Topic: OK You Computers <gaming> Gurus..

[Hexx]

I think it's time I built a new system (parts of this one are many years old- and Doom3 is coming out...)

Anyways I know I've dazzled most of you with my intricate understandings in how computers work over the years but now I'm stumped..

Chipset-  I'm thinking an Athlon 64 something something.. an ideas on what processor I should grab? I've always had an AMD chip and never had any problems with it. I'm assuming AMD still offers comparable performance to the intel at a cheaper price- let me know if I'm wrong


Graphics Card - Here's the big one, 6800 Ultra or X800XT thingy? From the stuff I've read Im leaning towards the X800XT - the problem is I really didn't understand anything that I read. Basically I *think* the  6800 needs alot more power to do roughly the same thing and I'll have to spend more to put a better power source in.
-Other thing is- I'm in Canada, o the East Coast, haven't seen to many (well any actually) of either of these listed. I'm assuming it's going to cost ALOT of money to upgrade to one.  If I go with one of the "older" 9800XT or 9600XT (or whatver the numbers are for the latset ones before the X800XT came out) will it still be OK for a bit?
I'm running a Geoforce 3 Ti 200 with 128 megs of ram atm -am I going to notice tht big a difference?

And finally -what's up with "liquid cooling" _ Do I need this? are fans not good enough anymore?

The rest of the system I think I can handle (not replacing the monitor yet -it's about 7 or 8 years old but still seems to work OK) and the rest of the system will be built around the CPU and the Graphics card.

-And don't worry about finding prices for me (I know some of you do it) there's not a chance I cxan put this together myself so I'll be buying it a t whatver local shop I can find in Halifax that seems to be decent.

Thanks for any advice you can provide.

[benbean]

I'm looking at doing the same thing Hexx.

So far I have decided on a AMD 3200+ XP CPU (£130 GBP)

K7N2 Delta-ILSR motherboard. http://www.msicomputer.co.uk/products.aspx?product_id=703422 (£65 GBP)

Sapphire ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB DDR AGP +DVI +TV Out Retail. http://www.sapphiretech.com/vga/9800proatl.asp (£140 GBP)

Add 1GB performance DDR 400 RAM approx £150 - £200

Thats the next machine I intend to build. This should do me for the next couple of years, by then the 64bit CPU's, new motherboards for PCI Express and the new PCI Express graphics cards should be more affordable.

[Bonk]

I reccommend you have a chat (or two ) with the people here:
http://www.k-pcltee.com/   (quality and knowledge)
or
http://www.cellarcomputers.com/ (selection)
Before you go to the futureshop or something.

I've been building cheapy frankenstein servers lately so I'm not up on the latest gaming PC's but if I were to build one for myself I'd go with:
Asus P4 Mainboard
Intel P4 2.8 GHz /800
512-1024MB RAM
Matrox Parhelia
200 GB WD HDD
A quality power supply and case, an extra chassis fan... the rest can be disposable components, but that'd be what I want..

There are plenty of cheapy, premounted AMD processors on a generic mainboard that will probably smoke your current system for cheap...

The latest games will always require a 6-700 dollar video card to get all the features and you'll be lucky if there's no issues. Myself, I like to stay a year or two behind and never pay more than 250 for video.

Liquid cooling: if you want the gee-whiz effect yeah, get some neon to go with it... I can see its use in audio applications where the reduced noise level is required but I can't see using it just so you can overclock a cheap processor and burn it out faster... extra chassis fans are good for me - noisy but cheap.

[FVA_C_ Blade_ XC]

I would go with a PCI Express board and a AMD64fx chip.

[KBF-Nail]

Check this place out Hexx   www.outpost.com


But yes I have never had any problems with Athalons either. Works great.

[Capt_Bearslayer_XC]

Another place to find great prices is price watch

I got some excellent deals on this site.

