Topic: Do we need another Star Trek Command Game?

[FVA_C_ Blade_ XC]

Balance of Terror....

I don't remember seeing the Enterprise launching them. I was pretty young at the time though

It did not but they talked about the first war that was fought with missles

[Rota]

Well if it didn't fire them on the show it shouldn't fire them in the game lol. I guess it just boils down to whether you want to play a video game based on a board game, or a video game based on Star Trek.
I think that there is something lost if you try and combine the two. If you have a Constitution class firing missiles you are kinda corrupting the space/time line deal.And that would make the time police very angry rofl. Seriously though, the majority of game buyers would likely opt for a Star Trek game over a SFB game and the developers need to know they will get paid imho.

[Tulwar]

Yes, we do need a new SFC.  I whole-heartedly agree with just about everyone who has posted here, but must respectfully disagree with ROTA.  SFC is SFB for the computer.  Those who were attracted to SFC because it is SFB can only see SFC3 as a poorly executed abomination.  The single player campaigns had some merit, but I couldn't go too far before my computer crashed.

There were a lot of material, such as Klingon PFs that was not included in OP.  G-racks and plas-D did not work the way they should, and the AI was too stupid to fight against a missile onslaught.  These failures are minuscule compared to the achievement of making a functional real-time SFB type computer game, but we were hoping for an improvement.  I do not fault the developers for not being perfect.  A new game would correct these failures.

The other need in a new game is a Dynaverse with an element of high strategy.  People have already written eloquently on this subject, so I will add no more.

BTW --- Larry Niven wrote an episode for the ST cartoon in the '70s base on his story, "The Soft Weapon."  That is where the Kzin come from.  The cartoon is not considered cannon by Paramount.  Some jerk wrote a porno story based on the Kzin, and so offended Niven that he will no longer license anything with that proud race outside the "Tales of Known Space."

[SkyFlyer]

I heard from a pretty reliable source that Taldren basically had one in the bag ... or close.

Anyone know where it went? Can it be finished?

<S>

WaterTiger

I think youre talking about SFC3... wait... SFC3 isnt reliable... hmmm what could he be talking about?

[Rota]

SFC is SFB for the computer

We can agree to disagree then
When most people see the words StarFleet Command, they immediately think of Star Trek.
While the first 3 games were based on sfb, todays games need far more than turn based moves. The next game will need 3d open space and battles also fought on planets to compete with the dimensions found in other games.If they can market an sfb game and make money then kudos to them.

[SkyFlyer]

they need a mix of SFC2 : OP and Freelancer, but much, much more multiplayer depth than FreeLancer.

[J. Carney]

Well if it didn't fire them on the show it shouldn't fire them in the game lol. I guess it just boils down to whether you want to play a video game based on a board game, or a video game based on Star Trek.
I think that there is something lost if you try and combine the two. If you have a Constitution class firing missiles you are kinda corrupting the space/time line deal.And that would make the time police very angry rofl. Seriously though, the majority of game buyers would likely opt for a Star Trek game over a SFB game and the developers need to know they will get paid imho.

Rota:

The original plans for the Klingon D7 included missles and phasers, they were just never fired on TV.

The Romulan seeking plasma is canon from Balance of Terror- can we have it back now?

The missiles are canon for Ferengi, and yet you are notgoing to let us have them?


All I can hear in what you are saying is 'I want a trek game where everyone has the same weapons- MAGIC PHOTONS!!!' There is no fun in that.

SFC's variaty is what makes it popular, not having that variaty hurts- like SFC3 showed.

And PS, if you want to make it canon, realize that you can't pick and chose what is in it. No trrowing out missiles because you don'tlike them- they are canon, too! You'd have about 4 classes for everyone but the Feds and a dozen for them and that would be it.

There's just not enough canon material for a game like SFC.

[EmeraldEdge]

And they mentioned Cardassians using drones in Voyager, as well I believe.

[FPF-DieHard]

Why do we continue the illusion that we are one community?

[Rod ONeal]

SFC is SFB for the computer

We can agree to disagree then
When most people see the words StarFleet Command, they immediately think of Star Trek.
While the first 3 games were based on sfb, todays games need far more than turn based moves. The next game will need 3d open space and battles also fought on planets to compete with the dimensions found in other games.If they can market an sfb game and make money then kudos to them.

