Topic: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)  (Read 12737 times)

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Offline Gook

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History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« on: July 10, 2004, 08:05:11 am »
Firstly usual disclaimer about long posts and short attention spans. It?s gonna be very long so get a beer/coffee/catnip.

Secondly I'll try to be as objective as I can, but I was on a particular side and will probably be partial in the eyes of some, this is not intentional.

Every few weeks or so there are references to AF, that is , Artic Fire, the server, now whatever you think about it, some who are here now were not then, and don't know what actually went down. There are still many who were there and they can correct the failing memory of an old retard, where I am sketchy or you think I'm plain wrong.

The game was EAW.

So the BAD stuff first.

The Patrol Bug, this was a "bug" whereby if a smaller ship disengaged from a larger ship, the smaller ship would get the DV shift on the Hex, although it was used by some in AF the real abuses of it started on the CW series of campaigns. It has now thankfully been fixed.

Connection issues, these were rampant, DSL/cable was not really available as it is now, most played on a 56k modem, and some like me to start, were on a 28K modem. When the connection was lost there was no way of telling whether the line had been lost or someone had ALT/F4'd out. This of its self would not have been a problem of huge proportions without Ship loss.

Ship loss, whether bad connections or through combat losses, resulted in you being busted back to an FF, as PP was harder to come by then, if you lost a ship through connectivity issues you were pissed, some would avoid ship loss in PvP by ALT/F4ing out a game and thus saved their ship.

A combination of all of the above lead to allegations of cheating and thus to flame wars on Taldren.

Getting on the server was also a problem, especially in prime time, there were around 2000 people trying to get around 150 places, so many were frustrated that thy could not get on, or if they were on were booted because of connection problems.

Server crashes were frequent and because Artic was in Alaska, and worked, it could mean the servers were down for long periods adding to everyone's frustrations.

There were no DB cleaners and the server got slower as the DB grew and it could towards the end take upwards of 2 minutes to fly from one hex to another. It was ultimately the sheer size of the flatfile DB which ended the server when it imploded.

Draft radius was set at 2, which some disliked.

Rotting Fur was a tactic used by one player who had two accounts, one Hydran, his main, and another Lyran, the pilots second Lyran account was called "Rotting Fur". He would log in the second account, take missions and fly off the board losing the mission and lowering the DV of the Lyran hex, then log in the main Hydran account and flip the hex.

Super warping, was a tactic used by some whereby they had 2 accounts of the same race on different fronts, and would use the account which was needed the most, then when the heat was off or they needed to be on the other front quickly, rather than fly across the big map they would switch accounts.

There are probably other things but others can point those out.

The Good stuff

Firstly before the thing started there was skullduggery and much manoeuvring and politics, all on the boards and all in character. The sides were:

Fed + Gorn
Klingon + Lyran
Hydran + Kzinti
Romulan + ISC (not sure about the last Rommies may have been with Klinks and the ISC on their own).

The sides were all trying to make alliances before the map came out, and the full gamut of spies and negotiation, bluff, carrot and stick were employed. We waited around 6 weeks for the map and played on other servers, but the planning went on, and it was FUN.

When the map was published it caused a sensation, it was HUGE, the positions were traditional, but there was a lot of empty space to conquer/colonise and plenty of scope for manoeuvre. Mandatory missions in neutral and enemy space and neutral hexes had a DV of 40 or 50 (could be wrong on that). It was staggeringly different, there had been nothing like it online that I had seen and although the previous servers had been fun, the sheer scale of this one and the numbers playing put it in a different league. I had been playing wargames for 30 years by then, and it was what I had been waiting for, a huge campaign with thousands of players , played 24/7 online, globally and no bookkeeping for me, as well as diplomacy etc. and of course, PvP. Now many did not like the map, I loved it.

VCs were introduced for the first time, they were simple and to the point. The first race to 6000 econ or to hold 2 enemy capitals while holding LOS to your own was the winner.

We all started many hexes apart at least 20 I think, maybe more. As a result of the diplomacy, the Romulans appeared to have reached a détente with the Feds, and a "green line" was drawn in the stars over which they would not expand. The Feds thought this was great as they could concentrate on the Klinks and ISC. Then the line was crossed and "renegade" Rommies raided fed space. The Rommie hierarchy remonstrated with the rebels in public, but the rebels led by Pinky Gen, were unrepentant and said they would fly with the Klinks regardless of what the Senate said and would raid Fed space. Flame wars erupted, it all got very heated, and many including myself were taken in by it all.

While the Rommies were causing diplomatic havoc, the Gorn made contact wi the Feds and turned on the ISC, the ISC came bounding out of the East and engaged the Feds, the Hydrans marched North to the Lyrans, the Klinks crossed the fed border in force and made moves to the Hydrans and curiously expanded to the Rommies, but did not cross into their space. The Kzin attacked toward the Lyrans and the Feds. The map was so huge it took a week to make contact for most.

During the second week things began to unfold. The Rommies attacked the Feds, the "rebels" were not and it had all been a ruse de guerre. The Feds redeployed, but there numbers were massive and they were able to take on the Kzin, Klinks, ISC and Rommies at once with Gorn help. The Kzin encircled a huge area of space en route to the Lyrans and contact was made. The ISC started a huge offensive against the Fedo/Gorns, the Rommies threw all pretence aside and attacked the Feds with Gusto, the Klinks put all their resources into the Fed front and the pressure began to tell on the Feds. When the Kzin line reached Fed space the Feds were fighting virtually the whole Galaxy. The Hydrans wer pressing the Lyrans and making rapid advances, all was finally balanced.

Then the rumours were started. The 9th were coming. The propaganda war was unleashed on the boards and talk of 150 Starlancers lead by the 9th , who like the cavalry to save the beleaguered wagon train, would save the Feds and push back the invaders. The 9th were coming. The Klinks tried to counter with talk of their own fleets, but the seed had been sown, the 9th were coming. The Rommies had their diplomatic coup, now the Feds had their propaganda coup, the effect was electrifying, these ace of aces (as they were portrayed) would rollback the "Huns" and the doors of Stovokor its self  would fall. Quite masterly.

Then the Hydrans who had made good progress seemed to get very quick at flipping and were doing extraordinarily well, seemed to be doing, well, too well! Not because of the speed but because of the placement of the hexes, which were way out of reach and suddenly appeared with no LOS to the remaining Hydrans. KDF-Kang, a brilliant Admiral, watched the News for 2 days, then announced, with the evidence, that a certain Hydran had been up to no good. Rotting Fur was caught and confessed on Taldren, but what to do about what he had done?

