the D2, I'm losing interest in that aspect of the game.  However, I'm all for another tourney.  One thing I'm not entirely clear on is if it'll be solely a Fed tourney, or all races like the last one.


Also, will it be random;y closen BPV and era, or a set value and era?



either way I'm all for it

[FPF-DieHard]

With all the ideas of OoB and CnC rules circulating for the D2,

There are not OOB or CnC rules for ship on War Cruiser hell 

[Commander Maxillius]

so there's only going to be CL's and lower in the shiplist?


SWEET!!!


ISC, here I come!!!

[FVA_C_ Blade_ XC]

The only good Fred pilot is a dead Fred pilot.


Nuff-Said.

[Hexx]

so there's only going to be CL's and lower in the shiplist?


SWEET!!!


ISC, here I come!!!

Isn't a CW bigger than a CL?

[Commander Maxillius]

last I knew War Cruiser (CW) is the same thing as Light Cruiser (CL).  The more peaceful races call them CLs because they're lighter than Heavy Cruisers, but are similarly armed.  The more warlike races call them CWs for the same reason, plus they are cheaper to build in wartime.


Examples:  F-CLC is DEFINATELY similarly equipped to the F-CC, lacking (I think) 2 forward phaser 1's, but making up for it (slightly) in maneuverability.

However, not all CLs can be called CWs, as anyone's who's ever flown the F-CL can attest to.



EDIT:  correction, the CLC is the CC+'s superior in battle, by 1 G-rack and 1 turn mode.

[FireSoul]

Who is number one..
.. hrm.

(...) .. who cares. I'll just see you on the next GW server.

[762_XC]

Since ISC don't have any war cruisers, and their CL's are like other ppl's heavy cruisers, I guess for CW hell the frogs will have to fly destroyers!

Bwahahaaha!!!

[FireSoul]

Since ISC don't have any war cruisers, and their CL's are like other ppl's heavy cruisers, I guess for CW hell the frogs will have to fly destroyers!

Bwahahaaha!!!

actually....

[Commander Maxillius]

Does that mean the Hydrans are going fighterless?

[FPF-DieHard]

Aren't the players cute when they think their opinions have weight?   

[FireSoul]

Since ISC don't have any war cruisers, and their CL's are like other ppl's heavy cruisers, I guess for CW hell the frogs will have to fly destroyers!

Bwahahaaha!!!

actually....

http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163348780.msg1122476272.html#msg1122476272

[FPF-DieHard]

Since ISC don't have any war cruisers, and their CL's are like other ppl's heavy cruisers, I guess for CW hell the frogs will have to fly destroyers!

Bwahahaaha!!!

actually....

http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163348780.msg1122476272.html#msg1122476272

You know I nag you everyday on MSN, but how soon until weel See OP+ 4?

[FireSoul]

Since ISC don't have any war cruisers, and their CL's are like other ppl's heavy cruisers, I guess for CW hell the frogs will have to fly destroyers!

Bwahahaaha!!!

actually....

http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163348780.msg1122476272.html#msg1122476272

You know I nag you everyday on MSN, but how soon until weel See OP+ 4?

Dunno. Still lots to do. Just finished reviewing refit dates based on official data that I now have. Klingons will be happy (K refits are as soon as 169!) Lyrans will not. (Powerpack refits aren't UNTIL 177.)

.. in fact, to give you an idea.. the L-CWLP was *7* years too early, .. no wonder it's such cheese. Meanwhile, the C8K has been moved back by 6 years, to where it's supposed to be.

[FPF-DieHard]

.. in fact, to give you an idea.. the L-CWLP was *7* years too early, .. no wonder it's such cheese.

 

[likkerpig]

.. in fact, to give you an idea.. the L-CWLP was *7* years too early, .. no wonder it's such cheese. Meanwhile, the C8K has been moved back by 6 years, to where it's supposed to be.

Gah! Burn the heretic!
Hexx, gas up the Pigmobile, we got a roadtrip to Ottawa!
Now where did I put the bamboo splinters and "Celine Dion sings Mettalica" cd?
Wonder if the iron maiden will fit on the roof rack....

[Hexx]

.. in fact, to give you an idea.. the L-CWLP was *7* years too early, .. no wonder it's such cheese. Meanwhile, the C8K has been moved back by 6 years, to where it's supposed to be.

Gah! Burn the heretic!
Hexx, gas up the Pigmobile, we got a roadtrip to Ottawa!
Now where did I put the bamboo splinters and "Celine Dion sings Mettalica" cd?
Wonder if the iron maiden will fit on the roof rack....

Can't we PLEASE do something meaner to him??

We have to wait SEVEN more years for the power refits?
I think the movie by the same name may contain some inspiration...



Uhmm seriously though, can someone actually tell me on any D2 server involving Lyrans and Kzin, how the Lyran empire is goig
to be around without the power refits earlier?

