Topic: UFP-1 Starfleet One released

[AgentSloan]

USS Galayx Class
http://www.stguardian.to/fed/galaxy/

"Death of the USS Odyssey"



BOOM.

[Chris Johnson]

*ahem* I sort-of revised my last post to contain more stuff.  You tried stating that the Sovereign-class was canonical and got the impression I deemed it unofficial despite otherwise.  I'm saying it was a fanboy ship.  I didn't say it was uncanonical.  There are fanboy ships that are canonical in Trek.  The Delta Flyer was almost a hot rod herself:

"We are not building a 24th-century hot rod." -- Tuvok

However, as I said, lets get back on topic, to the main discussion Don.  As I said, I updated my last post.

(Before we go on, I'd like to say thanks for the link, I never knew about the original plans of an NCC-1701-E Galaxy-class U.S.S. Enterprise before decided a new ship was going to take its place, if that was what happened. )

[Chris Johnson]

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schematics/starfleet_ships1.htm

Scroll down to the Galaxy-class section of the page.  If I interpreted your post correctly, you were close, if not spot on.

[Centurus]

I know I am the one to blame for this whole out of control discussion.  A month or so ago someone had posted in another thread the link and some pics of another Titan class.  It was a kitbash die-cast model.  I went to the site, and started looking around all the different ships, and then came across the President's Ship, and then posted the link in a new thread seeing if anyone would be willing to do the ship, which was just a simple retexture of the Galaxy class, but Fury decided to try it out on a Sovereign.  Either way, it was beautifully done.  I didn't expect the whole thing to turn out into a debate as to whether or not a ship was a fanboy ship or not.  Too bad we just can't have a retexture of every single class of ship to bear the name Enterprise, that way people can choose which ship they think should be the President's Ship.  Fury, if you're reading this, you think you'd be willing to take on a project like this?  I ask you because you did such a beautiful job in retexturing the Sovereign.  I know someone else made a MkII Connie retexture for the President's Ship, but unfortunately I can't use it cause I don't have the software or the skills necessary to convert it to SFC3.  To those of you that were discussing the validity of the Sovereign as a potential candidate for the President's Ship, I do not wish to come off as angry or disrespectful.  I just didn't think that something like this would flare up so much. 

[Chris Johnson]

No, I should take blame.  Now, I think the Sovereign alone is an okay design given Berman's modifications to Gene's own ST Galaxy, and new technology setting fourth in one area or two finally (I wonder if we'd be stuck with Phasers and Photon Torpedoes for the rest of the Federation's existance actually).  I just thought of the Sovereign to be a ship of battle more, for eye-candy yes, but nonetheless an accepted ship of battle.  I never thought of mixing up a Sovereign with gold and blue and other UFP colors to indicate it as a ship for the UFP's President.  It seemed too much to me like a fanboy seeking grandeur fantasies of starship combat finally got the highest power in the UFP to do such. 
I tried reasoning, "Why a Sovereign-class?  Although a Galaxy-class Starship can hold her own very well compared to other ships in her early time, it also was designed for diplomatic relations and deep-space exploration in mind."

I felt it better that a Galaxy-class would be better suited for a ship for the UFP President seeking peace in the Galaxy, not seeking a fight.  Of course people have their disagreements and opinions.  Sometimes its nice to discuss something useless and make it feel productive and enjoyable.  That's why I actually think it was a good thing Don showed up.  Lets just try to keep the hostility down. 

Down to the point: I believe it to be my fault.  I always have a bad habit of instinctually adding my two cents in without truely thinking 100% correctly.  But not to say that all this is entirely bad... As long as hostility is kept to a minimum and there's an interest of discussing this someplace, I think it would all be fine.

