Topic: Orbiter class carrier/tug - second "make-shift" carrier (aux cva?) proposal. (Read 6885 times)

Mackie · « **on:** August 18, 2004, 11:29:33 am »

note: this has not yet been converted to sfc2

credits: desty nova
lightwave version: http://www.the-tcs.net/dldir/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=179

normal tug, nacellas shortened by nearly half. added fore and aft thingymabobs from freighter hull to the pod and also the fighter bays

any better ?

Klingon Fanatic · « **Reply #1 on:** August 18, 2004, 11:40:56 am »

Well done Mackie!

Any more non-Feds in the works?

KF

Mackie · « **Reply #2 on:** August 18, 2004, 11:44:13 am »

not too many right now, destys aliens arent very easy to bash because his such a polysaver, for example when it comes to connections between lyran hulls; remove the "box" connecting the hulls and youll find theres holes on the hulls :p

Dizzy · « **Reply #3 on:** August 18, 2004, 12:09:05 pm »

WHOOHOO!

Yeah, Baby! Yeah!

Starforce2 · « **Reply #4 on:** August 18, 2004, 04:07:15 pm »

zerosnark · « **Reply #5 on:** August 18, 2004, 04:10:15 pm »

Very nice.

A few thoughts:

Hubba hubba!

Why shorten the Nacelles?

The Dusty model of the tug has a few too many phasers. . .

Almost want a seperate shuttle bay for admin shuttles on pod. . .

May want to use Lord Schupp Tug to get an extra shuttle bay for the tug. . .

Mackie · « **Reply #6 on:** August 18, 2004, 05:39:30 pm »

1. i ment to say pylons :p
2. maybe, but this isnt a normal tug ;]
3. there is, at the end of the pod.
4. I prefer staying to one artist when bashing , most of the time anyways :]

zerosnark · « **Reply #7 on:** August 18, 2004, 06:32:02 pm »

Quote from: Mackie on August 18, 2004, 05:39:30 pm

1. i ment to say pylons :p
2. maybe, but this isnt a normal tug ;]
3. there is, at the end of the pod.
4. I prefer staying to one artist when bashing , most of the time anyways :]

Well. . .alrighty then!

I can't wait until you release this model! I think it definately has a home in my shiplist.

Arcanum · « **Reply #8 on:** August 18, 2004, 07:27:56 pm »

Very very cool . .

hmm a seperate shuttle hanger? are you thinking about a hanger specifially for Carrier Onboard Delivery(COD) type area Zero?

zerosnark · « **Reply #9 on:** August 18, 2004, 08:22:45 pm »

Quote from: Arcanum on August 18, 2004, 07:27:56 pm

Very very cool . .

hmm a seperate shuttle hanger? are you thinking about a hanger specifially for Carrier Onboard Delivery(COD) type area Zero?

Not quite. The ship featured in this thread is a standard tug with a "CVA carrier pod" attached.

In Star Fleet Battles (and SFC I suppose), the Fed Tug and Fed DD have shuttles. But from where are the shuttles launched? On the CA and DN, there are rather large and obvious shuttle bays. On the DD and tug, the warp drive controls, ships stores, AND the shuttles are all crammed into the saucer. The fed DE was particularly offensive because it carried the same number of shuttles as a Fed CA. How are all these little dudes launched?

So, along comes the modeller Lord Schupp. His models of both the Tug and Fed DD's include a shuttle bay on the dorsal connecting pod that is clearly not on the original old Franz Joseph drawings. Cool. That's where the shuttles live.

So.
The concept is that the Fed Tug shown here is the standard tug.
Logically, it should have the standard Tug shuttle bay. This combo would need shuttles just as much (probably more so!) as a standard tug carrying a cargo pod. Launch Weasels off the tug. Launch Scatterpacks off the pod.

****

As an aside: Do you know what carrier COD was originally used for? Answer: Deliivering Nuclear Weapon components to US Carrriers on deployment in the '50s. Seems that the ships did not leave the US with complete nukes on board.