[likkerpig]

We have to wait SEVEN more years for the power refits?
I think the movie by the same name may contain some inspiration...

Oh ya! Loved that movie, funny as hell!
Sure, we can throw in some of that stuff too...
Lemme see... costco size can of spagetti... hammer... nails...

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

Mmmmmm... L-DBCP

[Hexx]

Mmmmmm... L-DBCP

Which 'm sure FS will now find evidence for to show that it comes out in 2299 or something...

I really must remember to do something to his poutine...

[FireSoul]

Can't we PLEASE do something meaner to him??

We have to wait SEVEN more years for the power refits?
I think the movie by the same name may contain some inspiration...



Uhmm seriously though, can someone actually tell me on any D2 server involving Lyrans and Kzin, how the Lyran empire is goig
to be around without the power refits earlier?

Sure. Practice, play better, and learn not to run away so much.

[Astarte]

.. in fact, to give you an idea.. the L-CWLP was *7* years too early, .. no wonder it's such cheese. Meanwhile, the C8K has been moved back by 6 years, to where it's supposed to be.

Gah! Burn the heretic!
Hexx, gas up the Pigmobile, we got a roadtrip to Ottawa!
Now where did I put the bamboo splinters and "Celine Dion sings Mettalica" cd?
Wonder if the iron maiden will fit on the roof rack....

Let me know when you are coming so I can put on a pot of coffee.  Something tells me it will be a long night.

[FPF-Bach]

Fed to Fed, corbo would be the only one of the above names mentioned that'd give me trouble.

Unless somebody just beamed some marines over and captured you!   

[FPF-DieHard]

Sure. Practice, play better, and learn not to run away so much.

 

[likkerpig]

[
Let me know when you are coming so I can put on a pot of coffee.  Something tells me it will be a long night.

Hate to impose, but do you have a patio or linoleum floored room we can leash Hexx in?
He's usually pretty good, but when visisting new people he gets a little excited and sometimes has an "accident".
Linoleum, vinyl or concrete cleans up so much easier...
He's a cute little water fountain though!

[Hexx]

Can't we PLEASE do something meaner to him??

We have to wait SEVEN more years for the power refits?
I think the movie by the same name may contain some inspiration...



Uhmm seriously though, can someone actually tell me on any D2 server involving Lyrans and Kzin, how the Lyran empire is goig
to be around without the power refits earlier?

Sure. Practice, play better, and learn not to run away so much.

    

Don't you think if I was planning on playing better and not running away I'd have done it by now?

[Strafer]

ROFLMAO
'pig and Hexx... East meets West somewhere in the middle!

[Mog]

.. in fact, to give you an idea.. the L-CWLP was *7* years too early, .. no wonder it's such cheese. Meanwhile, the C8K has been moved back by 6 years, to where it's supposed to be.

Gah! Burn the heretic!
Hexx, gas up the Pigmobile, we got a roadtrip to Ottawa!
Now where did I put the bamboo splinters and "Celine Dion sings Mettalica" cd?
Wonder if the iron maiden will fit on the roof rack....

Can't we PLEASE do something meaner to him??

We have to wait SEVEN more years for the power refits?
I think the movie by the same name may contain some inspiration...



Uhmm seriously though, can someone actually tell me on any D2 server involving Lyrans and Kzin, how the Lyran empire is goig
to be around without the power refits earlier?

I would hope that Firesoul has managed to reduce drone speeds to SFB spec, and that fighters would also have SFB speeds (with Warp Booster Packs appearing at SFB date, not from the get-go), else these changes may do the very thing Hexx fears.

As for the comment of practising and flying better, alll I'll say to that is bollocks.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

I agree with the Lryan concerns and think such a change might have greatly unbalancing effects.  I think this needs to be tested before any changes are made, and that none really need to be made to the detriment of the Lyran ships. 

As a Kzinti player, I don't want an unfair advantages thrown my way regardless of whether it is in accordance with a board game, whether SFB, Monopoly or chess.

[Capt Jeff]

I agree with the Lryan concerns and think such a change might have greatly unbalancing effects.  I think this needs to be tested before any changes are made, and that none really need to be made to the detriment of the Lyran ships. 

As a Kzinti player, I don't want an unfair advantages thrown my way regardless of whether it is in accordance with a board game, whether SFB, Monopoly or chess.

Exactly.

If the Lyrans two tradition enemies (Hydran, Kzinti) get benefits from the way this game works in the way of a boost in fighters and drone speeds, I see no reason to take anything that might help the Lyrans out.

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

I want my... I want my... I want my DBCP for nothin' and my gatlings for free....

[Hexx]

I want my... I want my... I want my DBCP for nothin' and my gatlings for free....

Agreed
DBCP as the starting Lyran ship across all eras would redress some of the currently seen balance issues.

