Topic: What do I have to do to sell this...? (Read 5802 times)

Lepton · « **Reply #20 on:** August 04, 2004, 10:27:28 pm »

Head of steam?? More like a fart with a little sh** in it. It just makes them look and smell bad.

Corbomite · « **Reply #21 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:33:12 am »

Quote from: Lepton on August 04, 2004, 10:27:28 pm

Head of steam?? More like a fart with a little sh** in it. It just makes them look and smell bad.

Says the guy with the -31 Karma.

I don't know what I did to deserve this cheap shot as I was very civil in my response to your ignorant mumbling. So be it. You got what you wanted. You've made an enemy. Next time I'll just sh*t in your face instead.

Lepton · « **Reply #22 on:** August 05, 2004, 06:41:34 pm »

Lordy, so touchy. It's a bit of scatological humor. Get over it.

Corbomite · « **Reply #23 on:** August 05, 2004, 07:55:10 pm »

Now who can't recognize a joke? You can be quite sure I don't give a rat's ass about what you say or think.

Ronin · « **Reply #24 on:** August 05, 2004, 09:27:33 pm »

Quote from: KHH Jakle on August 03, 2004, 09:20:22 pm

I don't know, but I am earnestly looking for input from everyone here as to what set up would make participating in some organized GSA play worthwhile.

While I can not speak for everyone, I can't help feeling that some sort of strategic element would be helpful if your goal is to bring D2 players into the GZ realm. While the "live or die" aspect of GZ play is a rush, and the challenge (in terms of tactics) formidable and enjoyable, something beyond a weekly battle for a "win" might be helpful in luring D2 players to try your offering.

Do I recall that GZ was once discussing a system that incorporated spies and a realm of intellectual and "non-combat" activities that would work in conjunction with their league? A system which, like the D2, has the potential to put the group who used their brainpower best in the winners circle? Something like that would interest me. But if it was merely discussed and dropped I would certainly understand a reluctance on your part to spend a lot of time and effort on something that might bring D2 pilots to your league.

I wish I could offer more in the way of constructive ideas on what would accomplish what you seek. I offer these thoughts for what they are worth with hope that it may be of some help.

Respects and kind regards...

KHH Jakle · « **Reply #25 on:** August 06, 2004, 08:15:35 am »

That is a great idea. Unfortunately, we are limited by what can be done with existing code/framework in the short term. Long Term....well, the crystal ball is hazy.

Kel posted and interesting comment on our boards: we are having a discussion about setting up a companion divisional league that is a bit more...recreational (same format, but a bit looser on the match completion timelines).

This league would have what you guys generically call 'CnC' built in. GZ has developed a set of SFB based ship selection criteria called 'Patrol Battle Rules' (PBR) which is very popular with the GDA bunch.

In addition to eliminating what some might consider 'cheese' combos, it also adds a great deal of depth and thought to each game, as each side has to is tested to come up with the best available combo (subject to the confines of PBR) as well as has the skill to get the most out of non-supercharged 'line' ships.

is that attractive?

FPF-DieHard · « **Reply #26 on:** August 06, 2004, 10:39:34 am »

My fleet is interested but I have my reservations after reading many of the after action reports.

I would like a GZ league to be more like "Stock Car Racing," I want pilot skill, not who can develop the cheesiest fleet, to determine who wins or looses.

Is PBR mandatory in the next cycle? If yes, count me in. If no, I'll wait until that happens.

I like the SFC battle forces you have on your website and would love to see a league that only uses them.

KHH Jakle · « **Reply #27 on:** August 06, 2004, 11:20:46 am »

Stay tuned then...cause I am working on the PBR league. It's just a matter of numbers. I need 8 teams. So far, I have 3 completely viable teams: KHH, FSD, GDA. There's another 3-4 on the fence (either not sure if they are still viable, or not sure about PBR).

So, if you can bring a team with you....that's a big net gain.

As for your After Action Report comment: your right, this last cycle has seen an increase in rancor between teams that have widely differeing views of what the game should be. Within the GZ communti, you have the anything goes crowd, and the PBR crowd. That, along with some unnecessary roughness so to speak has brought in an unsavory element to the league. I honestly feel like the PBR crowd is overall much more fun bunch....

Battle Forces: totally agree. Optimumly, it would be excellent to move from TBPV games to Battle Force games. The stumbling block there is each race needs some one who both understands PBR and knows their race to develop competetive Battle Forces. I wrote all the ones on my website, and I received commentary from those that know those races that said "that's not what I would have put together" - and that's WITH PBR in place. So I don't have the skill set to design Battle Forces across the full spectrum. When it comes down to it, I only know Klink.

So it would take continued development. Getting the PBR League in place would probably be a leap in that direction.

FPF-DieHard · « **Reply #28 on:** August 06, 2004, 11:38:51 am »

Count me in for a PBR league. I suggest making battleforces an option.

PS, your Federation ones were pretty damn good for someboby who only know Klingon.

GDA-Kel · « **Reply #29 on:** August 06, 2004, 12:12:05 pm »

Quote from: Mog on August 04, 2004, 02:00:43 pm

As I said in my previous post, really the only things stopping me from joining up are time zones and not being in any group or fleet. I don't understand your final paragraph.