*****

As another aside: COD? Yah know. . . . My thought that is in Trek small ships tend to be slower (stratigically, not tactically) than large ships.

My view on Trek tugs is that these big Warp 8 brutes are specifically designed for priority cargos that need to get somewhere quick (sometimes, that cargo would be two squadrons of bad a** fighters loaded with drones) The Fed Scouts have also been cited as being used as VIP transports. Why? Well, sometimes you just can't spare a cruiser to transport ambassadors. The klinks use the D7N. Their ambassaors want guns. Fed ambassadors. . .well. . .they get stripped destroyers.

*****

But back to the point.. . when can I start beating up some Mirak with this bad boy?

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #10 on:** August 18, 2004, 09:14:43 pm »

Cool, Mackie. Thanks for doing this for us.

I was reading the posts in the original "Lewis" thread and realised that I never uploaded this model. I too like having bashes done from one artist. I figured that I might want to get it up right away and hope that you'd use it for this. Thanks again.

Mackie · « **Reply #11 on:** August 18, 2004, 09:36:10 pm »

heres the shot of its arse end

i suppose thats a normal shuttlebay thats under the pods impulse engines?

and as for the second question, im somewhat confused, did i do things right or wrong this time? $:-\$

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #12 on:** August 18, 2004, 09:54:00 pm »

Well, I don't know about anyone else, but you did right by me man. As far as the saucer phasers go, I think that Desty might have gotten a bit lazy and just used the Connie saucer and didn't remodel the phasers.

zerosnark · « **Reply #13 on:** August 18, 2004, 10:17:41 pm »

Quote from: Mackie on August 18, 2004, 09:36:10 pm

and as for the second question, im somewhat confused, did i do things right or wrong this time? $:-\$

Well, I think you did alright as well

I don't think I have seen any other carrier tugs out there.

(Have a positive Karma on me!)

I suppose that is the normal shuttle bay on the arse end. Heh.
I have a dumb thought: Going back to SFB, was this ship capable of packing a cargo pod on the back end?

I know the Battle pod was a double weight pod, but the tug still had the capability of towing a second cargo pod in addition. Effectively, the cargo pod added added "padding" (with 30 cargo boxes) to the battle tug, but the combo jumped up to a "2" move cost and a hideous turn mode.

Was the same true of the CVA pod?
I suppose they outlawed the ugly combos of Battle pod + lightweight carrier pod? and CVA pod +light weight battle pod?
(shudder)

USS Mariner · « **Reply #14 on:** August 18, 2004, 10:31:53 pm »

I wonder if you could make TMP kitbashes this good looking......

Semi-joke. I just think that you need to practice a bit on those TMP bashes a little. They just seem...DS9TM-esque to me.

Buuuuut, while yer at it, could you make the USS HOPE NCC-H235 (http://www.inpayne.com/models/kitbash/trekpage_hope.html) using either LS or (most likley) Desty Nova ship parts? I just think that this would be neat to see as a CLH...

BTW, if you do make this, could you have a version where the nacelle has it's intercooler part facing upward, thereby having the medical stripe on both sides? I just like having Tri-nacelle ships symmertical, makes 'em more plausible (and nicer looking) to me.

Mackie · « **Reply #15 on:** August 18, 2004, 10:38:21 pm »

Quote from: Mariner Class on August 18, 2004, 10:31:53 pm

I wonder if you could make TMP kitbashes this good looking......

Semi-joke. I just think that you need to practice a bit on those TMP bashes a little. They just seem...DS9TM-esque to me.

Buuuuut, while yer at it, could you make the http://www.inpayne.com/models/kitbash/trekpage_hope.html using either LS or (most likley) Desty Nova ship parts? I just think that this would be neat to see as a CLH...

BTW, if you do make this, could you have a version where the nacelle has it's intercooler part facing upward, thereby having the medical stripe on both sides? I just like having Tri-nacelle ships symmertical, makes 'em more plausible (and nicer looking) to me.

maybe, if i can find a medical pod. and as for my tmp bashes i suppose its a thing of personal taste; I prefer them ds9 esque (and by that i mean somewhat unorthodox configurations and "upgraded parts") :p

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #16 on:** August 18, 2004, 10:44:25 pm »

OK, as long as you're fielding requests.

