Topic: Just out of Curiosity

[theRomulan]

To start off, I love SFC3.  However, having played SFC2 for a while, and getting used to how the combat system works, I just have a few questions about how SFC3 has changed.  

First, is it just me, or is alpha striking really the only way to go?  Being on the dynaverse, playing one on one, etc., it seems like the age of picking your opponent apart from a distance is gone.  Perhaps because the shield reinforcement system is different, etc., it just seems like hitting someone lightly doesn't make much a difference.  

Second, but what about targetting other components of a starship.  I mean, I can understand how we wouldn't want a game where it's very easy to just destroy the warp core.  As it stands now, it can be done at a reasonable span of time, but I don't think it's too easy.  However, what's the significance of even targetting the other weapon systems?  I mean, it's actually harder for me to destroy the sensors than it is to hurt the warp core. Also, why target single weapons when you can hardly stun them unless you alpha strike something to death?  I mean, mizia always had a place in SFC2, and I wonder if it still exists in SFC3.  I try mizia, I even try to destroying parts of the ship other than the warp core, but unless I've got a legendary crew with multivolley torpedoes smacking into something, I hardly produce results.  In my opinion, we should be given at least some good reason to target weapon systems, right now it's not worth the time and energy compared to more vital things.  Or at least that's what it seems like.

Otherwise, I like the game.  But, oh, wait, just one more question.  What's the use of the erratic maneuvers in this game? I mean, ECM stuff is gone, and everything works on the angular velocity, and I understand that system pretty well, but I'm not quite picking up the usefulness of using EM.  

Either way, I really enjoy the customization and such.  I was never a fan of the 180+ ships in SFC2, because regardless of the hardcore fans opinions, I rarely encountered variety of ships, and there was always a hot 8-10 from each race.  Different looking hulls are cool... but I can live without them.  The cloaking is good, so long as it is tweaked to be just a smidgen better, yada yada yad.  Someone please just post back with some information as to whether mizia strikes, targetting smaller weapon systems, and using EM is useful or not, and how it's done.  That'll make me happy.    

[Vysander]

Quote:

First, is it just me, or is alpha striking really the only way to go?  Being on the dynaverse, playing one on one, etc., it seems like the age of picking your opponent apart from a distance is gone.  Perhaps because the shield reinforcement system is different, etc., it just seems like hitting someone lightly doesn't make much a difference.  

agree... while with the top of the line weapons I can sometimes register a good hit in at range 20+, nothing is decisive unless it's at range 3.  Not to mention running away is ridiculously easy in this game.  Patch should help the shield reinforcement as it drains the other 3 shields by some 30%.

Quote:
Second, but what about targetting other components of a starship.  I mean, I can understand how we wouldn't want a game where it's very easy to just destroy the warp core.  As it stands now, it can be done at a reasonable span of time, but I don't think it's too easy.  However, what's the significance of even targetting the other weapon systems?  I mean, it's actually harder for me to destroy the sensors than it is to hurt the warp core. Also, why target single weapons when you can hardly stun them unless you alpha strike something to death?  I mean, mizia always had a place in SFC2, and I wonder if it still exists in SFC3.  I try mizia, I even try to destroying parts of the ship other than the warp core, but unless I've got a legendary crew with multivolley torpedoes smacking into something, I hardly produce results.  In my opinion, we should be given at least some good reason to target weapon systems, right now it's not worth the time and energy compared to more vital things.  Or at least that's what it seems like.

there's 3 things I target... warp core, impulse, tractor.  Mostly the warp core and the other two as needed...  I've never seen mizia to work to any extent.. I will blow apart the ship before I nail even one weapon when targetting hull in general.  Patch will help with that as it actually decreases damage of the weapon as it goes yellow and red.

Quote:
Otherwise, I like the game.  But, oh, wait, just one more question.  What's the use of the erratic maneuvers in this game? I mean, ECM stuff is gone, and everything works on the angular velocity, and I understand that system pretty well, but I'm not quite picking up the usefulness of using EM.  

i'd only use it as a smaller nimble ship... anything over CA size and it doesn't seem to help a bit.  I think it just adds a bit to AV.

So yep... we're all waiting for the patch

[Whiplash]

Alpha strike is definitely the primary tactic these days. You can be further out and still be effective compared to SFC2 alphas, but its still basically an alpha strike.

I only ever target warp core. I tried targeting impulse engines for a while on small ships, but they never slowed down. I'm not sure what good it does. Warp core seems to hurt their power, and power is still critical for fighting in this game. I have not yet seen anything else really worth targeting.

W.
 

[Firestorm]

I've seen many go after my cloak first, then the warp core.

[grey one]

Re picking you opponent apart from a distance. I haven't tried this online (my game machine isn't on the net
{I know, for shame}) but it works in single player, both campaign and conquest.
  A ship with 3 forward Quantum Torps, and at least class 5 shields can sit at about 40 from a star base
and take it down. Having 3 XIIF phasers also helps. Obviously first you have to take out the mobile opponents,
 then the defenesive platforms. The platforms can be treated like the star base.  

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Quote:
Re picking you opponent apart from a distance. I haven't tried this online (my game machine isn't on the net
{I know, for shame}) but it works in single player, both campaign and conquest.
   