Well rather than bitch about it and flame the server to death, or walk out, the leaders flew to a meeting in game. There was a 2 day ?ceasefire? you could consolidate but not expand. The Klinks who had the most numbers near to the offending area in an area of space I think the Hydrans called ?The Duchy?. The Klinks moved en masse reduced the hexes and the Lyrans retook them. Then the Klinks lost missions on their own supply line to the area, vacated and the Hydrans flipped them neutral. That was the best we could do and although Artic could have manually readjusted them, this was deemed risky to the DB. So what had been a server threatening crisis was averted by co-operation. The Klinks said they wouldn?t use that route to arttack the Hydrans aor link with the Lyrans for a week and the game came through.

During the Hiatus all sides consolidated.

The Kzin were the first off the blocks, with one fleet led by Brezgonne they firstly stopped the Fed expansion, then took the new fed colonies and were the first to take a Fed Planet proper. In the West the main Kzin force ploughed on to Lyran space and began to munch up Lyran space proper, the battles were fierce and lasted about a week to 10 days. By the end of it large areas of Lyran space were in Kzin hands and the Lyrans suffered a TMC (total morale collapse), it was left to Skyawapa and Kzinbane to defend Lyran space, but more of that epic later.

During the next 2 weeks the Rommies held their front and the combined Rommie and Klingon fleets struck deep into the Federation. Many fierce PvP actions were fought, but the coalition advance was remorseless. In the East the ISC struck deep into fed territory and repulsed a very heavy Gorn flanking manoeuvre. The Hydrans switched fronts and struck out toward the Klingons and in the process helped the feds. The Lyrans were in dire straights and the Klinks began the long haul of trying to link with them. This redistribuition of forces allowed the Feds to stop the Klingo/Rommie advance and a stalemate ensued.  The Gorn smarting from their repulse by the ISC made for Kzin space. During this time the 9th had arrived, but being 2-3 weeks behind had to get PP for the ships they wanted which took time.

Then the deepstrike proper was borne. Durin and at least one other struck out east through Rommie space with a base. They passed into neutral space beyond the Rommies, and there set up barad dur. It was a master stroke. The Rommies hastily withdrew heavy units from the front line in an attempt to erradicate the base at barad dur. The feds redeployed some the forces releived by the Rommie withdrawal and with the newly formed 9th smacked into the ISC and drove them back. The Klinks and remaining Rommies were held in check, the Klinks put considerable effort into contacting the Lyrans but were still a long way off. The Hydrans were engaging the Klinks on their front and pushing them back slowly.

Barad Dur was a stroke of genius. It was quickly followed by the Kzin redeploying major units to the Gorn front and Hades and Jefe dropping a base on the edge of Gorn space, which was quickly extended to take a planet and the Kzin ?Farstar County? was born.

In Lyran space the dynamic Lyran duo each in a DN set about trying to halt the Kzin. The defence was skilful and epic and many a 3 ship drone squadron fell to the mighty pair. They were alas for the Lyrans too few and the Kzin moved to within 3 hexes of Lyra. Brezgonne had by this time one thing on his mind, EARTH he and his squadrons were pressing remorselessly toward Terra itself.

1AF then deployed a base (with Durin) on the extreme eastern edge of the Map to the North of ISC space, this was Khazad Dum. From there all of 1AF struck into the unprotected rear of ISC space, causing panic and confusion amongst the Frogs,  many of whom used the dubious, but not illegal ?superwarp? tactic to fend off the predations of 1AF in the rear and fight on the main front.

The Feds with more piolts coming on line then set out to intercept the thin line which the Klinks were making toward the stricken Lyrans. It was a classic paralell race to see who would get there first.

The Rommies had by now neutralised Barad dur and were returning to the main Klingo/Fed front and were grinding forward hex by Hex. The Hydran offensive had stalled. The Gorn with a couple of Fred heavies were trying to dislodge the  Kzin from their space and although the county shrank the planet it had become based on held. The ISC were inflicting heavy losses on 1AF, but at the cost of losing on their front with the Flatheads.

Around 5 weeks in it dawned on everybody that the race with the best chance of winning was actually the Kzin! The smallest race on the board. The Lyran collapse meant Lyra was under seige and the Kzin were 2 hexes from the Tri-star in Gorn space and only 10 from earth!

Offensives ceased from the major powers. Battered fleets were withdrawn from the front refitted with new ships and plans drawn and plots hatched.

Now whether you agree with spying or not, it was used, and the Rommies were the masters. There was a meeting in a gamespy room between all the leaders except the Feds and Gorn. There the Rommies revealed that they had the Fed plans and these were handed over. The Feds were going to crush the Kzin while holding on all other fronts, then push on to  Lyra and thus win for the Alliance (edit later changed to Frog capital). The Fed battle map has been published many times, but their own discussions on their boards have not and these are annexed to this post.

The Kzin had their small forces spread from the Tri-Star to Lyra, which was way too thin. The Klinks and Lyrans meanwhile hatched a plot against the Kzin, while plotting with all other races to launch a premptive strike against the Fed/Gorn Axis, which was to start one hour before the Fed one. The Klinks were going to use this to cover a strike from Lyran space, which they had finally reached, and many Lyrans were going to return to the server to exact revenge on the Kzin.

The Feds deployed as follows:

1XF hold the Klingon Front
3rd Hold the juncture of Klinks and Rommies
9th Strike into Rommie space
Wolfpack attack ISC from front
1AF attack ISC from Kazad Dum
Dizzy and Pneumonica81 with the main Fed thrust head for Mraa
Mu?s independent brigade hold Diz/P81 left flank
Rook and his expeditionary force were to hold right flank, cut the LOS from Gorn space and then come in round the back of the Kzin.

All Kzin front forces were to converge on Mraa.

The Klingons were going to put a huge thrust up against 1XF
They were also going to link with the Lyrans and take the space the Kzin had vactated to defend Mraa, in the west.

The Hydrans were going to suport the Kzin by helping the Klinks (as they thought against the Feds) but in reality the Klinks just wanted their fleets out of position.

The Gorn were to eradicate the ?Farstar County? and demostrate on the northern edge of the ISC salient.

The ISC were to ignore 1AF and attack full bore the Wolfpack, and barrel into Fed space proper.

Alea Jacta est.

I stayed up all night waiting for the ?Big Push? as did the very few kzin, (about 15 of us in total) around 03.00 the server went down. It never came back up, the DB had died. It was 2278.2 (and still only slow drones!!)

It lasted around 6 weeks, it was frustrating, exhilarating, but for me just about the best fun I?ve had online. The newness  and novelty was a great factor, using RW for the first time and TALKING to people for the first time. Not being constrained by a small map, the subterfuge, the cheating, the resolutions and the battles of which I had many all made it FUN (IMHO) this last para obviously not objective, but very much subjective.

In another thread are intercepted Fed comms.