How about you take Desty's NCL and attach the saucer neck and pods from the Tug(s) to it and make us a LTT and LTV? (light tactical transport)

Please?

USS Mariner · « **Reply #17 on:** August 18, 2004, 10:46:12 pm »

Well that explain a heck of a lot.

Don't fret about the textures, I can do those. Just bash up the thing with a normal tug and (if mapped right, since I can't map

) I should be able to use word and paint to make some smoooooth texes. I've done it in the past, and LS's DD's have never looked better...

Uhoh, brain fart...

Could you make this too Santa?

USS TRIUMPH NCC-2191 (http://www.inpayne.com/models/kitbash/trekpage_triumph.html)

Mackie · « **Reply #18 on:** August 18, 2004, 10:51:50 pm »

Rod: which ship is NCL? i suck with those short class names :p
Mariner: yes indeed, very lovely ship , ill get onto it as soon as i can (so yes for the medic ship and yes for the triumph)

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #19 on:** August 18, 2004, 11:09:09 pm »

This one.

Link-> http://www.nightsoftware.com/starforce/SFC/Desty_Nova/Federation/FNCL.rar

Mackie · « **Reply #20 on:** August 18, 2004, 11:16:36 pm »

easy job. :p thats it for requests this time k?

im making:

1. Triumph
2. CVL tug thing
3. Hope

til the next time

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #21 on:** August 19, 2004, 12:15:41 am »

Thank you. I'll be looking forward to seeing them all.

zerosnark · « **Reply #22 on:** August 19, 2004, 07:26:48 am »

Yeah, don't get overloaded before releasing the carrier tug

Julin Eurthyr · « **Reply #23 on:** August 19, 2004, 07:38:12 am »

While you're working on tugs / tactical transports:

Could you do a 0-pod, 1 pod and 2 pod variants?

Should be farily easy once you figure out how to clone a second pod cylinder and tack it on the tail end of the first pod, with textures... Too bad I can't figure out how to make a 3-d box even...

Heck, with the second pod, you can do things like BTVs (Battle tug carriers, I'll have to check which pod has to be stuck in front), etc...

zerosnark · « **Reply #24 on:** August 19, 2004, 12:27:56 pm »

Atrahasis has 0, 1, and 2 pod varients of the standard tug.

He also has 0, 1, and 2 pod varients of a tug with Phase 2 engines (Keppler class).

Lord Schupp has the standard tug with 0, 1, and 2 pods. The primary difference with these tugs is the addition of a shuttle bay right above the Pod connector.

My personal ship list uses all three tugs.

As for the current work, CVA pods (like Battle pods) are 1 1/2 weight pods. Fed fleet tugs cannot carry two 1 1/2 weight pods. The battle pod can be paired with a single weight cargo pod. I do not know if the same is true for the CVA pods.

There is a NCL tug variant. My understanding is that these tugs cannot carry 1 1/2 weight pods. There are single weight battle and carrier pods available. Don't know if these lightweight pods can be paired.

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #25 on:** August 19, 2004, 02:09:46 pm »

I'm not sure about all of the different possible pod/tug combos. If someone wants to model a whole pack of them and needs all of the info I'll gladly assemble it.

My current shiplist (that I'm working on for GaWtm) has a full size tug carrying a battle pod and a cvl (light carrier) pod. The battle pod is the front pod. Also one with 2 carrier pods. A heavy CVA pod in front and a light CVL pod in the rear. Of course single CVA heavy carrier pod version and a single battle pod version.

The LTT, based on the NCL (new light cruiser) I have one with a CVL light carrier pod and one with a light battle pod.

Desty has only made one pod though and I don't know if it's possible/easy to create a smaller one from it. Maybe resize the whole model and then remove the now smaller pod and reattach it to the full size model? It would physically be about 70% the size of the larger pod, judging from the SSD.

I'm not sure how many tug/pod models that Mackie wants to bother with. Any would be appreciated, of course.