[FPF-DieHard]

MAYBE the powerpacks in 2270 are too early, definately 2277 is too late IMHO.

Server admins can tweak this for whatever server they decide to use, it isn't that hard to do. 

[Laflin]

I want my... I want my... I want my DBCP for nothin' and my gatlings for free....

Agreed
DBCP as the starting Lyran ship across all eras would redress some of the currently seen balance issues.

Pshaw - you'll start out and remain in a L-CL and like it...perhaps you'll even learn something new

[Hexx]

<looks at stats for Lyran CL>
<checks Grades in such things As "Running Away" "Getting Killed"

Sorry Laflin.. nothing those ships can teach me..

And when are you coming back to show us how to kill a DNH using nothing but an FF
and a plastic fork?

(no seriously, returning anytime soon?)

[FPF-DieHard]

Actually before you get the torches and pitchforks, what Ships exactly will be affected by this?

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

Actually before you get the torches and pitchforks, what Ships exactly will be affected by this?

Everything with a 'P' on the end of it... eg. DBCP

[FPF-Paladin]

Hmm.  Seems to me ~all~ races get hit by the SFC drone speed?  All of ADBs oh so carefully balanced SFB shiplists were based on those speeds, not just a Lyran power pack.

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

Hmm.  Seems to me ~all~ races get hit by the SFC drone speed?  All of ADBs oh so carefully balanced SFB shiplists were based on those speeds, not just a Lyran power pack.

What is being referred to here, is that hexagonal tracking and linear tracking are different, and that the seeking weapons in SFC have to travel further, hence they were given a speed increase in SFC compared with their SFB counterparts. The Lyrans are traditional enemies with the Kzinti, and do not use drones or fighters themselves, so they gain nothing from this. The Lyrans have been viewed as unpopular in the past, so it is being argued here that to make them even more unpopular (even if it is for the right reasons) is not a good thing.

[Dizzy]

What tracey said.

[FPF-DieHard]

The Lyrans have been viewed as unpopular in the past, so it is being argued here that to make them even more unpopular (even if it is for the right reasons) is not a good thing.

This whole argument is bullsh*t.  Look at the Lyran shiplist, they still have plenty of good ships availble between 2270 and 2277.

Lyran have been un-popular because you can't run 1:30 hex munching misisons in their ships, never for theit lack of PvP ability.

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

The Lyrans have been viewed as unpopular in the past, so it is being argued here that to make them even more unpopular (even if it is for the right reasons) is not a good thing.

This whole argument is bullsh*t.  Look at the Lyrna shiplist, they still have plenty of good ships availble between 2270 and 2277.

That doesn't actually refute the argument.

[FPF-DieHard]

The Lyrans have been viewed as unpopular in the past, so it is being argued here that to make them even more unpopular (even if it is for the right reasons) is not a good thing.

This whole argument is bullsh*t.  Look at the Lyrna shiplist, they still have plenty of good ships availble between 2270 and 2277.

That doesn't actually refute the argument.

Yes it does.   Your argument is that the Lyrans become a chump race with the Powerpack refits set back to the SFB dates.  I'm saying this is BS because they still have plent of good ships during this time period.

The L-CF, L-CC+, L-CCH, L-JGP, and a bunch of other good ships are not affedted by this change.

[FireSoul]

Actually before you get the torches and pitchforks, what Ships exactly will be affected by this?

Everything with a 'P' on the end of it... eg. DBCP

Don't forget that phaser refits are also a 'P' refit.

[likkerpig]

Yes it does.   Your argument is that the Lyrans become a chump race with the Powerpack refits set back to the SFB dates.  I'm saying this is BS because they still have plent of good ships during this time period.

The L-CF, L-CC+, L-CCH, L-JGP, and a bunch of other good ships are not affedted by this change.

Heh, not to nitpick... ok to nitpick... the jgp doesn't belong on that list. One hit wonder, lord help you if you try saberdancing with it. CC class are ok, cf is great.
Quit derailing the thread! Leave the Lyrans alone and get back to bashing Hexx!

[FPF-DieHard]

Actually before you get the torches and pitchforks, what Ships exactly will be affected by this?

Everything with a 'P' on the end of it... eg. DBCP

Don't forget that phaser refits are also a 'P' refit.

Are the Phaser refits and the Powerpacks seperate refits?

[FPF-DieHard]

Quit derailing the thread! Leave the Lyrans alone and get back to bashing Hexx!

Isn't this great? this ALMOST turned into a "Bash DH, that cheesy DN-flying bastard!!" yet like water flowing downhill, it all comes back to Hexx 

[FPF-Paladin]

I guess I shouldn't have said anything... sorry about that.   