[battlestar001]

The sovvy is offically a deep space explorer. Unoffically a battleship. During the dominion war starfleet built the Galaxy insted because it was a proven design. I doubt that there would be only 12 galaxys spread out  between 80 000 light years. There would have to be a lot more galaxy classes in production. Soverigen was designed with the borg in mind so was intended to battle them along with the defiant and the arika. The sovvy is less a fan boy ship and more like a work of art

[Chris Johnson]

I've stopped blindly going to official stuff when Akiraprise showed up. *sigh*

Both the Galaxy-class and Sovereign-class starships are works of art.  With more people nowadays trashing the Galaxy-class because of its looks, I keep looking at the Sovereign-class, a popular design as most see it as.  Being as short as a Constitution-class, longer than a Galaxy-class, and armed to the teeth with big starbase phasers (People keep telling me Type XII phasers are starbase phasers...), big and bulky warp engines that take you to the insane Warp 9.99 speed, blue "Quantum" torpedoes (Aren't they just big m/am warheads like Photons anyway?)... I absolutely have no idea how to describe it.

In love, there is the outer beauty for physical attraction, and inner-beauty for the emotional attraction, something much stronger.  Using this analogy, I find that a Galaxy-class has more inner-beauty than the Sovereign ever has.  Firstly, the Sovereign is just a hot rod as I keep saying.  Quote: "We have the 'cadillacs' of starships; I wanted a porsche." -- John Eaves
In the Galaxy-class, there's her own unique outer-beauty, escaping from the TOS's conventional way of circular saucers, cylindrical hulls and warp nacelles.  And for its size, has more compact warp nacelles!  Emphasizing that, yes people, technology will continue to get smaller.  Aside from the Defiant-class--an oversized pseudofighter with battlecruiser firepower--The closest thing I found to such was the Intrepid-class, carrying similar traces of the Galaxy-class design while being unique on her own, especially when you consider the fact that those little pair of engines can make the Intrepid-class go almost as fast as the Sovereign can!
There's also the inner-beauty of the Galaxy-class.  Inside you see a community, a small city at work, normally peaceful and explorative.  Oh sure, she's armed pretty well, but keep in mind, she's built for deep-space exploration and peaceful diplomatic relations when coming into first contact with new species, new governments.
The Sovereign-class is one step back, inner and outer-beauty.  It's main purpose is to be armed to the teeth, and to look cool while fighting her enemies, the first one being the Borg, and last being that Reman whatchamacallit that could easily pulverize the Sovereign-class.  It has Photon and Quantum launchers all over it like pimples in your face at puberty, must have a lot of torpedoes for that!  Big starbase phasers, huge Enterprise-B-esque impulse engines that makes her turn on a dime better than her Gaalxy-class "counterpart," and a Captain's yacht that looked like Ford built it with Firestone Shuttlecraft engines!

I never thought of Starfleet as a big military full of cool-looking Porsches and Cadillacs with your everyday Honda and Toyota cruisers of the 2360s hauling butts from one starbase to another.  John Eaves made a mistake to go for a cool-looking ship.  In real life, I wouldn't view it much that way.  Cooler starship means more audience, more money.  Akiraprise is a "cooler" design than the more historically-consistant Daedelus-class.  Cooler ships means better ratings meaning more money.  Berman has his share of profit from cool ships.  The Sovereign-class certainly looks cool.  Just, cool.  If people really appreciated what Star Trek was all about, we wouldn't have many of these ships; as in no Defiant-class, no Sovereign-class, no Prometheus, no Steamrunner, etc.  We'd still have our New Orelans-class starships, our Galaxy-class, our Nebula-class (we still do amazingly enough), etc.  And that would mean lower ratings in the real world, and possibly less chances for games.  So we should be thankful for profit.

Canonical-wise, why would starfleet waste a bunch of resources on a whole lot of newer class of starships in favor for a "fleet makeover"?  Almost every class of Starship seen in the 2360s, aside from the Galaxy-class, Nebula-class, Miranda-class, and Excelsior-class, had been replaced with a ship equivalent or more powerful than their own.  Couldn't they just spend more resources on upgrading rather than scrapping and rebuilding?

Aieee... *sigh* This is why I should knock myself back a hundred years into the prime of Star Trek's past and be happy with my Constitution-class and Excelsior-class ships, and so on...

I may not have expressed my opinion in full; in the way I wanted to, but I gave it my best shot.  I just hope I didn't insult anyone, that's not my intention.

