Topic: The Curse raises its ugly little head.... (Read 3307 times)

Sandman3D · « **on:** July 19, 2004, 12:45:43 pm »

Any of you old Taldrenites recognize the direction that we are starting to fall into? All the problems about PERMISSIONs is what drove away some of our best modelers. All the bickering and name calling is worthless and accomplishes nothing. All it does is alienate the honest bashes and modders...the ones who don't ask are sitting back and laughing their a$$e$ off. This stuff will continue until someone comes up with a way to make a .mod file write protected or conversion protected. Until then, just chill. You don't have to get upset over it...hell, feel flattered that someone like your stuff enough to go to the trouble to steal it. Yes I like to be acknowledged, but as I'm not an expert or anything, I don't sweat it. Once you start getting upset over this stuff, your hobby is no longer fun.

IN OTHER WORDS...CALM DOWN AND DON'T SWEAT IT!!!!!

Core · « **Reply #1 on:** July 19, 2004, 01:20:09 pm »

well said

Rat Boy · « **Reply #2 on:** July 19, 2004, 01:34:03 pm »

I thought for a second someone got hurt trying to do another Melak.

Core · « **Reply #3 on:** July 19, 2004, 01:45:03 pm »

well that could happen again how knows and this subject is without heart

Dolphoenix · « **Reply #4 on:** July 19, 2004, 01:48:58 pm »

I have a question for the community.

All of our ships are currently iin zip format.

What are thoughts on these zip files being password protected, and (lord help me on this one) people having to email asking for the password, or have to read an online agreement before being able to download or in order to get the password..?

Rat Boy · « **Reply #5 on:** July 19, 2004, 01:59:20 pm »

There should be like a Scarlet Letter or something we can brand thieves with. If you make them enough of a pariah in the community, then they'll slither back under the rock they crawled out of.

How does this look for a mark?

T

Dolphoenix · « **Reply #6 on:** July 19, 2004, 02:20:08 pm »

Nothing has been stolen that I know of at this time. Although it is being implied that he intends to do just that. I'm serious, I'd like ideas on ways to distribute models to make sure this sort of nonsense doesn't happen

Rat Boy · « **Reply #7 on:** July 19, 2004, 02:24:25 pm »

Even if you password lock the zip file or put in a licensing agreement, some cheat's just going to lie to get permission. I think there should be a new community standard where every mod put up for public consumption should have a Certificat of Authenticity, a read-only file included in the zip that proves that the mod is genuinely from the modder. If it isn't or if it could be proven that the CoA has been forged, that person should be universally banned from all forums, tournaments, etc.

TheStressPuppy · « **Reply #8 on:** July 19, 2004, 02:44:59 pm »

We (those who are veterans of the taldren flame wars) have all been thru this before. I never understood why people bring themselves to this level, but i guess its the same reason as bill clinton...because they can. Ive seen MANY good veteran modders dissapear. Because of this and I was very reluctent to go back to SFC modding because of situations like this. I had high hopes for Trekmods sfc section, but here we go again.

I do appologise to the good members of SFC modding, and hope we can find some way to end this nonsense.

F9thRyker · « **Reply #9 on:** July 19, 2004, 02:53:06 pm »

Quote from: Sandman3D on July 19, 2004, 12:45:43 pm

Any of you old Taldrenites recognize the direction that we are starting to fall into? All the problems about PERMISSIONs is what drove away some of our best modelers. All the bickering and name calling is worthless and accomplishes nothing. All it does is alienate the honest bashes and modders...the ones who don't ask are sitting back and laughing their a$$e$ off. This stuff will continue until someone comes up with a way to make a .mod file write protected or conversion protected. Until then, just chill. You don't have to get upset over it...hell, feel flattered that someone like your stuff enough to go to the trouble to steal it. Yes I like to be acknowledged, but as I'm not an expert or anything, I don't sweat it. Once you start getting upset over this stuff, your hobby is no longer fun.

IN OTHER WORDS...CALM DOWN AND DON'T SWEAT IT!!!!!

Well said Sandman... Well said.

NannerSlug · « **Reply #10 on:** July 19, 2004, 02:59:21 pm »

well.. my suggestion is that us, the modders, be more responsible in asking for permissions.

you are right sandman.

the modelers might want to make some sort of list on their sites of mods that have permission to use their works *if* they feel compelled to lock down models. this way people could see who had permission to use their stuff.

F9thRyker · « **Reply #11 on:** July 19, 2004, 03:01:23 pm »

For those who want to keep their models locked down, a 'permissions list' isnt a bad idea...

Good call Nanner

The Pelican · « **Reply #12 on:** July 19, 2004, 03:06:47 pm »

There's no 100% guaranteed way to do it really. There are always ways around it. The only thing you can do I suppose is make sure you have a list of all people who DO have permission to use your Models. The only way to do that is to not allow downloads on your site. But ask people to send an e-mail asking permission to use the Model first. Then you send them the appropriate link(s). You would then at least know who has permission to use your Models. You could put the list on the site, so others know who has permission, and can report anyone who is using your Models and isn't on the list.

Realistically, that's about as much as you can do to make sure people don't use your Models without your permission.

I, Mudd · « **Reply #13 on:** July 19, 2004, 03:47:58 pm »

Permission.

Egos will kill this community.