Mackie · « **Reply #26 on:** August 19, 2004, 02:17:55 pm »

you confuse me people :p

Kampela class light tactical transport
note: this has not yet been converted to sfc2

credits: desty nova
lightwave version: http://www.the-tcs.net/dldir/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=%20180:

Mackie · « **Reply #27 on:** August 19, 2004, 03:01:37 pm »

note: this has not yet been converted to sfc2
Attila class barrage ship

credits: desty nova
lightwave version: http://www.the-tcs.net/dldir/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=182
note 2: I know its a bit overkill but it looks l337

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #28 on:** August 19, 2004, 03:32:14 pm »

Wow! ...like'em both a lot. Using the police cutter bridge is a novel idea, as well. The LTT (cl based tug) is another long over due welcome addition.

Wondering what the hold up is though on converting them to SFC? I want to plug them in, man! Are you "getting in touch with your feminine side" and just teasing us, or what?

FoaS_XC · « **Reply #29 on:** August 19, 2004, 04:01:22 pm »

Mackie would you mind if i made these again, only this time out of Lord Schtupps model.

Mackie · « **Reply #30 on:** August 19, 2004, 05:03:25 pm »

normally i wouldnt but i intent to try that my self so no but thanks for the offer (but im not there to stop if you really want to )

zerosnark · « **Reply #31 on:** August 19, 2004, 05:20:32 pm »

Yeah, this is a cool bunch of models. Too bad they have not been converted yet.

A few comments on the LTT:
a) Three LS phaser mounts? wow. I guess I have not looked at the SSD lately
b) The ship name should not appear on the pod. The pods are interchangable between ships.

The picture of the Cutter barge got me thinking about tugs in general. . .
. . .I understand the cruiser size engines on the tug. What is bizzare is the cruiser/DD size saucer. Considering the phaser firepower and lab space of these ships, I suspect starfleet had an ulterior motive in building these ships and that they are really used for patrol work and system survey work in addition to "self escorting convoys".

Mackie · « **Reply #32 on:** August 19, 2004, 05:55:29 pm »

I wasnt sure on what i should write on the pod ;p
as for the phasers and such, thats what came with the model

and the Attila class, The "pod" is not actually a "pod" but a lengthened arse end of the original model where i removed windows from

Julin Eurthyr · « **Reply #33 on:** August 19, 2004, 05:57:27 pm »

From R2.8, Fed Tug:

Can carry one or twp pods; one but not both can be a "double weight" pod. If there is a double weight pod, it must be in front.

If a Light battle pod is in the rear position, all systems on the pod are treated as cargo. Battle Pods cannot be the rear pod in a pair as it is double weight, and forced into the front slot...

From the LTT's description:
Can only carry one pod, but it can be a double-weight pod.

Pod weights:
Starliner, Cargo, Repair, Troop Transport, Self Defense, Light Carrier (CVL), Light Battle are 1-weight pods
Battle, Carrier (CVA) are 2-weight pods (and therefore only in front)

So, believing that the only pods really in need of separate textures are the battle and carrier pods (Starliner pod needs more windows but is rarely used, Troop Transport, Repair, Cargo, Self Defense are probably stock pod hulls), the paired combinations on the main tug are:

CVA / CVL
CVA / Stock
Battle / CVL
Battle / Stock
Stock / CVL
Stock / Stock

The LTT would need a Stock, Battle and CVA / CVL pod, no combinations allowed...

Just some friendly information for the tug-builders out there...

zerosnark · « **Reply #34 on:** August 19, 2004, 07:22:22 pm »

From, the Star Fleet Technical Manual (1975 edition!)

Pod types include:
Mk I Bulk Liquids
Mk II Dry bulk
Mk III Refers
Mk IV Personnel
Mk V Products

Markings are a pendant at the bow, with red strip running along the length. The strip is broken up by the words "Star Fleet Transport Command", about the size of the NCC numbers on the ship.

Underneath the words "Star Fleet Transport Command", right justified, and in the same size, is the NCC number. The NCC number is four digit and unique (presumably) to the pod.