Well, here's my $.02 on the demise(sic) of SFC. The first game sold the best. I believe that it was because of it's roots in SFB. I think that each version sold less because they continued to disappoint the SFB crowd. Adding more attrition units, the Kzinti and the ISC to EAW was a good idea. I think that if they had also added/fixed some more SFB elements and had better more in depth campaigns that it would have sold better than SFC1. I believe that if they had "fixed" the cloak, did a better job on attrition units (they were improved, but not enough), fixed the G and D racks and other weapon deficiencies, and possibly added EW lending, it would have been enough to attract, rather than lose, more players. Between disappointed "hardcore" (trust me, none of us here are truly hardcore SFBers) SFB players and the "it's too hard to play" crowd leaving, EAW didn't sell as well. I believe that the 2nd crowd were most of the defectors from EAW though.

Orion Pirates added the pirates, of course. They weren't done very well though. I'm not talking about option MTS. here. Having multiple variants works fine. They should have had a group of quality SFB Orion players do the ships though, IMO. The Orions need better implemented engine doubling, their stealth bonus (the stealth bonus is in the shiplist, but it isn't in the game), and more accurate weapons layouts. The way that they are implemented into D2 isn't popular, although I don't fault Taldren for the way that they did it. It just didn't work out well for pirate players who want to conquer the galaxy. Add the pirate layer interaction (which is what kept EAW more popular for a long time) and that equals more lost players. Both from the SFB camp, and the non SFB players.

SFC3 is more of a completely different game, not a continuation of the series. A lot of the SFC players just don't like it. At first we didn't even have a weapons chart to go by. It was fly around, get on your opponents 12 or 6, and blast away (Oh, and watch out for the guy in the bigger ship trying to run your @ss over. That was the worst feature that I'd ever seen.). Some of the other elements introduce some other strategies, but not enough. Add to that the fact that it was a rush job, that leaves it feeling very incomplete, and the developer/producer interaction, and it's no wonder that it didn't do really well.

All of this is 20/20 hind sight though, and possibly even with blinders on. I just feel that is SFC had gone more in the SFB direction than it did, even with EAW, that it would have grown in popularity. As it was it had too many "house rules". While I think that many would have been willing to deal with them as an interim situation, adding more "house rules" didn't help it out.

[Rod ONeal]

Well if it didn't fire them on the show it shouldn't fire them in the game lol.

The unrefitted Connie doesn't have missiles in SFB either. They were added because they were needed to compete with the Klingons. You know, for a while they tried to remove machine guns from fighters because they were considered obsolete in the era of missiles. They were put back on though. Just as missiles (drones) could have made a comeback in Trek with better missile tech and the tactical need.

I guess it just boils down to whether you want to play a video game based on a board game, or a video game based on Star Trek.

I want to play a video game based on Trek that is balanced and diverse. IMO, that's exactly what SFB is. While all of this tech was being developed in SFB there was no Trek, except for reruns of TOS.

I think that there is something lost if you try and combine the two. If you have a Constitution class firing missiles you are kinda corrupting the space/time line deal.And that would make the time police very angry rofl. Seriously though, the majority of game buyers would likely opt for a Star Trek game over a SFB game and the developers need to know they will get paid imho.

When TMP came along they were wanting to continue the canon timeline and adapt it to their game. Paramount wouldn't allow it though. Thus the diversity. The lack of current canon in SFB is due to that. If they had allowed ADB to do that then we wouldn't have this problem in the first place. I agree with you that the two might not be able to be combined now. Canon changes so much that you'd have to design a new game for every movie and every series, unfortunately.
Of the two "timelines" SFBs is much more consistent and makes for a better balanced game. The gameplay in SFB hasn't even been scratched yet. There's rules for boarding party combat that could be adapted to an FPS, and a GURPS RPG game based on SFB. Then there's Federation and Empire for an Empirical strategy level game. A game engine that could handle all four levels of play would be awesome. Awesome, and complex as a Mofo to design.

[EmeraldEdge]

I love all the "That's not Trek" people but then they love games like EF and Armada and whatnot that have all sorts of stuff that's not Trek and limitations and you name it.   Stuff gets made up for games all the time, but if you are making a game system at least make it diverse.   SFC3 had like 2 weapons just with different names and stuff, it got boring REALLY fast.   No diversity in the way you use the weapons at all.   There are plenty of options out there too, you just have to use them. 