[battlestar001]

The galaxy class is in a league of her own. But for a very large spacefaring race to stop designing new ship classes would be bad. as newer technology come out not all classes of ship will be able to begraded to hold it so designers would have to design new ships that can be built with this new technology that also would be able to be upgraded with newer technology. Also as the federation is expanding , more ships, newer ship and faster capital ships would be needed. The sovvy is kinda like a hot rod.  but in saying that what about the intrepid class? she has some design simulartys with the soverigen. She has no neck and is slimar to the soverigen.

[Chris Johnson]

Keep in mind; The Sovereign-class was made in 1996.  The Intrepid in 1995.

Although you hold up a point, what about the rest of the technology on ships that had been only in service for a few years?  The Intrepid's been out for five or seven, why not develop a class to replace it?  If we go by the "logic" of always desigining a new class of starship to replace another that was recently out with new technology herself, would you honestly think resources are put into good use?

[battlestar001]

Found these date for ship lornchers.


Promeathus - 2375
soveriegn - 2372
Nova - 2370 (Estamate)
Defiant - 2370
Intrepid - 2370
Akira - 2365 (Estamate)
Streamrunner - 2365
Galaxy - 2360
Nebula - 2357 (Estamate)
Ambasador - 2330 (Estamate)
Centuar - 2330 (Estamate)
Constutation - 2284 (Estamate)
Excelsior - 2284
Oberth -2270 (Estamate)
Miranda - 2260 (Estamate)
Constition -2245
Deladious - 2155
NX - 2151

[Chris Johnson]

That book is not really canonical, is it?  Especially when some information for it is wrong, such as the Constitution-class (refit) data.  The Enterprise was called in for a refit at some point in 2270, and for one and a half years was upgraded to the latest tech.  The lone fact that they had the commision date wrong for the refitted Constitution-class's commision tells me that the book you are referencing can't be trusted as truely canonical, even if it is made by paramount.  It is also contradictory to it's online database where here it states, and I quote: "The starship underwent several refits, most notably in 2270, involving an upgrade of most systems and the replacement of the bridge and warp-drive nacelles."

Also, the sypnosis for Star Trek: The Motion Picture states it takes place in 2271.  We do not see an original series Constitution-class in that movie; the Big E was refitted.  Therefore, the commision is at 2270 or 2271, contradictory to your book.  Therefore, I don't really think it is a reliable resource.

No offense intended, but I really knew that 2273 was a wrong date, and figured to note that out.

[Chris Johnson]

I'm still clueless as to why a whole fleet to replace another quickly and miraculously... Especially when that fleet is only a few years old at best.  I mean, not much is known about class starships like the Cheyenne-class or New Orelans-class, or Challenger or even Niagra-class.  Why not send one of these class of starships out to battle instead of an outdated Miranda or Excelsior-class starship?  Why waste resources for a class of starship almost doomed to be mothballed? (Excelsior-class for example; The Lakota was heavily upgraded.) In the end, Starfleet might be more reckless than Kirk is on his Starship tactics.  I doubt that all those class of ships that look like they belong in the Galaxy-class design lineage (that were in the battle at Wolf 359 most notably) were decommisioned at the same time so soon in its service.

[battlestar001]

well the date when the refit became standered design may have been 2373 but whatt about the others that were upgraded?

[battlestar001]

ah but as  space faring races get older there ships will start looking tmore like 'hot rods'. Would u drive a car from the early 20th centuary that looks like a brick?

[battlestar001]

yeager, yuck

[Chris Johnson]

Although we've made some good points--all of us--I think we should go back to the original topic of discussion before we continue veering off-course; About which ship is best suited for the President of the UFP and why.

[Centurus]

Although we've made some good points--all of us--I think we should go back to the original topic of discussion before we continue veering off-course; About which ship is best suited for the President of the UFP and why.

Isn't this how this whole topic started to veer off-course?  Oh well.  Anyone attempt taking a crack at retexturing other classes as the UFP President?

[battlestar001]

easy, the most advanced ship class in the fleet.

[Core]

or the bigest ship with the latest word in tech even if it is prototype or experimental

[Chris Johnson]

In otherwords, the warship Prometheus?

I'm sorry, but it's rediculous.  It's just a big ship of war.  Why would the president want to get himself killed in a war?