« Last Edit: July 10, 2004, 08:36:18 am by Gook »
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Offline Laflin

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2004, 08:08:53 am »
Man oh man  - take a breath!  Who would have guessed that you work in the legal field?  That WAS a long one  :P

Offline Hexx

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2004, 08:22:09 am »
LOL what a frickin server it must have been.
LOve to get something like that going, problem is we're kinda short a couple hundred players..
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Offline SSCF-LeRoy

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2004, 12:39:21 pm »
Sounds like AF was a real humdinger ;)

Offline Max Power

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2004, 03:28:45 pm »

So the BAD stuff first.

The Patrol Bug, this was a "bug" whereby if a smaller ship disengaged from a larger ship, the smaller ship would get the DV shift on the Hex, although it was used by some in AF the real abuses of it started on the CW series of campaigns. It has now thankfully been fixed.


Though it was almost like a vampire - even when you thought that you had driven a stake through it's heart, it somehow came back to life. Good riddance.

Connection issues, these were rampant, DSL/cable was not really available as it is now, most played on a 56k modem, and some like me to start, were on a 28K modem. When the connection was lost there was no way of telling whether the line had been lost or someone had ALT/F4'd out. This of its self would not have been a problem of huge proportions without Ship loss.

Ship loss, whether bad connections or through combat losses, resulted in you being busted back to an FF, as PP was harder to come by then, if you lost a ship through connectivity issues you were pissed, some would avoid ship loss in PvP by ALT/F4ing out a game and thus saved their ship.


The real problem was if you crashed, and the other player didn't alt-F4, you'd lose your ship. Back in those days there were a lot of people that didn't alt-F4. So you got good with frigates, I'll tell you.


Getting on the server was also a problem, especially in prime time, there were around 2000 people trying to get around 150 places, so many were frustrated that thy could not get on, or if they were on were booted because of connection problems.

Server crashes were frequent and because Artic was in Alaska, and worked, it could mean the servers were down for long periods adding to everyone's frustrations.

There were no DB cleaners and the server got slower as the DB grew and it could towards the end take upwards of 2 minutes to fly from one hex to another. It was ultimately the sheer size of the flatfile DB which ended the server when it imploded.


See "dynaverse alfa test" at the bottom of the page: http://www.ranter.net/mu/sfc2/sfc2rants1.html

Draft radius was set at 2, which some disliked.


Because it caused frequent crashes. Then you'd have to pray you didn't lose your ship.

Rotting Fur was a tactic used by one player who had two accounts, one Hydran, his main, and another Lyran, the pilots second Lyran account was called "Rotting Fur". He would log in the second account, take missions and fly off the board losing the mission and lowering the DV of the Lyran hex, then log in the main Hydran account and flip the hex.


I think this is the only time I can remember that we've had a problem with a hydran player. Come to think of it, wasn't it Nomad? I forget what Hobbes did to repent for us about this other then what is listed below. I was a very minor player then.


When the map was published it caused a sensation, it was HUGE, the positions were traditional, but there was a lot of empty space to conquer/colonise and plenty of scope for manoeuvre. Mandatory missions in neutral and enemy space and neutral hexes had a DV of 40 or 50 (could be wrong on that). It was staggeringly different, there had been nothing like it online that I had seen and although the previous servers had been fun, the sheer scale of this one and the numbers playing put it in a different league. I had been playing wargames for 30 years by then, and it was what I had been waiting for, a huge campaign with thousands of players , played 24/7 online, globally and no bookkeeping for me, as well as diplomacy etc. and of course, PvP. Now many did not like the map, I loved it.


To amplify, the map was MASSIVE. You could play for days without any kind of contact. We're talking thousands of hexes. Quite the opposite you'd see today.

VCs were introduced for the first time, they were simple and to the point. The first race to 6000 econ or to hold 2 enemy capitals while holding LOS to your own was the winner.


About the same VCs were used later in CW2. Too bad about the Kzin :)



Then the rumours were started. The 9th were coming. The propaganda war was unleashed on the boards and talk of 150 Starlancers lead by the 9th , who like the cavalry to save the beleaguered wagon train, would save the Feds and push back the invaders. The 9th were coming. The Klinks tried to counter with talk of their own fleets, but the seed had been sown, the 9th were coming. The Rommies had their diplomatic coup, now the Feds had their propaganda coup, the effect was electrifying, these ace of aces (as they were portrayed) would rollback the "Huns" and the doors of Stovokor its self  would fall. Quite masterly.


AKA the Nanner effect...or perhaps the Ghis effect would be a better term.

Then the deepstrike proper was borne. Durin and at least one other struck out east through Rommie space with a base. They passed into neutral space beyond the Rommies, and there set up barad dur. It was a master stroke. The Rommies hastily withdrew heavy units from the front line in an attempt to erradicate the base at barad dur. The feds redeployed some the forces releived by the Rommie withdrawal and with the newly formed 9th smacked into the ISC and drove them back. The Klinks and remaining Rommies were held in check, the Klinks put considerable effort into contacting the Lyrans but were still a long way off. The Hydrans were engaging the Klinks on their front and pushing them back slowly.


Lol...what is it with Romulans and suseptability to deep strikes...my personal favorite was when JM set up camp nearly literally in the middle of their territory during CW3. Threw their entire force into disarray for a week.


In Lyran space the dynamic Lyran duo each in a DN set about trying to halt the Kzin. The defence was skilful and epic and many a 3 ship drone squadron fell to the mighty pair. They were alas for the Lyrans too few and the Kzin moved to within 3 hexes of Lyra. Brezgonne had by this time one thing on his mind, EARTH he and his squadrons were pressing remorselessly toward Terra itself.


Wonder if flaming by Dizzy had anything to do with it...

Now whether you agree with spying or not, it was used, and the Rommies were the masters. There was a meeting in a gamespy room between all the leaders except the Feds and Gorn. There the Rommies revealed that they had the Fed plans and these were handed over. The Feds were going to crush the Kzin while holding on all other fronts, then push on to  Lyra and thus win for the Alliance (edit later changed to Frog capital). The Fed battle map has been published many times, but their own discussions on their boards have not and these are annexed to this post.


They gave us the entire coalition battle plan before one server (forget the name). It was hilarious. They just couldn't figure out how we knew exactly what to do, lol. Every time they changed plans we'd have the complete text within minutes. Needless to say I started to check forum security more carefully after that..

It lasted around 6 weeks, it was frustrating, exhilarating, but for me just about the best fun I?ve had online. The newness  and novelty was a great factor, using RW for the first time and TALKING to people for the first time. Not being constrained by a small map, the subterfuge, the cheating, the resolutions and the battles of which I had many all made it FUN (IMHO) this last para obviously not objective, but very much subjective.

In another thread are intercepted Fed comms.