I understand why SFC is as is (I learned a lot about SFC from a beta tester who was very helpful in answering a lot of tactical questions I had way back then about SFB - SFC) and I don't have any issue with the hard fact that most of the time, during whatever stardate, someone is at a disadvantage.  Balance?  I'm not sure it's possible as things stand.  I try to just take the game for what it is now.  I also try to ignore the adjustments made to ships that are popular with the PvP crowd, while the ships that are really obviously broken because no one will fly them generally are passed over.

I wrote what I did (a little bitterness maybe in there too..) because I'm used to flying ships that won't fight at 31 well, or do 1:30 hex munchers...  about 99.99% of my entire D2 experience, so I don't really have too much sympathy about the extra power.  It wasn't really anything personal... I usually keep my balancing thoughts to myself.  I will say this though:  there are entire other races and ships in much worse trouble than a P refit being adjusted.

[likkerpig]

I guess I shouldn't have said anything... sorry about that.   

I understand why SFC is as is (I learned a lot about SFC from a beta tester who was very helpful in answering a lot of tactical questions I had way back then about SFB - SFC) and I don't have any issue with the hard fact that most of the time, during whatever stardate, someone is at a disadvantage.  Balance?  I'm not sure it's possible as things stand.  I try to just take the game for what it is now.  I also try to ignore the adjustments made to ships that are popular with the PvP crowd, while the ships that are really obviously broken because no one will fly them generally are passed over.

I wrote what I did (a little bitterness maybe in there too..) because I'm used to flying ships that won't fight at 31 well, or do 1:30 hex munchers...  about 99.99% of my entire D2 experience, so I don't really have too much sympathy about the extra power.  It wasn't really anything personal... I usually keep my balancing thoughts to myself.  I will say this though:  there are entire other races and ships in much worse trouble than a P refit being adjusted.

Bah! Pure Fed hyperbole! Nobody listen to him! Lyrans are underdogs and everyone else is uber, that's all you need to know!
Get back to bashing Hexx!

[Hexx]

DH you seriously must be on some really whacky meds.
Coming from a guy who's standard ship is a DNH..
Why don't you go back to the SPCA, see if you can find a date for the
evening to distract you, cause obviously you have no idea what you're talking about.

Do you really think if the Lyran ships are that great we would be forced to use
pilots like 'Pig?

Anything without a "P" on the end suxxors bigtime.
Unless it has a "T" on the end, in which case it's almost up to standard levels.

[FPF-DieHard]

DH you seriously must be on some really whacky meds.

No disputing that . . .

Coming from a guy who's standard ship is a DNH..

Comes out in 2278, by then you have your P refits

Why don't you go back to the SPCA, see if you can find a date for the
evening to distract you, cause obviously you have no idea what you're talking about.

Socierty of Precious and Cute Androrians?   I'm a founding member 

[Hexx]

DH you seriously must be on some really whacky meds.

No disputing that . . .

Coming from a guy who's standard ship is a DNH..

Comes out in 2278, by then you have your P refits

........

I really hate you..

[Ronin]

Best Fed, eh? Have the pilot you believe is best challenge TobinDax. My money is on Dax every time.

Jolan'tru

[Hexx]

Best Fed, eh? Have the pilot you believe is best challenge TobinDax. My money is on Dax every time.

Jolan'tru

Dax....Dax...

Didn't I get him killed when he was my wingman once?

[Ronin]

If I had to guess my answer would be, based on countless written commentaries here, "probably so."  ;-)

Jolan'tru...

[likkerpig]

Do you really think if the Lyran ships are that great we would be forced to use
pilots like 'Pig?

Hmm, think you mis-phrased that... if we had great ships we wouldn't need pilots like 'Pig.

Yer still dumb as a sack of hammers, needing me to correct your obvious grammeritacal errors.
Just get back in the basement, we'll bring you out when we need a figurehead or a "customer".

[FPF-Paladin]

Ok then...  I'll twist an old saying around to say in a short way what I could write for pages about.

D2 Fun is understanding an imperfect game perfectly, not wishing for the perfect game.

Opinions, to each their own, and viva la differencé.





/fed propaganda on

Of course... if we all spent our time worrying about making the game perfect, we'd all fly Federation.

/fed propanganda off




This does mean I still get to whine from time to time, right...?  Right...?  Damn.


 

[likkerpig]

This does mean I still get to whine from time to time, right...?  Right...? 
 

Only if Kroma gets ahold of you. Or you loose to Hexx. Otherwise no.

[Mog]

Drone/fighter defences:

Everyone has phasers, tractors and t-bombs, so no need to list them.

Federation: Dual purpose G racks and fighters - energy cost=0
Gorn: a small number of D rack equipped ships - energy cost=0; late on, PFs - energy cost=0
Hydrans: fighters - energy cost=0
ISC: a small number of D rack equipped ships, and fighters - energy cost=0
Klingons: AMD and fighters - energy cost=0
Kzinti: AMD and fighters - energy cost=0
Lyrans: ESG - energy cost=5, late on, PFs - energy cost=0
Romulans - as Gorn - energy cost=0

Other than PFs, every weapon on a Lyran ship requires energy to use. The Hydrans are similar except for the fact that they have attrition units from the start, not to mention their hellbore ships have the most power.