I wouldn't worry too much about timezone differences for you or Cleaven. We (the GDA) have flown matches starting at 9 AM (EST) on a Saturday to starting as late as 10 PM (EST) on a weekday. Most fleets are also equally accomodating regarding scheduling.

As far as fleets go, we could always use another experienced 'Bruce,' if you're so inclined

Of course, you could always try and put your own team together. The term 'fleet' is a bit too official for this structure. You really only need 3-5 guys and a method of staying in relatively close contact with each other. Jakle is correct in that you need one guy to remain 'engaged' to facilitate scheduling matches and rounding up your 3 man team.

A Rom fleet would be a nice addition.....

Mog · « **Reply #30 on:** August 06, 2004, 12:35:16 pm »

Ah Kel, i should have added, weekends are usually out for me wrt SFC playing, leaving weekdays from 1pm EST to 6pm EST.

KHH Jakle · « **Reply #31 on:** August 08, 2004, 08:14:50 pm »

http://gzleagues.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=84

I set up a seperate forum for PBR League discussions.

Thanks FPF for pinging our main forum. Please monitor the PBR forum (link above) for news

FPF-DieHard · « **Reply #32 on:** August 09, 2004, 09:51:07 am »

Quote from: KHH Jakle on August 08, 2004, 08:14:50 pm

http://gzleagues.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=84

I set up a seperate forum for PBR League discussions.

Thanks FPF for pinging our main forum. Please monitor the PBR forum (link above) for news

Wating for a reply in the fleet forum, we may be a go on the PBR league.

KHH Jakle · « **Reply #33 on:** August 09, 2004, 11:47:56 am »

Awesome. I anxiously await the asnwer...

Corbomite · « **Reply #34 on:** August 09, 2004, 08:43:12 pm »

Jackle,

Since the ISC get and extra bonus (paid for in BPV) of being able to fire more I-Torps than SFB I would limit all ISC fleets to one ship with PPD (1 - 4). Otherwise it looks good to me.

KHH Jakle · « **Reply #35 on:** August 10, 2004, 07:34:41 am »

Interesting....

I think when I first looked at it, in 90% of the cases - that's exactly how it works out (only one PPD armed ship). But that might have also been a factor of the TBPV limits we were acting under when it was first drafted

In other words, with the highest possible TBPV, if you bought a CC or a DN, there wouldn't be enough BPV left for the other 2 ships to also get a CA. Of course, I believe there is another ship - the CM? - that was a PPD test bed.

Anyway - I'll take a look. Thanks!

Corbomite · « **Reply #36 on:** August 10, 2004, 09:32:30 am »

What I'm worried about is misunderstandings in situations like this:

There are two CL hulls with PPD for the ISC - The CSP(Z) line and the CMP(Z) line. The Strike cruisers have 2 PPD and the Medium Cruisers one PPD.

Now the confusion starts one which ship is considered the leader. The ISC doesn't have traditional Command Variants like other races and the disticntion here is a little blured as to what the determining ship will be. Their weapons suites are comparable (1 PPD and 2 G-Torps vs 2 PPD's, the rest is the same), but one is labeled a Medium Cruiser. Does that make it "bigger" than a Strike Cruiser of the same hull class?

If it does there is no problem if I read your rules right. There can't be a Strike Cruiser wing to a Medium Cruiser because of the one PPD slot (I read that as one PPD only, not one PPD ship). If the Strike Cruiser can be designated leader then we have a problem.

KHH Jakle · « **Reply #37 on:** August 10, 2004, 10:13:59 am »

I see what you are saying...

What it seems like is that in this specific situation, there is room for debate on which one is the 'Lead' - based on how I defined it.

I'd like to see if there is a way to fix that without locking them into only one PPD armed ship.

Evil Kraven · « **Reply #38 on:** August 10, 2004, 10:58:41 am »

hmmmm, I would think the ships you speak of, would be under a command varient. does ISC have a support ship?nI would think they would have some ppd supporting ships. so it would be kind of difficult to restrict it.

but I don't see a multiple PPD ships being together (faceing like 6 or more ppd's should'nt happen). also any carriers would need escorts. that tones done the use of strike carriers I would think.

JMHO

"The Evil One"
Kraven

KHH Jakle · « **Reply #39 on:** August 10, 2004, 11:17:32 am »

It's a Strike Cruiser Krav - not a Strike Carrier. So the Carrier/Escorts rule doesn't come into play

Those two ships aren't command variants - so that one doesn't come into play either.

All races have Combat Support ships - but neither of these ships fit that bill.

No - these are just line ships that happen to make a muddle of the PPD Deployment rule. I need to fix that. I'll probably need to make several tweaks prior to the PBR League Cycle kick off. I kinda laid off on updates a couple months ago.

You are right though - no matter what, in a 3 ship squadron, no way the PPD's could exceed 5 (much less 6).

Corbo - did you look at the Matrix at all? Any recommendations on making that more user friendly as a reference tool?

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Topic: What do I have to do to sell this...? (Read 5802 times)