You forgot to mention the planned sunday morning federation offensive (or didn't make it clear). All the federation would log in in the AM when no one was around and hit everyone full blast. The database finally died literally just before they were to kick off the attack. There was a line ready to log in when the final death came. Heh, in recognition to their scheming ways I later used the same tactic on IDSL to turn a certian defeat into a victory.

Offline Durin

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2004, 05:02:28 pm »
Gook you nailed it right on brother.I think that server is one of the reasons I'm still here all these years later.I'm hoping that one day something will come along that is close tto what we had there. Great post :goodpost:

Offline Lepton

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2004, 05:39:00 pm »
Good post, not my kind of server.  Good riddance to that crap.


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Offline Durin

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2004, 07:02:14 pm »
Good post, not my kind of server.  Good riddance to that crap.

And you sir can bite my hairy arse.

Offline likkerpig

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2004, 07:30:40 pm »
My memory is a bit (ok a lot) foggy here, but didn't AF go pay to play before it shut down? Or was that another server? Or has the alcohol finally done it's worst on my poor suffering brain?
I got onto the D2 while AF was still up, I've always thought it went Pay to Play.
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Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2004, 07:39:38 pm »
Good post, not my kind of server.  Good riddance to that crap.

And you sir can bite my hairy arse.

Can he shave it first?   Nobody likes getting dwarven ass hair in their teeth . . .

It pains me to agree with Lepton but I have to.  Too much under-handed dis-honorable crap happened back in those days.
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Durin

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2004, 07:57:31 pm »
My memory is a bit (ok a lot) foggy here, but didn't AF go pay to play before it shut down? Or was that another server? Or has the alcohol finally done it's worst on my poor suffering brain?
I got onto the D2 while AF was still up, I've always thought it went Pay to Play.
 :drink: :help:


Af's machine went poop and the community got together and sent him enough money to get a new box.

DieHard  even with all the bad it was still the best server I have been in.  ;)

Offline likkerpig

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2004, 08:01:58 pm »
My memory is a bit (ok a lot) foggy here, but didn't AF go pay to play before it shut down? Or was that another server? Or has the alcohol finally done it's worst on my poor suffering brain?
I got onto the D2 while AF was still up, I've always thought it went Pay to Play.
 :drink: :help:


Af's machine went poop and the community got together and sent him enough money to get a new box.

DieHard  even with all the bad it was still the best server I have been in.  ;)

Thanks Durin, at least I know I've got a few active cells left......
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Offline Mog

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2004, 09:52:15 pm »
Yes, the community chipped in for a new server; a little bit later, database go bye bye, as does artic himself, server and all.

I honestly can't believe how proud you sound, Gook, of the spying and stuff like that  I didn't realise it was going on back then. The only one I'm aware of (and which still leaves bad feelings in the Klingon camp) is CW5, the ISC Pacification War, where the Romulan players were caught spying I believe.

You make the campaign sound rather exciting. I have a definitely different view of it, mind-numbing boredom springs to mind lol. Ai mission after ai mission after ai mission for days on end, trying to get to enemy territory just to fight someone. The map was just too big, even for the 100 (not 150) players on at a time.

I guess we see it differently because I have a pessimistic outlook with far more tendency towards pvp, whilst you seem more optimistic about it, and enjoy more the ai side of things. That's fairy snuff.

My favourite campaign is AOTK. Thoroughly enjoyed that. Was full of frantic pvp. Loved it. GW1 comes second, Kzinti are my favourite opponents.
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Offline Fluf

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2004, 10:04:21 pm »
I actually got to play on that server for a few short times and had a blast.  I had no idea all this was going on behind the scenes.  This was when the dyna was brand new, and I was still in SL, but I do remember this map, and driving southward out of MRaa toward s Fed space with Brez a few times. 

I do remember the huge map, an though it was a fantastic experince. 

And Lepton, even with the things that were going on in the background, this was the formation of what fleets and people that are still in this game, now.  KAT grew out of this server.  KOTH played there as the Patriarchs Honor Den, but were still a SL fleet, and then joined the GFL for a year before coming back out into the mainstream D2 for Rooks Tavern 3 and CW6, so we missed most of the first CW servers.

But I do miss those days.  AF was one of the best and most fun servers I had ever played on.
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Offline Laflin

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2004, 12:13:39 am »
The Horror - all I remember from AF is the unending fields of gray (HAH! Moggy!) hexes - there sure were a heck of a lot of 'em  ;)

Offline Lepton

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2004, 12:53:54 am »
SS2, that is my kind of server.  If I remember correctly, all border conflict, lots of PvP, no tunneling through empty space. Can't remember any specific drama on that one or was that the one with a PF associated flamewar?  It all runs together for me.  Hex-flipping is hex-flipping.


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Offline Gambler

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2004, 12:54:46 am »
I flew ISC on that server and had a great time deep in Fed space most of the time.  You got most of it right however there were a few corrections.

The ISC had no allies except what alliances we were able to make during the course of the game.  This meant that our first goal was to make connections with the Romulans to keep them off of our flank.  We had a common enemy in the Feds so this wasn't too difficult.   This was successfull and they didn't encroach into ISC territory, but at the same time we were placed in the akward position of sometimes ending up in missions vs Romulan pilots.  The protocol was that both pilots would disengage and move out of the draft radius.

One thing the ISC did threw AF and the Feds for a loop was that we went straight for Fed space.  The initial estimation was that races would take a week or so just building up their space before going on the offensive.  Instead we took the battle to them.  This gave us an advantage in that they were having to defend their home space while we had a supply line going back to the homeworlds that could be expanded on to raise the economy.

Gook is right, we did use Superwarp.  We had to.  Comparing the number of ISC captains vs the number of Feds and Gorns if we hadn't we wouldn't have been able to protect the homeland from the Wolfpack.

It was definitely a fun server.  
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Offline Gook

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2004, 04:47:25 am »
I actually got to play on that server for a few short times and had a blast.  I had no idea all this was going on behind the scenes.  This was when the dyna was brand new, and I was still in SL, but I do remember this map, and driving southward out of MRaa toward s Fed space with Brez a few times. 

I do remember the huge map, an though it was a fantastic experince. 

And Lepton, even with the things that were going on in the background, this was the formation of what fleets and people that are still in this game, now.  KAT grew out of this server.  KOTH played there as the Patriarchs Honor Den, but were still a SL fleet, and then joined the GFL for a year before coming back out into the mainstream D2 for Rooks Tavern 3 and CW6, so we missed most of the first CW servers.

But I do miss those days.  AF was one of the best and most fun servers I had ever played on.

Hey Fluf I had no idea you were on AF, were you Fluff then or did you have another Handle?

You are aright about the fleets though, those races which didn't have them, had them afterwards, GPF, KATs etc.