[drb]

Hoi Hexx,

 I have to agree with Bonk; k-pc ltee. is the place to go for service. I bought a nice system there before moving up to Toronto. Prior to buying an entire $3,500 system at his shop I always called his shop for advice in many matters for years as I tried to keep my "futureshop blue light special of the week" up to date through endless upgrades and tweeks. Their service and product knowledge is second to none, even if you do not buy anything at K-P's, calling the store would be well worth it, again, great staff.
 As you are in Halifax head on down to Blowers Street PaperChase for a Iqbal's samosa, don't forget the chutney! Next, go to the LC, a case of Clancy's, Moose Red, and a quart of rye.  Get Bonk to make ready with a canoe, paddle to McNab's Island in a gale, get wwrreaked on the beach and eat samosas and blueberries for days.
  I better stop before I  hop on a plane.

Enjoy Halifax Hexx, you lucky bast****

drb

[Lepton]

I have to agree with the PCI express recommendation.   There is no sense in buyinq non-PCI express motherboard unless you like throwing money away.  If you haven't got the money to drop on a PCI express-based system, then I'd just wait until you can.

[kbf-jd]

I have to agree with the PCI express recommendation.   There is no sense in buyinq non-PCI express motherboard unless you like throwing money away.  If you haven't got the money to drop on a PCI express-based system, then I'd just wait until you can.

Well that depends.  I do like the IDEA of getting PCI Express, that would make it a VERY Expensive system.

I don't have money to throw away, so I usually build a system that has 90% of the power of the bleading edge system, but is 50% or less of the price. 

If money is not option, go for it.  I'm just cheap..

jd

[Hexx]

Of course *I* know what you're talking about, but maybe one of you can explain what "PCI Express" is for lackwits like that Green fellow...

[Elvis]

Sweet spots, hmmmm.

I don' think there are any PCI express boards out for the AMD processors. If your going to wait for PCI express for the AMD 64s, you might as well wait for btx boards, to make your system further future proof.

The 754 processors right now are cheaper than the 939 processors. I would probably go with an A64 3200 or 3400 and an nForce 250 chipset.

As far as the video card the 6800GT is getting a lot of good press. As far as power is concened the GT will run with a 350 watt power supply.  I believe they toned down the power requiement after the 450 watt + became public with the initial reviews. I have not see any 6800 Ultra's yet, so I can't verify whether they lowered the power req. on that also. My last card was a 9600Pro and recently upgraded to the 6800 Ultra, Nvidia has a good product out there. But if your a fan of ATI I'm sure the X800s are awesome.
  

[Strat]

PCI is a new Bus technology.  Must faster, especially for video. I think it is also the technology that allows the uses a system of 2 video cards to give you the final image. (A lot details to look up on that LOOK HERE)  Increases FPS by 100%.  However, I could be a little off on that.  I stoped keeping up with that stuff when I Decided I'd have to make 3x more money than I do now to afford it all.

My simple input is that you stray Aways from and chipsets like VIA, SIS, and toward the nVidia chipsets.  They repeated (at least the places I looks) to give better performance.  Also from a technelogical standpoint - as well as experience, SIS is Cheap, and VIA, well VIA has showen itself to be full of problems, little problems that show themselves at the worst times.  I've been working on computers for a few years now, and I find VIA to bew workable, but not realiable.

Therefore I say try nVidia.  I have just buoght my first mainboard with a nVidia chipset, so I have yet to have firsthand experience with the stuff, however, my research in forums seems to show that many people complain of problems MUCH LESS often with the nVidia chipset boards then people have complained of problems with the VIA chipsets.

-Strat

[Strafer]

Of course *I* know what you're talking about, but maybe one of you can explain what "PCI Express" is for lackwits like that Green fellow...

In marketting terms? "The Latest & Greatest"

[FPF-DieHard]

I don't have money to throw away, so I usually build a system that has 90% of the power of the bleading edge system, but is 50% or less of the price. 

What the Klink said.

