Topic: Making SFC3 Bases More Realistic

[Daew Anahos]

Just a observation...

If you attack a fixed instillation e.g. Battle Station let's say you get smacked around and have to book to save your Ark Royal class BB (Playing the awesome Nuetral Zone mod...see the D3 forum if interested) but before you book you managed to wipe out all four enemy ships protecting the station and a defense platform.

Now thinking logically, when you return to the base, you should find it missing the four ships and one defense platform you vaped --- but the enemy fixed instillations are always back at full strength!  

Is there a way to update the bases so that when you return to attack it - it reflects the damage already inflicted upon it? This would be more realisitic.

Thanks In Advance!  

[jdmckinney]

Actually, wouldn't they have had as much time to repair and rebuild as you took to get back to base for repair? I would think building simple defense platforms and rerouting of defensive fleets would be about as easy as repairing and reorganizing an attack fleet, unless you have separate fleets taking turns running at the base. Since it is a bit of a toss-up, the simplicity of the script seems the easiest way out. I don't think the DB can capture hex base damage status, since it is generating a base rather than using a specific one, like it does with AI ships -- but I could be very wrong.

[NuclearWessels]

Yes, the scripts only draw the main bases from the dynaverse - they automatically fill in the smaller platforms and additional defenders from scratch each time.

The scripts simply don't have any way to communicate the state of supporting defense platforms and whatnot from one mission to the next.  The same holds for any AI defender ships that get spontaneously generated for the mission (as opposed to the drafted player/AI participants).

Essentially the only way the info could be communicated is if all the defending elements in a hex are drafted participants - but that quickly slams you up against the limits for the number of drafted participants in a mission (1 base, a few platforms, and 1 defender ship would only leave one ship slot for the attacking fleet!)

I guess if someone got ambitious enough to have the mission scripts and an SQL server interacting (as per some of the D2 discussions TraceyG, Darkelf and others were pursuing) then you could work around it, but that will be a HUGE undertaking.

dave

   

[Daew Anahos]

Quote:
Actually, wouldn't they have had as much time to repair and rebuild as you took to get back to base for repair? I would think building simple defense platforms and rerouting of defensive fleets would be about as easy as repairing and reorganizing an attack fleet, unless you have separate fleets taking turns running at the base. Since it is a bit of a toss-up, the simplicity of the script seems the easiest way out. I don't think the DB can capture hex base damage status, since it is generating a base rather than using a specific one, like it does with AI ships -- but I could be very wrong.  

Thanks for the responses, Nomad and Evil Dave, could some kind of routine be included in the database that adjusts the order of battle for the base hex based on how much the defense value is raised or lowered to at least take an actual stab at reflecting the effects of an attack?  

[NuclearWessels]

Unfortunately, no, the scripts have no way of asking for that kind of information - they are VERY limited in their ability to communicate with the DB.  I mean VERY EXTREMELY limited.  Pretty much they can only ask the DB whose territory the mission takes place in and what kind of terrain should be around.  For ships/bases they can basically just say either:
(a) draft any nearby dynaverse ship in size range X-Y, or
(b) create the following ships out of thin air ....

The game engine then sends them whatever it decides on, but doesn't give the scripts any other information.  

dave


 

[ChamadaIV]

"Realistic" eh? That is a fallacy if ever there was one. "Logical" would be a more, heh  , logical choice.    

IMO of course....

not to be rude or anything....    

[Daew Anahos]

Just a observation...

If you attack a fixed instillation e.g. Battle Station let's say you get smacked around and have to book to save your Ark Royal class BB (Playing the awesome Nuetral Zone mod...see the D3 forum if interested) but before you book you managed to wipe out all four enemy ships protecting the station and a defense platform.

Now thinking logically, when you return to the base, you should find it missing the four ships and one defense platform you vaped --- but the enemy fixed instillations are always back at full strength!  

Is there a way to update the bases so that when you return to attack it - it reflects the damage already inflicted upon it? This would be more realisitic.

Thanks In Advance!  

[jdmckinney]

Actually, wouldn't they have had as much time to repair and rebuild as you took to get back to base for repair? I would think building simple defense platforms and rerouting of defensive fleets would be about as easy as repairing and reorganizing an attack fleet, unless you have separate fleets taking turns running at the base. Since it is a bit of a toss-up, the simplicity of the script seems the easiest way out. I don't think the DB can capture hex base damage status, since it is generating a base rather than using a specific one, like it does with AI ships -- but I could be very wrong.

[NuclearWessels]

Yes, the scripts only draw the main bases from the dynaverse - they automatically fill in the smaller platforms and additional defenders from scratch each time.

The scripts simply don't have any way to communicate the state of supporting defense platforms and whatnot from one mission to the next.  The same holds for any AI defender ships that get spontaneously generated for the mission (as opposed to the drafted player/AI participants).

Essentially the only way the info could be communicated is if all the defending elements in a hex are drafted participants - but that quickly slams you up against the limits for the number of drafted participants in a mission (1 base, a few platforms, and 1 defender ship would only leave one ship slot for the attacking fleet!)

I guess if someone got ambitious enough to have the mission scripts and an SQL server interacting (as per some of the D2 discussions TraceyG, Darkelf and others were pursuing) then you could work around it, but that will be a HUGE undertaking.

dave

   

[Daew Anahos]

Quote:
Actually, wouldn't they have had as much time to repair and rebuild as you took to get back to base for repair? I would think building simple defense platforms and rerouting of defensive fleets would be about as easy as repairing and reorganizing an attack fleet, unless you have separate fleets taking turns running at the base. Since it is a bit of a toss-up, the simplicity of the script seems the easiest way out. I don't think the DB can capture hex base damage status, since it is generating a base rather than using a specific one, like it does with AI ships -- but I could be very wrong.  

Thanks for the responses, Nomad and Evil Dave, could some kind of routine be included in the database that adjusts the order of battle for the base hex based on how much the defense value is raised or lowered to at least take an actual stab at reflecting the effects of an attack?  

[NuclearWessels]

Unfortunately, no, the scripts have no way of asking for that kind of information - they are VERY limited in their ability to communicate with the DB.  I mean VERY EXTREMELY limited.  Pretty much they can only ask the DB whose territory the mission takes place in and what kind of terrain should be around.  For ships/bases they can basically just say either:
(a) draft any nearby dynaverse ship in size range X-Y, or
(b) create the following ships out of thin air ....

The game engine then sends them whatever it decides on, but doesn't give the scripts any other information.  

dave


 

[ChamadaIV]

"Realistic" eh? That is a fallacy if ever there was one. "Logical" would be a more, heh  , logical choice.    

IMO of course....

not to be rude or anything....