*****

All this aside, thanks for posting the rules on the pods!
I agree that the modeling community only needs to do a Battle pod, Cargo pod, and Carrier pod.

*****

As another aside: I think the Starliner pod would be more common than you think. I could imagine this would be a key way to move PEOPLE from one colony to another. I surmise the Fed Tugs would be just about the fastest ships in space. Why would you take a Warp 4 freighter when you could take a Warp 8 Tug?

For transporting ambassadors, I think it is clear that the Fed Scouts are used for this role. But for Admirals who need flagships: A starliner pod might do nicely.

(Of course. . .in SFB you just add two flag boxes and four phasers to a cruiser to create a flagship. . .in the US navy, you tend to take out half the weapons to fit in the command spaces)

atheorhaven · « **Reply #35 on:** August 21, 2004, 03:28:21 pm »

Quote from: zerosnark on August 19, 2004, 05:20:32 pm

Yeah, this is a cool bunch of models. Too bad they have not been converted yet.

I've downloaded all of them, just have to convert them. Will use converting them over to break up my evening.

Mackie · « **Reply #36 on:** August 21, 2004, 04:01:42 pm »

sehr gut! HEIL ATHEORHAVEN!

zerosnark · « **Reply #37 on:** August 21, 2004, 05:13:24 pm »

EXCELLENT!

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #38 on:** August 21, 2004, 09:14:44 pm »

Both Mackie and Atheorhaven get a Karma bump.

Thanks guys.

Mackie · « **Reply #39 on:** August 23, 2004, 02:49:36 pm »

Quote from: Furyofaseraph on August 19, 2004, 04:01:22 pm

Mackie would you mind if i made these again, only this time out of Lord Schtupps model.

re reply :p
few days after tinkering around with models ive come to the conclusion that im overally way too lazy to remake the models so on the second though, you go ahead :p

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #40 on:** August 26, 2004, 05:04:10 pm »

Bump

for news on the conversions.

atheorhaven · « **Reply #41 on:** August 26, 2004, 08:52:03 pm »

Quote from: Rod ONeal on August 26, 2004, 05:04:10 pm

Bump for news on the conversions.

Completed conversions to be uploaded later on tonight..

Alamo

Lewis

Orbiter

Pogues

To be completed.. Attila and Juster.. probably more by now.

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #42 on:** August 26, 2004, 10:12:44 pm »

Thanks!

Mackie · « **Reply #43 on:** August 26, 2004, 11:19:28 pm »

quite l337, I say. thanks yet again m8

Mackie · « **Reply #44 on:** August 27, 2004, 06:39:18 am »

right now i seee pogues and alamo in my ftp folder and a piece of some other broken zip, keep uploading alec

atheorhaven · « **Reply #45 on:** August 27, 2004, 06:31:18 pm »

Quote from: Mackie on August 27, 2004, 06:39:18 am

right now i seee pogues and alamo in my ftp folder and a piece of some other broken zip, keep uploading alec

Done and there..

Rod ONeal · « **Reply #46 on:** August 27, 2004, 08:10:40 pm »

Thanks again, men. These models get a BIG welcome to my models folder.

FireSoul · « **Reply #47 on:** August 29, 2004, 12:54:55 pm »

So, uh.. can someone let me know when the tugs are ported to SFC2?

atheorhaven · « **Reply #48 on:** August 29, 2004, 02:38:08 pm »

Quote from: FireSoul on August 29, 2004, 12:54:55 pm

So, uh.. can someone let me know when the tugs are ported to SFC2?

The Lewis and Orbiter are done and up at Mackie's..

Mackie · « **Reply #49 on:** August 29, 2004, 02:48:33 pm »

i just forgot to mention about it here ;p hteres another thread in this forum

News:

Topic: Orbiter class carrier/tug - second "make-shift" carrier (aux cva?) proposal. (Read 6885 times) var addthis_config = {"data_track_clickback":true};

Topic: Orbiter class carrier/tug - second "make-shift" carrier (aux cva?) proposal. (Read 6885 times)