[Kroma BaSyl]

I don't have money to throw away, so I usually build a system that has 90% of the power of the bleading edge system, but is 50% or less of the price. 

What the Klink said.

What the Fed said the Klingon said.

I like the 6800 over the ATI if you are going for the bleed edge in VID card though. I just ordered the last of the parts for my new system on Friday. AMD 3200+ XP, 1 GB Corsair 3200 DDR, ASUS AN78X MB, HD 200 GB SerialATA Seagate, etc.

[FPF-DieHard]

I don't have money to throw away, so I usually build a system that has 90% of the power of the bleading edge system, but is 50% or less of the price. 

What the Klink said.

What the Fed said the Klingon said.

I like the 6800 over the ATI if you are going for the bleed edge in VID card though. I just ordered the last of the parts for my new system on Friday. AMD 3200+ XP, 1 GB Corsair 3200 DDR, ASUS AN78X MB, HD 200 GB SerialATA Seagate, etc.

You mean 9800?   I'm wating for thew price to drop after the X800 become more widely available.

[Kroma BaSyl]

I don't have money to throw away, so I usually build a system that has 90% of the power of the bleading edge system, but is 50% or less of the price. 

What the Klink said.

What the Fed said the Klingon said.

I like the 6800 over the ATI if you are going for the bleed edge in VID card though. I just ordered the last of the parts for my new system on Friday. AMD 3200+ XP, 1 GB Corsair 3200 DDR, ASUS AN78X MB, HD 200 GB SerialATA Seagate, etc.

You mean 9800?   I'm wating for thew price to drop after the X800 become more widely available.

No I meant the FX6800 nVidia. Although I am going with a FX5600 and will wait to upgrade to a better VID card next year.

[Gook]

I don't have money to throw away, so I usually build a system that has 90% of the power of the bleading edge system, but is 50% or less of the price. 

What the Klink said.

Bloody Hell!!! DH and I AGREE on something!!!

I've always gone AMD its a lot cheaper, as for graphics boards, Nvidia based ones seem to have less trouble than ATI (IME) when it comes to online gaming, I have 4 PCs in my "den" and the 2 Invidia based cards have not had to DL any fixes whereas the ATI ones have.

[Doppler]

I don't have money to throw away, so I usually build a system that has 90% of the power of the bleading edge system, but is 50% or less of the price. 

What the Klink said.

What the Fed said the Klingon said.

I like the 6800 over the ATI if you are going for the bleed edge in VID card though. I just ordered the last of the parts for my new system on Friday. AMD 3200+ XP, 1 GB Corsair 3200 DDR, ASUS AN78X MB, HD 200 GB SerialATA Seagate, etc.

You mean 9800?   I'm wating for thew price to drop after the X800 become more widely available.

No I meant the FX6800 nVidia. Although I am going with a FX5600 and will wait to upgrade to a better VID card next year.

All Hail the pink tutu ! The maker of magnificent units ! listen and learn the pink tutu makes em rock solid ! ( no I dont mean it that way ya queers !)

[Kroma BaSyl]

I don't have money to throw away, so I usually build a system that has 90% of the power of the bleading edge system, but is 50% or less of the price. 

What the Klink said.

What the Fed said the Klingon said.

I like the 6800 over the ATI if you are going for the bleed edge in VID card though. I just ordered the last of the parts for my new system on Friday. AMD 3200+ XP, 1 GB Corsair 3200 DDR, ASUS AN78X MB, HD 200 GB SerialATA Seagate, etc.

You mean 9800?   I'm wating for thew price to drop after the X800 become more widely available.

No I meant the FX6800 nVidia. Although I am going with a FX5600 and will wait to upgrade to a better VID card next year.

All Hail the pink tutu ! The maker of magnificent units ! listen and learn the pink tutu makes em rock solid ! ( no I dont mean it that way ya queers !)

The cobbler's children are finally getting some footwear. ;-)

[Hexx]

OK how does this look..

