Topic: Litterbox 5 shiplist / modelpack installer for test server

[Lepton]

Is there a test server up yet??

[Fluf]

almost got it.  Give me 30 mins and Ill get a test server up.

Will be using stock missions for now.  Might do a mission pack later this weekend, but right now, until I hear some bugs are squished, we are going stock missions.

[Green]

almost got it.  Give me 30 mins and Ill get a test server up.

Will be using stock missions for now.  Might do a mission pack later this weekend, but right now, until I hear some bugs are squished, we are going stock missions.

Copy Fluf, you posted the above at 2059, I'll let ya slide and will log in at 2130 ... hey, I hear ya got a pie baking, so I'll spot ya 30 seconds to pull it out of the oven.

[Dizzy]

Ok, im confused now... What will the LB5 installer do to my models folders?

[Fluf]

It will copy your stock model folders, and make new ones in a DIPModels folders, giving you new models for different classes. 

[Dizzy]

So it copies ONLY the STOCK model folders and creates new folders from them? That part is safe. So this is compatible with 3.3 despite it having changed geometries from 3.0 to 3.3? What about when it tries to load a ship that has the changed 3.3 geometry?

Do I need to backup my Models folder? Or is the instal benign and doesnt mess with any existing folders. Also, how do I get rid of the LB5 folders? You didnt copy them into the Models folder, did you?

[Julin Eurthyr]

Okay.

When LB5 is installed over an OP+ installation, this is what happens:

1.  OP+ files (shiplist, fighterlist, strings shipname and model.siz) are backed up.

2.  The Litterbox ones are put into place.

3.  The DIPModels folder is created.  The new ship folders are populated from the contents of the stock OP model directories (ie, the F-NCA folder copies the content of the current FCL folder.  Whether this is the stock Miranda, or a replacement ship doesn't matter.  I use Fleetdock 13 models in my stock folders, and they copy perfectly well.  OP+ models in the OP+ directory are not even touched.

The DIP shiplist does not reference, call, or interact with the OP+ model folder in any way, shape or form.  It's existance (or lack thereof) does not affect LB5/DIP in the least.

If you put the Litterbox shiplists into the "other mod" folder of the shiplist chooser, you can use the chooser to swap freely between OP+ and LB5, theoretically using 2 completely different model sets (outside of what stock folders are referenced by both OP+ and LB5...

Found other questions:

The installer does not do anything with the contents of the stock models folder, other than copy files from them.  Yes, it is benign...

The DIP folders are in a special directory, separate from the stock models and the OP+ models.  In a full OP+ / LB5 installation, you'll have models in 3 places.

LB5 folders are currently designed to disappear with the uninstallation of LB5.  Eventually, we hope to have the DIP folders remain on the hard drive permanently while the shiplist may change from campaign to campaign.  This is the long term vision that is always subject to change (we might eventually re-write the DIP shiplist to reference the OP+ folders

[KBFLordKrueg]

So it copies ONLY the STOCK model folders and creates new folders from them? That part is safe. So this is compatible with 3.3 despite it having changed geometries from 3.0 to 3.3? What about when it tries to load a ship that has the changed 3.3 geometry?

Do I need to backup my Models folder? Or is the instal benign and doesnt mess with any existing folders. Also, how do I get rid of the LB5 folders? You didnt copy them into the Models folder, did you?

I think ya making it way more complicated than it is, Dizzy. I downloaded LB5 stuff, played for a while, then ran the uninstaller and played on another server. No problems, everything was just the way I left it.

[Dizzy]

The installer does not do anything with the contents of the stock models folder, other than copy files from them.  Yes, it is benign...

The DIP folders are in a special directory, separate from the stock models and the OP+ models.  In a full OP+ / LB5 installation, you'll have models in 3 places.

LB5 folders are currently designed to disappear with the uninstallation of LB5.  Eventually, we hope to have the DIP folders remain on the hard drive permanently while the shiplist may change from campaign to campaign.  This is the long term vision that is always subject to change (we might eventually re-write the DIP shiplist to reference the OP+ folders

TY for clarifying. Now I understand. Now about how many more folders are created and can you estimate the approximate size of the final install?

I think ya making it way more complicated than it is, Dizzy. I downloaded LB5 stuff, played for a while, then ran the uninstaller and played on another server. No problems, everything was just the way I left it.

MB I did, LK, but it's more important than you may realize, especially to a server designer such as myself. See, ever since SG3 when S'Cipio, Karnak, and I started this new models folder creation thing, it has been copied and improved upon by about every server since. The problem with RDSL and SG3 was that it added folders to the stock directories. When FS did it, he did it right by adding his models in a seperate folder leaving the stock OP Models alone. For SG4, we are doing the same thing. A few extra folders are created, mostly for the new PF models. It is also a benign installation.

But the thing that is most important to me is what I can steal from LB5 for SG4. And if they have a DIP model folders standard that works good, I should try and refine it and use it in SG4. I mean, that is their intent, for it to become a standard installation for D2, coexisting with OP+.

And perhaps all this discussion should have taken place in a Dev forum for us server admins to figure out, it has shed light for others that are familiar with this process so they know not to be worried about what a new server install kit will do to your game and the way it is setup.

Lessons have been learned. SG3 (because we didnt know any better) and RDSL all messed with the stock directory. And there were problems getting rid of it. Now, with the implementation of copying to new folders, you eliminate the risk of corrupting your game. That's what it's all about. A perfectly safe install, one that is idiot proof, installs and uninstalls without complication and is one smooth operator. Seems like that's what the LB5 installation program is like from what I have read. We will see.

[TotensBurntCorpse]

Alliances on the test server?

seems the mirak are not allied with the roms/isc/hydrans

I BLAME FLUF!

So much for baking pies !

[Julin Eurthyr]

Diz:

Early in the installation process, back when I was testing on a purely stock install, I measured an 130 MB increase in the size of the SFC game folder.

I've added a folder or 2 since then, and now I'm testing directly into my main play folder, as I prefer to test live instead of under sanitized conditions.  Unfortunately, that style won't let me gauge properly the actual increase, since I am a fan of TOS / SFB ships instead of the TMP style that comes with the game.  I don't think I'm adding more than 150-200 mb on to a purely stock install.

All that from just a bit over 300k of installer...  Nice to see the 56k-ers aren't having a problem (or waiting a day) to get onto the test server, eh?

Have you installed the package?  Go to <game>/dipmodels/models and count the folders in there.  That's all the ships (and PFs) that I've added.  I've got to write a readme with the whole model list spelled out one of these days...  Though, off the top of my head, I think each race got enouugh folders so between stock and DIPmodels they got about 14-15 model folders each.  Primary goal was to get a folder for FF, FFB, DD, DW, CL, CW, CA, NCA, BCH, DN, BB, CVL, CV, CVA, TUG, LTT.  Rommies got a 2nd (Starhawk) PF folder, and the LDR got a lot more folders, including their PF.  I've even started expanding the Pirate selection...