[762_XC]

Drone/fighter defences:
Hydrans: fighters - energy cost=0

Fighters are drone defense? Oh my, that's a good one.

 

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

When it comes to power management, Lyran ships are very tricky, if not perhaps the most difficult of all the races. Turning off disruptors is considered 'normal' just so you can get ESGs to charge. Very few Lyran pilots actually use their disruptors, the ships just dont have the power. Remember, a Lyran must fly fast in order to use its primary heavy weapon to have any chance of hitting an opponent with them. The only saving grace that helps a Lyran ship, fortunately, is the ESG capacitor.

[Corbomite]

When it comes to power management, Lyran ships are very tricky, if not perhaps the most difficult of all the races. Turning off disruptors is considered 'normal' just so you can get ESGs to charge. Very few Lyran pilots actually use their disruptors, the ships just dont have the power. Remember, a Lyran must fly fast in order to use its primary heavy weapon to have any chance of hitting an opponent with them. The only saving grace that helps a Lyran ship, fortunately, is the ESG capacitor.

Aaaaahhhh!! I see the problem now! Do all of you think that the ESG is the Lyran "primary heavy weapon"? Specialized or unique does not mean primary. I think I can count on one hand the times I have been hit by an ESG w/o first having been damaged and slowed down enoughby Disruptors and Phasers for the ESG to connect and finish the job and every one of them has been in team play where you can get distracted or maneuvered.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Definately agree with Corbo here.

ESGs are nice but its the dizzies and phasers that usually do it for the Lyrans.  The fear of the ESG is often a better weapon than the weapon itself IMHO, some players even use the ESG defensively  .

Against slow drones and first generation ftr races they can be used as a solely offensive weapon, but later on its dual use comes more into play.

[Mog]

Drone/fighter defences:
Hydrans: fighters - energy cost=0

Fighters are drone defense? Oh my, that's a good one.

 

If you didn't know that then I suggest you go back to school and learn to use fighters properly.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Mog,

t00l is talking about the stupidity of the fighter AI, how they seem to rather fire range 15 phg shots at an enemy than hold them from drone defense.

Rare is it that they actually help you in drone defense unless you are castling with them set on 'defend me'

[762_XC]

Drone/fighter defences:
Hydrans: fighters - energy cost=0

Fighters are drone defense? Oh my, that's a good one.

 

If you didn't know that then I suggest you go back to school and learn to use fighters properly.

You're joking!

Woe to the Hydran who relies on his fighters for drone defense.

Can they help? In the right circumstances, yes, but letting your fighters get picked off by drones is usually a formula to defeat.

[Grim]

The case of the Hydran fighters as mentioned by Bearslayer and 762 in terms of point defense is true, sometimes they work properly a lot of the time they dont due to the crappy ai.

Just relying on your fighters for point defense is suicide.

[Dizzy]

I think I can count on one hand the times I have been hit by an ESG w/o first having been damaged and slowed down enoughby Disruptors and Phasers for the ESG to connect and finish the job...

AhHa! He finally admits defeat! +1 karma

and every one of them has been in team play where you can get distracted or maneuvered.

ack! he's making excuses. -1 karma.

Net karma =0

[Corbomite]

And after I shilled for your server for free. Sheesh!

[Dizzy]

Ok, +1 karma for that. And +1 karma for that slave girl in your pic which I am telling everyone I am pimlping her to you at inflated prices.

Oops. Sorry corbo, looks like I can only do one karma change per 12 hours. You lose.

Net Karma gain = +1

[WarSears]

Drone/fighter defences:
Hydrans: fighters - energy cost=0

Fighters are drone defense? Oh my, that's a good one.

 

If you didn't know that then I suggest you go back to school and learn to use fighters properly.

You're joking!

Woe to the Hydran who relies on his fighters for drone defense.

Can they help? In the right circumstances, yes, but letting your fighters get picked off by drones is usually a formula to defeat.

Hydran fighters geting picked off by drones now thats funny.

[Mog]

Mog,



Rare is it that they actually help you in drone defense unless you are castling with them set on 'defend me'

Modus operandi from my experiiences.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

Hydran fighters geting picked off by drones now thats funny.

Well if the drone user is 1/2 decent it works, come by sometime Sears and I'll teach ya......

[FPF-DieHard]

Stop suggesting people learn tactics, it doesn't work 

[Dizzy]

Stop suggesting people learn tactics, it doesn't work 

Most of us have been playing the game for years. Is it fast approaching the old saying that 'if you dont have it you never will?'

[WarSears]

Hydran fighters geting picked off by drones now thats funny.

Well if the drone user is 1/2 decent it works, come by sometime Sears and I'll teach ya......