Processor
 AMD  Athlon? XP 3200+ / 2.2 GHz ( 400 MHz ) - L2 512 KB - Retail $278.00

MB
ABIT NF7-S  - nVIDIA® nForce2 - 8x AGP,  400MHz DDR, 5-PCI, SATA, Dolby Digital 5.1, USB 2.0, 10/100 LAN, IEEE 1394 $149.99

HD
 WD  200GB 7200 ATA100 IDE  8M 3yr. $189.00

Vid Card
ATI  RADEON? 9800 PRO  - 256MB DDR, 8x AGP DVI + TVO - Retail - ((380/680MHz core/memory) $415.00

CD   
AOpen DRW8800 - DVD+/-R(8X) DVD+/-RW(4X) CD-R(32X) CD-RW(16X), DVD-ROM(12X) DVD+/-R(8X) DVD+/-RW(8X) DVD-Video(5X) CD-ROM(40X) CD-R(40X) CD-RW(32X) - Retail   $120.00

RAM
2xKingston 512MB 64X64 DDR PC3200 400MHz $149.00  (298.00)


How does this look? Anyone know anything about it?

Cost (for the above) would be about $1450 Canadian plus some sort of tower.
I chose the 9800pro as although it is $200 more than the 9600 it *seems* to have far higher benchmarks. (PLEASE correct me if I'm way off)

I need (or would like) a system that will run Doom3 and HL2 nicely, as well as EQ2 (maybe) and of course (and actually most imprtantly) will continue to run OP for me 

Also I really don't know how all the above meshes together -if I've completely screwed something up could someone please tell me? 

Thanks for all the suggestions made so far

[Kroma BaSyl]

I like the Corsair XMS Series TWINS for matched RAM in nVidia MB due to the dual memory controllers, although I have heard good things about the RAM you choose too.

Make sure your DVD burner does Dual Layer DVDs. NEC makes one that is $89 US.

[Strat]

I like the Corsair XMS Series TWINS for matched RAM in nVidia MB due to the dual memory controllers, although I have heard good things about the RAM you choose too.

Make sure your DVD burner does Dual Layer DVDs. NEC makes one that is $89 US.

According to benchamks, Kingston HyperX performs just as well as the XMS series for overclocking and same performance stock.

[Kroma BaSyl]

I like the Corsair XMS Series TWINS for matched RAM in nVidia MB due to the dual memory controllers, although I have heard good things about the RAM you choose too.

Make sure your DVD burner does Dual Layer DVDs. NEC makes one that is $89 US.

According to benchamks, Kingston HyperX performs just as well as the XMS series for overclocking and same performance stock.

Yeah, but I like the Corsair TWIN matched DIMMs for stability on the nVidia dual memory controler chipset is all. Although the Kingston are high quality and shouldn't poses any trouble.

[Hexx]

I like the Corsair XMS Series TWINS for matched RAM in nVidia MB due to the dual memory controllers, although I have heard good things about the RAM you choose too.

Make sure your DVD burner does Dual Layer DVDs. NEC makes one that is $89 US.

According to benchamks, Kingston HyperX performs just as well as the XMS series for overclocking and same performance stock.

Yeah, but I like the Corsair TWIN matched DIMMs for stability on the nVidia dual memory controler chipset is all. Although the Kingston are high quality and shouldn't poses any trouble.

 


<sigh> I remember buying my first computer " Wow you got a 486/DX2?? You rule!"

Sooo what you're all saying is the above componenets should work OK together? I didn't screw anything up?

[Kroma BaSyl]

<sigh> I remember buying my first computer " Wow you got a 486/DX2?? You rule!"

Sooo what you're all saying is the above componenets should work OK together? I didn't screw anything up?

Just make sure you get a Dual Layer DVD burner is all.