Like I said Mog, space is BIG :) As I recall the grey was for the first week then it was none stop PvP.

Pig, I didn't send any dosh to Artic, but did to BBJ for "hector" or whatever it was called, Artic had ascended his mountain by then and CW campaigns were under way.

Gambler, TY for corrections
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Offline Gook

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #18 on: July 11, 2004, 05:04:35 am »
I honestly can't believe how proud you sound, Gook, of the spying and stuff like that  I didn't realise it was going on back then. The only one I'm aware of (and which still leaves bad feelings in the Klingon camp) is CW5, the ISC Pacification War, where the Romulan players were caught spying I believe.


Spying is part of warfare IJN34 ring any bells, or Bletchley and Enigma. I actually don't like it much, but it was in character for the Rommies and ISC to do it, the Rommies especially are supposed to do stuff like that. I just made sure , Like Max, security on the Kzin boards was up to snuff. We also had an ex SPQR'r for a while which helped as we developed counter espionage techniques, and unless I'm wrong the only info they got was deliberate disinformation, but they who deny they exist will probably neither confirm nor deny that :) Having a J'inn around helps a lot to when it comes to disunformation, on one server we let slip our real plans and hid the fakes to finesse a spy it worked, we got the spy then carried on with the leaked plans which no one thought we would do.

CW5 the Klinks should have won, and you are right they lost because of spying. None Pacified RMs were under NDA from Rommies (we didn't know how much info we were gonna get) when I realised it was the while shooting match I kinda leaked clues on Taldren, that we knew, Socky picked that up, but was apparently overuled. The Klink missions which succeded were BM ones which they didn't tell the hierachy about, and thus Hydraxx fell to Squiggy and 2  or 3 other 69ers, Khemarrah and Maz I think, could be wrong. Lyraa we learned about at last minute and managed to hold it for a long while, but it fell. Gorns we knew everything and thud they held, then we switched to ISC homeworld. I know the Klinks were well pi$$ed at the Rommies afterwards.
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Offline Capt Jeff

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #19 on: July 11, 2004, 05:58:28 am »
Definetly a ground breaker....nothing really like it since.  Maybe one day......

I remember doing my "retarded" hex munching down by Klingon space one day and I draft someone.   Now mind you, there was no springer chat, and most did not have voice chat either.  The only boards I knew at the time was Taldren.  Absolutely no way to chat on server except in a mission itself...  So, I draft someone and who is it?  The Great Pnuemonic 81.   He says there was a cease fire with the Klingons and to come up north with him.  He gave me his e-mail and that got me to his Fed forums  (the one before Nanner put up the CIC).  Chay and Tanked and the other 1AF guys had a RW up running 24/7 one of their machines and I joined in.   After hanging around with them and learning how to fly better, they asked me to join.  Boy what fun...no matter what anyone says about AF, I will always look back on that with absolute fondness.

Only server that's came close, IMHO is the original Storm Season.
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Offline Gambler

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #20 on: July 11, 2004, 08:25:53 am »
AFter going to bed last night I came up with an additional cross we ISC had to bear.  Because we had no official allies on the server, it was a crapshoot who we would end up with as wingmen on any given mission.

I don't know how many missions I got in Fed space where I was fighting a Feddie and had a Fed AI wingman.  This led to the unfortunate fact that if I won the mission but my wingman survived, the defense value of the hex would go UP, not down.   We ISC became quite adept at getting our AI wingmen killed before the end of the mission.
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Offline Durin

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #21 on: July 11, 2004, 08:37:55 am »
I remember that one too Gambler.It truely was a pain to you guys.At the time I was glad..we were  soooo pissed you guys kept  coming right at us.  ;D

Offline Capt_Bearslayer_XC

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #22 on: July 11, 2004, 08:50:23 am »
This was my very first Dyna-Verse server.  The whole 'rotting fur'  incident is what clued me in on that.

I remember being very quiet on RW, just trying to figure out what was going on and how I could help.

I was such a n00b back then...;D

But I guess I liked it b/c I am still here.
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Offline Commander Maxillius

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #23 on: July 11, 2004, 12:53:02 pm »
so why hasn't there been an attempt to start an Arcticfires-type server right where the DB died, so that all of the cutthroat trickery and hard work can come to fruition?

I wanna know who wins, dammit!!!
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Offline Gook

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #24 on: July 11, 2004, 01:23:11 pm »
so why hasn't there been an attempt to start an Arcticfires-type server right where the DB died, so that all of the cutthroat trickery and hard work can come to fruition?

I wanna know who wins, dammit!!!

Not enough people for that type of server and that big a map anymore  :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

We need more Peeps  :cuss: :cuss: :cuss:
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Offline Corbomite

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #25 on: July 11, 2004, 03:24:10 pm »
Problems and all it was still the most fun I ever had on a server. The newness of it all and the complexity of the battle plans made it truly memorable. Gigantic map, 100 people (eventually dropped down to 80 to help with crashing) and literally hundreds waiting to get in made it seem like it could actually be a persistant universe that might last a year or more. Alas it was not to be. :(

Offline Lepton

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #26 on: July 11, 2004, 04:01:01 pm »
What's quite amazing to me is that the entirety of Artic Fire could have been done on GSA with a simple web interface map and an SQL database, but because you all were stuck on the D2, you had people waiting that could have been playing and a corrupted DB.  Had you all not had the D2 you'd have been forced to come up with creative solutions to the campaign problem, but since it was there, that's what you all have concentrated on for 4 years now or however long it has been.  And what have you got: some custom missions, some new rules, and the same old problems.

Perhaps the only redeeming feature is the fun you all had which merely would have been in a different context had you all come up with your system for doing campaigns and you'd be singing songs of the old days about that instead of this.  Six of one, half-dozen of another.  The things that made it special were you all being there.  The format is nothing special.


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Offline Gambler

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #27 on: July 11, 2004, 04:32:37 pm »
I played GSA a few times, and D2 quite a lot.  The difference for me was the fact that I could spend two hours sitting on GSA and maybe get one or two games played.  During the same two hours on a D2 server I could play four or eight or ten missions depending on what went down.  Sure I could have done the same thing just stand alone on my own PC, but that wouldn't have had the same emotional feedback that came from donig something for the greater good.

You also have to put yourself into the mindset four years ago when AF was first put forth.  Until that time there hadn't reallly been anything with different racial alliances.  We were used to servers where DV's were low, maps were small and a player could log off with a large territory and 24 hours later have their entire home space completely overrun by another race.  It took all the fun out of the D2.  AF was aimed specifically at counteracting that.  A small band of dedicated players couldn't completely wipe out another race so quickly.

Some people are better AI warriors.  Some people love PvP.  Me, I like cooperative play vs AI and maybe a few opponents.  D2 lets people who like both styles of play get together with a common goal.