Some how when I was posting I knew you would jump to 762 defence oh and the crack about you teaching me how to you use drones 

Stop suggesting people learn tactics, it doesn't work 

This coming form a guy that gets to use fighters with PhG but very relay has to face them.

[Hexx]

Hydran fighters geting picked off by drones now thats funny.

Well if the drone user is 1/2 decent it works, come by sometime Sears and I'll teach ya......

Some how when I was posting I knew you would jump to 762 defence oh and the crack about you teaching me how to you use drones 

Stop suggesting people learn tactics, it doesn't work 

This coming form a guy that gets to use fighters with PhG but very relay has to face them.

As much as I hate to say it Sears has a point

I think SGO would be an excellent opportunity to test some improved Klingon Fighters with PhG's.
(If you're worried about them being ott we can just use them on Lyran Carriers)

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

oh and the crack about you teaching me how to you use drones 

Well thought it might be less painful than trying to teach you disruptors.......

<Big Snicker>

[762_XC]

Drone/fighter defences:
Hydrans: fighters - energy cost=0

Fighters are drone defense? Oh my, that's a good one.

 

If you didn't know that then I suggest you go back to school and learn to use fighters properly.

You're joking!

Woe to the Hydran who relies on his fighters for drone defense.

Can they help? In the right circumstances, yes, but letting your fighters get picked off by drones is usually a formula to defeat.

Hydran fighters geting picked off by drones now thats funny.

You can't possibly believe it's that hard.

[FPF-DieHard]

This coming form a guy that gets to use fighters with PhG but very relay has to face them.

Oh Whine me a river, do I need to show you how to fly Klink now?   

PS. what Hydran Light Cruiser is a match for a D5D?

[Mog]

This coming form a guy that gets to use fighters with PhG but very relay has to face them.

Oh Whine me a river, do I need to show you how to fly Klink now?   

PS. what Hydran Light Cruiser is a match for a D5D?

Your PS is a totally irrelevant question because D2 isn't about equal BPV matchups.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

You are right....  of course, I remember hearing a LOT of Hydran pilots on GW2 complain about losing their LB (156 BPV), LC (138), LM (150), & DG's (154) to D5D's (116)....  they would have 3, 6 ,6, & 3 fighters respectively. (costs not included in BPV totals)

I would have lost more than the one heavy I did against D5D's if it hadn't been for people new to the D2 NOT realizing that capturing was an option until they had already used all their marines on H&R's.

[FireSoul]

You are right....  of course, I remember hearing a LOT of Hydran pilots on GW2 complain about losing their LB (156 BPV), LC (138), LM (150), & DG's (154) to D5D's (116)....  they would have 3, 6 ,6, & 3 fighters respectively. (costs not included in BPV totals)

I would have lost more than the one heavy I did against D5D's if it hadn't been for people new to the D2 NOT realizing that capturing was an option until they had already used all their marines on H&R's.

Drone speeds increase the BPV of the D5D. I *think* it's 36 points more for medium speed drones (standard number of reloads), and 72 for fast. The fact SFC lets you have even more drones should count as a bit more BPV still.
.. anyways, point is that with Med speed drones, it just might be a close match-up in BPV.

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

This coming form a guy that gets to use fighters with PhG but very relay has to face them.

Oh Whine me a river, do I need to show you how to fly Klink now?   

PS. what Hydran Light Cruiser is a match for a D5D?

Your PS is a totally irrelevant question because D2 isn't about equal BPV matchups.

Actually Mog I think it is relevant,  reason being that in a light cruiser hull you shouldn't expect to be able to expect regular victories vs ships of larger hull classes on a regular basis without use of some impressive pilot skills.  When I fly a drone boat I don't normally expect to beat a BCH unless the pilot makes some seroius error.  Die Hards point being that it isn't so hard to deal with the gatling fighters of these smaller hull classes (as there are not so many of them) with a D5D, although the larger hulls may be, but that a light cruiser should have trouble with larger hulls is IMHO very valid.

Now if it come to an equal chance or a (relatively equal one) in a match facing an opponent in the same hull class and fighter and/or drones is at issue, then this is a differnt matter.  As is the case of the Lyrans vs Star Castling Hydrans.

[Corbomite]

You are right....  of course, I remember hearing a LOT of Hydran pilots on GW2 complain about losing their LB (156 BPV), LC (138), LM (150), & DG's (154) to D5D's (116)....  they would have 3, 6 ,6, & 3 fighters respectively. (costs not included in BPV totals)

I would have lost more than the one heavy I did against D5D's if it hadn't been for people new to the D2 NOT realizing that capturing was an option until they had already used all their marines on H&R's.