[kbf-jd]

HD
 WD  200GB 7200 ATA100 IDE  8M 3yr. $189.00

Go with a SATA Drive.  Should be faster and your board will support it....

jd

[SSCF-LeRoy]

HD
 WD  200GB 7200 ATA100 IDE  8M 3yr. $189.00

Go with a SATA Drive.  Should be faster and your board will support it....

jd

SATA=Serial ATA. It's faster and does away with those big ribbon cables.

[Hexx]

OK seems to be all good, Thanks All!

Before I run out and order it though- the DVD burner doesn't have "dual layer dvd burning"

What is it and why should I get it?

(If it's just to be stylish I'll still do it.. just wondering what it does..)

[SSCF-LeRoy]

Dual layer recordable DVDs have twice the capacity of previous media because they have two data surfaces on one side stacked on top of eachother. Dual layer DVD burners are designed to record to dual layer media, which is still somewhat difficult to come by and goes for $1.00 US per disk.

[Kroma BaSyl]

Yeah, basically it is like this. DVDs (movies) bought in the store are Dual Layer and have a capacity of ~9 GB (format is known as DVD9), non-Dual Layer DVDs (DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD+R, DVD+RW) can only write on a single layer and are limited to half the capacity of factory burned DVDs (format is known as DVD5, i.e. ~5GB of storage, although it is more like 4.3GB). The new Dual Layer burners can reach storage capacities of the store bought DVDs. All the Dual Layer burners also burn single layer formats, so by going with a Dual Layer drive you are not necessarily restricted to buying the more expensive blanks. Many of the newer single layer drives can be upgraded to dual layer with a firmwear patch, and may of the Dual Layer drives being marketed today are nothing more than the same old single layer model being sold last month with the firmwear already upgraded.

In anycase a Dual Layer drive can now be had for about the same price as a single layer, so you might as well go with the dual layer even if you will be waiting for the price of the dual layer blanks to drop before making use of that feature. In the mean time just use it as you would the single layer, but know that you are future proofed.

Here is a link to the Dual Layer drive by NEC that I just ordered. It turned out to be the exact same price as their single layer version ~83 US (probably just the single layer hardware with new patch applied).

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=27-152-025&depa=0

BTW, I order all my stuff from this site as well. Newegg rocks.

[SSCF-LeRoy]

Many of the newer single layer drives can be upgraded to dual layer with a firmwear patch, and may of the Dual Layer drives being marketed today are nothing more than the same old single layer model being sold last month with the firmwear already upgraded.

Really? Other sources have claimed that such updates are merely rumor.

[Kroma BaSyl]

Many of the newer single layer drives can be upgraded to dual layer with a firmwear patch, and may of the Dual Layer drives being marketed today are nothing more than the same old single layer model being sold last month with the firmwear already upgraded.

Really? Other sources have claimed that such updates are merely rumor.

There were rumors for certian drives. I believe that HP had initially marketed a single layer drive saying that it would be upgradable later, put it turned out that it couldn't be for some technical reason. It depends on the drive. It is probably more accurate to say that some of the current single layer drives on the market are in fact dual layer drives with the dual layer feature turned off in the firmwear, than the other way around.

[Age]

OK seems to be all good, Thanks All!

Before I run out and order it though- the DVD burner doesn't have "dual layer dvd burning"

What is it and why should I get it?

(If it's just to be stylish I'll still do it.. just wondering what it does..)

  I thought you knew all this ? See you later.

[Hexx]

OK seems to be all good, Thanks All!

Before I run out and order it though- the DVD burner doesn't have "dual layer dvd burning"

What is it and why should I get it?

(If it's just to be stylish I'll still do it.. just wondering what it does..)

  I thought you knew all this ? See you later.

No I don't know..
that's why I ask questions...

[kbf-jd]

HD
 WD  200GB 7200 ATA100 IDE  8M 3yr. $189.00

Go with a SATA Drive.  Should be faster and your board will support it....

jd

SATA=Serial ATA. It's faster and does away with those big ribbon cables.

Well, it does get rid of the bulky cables.  That helps....