I don't care how much time you play on GSA nothing can match the pure adrenaline rush when you realize that you've drafted another player and are waiting for the mission to load.  Who will it be.  What will they be flying.  Who will be the wingmen.  Will they be AI or real?  Will it be a balanced mission or will you be outnumberd?
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Offline IndyShark

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #28 on: July 11, 2004, 09:25:59 pm »
I played on AF and it was a lot of fun. Heck, it became an obsession. I wish we had more campaigns like that one.

Offline Lepton

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #29 on: July 11, 2004, 11:11:58 pm »
don't care how much time you play on GSA nothing can match the pure adrenaline rush when you realize that you've drafted another player and are waiting for the mission to load.  Who will it be.  What will they be flying.  Who will be the wingmen.  Will they be AI or real?  Will it be a balanced mission or will you be outnumberd?

That is what makes D2 inferior to my mind.  There is an inherent lack of fairness and equality in the D2, be it in terms of server numbers or mission match-ups.

The problem with most people's GSA experiences is that associated with league play where everyone is sitting there figuring out if they can beat someone else or some other group of people, bickering about terms, etc, etc,  However, if you had a hundred or more folks on at once who were actively working on a campaign map, you'd have none of those "manuevering" delays because people want to move the map and campaign forward as opposed to be being concerned about pride or saving face.

I understand the conditions at the time of AF from what I have heard here and from what I have seen I would have dropped the D2 like a hot brick.  Things have certainly gotten better but it is an inherently flawed system.


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Offline Mu

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #30 on: July 12, 2004, 12:37:40 am »
That was a great server, and really showed the potential of what SFC2 could be to a large community.  Like Neverwinter Nights, it also showed how the retarded limitations of the software kit would not allow it to actually happen.

AF was my first real Dyna server, after logging onto IPlay for several minutes and seeing the effects of the Blue Plague there, yawning, and leaving.  On AF there was also sort of a Blue Plague, but it afflicted me and the other Feds who were trying to pay attention to the strategic overview.  We were surrounded by nincompoops who would constantly draft us in meaningless fight the pirates missions, or get into bidding wars on ships we really really needed, or just lose a lot, or... well, you know.  There was still a lot of resentment over the one-sidedness of the IPlay servers, and so when the map is really big with the blue right in the middle, that's where everyone went.  The only ally we had was Valas... I mean the Gorn... I mean Valas, the only Gorn player.

It was also the site of my first ever PvP match, vs. Brez and his cheese-o fleet of 3 DF+'s that had been wrecking everyone with tractors and slow drone waves.  I remember that fight really well, since I really didn't know what I was doing and was uber cautious.  Me in an NCL, I basically just jerked around at range 50 firing proximity torps for a while, chatting, until I figured he was really annoyed, then charging overloads and a repel tractor, swooping in, dumping at range 2, destroying one ship and wounding another with no damage.  I then went back to range 50 and thought of how I could get him to fall for it again, and he got annoyed and left.  :P

It was also where I met a lot of reasonably good pilots, including Dizzy (in the coops that led to the Decoy Frigate tactic), Chay Maeryn (with whom I disagreed virulently about the use of the phaser as a primary, but he made it work somehow), Kruk (castling master), etc. etc. etc.  It was also where I figured out that not everyone thought like me, when in coop missions I would say, "OK I'm going for a sacrifice pass and get my ship damaged to drop his 1 and 2 shields and lock his vector down, follow on my 6 and exploit it so I can run and repair," then swoop in with overloads and do what I said, then see a couple of hopeless proximities fly in from range 30 where my ally was sitting far, far behind, hanging me out to dry.  (This sort of sacrifice play never really worked until I teamed with John Vaughn, who just couldn't help tractorslugging in the NCC, which is just what I wanted.)

It was a great server, full of open possibilities and the ability to define your own objectives, but in turn that bred the anathematic phenomenon of gaming politics.  I tried to stay out of it, then made some strategic posts (some of which were quoted in the intercepts :P) and all of a sudden I was a commander.  I really didn't care about command and just wanted to pursue the oddball strategic opportunities I saw and learn to be an excellent pilot, so my basic instructions to my ersatz brigade were, "Go here, do this, I don't care how.  Oh and fly better."  I still like this style of leadership, and tried to use it again when I got shoehorned into CW3 Fed RM.  Well, on anyone who was listening.

It was great while it lasted.

Offline Capt Jeff

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #31 on: July 12, 2004, 05:24:53 am »
Hey MU, glad you could stop by and give some insight   :notworthy:
Too bad AF didn't have the Database cleaner we have now....we could of finished that thing and who knows how that would of affected the entire history of D2....


About the "tunnels"....remember, most settings were stock.  I think hexes were 10,15,20 and 30 for planets.   Hex DV changes were 5 DV a mission, so it didn't take much to munch a hex.  Also, hexhealth reset ratio was set to 100% so once you took a hex, it was yours at full strength.  No need to "bump up" a hex.   
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Offline Max Power

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #32 on: July 12, 2004, 07:12:16 am »
What Mu didn't mention is how he ususally ends up in leadership positions:

Player Base: "Crap, player X, where is he? He didn't send out instructions like he was supposed to. Now what are we supposed to do?"
Mu: "Uh, I dunno. Flop and twitch?"
Player Base: "That's a great idea! Let's put him in charge!"

Offline Gook

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #33 on: July 12, 2004, 07:47:06 am »
Hell, Mu Hi.

This whole AF thing started because someone found the Ranter page :)

Good to hear from you, so when you taking over the Feds ;)

Log on and have a game if you can find all the bits required now ;)



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Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #34 on: July 12, 2004, 07:47:40 am »
"OK I'm going for a sacrifice pass and get my ship damaged to drop his 1 and 2 shields and lock his vector down, follow on my 6 and exploit it so I can run and repair,"


Hmmm, sounds like me yelling at my wingman ;D

Mu!!!  It is great to see you back.   Check out GW 3 when it goes live later on this summer, I think you'll like it.
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Offline Gambler

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #35 on: July 12, 2004, 10:24:47 am »
That is what makes D2 inferior to my mind.  There is an inherent lack of fairness and equality in the D2, be it in terms of server numbers or mission match-ups.


I see, so what makes things fun for you is total balance.  In my opinion, it makes a better captain when you can win when the odds are against you.  A worse captain when you lose when they are stacked in your favor.
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Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #36 on: July 12, 2004, 10:38:52 am »
That is what makes D2 inferior to my mind.  There is an inherent lack of fairness and equality in the D2, be it in terms of server numbers or mission match-ups.


I see, so what makes things fun for you is total balance.  In my opinion, it makes a better captain when you can win when the odds are against you.  A worse captain when you lose when they are stacked in your favor.