Hmmm, the only ship I lost to a D5D on that server was an LM that I flew horribly in an Ambush mission and my opponent had AI help. All the other fights I had ended up in them dead or running. Many of the pilots who lost ships had hardly, if ever, flown Hydran before. I remember being very shocked at the reports of downed ships on TS and thinking "how could they lose that fight?". Hydran tactics are not readily apparent. They have a strange mix of tech and philosophy that requires some time to adapt to. You Hydran regulars must surely agree or has it been so long since you started playing them you can't remember saying to yourself "what the hell am I supposed to do with this thing?"? Of all those, the DG would have the worst time against a D5D because of it's loadout and HW suite. Correct fighter deployment is critical as well as the use of OL Fusions and maybe even Suicide OL.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Actually, the DG is PREFERED b/c of the phaser suite against drones. 

6 forward arc phasers are great & even better after the + refit gives the PhG's LS/RS coverage.

Castling with overloaded hellbores did more than 1 D5D in. 

And I don't know what my problem is... I always lose one ship before I really get rolling on a server.... that was my LB in GW2.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

You are right.... of course, I remember hearing a LOT of Hydran pilots on GW2 complain about losing their LB (156 BPV), LC (138), LM (150), & DG's (154) to D5D's (116).... they would have 3, 6 ,6, & 3 fighters respectively. (costs not included in BPV totals)

I would have lost more than the one heavy I did against D5D's if it hadn't been for people new to the D2 NOT realizing that capturing was an option until they had already used all their marines on H&R's.

Drone speeds increase the BPV of the D5D. I *think* it's 36 points more for medium speed drones (standard number of reloads), and 72 for fast. The fact SFC lets you have even more drones should count as a bit more BPV still.
.. anyways, point is that with Med speed drones, it just might be a close match-up in BPV.

Yeah, the key is... can the D5D get waves of drones going after the Hydran? 

They can do this multiple times, the Hydran only needs to mess up once.

[Mog]

Seem to have drifted away from the drift away lol. No comments on my chart that shows only the Lyrans needing to use power (on top of phasers) for drone/fighter defence, in relation to a long delay on the power pack implementation?

[FPF-DieHard]

Seem to have drifted away from the drift away lol. No comments on my chart that shows only the Lyrans needing to use power (on top of phasers) for drone/fighter defence, in relation to a long delay on the power pack implementation?

I do not think anyone disputes this, at least not while sober. 

My point is the Lyrans being a "chump" race because ot the FYA for the powerpack being pushed back is not true.  Many good ships, CF, CCH, etc, are not affected by this.

[FPF-Bach]

Most of us have been playing the game for years. Is it fast approaching the old saying that 'if you dont have it you never will?'

Guess your SOL then!! 

[FireSoul]

Most of us have been playing the game for years. Is it fast approaching the old saying that 'if you dont have it you never will?'

Guess your SOL then!! 

I dunno. I learned something about PLaGs in PLaS launchers in time for GW4, and passed on that knowledge. I'm still learning.

[Mog]

Seem to have drifted away from the drift away lol. No comments on my chart that shows only the Lyrans needing to use power (on top of phasers) for drone/fighter defence, in relation to a long delay on the power pack implementation?

I do not think anyone disputes this, at least not while sober. 

My point is the Lyrans being a "chump" race because ot the FYA for the powerpack being pushed back is not true.  Many good ships, CF, CCH, etc, are not affected by this.

Heh, didn't you admit you suck at Lyran a few posts ago?

It's fairly commonly known that the preferred ships are the trimarans, because of better arcs on disruptors etc. The ones you list are catamarans, which may "look" good, , but in practice ...

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

Mog is absolutely right. The disruptors on the centre hull usually have a FX firing arc, while the outboard disruptors are only FA. Its a common tactic to turn off the outboard disruptors for extra power and speed and sabre dance with the centre ones. The L-CWLP is a classic example.

[762_XC]

For whatever MHO is worth, 77 is probably too late for that for that ship but 70 is very early to see a CW with that much power. If people are hung up on trying to get D2 perfectly balanced in every year, 73 (the year the Baron comes out) might be a good compromise year.

Just a humble suggestion.

[Mog]

762, you do realise that the D5C (out in 68) has 33 power, the I-CL (out in the year dot) has 32, to name but 2? The CWLP has 34. Huge advantage there, not!

Talking of the H-BAR, 34 power and 6 fighters 

This isn't an attempt at blackmail (more a statement of intent), but if this proposed change goes through, it will be the last nail in the coffin for me playing SFC.

[762_XC]

I realize that the CWLP reigns supreme in 2270-2272 in the war cruiser category, not that it really matters since there are bigger classes of ships to counter it. The D5C is far inferior, the ISC have never been balanced with anyone, and the BAR (WITH the fighters) is about equal when it comes out in 73.

As far as making the change, as DH pointed out, any server admin can edit YFA's as they see fit.

You don't bear this cross alone Moggy. In Firesoul's defense, OP+ has always been more about being accurate to SFB than being a panacea of D2 balance.