[J. Carney]

Why do we continue the illusion that we are one community?

Because we all want a good Trek game, and we will all play a good Trek game, even if it is not exactly what we want...

but that won't stop us from pestering the powers that be for what we want!

[TotensBurntCorpse]

Yes we need another star fleet command game.

HOWEVER,

It needs to be build up from the strengths of how OP and SFC3 work, and the best elements of the D2/D3 space combat need to be incorporated.

I dont really care if one game over the other is preferred but I have played both for some time now and freely admit that there are some elements in both games that would be complimentary.

BUT THE MAIN item for me would be far more connectivity for multi player combat in missions, such as how BF1942 holds more ppl or MMOG systems work with line of site connectivity.  IF you fly a certain distance away you "leave" the mission.

To me either game is pretty functional, what doesnt seem to fit most peoples palattes is what a dynaverse should be able to do.

[I, Mudd]

Why do we continue the illusion that we are one community?

Truer words have not been said about this group of forums. The doorstep to the temple of wisdom is a knowledge of our own ignorance. Either we accept and embrace the differences, or we split up and go our separate ways. Anything else is a waste of bandwidth.

At least with the differences, there will always be something to argue about/discuss ...

Count me in with the SFB-ers/F&E-ers. 30+ years of development; tried and true.

I, Mudd.

[kv1at3485]

Why do we continue the illusion that we are one community?

Agreed.

You cannot have an SFB near-clone while having an attempted Star Trek clone and vice versa.  It would be impossible to achieve a fusion that would satisfy everyone, or at least those who are want to be strongly opinionated.

I can say that my vision of some grand space strategy game deviates from F&E.  The economic system alone I would favour would be nothing at all like the one used by the board game.  The method of starship construction and the elements required?  Different.  And the list goes on and on.

With SFC we have had the chance to form our list of 'likes' and 'dislikes', what we'd like to see in future games, and what we'd rather have left out.  Now that we have our preferences for the post-SFC products, we can work to see if we can get them.

Let us hope that if there is another 'SFC' (whatever that means) there are at least two of them, and not one.

[Rota]

The original plans for the Klingon D7 included missles and phasers, they were just never fired on TV.

The Romulan seeking plasma is canon from Balance of Terror- can we have it back now?

The missiles are canon for Ferengi, and yet you are notgoing to let us have them?

If you want an early era added to the game that reflects that, cool.
Sure, give the Roms their seeking plasma from the balance of terror area, and remove it from the later era that followed that episode.

I still have never seen a Ferengi ship fire a missile on the show. They were far more advanced than that in the TNG era.

[KBF-Crim]

Should I be able to shoot a single photon torperdo to within a couple klicks of two cruisers, shoot the photon with my phasers...and cripple both enemy ships?....cuz I DID see that on a show...

And can I have a place to put in a code to drop your shields?.....cuz I seed dat in a moovy two

[AdmWaterTiger-11thFleet-]

I heard from a pretty reliable source that Taldren basically had one in the bag ... or close.

Anyone know where it went? Can it be finished?

<S>

WaterTiger

I think youre talking about SFC3... wait... SFC3 isnt reliable... hmmm what could he be talking about?

No Flyer, there was something in the works -- a game like SFC4 almost complete. It is in the can somewhere.

I want to know if it can be revived. Who has it? Where is it? Can we ( the community) fix it or complete it?

Who knows this answer?

<S>

WaterTiger

[J. Carney]

The original plans for the Klingon D7 included missles and phasers, they were just never fired on TV.

The Romulan seeking plasma is canon from Balance of Terror- can we have it back now?

The missiles are canon for Ferengi, and yet you are notgoing to let us have them?

If you want an early era added to the game that reflects that, cool.
Sure, give the Roms their seeking plasma from the balance of terror area, and remove it from the later era that followed that episode.

I still have never seen a Ferengi ship fire a missile on the show. They were far more advanced than that in the TNG era.

IT was in the episode where the Enterprise and the Ferengi Marauder both sent shuttles through a workhole. Geordi was on the Fed shuttle.