I has nothing to do with being a captain Gambler, rarely do the numbers matter on the tactical level unless you are by yourself.  Heck, modern D2 rules even allow the out-numbered to defend their space against a large force if they are good captains.

Numbers affect the strategic aspect of D2 which has little to do with how good of a "captain" you are.

Hell, I never cared if I win or loose as long as it isn't a complete blowout or I am totally out-cheesed in PvP.  Loosing SS2 was a hell of a lot more fun than winning SG3.
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Offline SSCF-LeRoy

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #37 on: July 12, 2004, 11:31:13 am »
This whole AF thing started because someone found the Ranter page :)


*AHEM* <raises hand>

Lot's o' good stuff in yer website their there, Mu. I especially like the "Dumb Fed Tricks" page

Offline KBF-Crim

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #38 on: July 12, 2004, 01:16:51 pm »
This whole AF thing started because someone found the Ranter page :)


*AHEM* <raises hand>

Lot's o' good stuff in yer website their there, Mu. I especially like the "Dumb Fed Tricks" page


Muwhahahaha!...me too... ;D

Had it bookmarked for ages....

So now some of you know....I CANT read minds...But I can READ.... ;)

<snicker>



Offline [RK] Castrin

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #39 on: July 12, 2004, 06:17:24 pm »
don't care how much time you play on GSA nothing can match the pure adrenaline rush when you realize that you've drafted another player and are waiting for the mission to load.  Who will it be.  What will they be flying.  Who will be the wingmen.  Will they be AI or real?  Will it be a balanced mission or will you be outnumbered?

That is what makes D2 inferior to my mind.  There is an inherent lack of fairness and equality in the D2, be it in terms of server numbers or mission match-ups.

When has war ever been fair?

I'm sorry but to my memory the greatest battles have always been those that one side or the other have been missmatched. Only by heroic effort (or just dumb luck) did the smaller force win, usually it was the case that the side with the larger, better, equipment/ships/etc won.

I don't see how making sure that all battles are by equal units truly replicates the fog of war or the fact that war is inherently unbalanced. Maybe I'm missing something.

 8)
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Offline Lepton

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #40 on: July 12, 2004, 11:22:56 pm »
Bah, don't confuse war with an online game that people do in their leisure time.  Fairness and equity are essential in playing games.  If you're playing 5 card stud, the dealer doesn't get 7 cards just because he feels like making a better hand for himself.  You've all had it wrong from the very beginning.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2004, 02:36:17 am by Lepton »


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Offline Mu

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #41 on: July 13, 2004, 12:01:59 am »
Hell, Mu Hi.

This whole AF thing started because someone found the Ranter page :)

Good to hear from you, so when you taking over the Feds ;)

Log on and have a game if you can find all the bits required now ;)


Like I own OP.  I don't think it's even being pressed anymore.  :P

Offline Gook

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2004, 03:31:37 am »

Quote

Like I own OP.  I don't think it's even being pressed anymore.  :P

Feds here is your opportunity to really learn how to fly, get Mu a copy of OP.

Klinks, wanna see how really good you are? Get Mu a copy of OP.

No disrespect meant to Klinks or Feds, but a couple of games with Mu is worth a thousand tactical posts. I'd send him one, but had to get Soreyes to send me one when I came back .

I can see the matchup now Darkelf v Mu, now that would be worth a film and even a song or two :)

Never played DE myself, but evryone keeps telling me he is the King O the Hill, Klink wise


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Offline FPF-DieHard

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2004, 07:38:36 am »

Like I own OP.  I don't think it's even being pressed anymore.  :P

Yeah you do  ;D
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline KBF-Dogmatix_XC

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #44 on: July 13, 2004, 11:24:56 am »
This whole AF thing started because someone found the Ranter page :)


*AHEM* <raises hand>

Lot's o' good stuff in yer website their there, Mu. I especially like the "Dumb Fed Tricks" page



Damn straight Mu's website r0xx0rs!!!1!!!11!!!



BTW, Mu, good to see you around again!


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Offline KBF-Dogmatix_XC

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #45 on: July 13, 2004, 11:40:05 am »

Quote

Like I own OP.  I don't think it's even being pressed anymore.  :P

Feds here is your opportunity to really learn how to fly, get Mu a copy of OP.

Klinks, wanna see how really good you are? Get Mu a copy of OP.

No disrespect meant to Klinks or Feds, but a couple of games with Mu is worth a thousand tactical posts. I'd send him one, but had to get Soreyes to send me one when I came back .

I can see the matchup now Darkelf v Mu, now that would be worth a film and even a song or two :)

Never played DE myself, but evryone keeps telling me he is the King O the Hill, Klink wise





Indeed...it's been ages, but I've had soem good matches against ole Mu...


MadElf won't like you refering to him as DarkElf...heheh.  He might come looking for you.  ;)
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Offline Capt_Bearslayer_XC

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #46 on: July 13, 2004, 11:46:26 am »




MadElf won't like you refering to him as DarkElf...heheh.  He might come looking for you.  ;)

Yeah, but we know Dark.... I mean Angry Pix... I mean MadElf will drop.... :P

Damn 56k'ers!!   :-\
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Offline KBF-Dogmatix_XC

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #47 on: July 13, 2004, 12:31:30 pm »




MadElf won't like you refering to him as DarkElf...heheh.  He might come looking for you.  ;)

Yeah, but we know Dark.... I mean Angry Pix... I mean MadElf will drop.... :P

Damn 56k'ers!!   :-\



Heh...lucky for you he drops, eh?   heheh...


Dogmatix, XC, KBF
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Offline Gook

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #48 on: July 13, 2004, 12:38:36 pm »

Quote

Like I own OP.  I don't think it's even being pressed anymore.  :P

Feds here is your opportunity to really learn how to fly, get Mu a copy of OP.

Klinks, wanna see how really good you are? Get Mu a copy of OP.

No disrespect meant to Klinks or Feds, but a couple of games with Mu is worth a thousand tactical posts. I'd send him one, but had to get Soreyes to send me one when I came back .

I can see the matchup now Darkelf v Mu, now that would be worth a film and even a song or two :)

Never played DE myself, but evryone keeps telling me he is the King O the Hill, Klink wise





Indeed...it's been ages, but I've had soem good matches against ole Mu...


MadElf won't like you refering to him as DarkElf...heheh.  He might come looking for you.  ;)



Ooops looks like I got the GreyGnome after me ;) Ooops I mean Looney Lep  ;D ;D ;D ;D
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.....Eurypides



Offline KAT MRess

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #49 on: July 13, 2004, 02:21:25 pm »
This led to the unfortunate fact that if I won the mission but my wingman survived, the defense value of the hex would go UP, not down.   We ISC became quite adept at getting our AI wingmen killed before the end of the mission.

AHA!