[Dizzy]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand, what does FS have in 3.4 for the Lyr P refits FYA? Are they any different from the past servers?

[FPF-Wanderer]

...Just finished reviewing refit dates based on official data that I now have. Klingons will be happy (K refits are as soon as 169!) Lyrans will not. (Powerpack refits aren't UNTIL 177.)

.. in fact, to give you an idea.. the L-CWLP was *7* years too early, .. no wonder it's such cheese. Meanwhile, the C8K has been moved back by 6 years, to where it's supposed to be.

Umm, Firesoul, what "official data" are you refering to?  I'm looking at Module C1, and it says the powerpack refit was standard from Y168 (2268/+5)...

*****
(R11.R5) POWER PACK:  The trimaran classes were found to extremely power deficient.  To make up for this shortage, a special power pack was designed and fielded in Y168.  This consisted of four APR power reactors and one battery.  It was hard welded to the belly of the center section of the CW and DW...Packs were;

Standard: DN, SCS, BCH, BC, CW, CWL, CWS, CWE, CWA, STJ, DW, DWL, DWS
Common: CVL, PFW, DWE, DWA
Never: LTT, CWM, DWM, CWG
*****

[FireSoul]

...Just finished reviewing refit dates based on official data that I now have. Klingons will be happy (K refits are as soon as 169!) Lyrans will not. (Powerpack refits aren't UNTIL 177.)

.. in fact, to give you an idea.. the L-CWLP was *7* years too early, .. no wonder it's such cheese. Meanwhile, the C8K has been moved back by 6 years, to where it's supposed to be.

Umm, Firesoul, what "official data" are you refering to?  I'm looking at Module C1, and it says the powerpack refit was standard from Y168 (2268/+5)...

*****
(R11.R5) POWER PACK:  The trimaran classes were found to extremely power deficient.  To make up for this shortage, a special power pack was designed and fielded in Y168.  This consisted of four APR power reactors and one battery.  It was hard welded to the belly of the center section of the CW and DW...Packs were;

Standard: DN, SCS, BCH, BC, CW, CWL, CWS, CWE, CWA, STJ, DW, DWL, DWS
Common: CVL, PFW, DWE, DWA
Never: LTT, CWM, DWM, CWG
*****

Hm. Strange. Ok. I was going to double check anyways.

[762_XC]

Cool, a flame fest over nothing. 

+ karma for FS!

[FPF-SCM_TraceyG_XC]

 

[FireSoul]

*sigh*. 

[FPF-Wanderer]

Don't sweat it, FS.  After two + years of hard work, adding gazillions of ships to the shiplist, the model work, hours upon hours of research...in short, being one of the reasons this game we all love so much is still around...I think the occasional boo-boo is inevitable, and quite forgivable.  As they say, no big whoop.  Just remember, OP+ is now the standard for SFC, I think that says it all.

Say, I was wondering...your Lyran persona, what county/clan do you hail from?  I've always found the Lyran racial background fascinating. And, have you read Heath's "TGP Forager" in the Fan Fiction forum?

[Laflin]

<looks at stats for Lyran CL>
<checks Grades in such things As "Running Away" "Getting Killed"

Sorry Laflin.. nothing those ships can teach me..

And when are you coming back to show us how to kill a DNH using nothing but an FF
and a plastic fork?

(no seriously, returning anytime soon?)

ETA sometime mid-March 2005 (crosses fingers)    I have lots and lots of rust to knock off the old hull

[FireSoul]

Don't sweat it, FS.  After two + years of hard work, adding gazillions of ships to the shiplist, the model work, hours upon hours of research...in short, being one of the reasons this game we all love so much is still around...I think the occasional boo-boo is inevitable, and quite forgivable.  As they say, no big whoop.  Just remember, OP+ is now the standard for SFC, I think that says it all.

Yeah, And to think I want to look at Mirak refits next.. ohh what a can of worms! 

Say, I was wondering...your Lyran persona, what county/clan do you hail from?  I've always found the Lyran racial background fascinating. And, have you read Heath's "TGP Forager" in the Fan Fiction forum?

I haven't really thought about a persona or any roleplay, and no I haven't followed any Fan Fiction. Lyran was the first SFB race I understood and mastered, long before any SFC matches or anything. I just wanted to continue with that..

[KBFTrajan]

2 best fed pilots would have to be

Nail and Warsears

KBF Trajan

[KAT Chuut-Ritt]

2 best fed pilots would have to be

Nail and Warsears

KBF Trajan

I'll second that motion   

+1 Karma for Trajan

[KBF-Nail]

BAstard Trajan 

[Green]

2 best fed pilots would have to be
Nail and Warsears
KBF Trajan

LOL ... great post bro.   

[WarSears]

2 best fed pilots would have to be

Nail and Warsears

KBF Trajan

Super duper Bastard Trajan