But REALLY faster?  It's supposed to be.  But most makers are just tacking SATA interfaces on their current HDD units.  These units don't really push the ATA133 standard now(cannot sustain the throughput of 133)  So having a 150 interface on the same hard disk is not going to help.

There are some faster drives out there, but they are expensive and smaller(basically server (AKA SCSI 10k rpm) drives)

I still agree to go SATA.  As a matter of fact, a lot of SATA cards are also RAID cards.  I like using hardware RAID where money allows...

jd

[Hexx]

HD
 WD  200GB 7200 ATA100 IDE  8M 3yr. $189.00

Go with a SATA Drive.  Should be faster and your board will support it....

jd

SATA=Serial ATA. It's faster and does away with those big ribbon cables.

Well, it does get rid of the bulky cables.  That helps....

But REALLY faster?  It's supposed to be.  But most makers are just tacking SATA interfaces on their current HDD units.  These units don't really push the ATA133 standard now(cannot sustain the throughput of 133)  So having a 150 interface on the same hard disk is not going to help.

There are some faster drives out there, but they are expensive and smaller(basically server (AKA SCSI 10k rpm) drives)

I still agree to go SATA.  As a matter of fact, a lot of SATA cards are also RAID cards.  I like using hardware RAID where money allows...

jd

Thanks jd
I think I'm just going to grab the one Kroma had listed for his system (probably go with 160 GB though, $75 cheaper for 40 gigs less) Seagate something or otheri"ll assume he's done the research and blame him if it's not worth it.

I can't really need 200GB can I ?
(asks the guy who thought he would never need 40..)

Oh and anything I should look for in a case?- I assume a 400w one is better than a 350 w but other than that?

[Kroma BaSyl]

In a PSU definitely go for 450 min. Enermax and Antec are both great quality. A good PSU is important for a rig like that.

This is a good one:

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-103-443&depa=0

Ones with ajustable fans are good, so as to crank down noise when not gaming.

[Age]

   You are right on the F-BCE but the person who is giving me all the Tactical information is Pestalence.Where would you think I get it from and he says Quote that you have to fire at range when taking on I-CCZ Quote That is why it take 40 minutes to take one out.I ask him the questions and always will.That is who supplies me with all the info.
    I will say this that I am still new at all this posting on forums and Pestalence knows that.I was only on Taldrens Boards for 4+ months and then here but I am on others as well SFC&Commmunity Tri- Mods Boards at STGD.There I am in Dom Wars.I hope you can understand all this now.         See you later or come over to the Tri -Mods forum.I am talking to some of the D3ers right now and collecting some latinum.I still like you guys but you drive me bonkers sometimes where I am about to blow up.

   www.stcd.sgnonline.com/forum/index.php

[Kroma BaSyl]

   You are right on the F-BCE but the person who is giving me all the Tactical information is Pestalence.Where would you think I get it from and he says Quote that you have to fire at range when taking on I-CCZ Quote That is why it take 40 minutes to take one out.I ask him the questions and always will.That is who supplies me with all the info.
    I will say this that I am still new at all this posting on forums and Pestalence knows that.I was only on Taldrens Boards for 4+ months and then here but I am on others as well SFC&Commmunity Tri- Mods Boards at STGD.There I am in Dom Wars.I hope you can understand all this now.         See you later or come over to the Tri -Mods forum.I am talking to some of the D3ers right now and collecting some latinum.I still like you guys but you drive me bonkers sometimes where I am abou to blow up.

   www.stcd.sgonline.com/forum/index.php

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=non%20sequitur

 

[Cleaven]

Perhaps a bit of quantum mechanics is also involved. Posts and anti-posts spontaneously coming into existence, meeting to annihilate each other and restore the thread to an energy neutral state. Now where is that anti-post????

[Strat]

Perhaps a but of quantum mechanics is also involved. Posts and anti-posts spontaneously coming into existance, meeting to annilate each other and restore the thread to an energy neutral state. Now where is that anti-post????