So that's where Maverick learned to fly!


BTW: the map was 100 x 100 hexes. 10,000 in total!

Once everyone figured out the Kzin/Mirak might actually win, they all turned on us! Sheesh, can you imagine the insult if we had. If I recall correctly, every server after that which had the same setup, everyone seemed to want to hit the Kzin right off the bat. Stop us before we got started.

Now why would they want to do that? (scratches head)


The main attraction for me WAS the fact that you never knew what you were getting when you pulled a mission. You had to be able to fly anything with little or no preperation at all. No preset games with equal footing, you had to master everything and fly against all odds and situations. I guess that debate still rages.

Still they was the first ones (there were 3 of them all told, gook outlined the third) that truly came close to "Hundreds of online opponents". The most I ever saw online simultaneously were 106.

Everything after that was a lot more organized, but for pure chaotic power-shifting pandemonium, you couldn't beat those servers.
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Offline Gambler

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #50 on: July 13, 2004, 03:02:37 pm »
This led to the unfortunate fact that if I won the mission but my wingman survived, the defense value of the hex would go UP, not down.   We ISC became quite adept at getting our AI wingmen killed before the end of the mission.

AHA!

So that's where Maverick learned to fly!


BTW: the map was 100 x 100 hexes. 10,000 in total!

Once everyone figured out the Kzin/Mirak might actually win, they all turned on us! Sheesh, can you imagine the insult if we had. If I recall correctly, every server after that which had the same setup, everyone seemed to want to hit the Kzin right off the bat. Stop us before we got started.

Would you believe that the ISC kept track in a meticulous fashion as the the game year?  We wanted to know well in advance when to expect a change in the drone speed, both from you guys and the Feddies.
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Offline SPQR Renegade

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #51 on: July 14, 2004, 03:29:23 am »

CW5 the Klinks should have won, and you are right they lost because of spying. None Pacified RMs were under NDA from Rommies (we didn't know how much info we were gonna get) when I realised it was the while shooting match I kinda leaked clues on Taldren, that we knew, Socky picked that up, but was apparently overuled. The Klink missions which succeded were BM ones which they didn't tell the hierachy about, and thus Hydraxx fell to Squiggy and 2  or 3 other 69ers, Khemarrah and Maz I think, could be wrong. Lyraa we learned about at last minute and managed to hold it for a long while, but it fell. Gorns we knew everything and thud they held, then we switched to ISC homeworld. I know the Klinks were well pi$$ed at the Rommies afterwards.

As a whole, we dumped the spying as soon as Canada West outlawed it. We weren't happy about it, but we did it. There were still a few who kept at it, and when word of that got out within the SPQR, it was nearly the end. More than half the fleet was ready to walk over it.

In hind site, I think that moment was the beginning of the end for the SPQR. Numbers went up and down after that, but it was never the same; Romulans are sneaky bastards, and that's what we wanted to be. With out that, we were nothing but thin skinned Gorn with a God complex and stylish haircuts. Oh the shame...

Offline Sirgod

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #52 on: July 14, 2004, 08:50:55 am »

CW5 the Klinks should have won, and you are right they lost because of spying. None Pacified RMs were under NDA from Rommies (we didn't know how much info we were gonna get) when I realised it was the while shooting match I kinda leaked clues on Taldren, that we knew, Socky picked that up, but was apparently overuled. The Klink missions which succeded were BM ones which they didn't tell the hierachy about, and thus Hydraxx fell to Squiggy and 2  or 3 other 69ers, Khemarrah and Maz I think, could be wrong. Lyraa we learned about at last minute and managed to hold it for a long while, but it fell. Gorns we knew everything and thud they held, then we switched to ISC homeworld. I know the Klinks were well pi$$ed at the Rommies afterwards.


As a whole, we dumped the spying as soon as Canada West outlawed it. We weren't happy about it, but we did it. There were still a few who kept at it, and when word of that got out within the SPQR, it was nearly the end. More than half the fleet was ready to walk over it.

In hind site, I think that moment was the beginning of the end for the SPQR. Numbers went up and down after that, but it was never the same; Romulans are sneaky bastards, and that's what we wanted to be. With out that, we were nothing but thin skinned Gorn with a God complex and stylish haircuts. Oh the shame...


You think the Gorn where Bad, The Kzinn started a whole New Propaganda Campain.



Stephen
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Offline EdCase 1AF (Ret.)

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #53 on: July 18, 2004, 08:44:41 pm »
Ummmm...
               All I can say is, what long memories you have. *Nods to Durin*  . Speaking as the original co-founder of the 1AF I must say it was indeed one of our finest (to that point ) hours.
                Glad to see the fleet lives on. For those who knew us.....
                      Tanked-Up  and I still game together on a regular basis (with some muttering about a return to SFC play.) The others amongst the "originals" have for one reason or another gone their seperate ways.

   Minor correction-- Chay Mareyn did NOT in fact participate in this server. Though he was a valued fleetmate.


Offline SkyFlyer

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #54 on: July 19, 2004, 01:41:28 am »
No offense lepton, but do you always have to pee on everything?
Sometimes the game is unfair, because it is a WAR SIMULATION!

Ah well... whats the point... :)

Wish I was part of AF... and yes diehard, SS was fun, but so was SG3 :)

And welcome back Mu.
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Offline Capt Jeff

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #55 on: July 19, 2004, 05:31:37 am »
Ummmm...
               All I can say is, what long memories you have. *Nods to Durin*  . Speaking as the original co-founder of the 1AF I must say it was indeed one of our finest (to that point ) hours.
                Glad to see the fleet lives on. For those who knew us.....
                      Tanked-Up  and I still game together on a regular basis (with some muttering about a return to SFC play.)



Glad to see you around Ed !  Your ships have been kept in perfect condition in dock in the hope that they once more would be called to duty if you guys ever have the "itch" again....  ;D
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Offline Durin

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #56 on: July 19, 2004, 06:21:58 pm »
Ummmm...
               All I can say is, what long memories you have. *Nods to Durin*  . Speaking as the original co-founder of the 1AF I must say it was indeed one of our finest (to that point ) hours.
                Glad to see the fleet lives on. For those who knew us.....
                      Tanked-Up  and I still game together on a regular basis (with some muttering about a return to SFC play.) The others amongst the "originals" have for one reason or another gone their seperate ways.

   Minor correction-- Chay Mareyn did NOT in fact participate in this server. Though he was a valued fleetmate.




Hey Ed, its real good to hear from you again.I hope both you and Tanked get the Itch again.

Offline C-Los

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Re: History for those interested Artic Fire (long)
« Reply #57 on: July 20, 2004, 07:02:33 am »
YES....Sir Case, grab up Sir Tanked and give it a spin again.....

Would love to fly wing with you guys... ;D
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