What is being suggested here will further limit any growth to this already waning pastime of SFC. What's next? I'll have to E-mail Wicked Zombie to fly his ship model on D2?

I'll ask again; Why post ship models to the internet at all, if not to enrich the community's enjoyment of the game?

If some one uses one of my ships in a mod, and they don't credit me as a builder, what have I lost? Recognition? I already posted here and at TCS to let you all know about it's release ... it's still on my site for download ... hmm ... what have I lost? Credit? A Job? Money?

Help me out here ...

I, Mudd.

Sochin · « **Reply #14 on:** July 19, 2004, 03:55:14 pm »

Well said Mudd a dose of reality in an insane thread, Kudos

Wicked Zombie · « **Reply #15 on:** July 19, 2004, 03:57:41 pm »

Yes, this is somewhat familiar territory StressPuppy. There've been a number of credit skirmishes and wars these past few years (in fact that's pretty much the only excuse we modelers have for griping at each other), some of which were uncalled for. A few oversized egos got trigger happy and started firing off at others when a few calm, thought out emails and pm's could've solved the problem and not pulled everyone else into it uselessly.

The thing people have to remember is, most modelers are protective of their work (these ships do take a lot of time, afterall). So naturally, even the slightest hint of foul play regarding our models is going to get us chambering our rounds and taking aim. Usually, it is a bit of an overreaction as 99% of the time, the 'offenders' just didn't pay attention to the readmes/policies/whatever. Fortunately, I don't think things are going to get as bad as the last time...

Sapharite · « **Reply #16 on:** July 19, 2004, 04:11:29 pm »

That is why for instance after smoking cigarette I will ask you for permission if I'll need a part of your great work man to mount to my MOD

You have my respect here (well if anything like this mean something to you). I said that because I am overhelmed by this rows and my ego has fallen down (if only not to deep into the hell)

Take care

Wicked Zombie · « **Reply #17 on:** July 19, 2004, 04:16:08 pm »

Quote from: I, Mudd on July 19, 2004, 03:47:58 pm

What is being suggested here will further limit any growth to this already waning pastime of SFC. What's next? I'll have to E-mail Wicked Zombie to fly his ship model on D2?

I'd say that's a bit drastic - my ego isn't that oversized. Obviously, this whole deal is yet another example of why I (and others) should keep quiet in these matters as tossing in one's opinion/gripes seldom helps the situation. If everyone just stuck to email/pm/instant messages and settled these things off-site first, before hinting at it on the forums, things would be a lot more peaceful.

At any rate, in a week or two, everything will be back to the way it was, I've seen this happen all too often...

I, Mudd · « **Reply #18 on:** July 19, 2004, 06:52:48 pm »

Hey WZ,

I just pulled your name out of the hat, so to speak ... but if the shoe fits ...

I hear what your saying about it all blowing over. I'd been lurking within this community long before I started contributing back with Tiberius Station-1, and yeah, you're probably right ...

Quote

Obviously, this whole deal is yet another example of why I (and others) should keep quiet in these matters as tossing in one's opinion/gripes seldom helps the situation.

Yeah, maybe I should just shut up and let destructive behaviors to the community just run their course. But it doesn't have to be this way. We could actually learn something, for once, from this lunacy.

All I'm saying is, when does the silliness end? All this talk about 'ownership' of Star Trek/Star Wars/Babylon5/Buck Rogers/WTF-ever models and permission for this and that really seems like some folks are putting the cart before the horse. What good are the models when no one is around playing the game because of all the touchiness/bitchiness of the modders and modellers that helped create the communities greatness to begin with?

Egos. Pah!

I'd heard it said, model for yourself first. Cool. That's your own deal. That's how I started, and still do quite a bit. A model born on my HD and will die there. It'll never see the light of the internet. You have 100% control of that situation on how that model is used.

But when you post it on line to be made available for downloading, you give up quite a bit of that control, and you must acknowledge that fact before you release it. Sure, A read me crediting the author of the file is great, and seeking approval from the creator is honorable; but all this fanatical rhetoric overpermission to use this file in a mod?

( Needs of the many ... outweigh the needs of the few ... or the one?)

Remember the Boba Fett Model for Quake 2? The same model was used over in the Half-Life community. No fuss over that

Quick test: Who made the Judge Dredd model for Quake 3? Who developed the Judge Dredd Mod ( not just a model, but a true mod, like the Vampire Hunter Mod ...) for Half-Life? How about the Aliens snark mod for Half-Life? How about the Yoda MDL for JK2?

The point of the test is, it really doesn't matter. Those things enriched their communities and blessed them with long and enjoyable lives. Granted, First Person Shooter's communities aren't quite like this one, but aren't we supposed to be better than them anyways?

Well, I'd heard it said about the SFC community ( incidentally from the SFC community ...

) that they were better, but lately, I'm not seeing it. Freedom Force and NWN communities are allot better in the sense no one is yanking down website over someone not crediting somebody over something.

Nuff said.

I, Mudd.

Core · « **Reply #19 on:** July 19, 2004, 07:15:59 pm »

remember the core of the mater (and i will let you guys ponder on that note) truly remember it rise above the shell get to the core and all will be fine

News:

Topic: The Curse raises its ugly little head.... (Read 3307 times) var addthis_config = {"data_track_clickback":true};

Dolphoenix

Dolphoenix

Topic: The Curse raises its ugly little head.... (Read 3307 times)