LOL!

????tsop-itna taht si erehw woN .etats lartuen ygrene na ot daerht eht erotser dna rehto hcae etalinna ot gniteem ,ecnatsixe otni gnimoc ylsuoenatnops stsoP .devlovni osla si scinahcem mutnauq fo tub a spahreP

[SSCF-LeRoy]

Perhaps a but of quantum mechanics is also involved. Posts and anti-posts spontaneously coming into existance, meeting to annilate each other and restore the thread to an energy neutral state. Now where is that anti-post????

LOL!

????tsop-itna taht si erehw woN .etats lartuen ygrene na ot daerht eht erotser dna rehto hcae etalinna ot gniteem ,ecnatsixe otni gnimoc ylsuoenatnops stsoP .devlovni osla si scinahcem mutnauq fo tub a spahreP

.dear ot darh laer s'taht ,yoB

[Hexx]

OK last thing (I promise!)

Was all set to get a Athlon XP 3200+, the guy at the store tells me for gaming I'd do better with a
P4 2.8 ghx (800 something or other) says hyperthreading is the way to go.
I thought I'd read that hyperthreading doesn't do anything for games.
Both are the same price, which is better for gaming?

[Kroma BaSyl]

OK last thing (I promise!)

Was all set to get a Athlon XP 3200+, the guy at the store tells me for gaming I'd do better with a
P4 2.8 ghx (800 something or other) says hyperthreading is the way to go.
I thought I'd read that hyperthreading doesn't do anything for games.
Both are the same price, which is better for gaming?

Would depend on the game, but in general Hyper threading adds performance only when multiple applications are being run. Thus if you run the game in windows mode while surfing the net for hardcore MPEGs it will be better.

As to the cost, even if the CPUs are priced the same you still need to factor in the difference in motherboard and possibly (if using rambus) RAM cost diffences. Also, in order to truly get better preformance out of an Intel rig you would need to use the more expensive rambus RAM as the intel chips are limited with DDR.

Long and short of it is, go with the AMD CPU. JMHO of course.

[kbf-jd]

OK last thing (I promise!)

Was all set to get a Athlon XP 3200+, the guy at the store tells me for gaming I'd do better with a
P4 2.8 ghx (800 something or other) says hyperthreading is the way to go.
I thought I'd read that hyperthreading doesn't do anything for games.
Both are the same price, which is better for gaming?

Here is a good deal if you want intel with PCI express...

http://www.slickdeals.net/forums/showthread.php?threadid=32755&postid=383225#post383225

[Hexx]

Thanks for the link jd.

Sfter reading opinions and specs from about 12 or so sites I still couldn't decide, so I said screw it, went with the AMD (thanks for the info Kroma) and got myself a drink.

So this is what the sytem is

AMD 3200+ XP
ABIT NF7-S MB
9800 Pro (256 ram)
2x512 mb of Kinston Ram (ooooh fancy)
160GB Seagate SATA HD
ND 2510A CD thingy
Some weird ass looking case...
http://raidmax.com/products/products_display.php?page_no=6&cID=1&pID=43
(only case they had in stock that wasn't beige- nothing wrong with beige I've just gotten bored of it)
-I went with the cases internal 420w PS, if something bad happens I'll upgrade to the Enermax 450 one.

Now...hehehe remember when I said that was everything? Kinda forgot I need a new monitor. I'm currently using an AcerView 77e, and I really like it. Problem is it gets a "haze" sort of effect going across the top of it every hour or so- not really bad but it's kinda distracting.

Anyway been looking at monitors

Anyone know anything about this one
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=24-116-232&catalog=23&manufactory=BROWSE
(Newegg does seem great, BUT THEY DON'T SHIP TO CANADA!!! ..heathen bastards..)

I can get it for about $360 -$400 here, but should I spend that much? Or can I get a good 19" monitor for much less? ( 19 is the biggest I can fit on my desk.. and I really don't want to spend the money on a LCD)

Again thanks everyone for the help, you're responses (while driving me insane looking at all the options presented) have been really helpful.

[SkyFlyer]

I'm waiting until next spring break/summer because I'm not going to be playing many games during school, and this comp is fine for school...

But when school is over, these will be my specs (approx)

Intel 64bit CPU @ 4ghz (approx)
64 bit mobo with PCI Xpress and DDR2
1stick of 1gb ram
160gb internal (non system apps)
15gb internal (already have... will have system apps ie OS etc)
40gb external (already have... will have games and stuff that I will move to diff comps etc)
DVD dual layer burner
DVD drive (which I have...)
7in1 memory card reader (which will come with the case)
New GeForce vid card
15 in moniter (until I buy a new one, this is the one I will have)

I'm building my own... and hopefully in about 10 months, these prices will be cheap enough that I can build this around $1500 USD.

[Strat]

OK last thing (I promise!)

Was all set to get a Athlon XP 3200+, the guy at the store tells me for gaming I'd do better with a
P4 2.8 ghx (800 something or other) says hyperthreading is the way to go.
I thought I'd read that hyperthreading doesn't do anything for games.
Both are the same price, which is better for gaming?

Would depend on the game, but in general Hyper threading adds performance only when multiple applications are being run. Thus if you run the game in windows mode while surfing the net for hardcore MPEGs it will be better.

As to the cost, even if the CPUs are priced the same you still need to factor in the difference in motherboard and possibly (if using rambus) RAM cost diffences. Also, in order to truly get better preformance out of an Intel rig you would need to use the more expensive rambus RAM as the intel chips are limited with DDR.

Long and short of it is, go with the AMD CPU. JMHO of course.

As far as Intel Vs Athlon Check out this link...
http://www20.tomshardware.com/cpu/20030513/index.html

If you look at those benchmarks, and the hardware spec they build them on, they seem pretty back-an-forth.

However, I'm with Kroma, stick with Athlon...

[SSCF-LeRoy]

I'm waiting until next spring break/summer because I'm not going to be playing many games during school, and this comp is fine for school...

But when school is over, these will be my specs (approx)

Intel 64bit CPU @ 4ghz (approx)
64 bit mobo with PCI Xpress and DDR2
1stick of 1gb ram
160gb internal (non system apps)
15gb internal (already have... will have system apps ie OS etc)
40gb external (already have... will have games and stuff that I will move to diff comps etc)
DVD dual layer burner
DVD drive (which I have...)
7in1 memory card reader (which will come with the case)
New GeForce vid card
15 in moniter (until I buy a new one, this is the one I will have)

I'm building my own... and hopefully in about 10 months, these prices will be cheap enough that I can build this around $1500 USD.

Nice

But why not an Athlon 64?

[SkyFlyer]

I prefer Intel... Especially the HT Tech.

[Elvis]

I went with the cases internal 420w PS, if something bad happens I'll upgrade to the Enermax 450 one.

As far as the power supply is concerned,, you've got 3 different types of DC output, 3.3V, 5V, and 12V. I couldn't find  the information for the power supply in that case, but there other supplies show 15-18A on the 12V line. If yours is the "15A" version it probably is not enough power. Most people just look at the volt rating and assume that is the important number, but it isn't; the number of amps carried on the 12V line is more important, you powering an energy hungry processor and video card. And when your case heats up which includes your power supply the Amps will drop and the quality of the power produced by that supply will also deteriorate.  Then stability of the machine will suffer.

If you wait till something "bad" happens it could be too late. Ever have a power supply pop and spew smoke?   When it pops what will it take with it, the motherboard, the processor, the memory? It is not worth the hassles of using a marginal power supply.

Look at the 12V line of the Enermaxs and Antecs, there is quite a difference. Also you'll be sure that power is clean and stable-which makes for a happy machine.

With that being said, you may never have a problem with your current power supply.