No human with a clue would let you do this. This is another tactic that works well (particulary against Borg) against AI. A human will anticipate and use warp to close.  

[D. Boon's Ghost]

Quote:
Re picking you opponent apart from a distance. I haven't tried this online (my game machine isn't on the net
{I know, for shame}) but it works in single player, both campaign and conquest.
  A ship with 3 forward Quantum Torps, and at least class 5 shields can sit at about 40 from a star base
and take it down...

I am sure I am wrong on this, but no other race has anything that resembles the Federation Q-torps.  A respected player mentioned last evening, that he sits out at a range of 60 to snipe.  60!  (ugh)
As a Romulan, I can only dream... and stick with alphas.  

   

[Thanos1]

Quote:
I've seen many go after my cloak first, then the warp core.  

Well, that's mostly because if you try to repair the cloak...you lose all repair capability.

-suleo  

[Aenigma]

I read sometime ago, that they are going to beef up starbases a bit in the patch, so that you can't snipe them anymore. They get weapons with range 50 or 60, don't know exactly, but sniping was no longer possible.

Quote:
  Originally posted by: D. Boon's Ghost

I am sure I am wrong on this, but no other race has anything that resembles the Federation Q-torps. A respected player mentioned last evening, that he sits out at a range of 60 to snipe. 60! (ugh)
As a Romulan, I can only dream... and stick with alphas.

Yes we Romulans have to use this tactic, it is the only tactic that ensures victory......... or at least survival.

Aenigma  

[grey one]

Quote:

Quote:
Re picking you opponent apart from a distance. I haven't tried this online (my game machine isn't on the net
{I know, for shame}) but it works in single player, both campaign and conquest.
   

No human with a clue would let you do this. This is another tactic that works well (particulary against Borg) against AI. A human will anticipate and use warp to close.    

I'm not sure how a human player (as opposed to Fed) would stop you with only immobile installations left. I admit that I don't see this as useful for other races (maybe the Klinks with their own super torp) but it was addressed to the question of slowly picking an opponent appart.  

[theRomulan]

Quantums are powerful weapons, and you can theoretically snipe people with them, but at the same time, the best stradegy is just to close distance with the person.  Plus, quantum torps take longer to recharge and fire again, so it isn't too hard to get close enough and prevent sniping.  

Also, Quantums are heavy weapons.  I know in SFC2 a klingon distruptor was also a heavy weapon, but keep in mind that it wasn't really that heavy at all.  However, quantums are pretty heavy, their like enhanced weapons.  

When I talk about sniping tactics, I'm talking about using standard weapons, like a photon, disruptors, or phasers.  In SFC2, using phasers from a certain range and picking shields apart was a good tactic for the opponent that like to run all day, or if he relied on plasma.  Photon's on proximit were okay, but klingons liked to use disruptors like this a lot.  

However, in SFC3, I have never seen anyone use mizia attacks to drain shields.  Is it my imagination, or are ships just a little strong in this game?  I mean, it takes me years to pound a bird of prey  down using plasma weapons.  I can wreck the entire ship and STILL have to pound him to death... with alpha strikes.  Targetting subsystems isn't effective at all either; there's no point to hitting anything except the warp core.  

Hopefully, in the patch, people will stop concentrating so much on cloak and shields so much, and realize that there are still a lot of the smaller details in this game that need to fleshed out.  Subsystem targeting is a good idea, pending there's actual strategic value to targetting something smaller than the warp core.  I can understand why it should take alpha strikes to knock out the warp core, i mean, it powers the entier ship, controls all functions.  But when I have to alpha strike a feds photon torpedoes just to get it stunned, or take out a small phaser 9 in the aft section, that's a waste of power.  I would be better off inhibiting all the power systems with that much firepower than I would taking out one measley phaser that he can repair in two shakes.  

My proposal would bee this: keep the warp core damage rates the same, but decrease the damage needed for the other systems.  Right now, it's actually harder to inhibit sensors than it is to get the warp core.  Impulse engines also take longer to knock out.  ?!?!  I already mentioned the weapons.  If we could stun weapons using ONE weapon instead of all weapons, then there'd be value in multi targetting subsystems, mizia strikes would bcome back into play, only become more surgical in nature.  You knock out or stun the systems you want.  Impulse engines... it would be great if the slower ships actually had a very good chance of slowing down their opponent, right now you might as well target... surprise... the warp core.  

I know that the ability to knock out or stun weapons easily would mean that unshielded ships would be in serious trouble, but who cares?  It's getting ridiculous how I can practically total an entire ship, but the only thing I was able to truly damage was their warp core.  They still have a chance ot come back after i've been whooping on them for several minutes.  Anyway, I'm glad that the patch will address the super shielding issues we got going on, with that reinforcement ability, and the cloaking device issue too.  But the mizia strike needs to come back.  I think SFC3 has potential to make them more dangerous than before.  SFC2 had mizia, but it went and weakened mizia by giving everyone double internals.  I never like that.  What was the point of a photon if everyone got double internals.  WE couldn't complain so much about the photon if it was able to knock out subsystems the way it should.  SFC3 has got the problem even worse.  It's like weaons have triple internals or something, and the warp core double.  Give us the single internals, an I think sub system targetting will become a valid tactic.  

Oh yeah, and I love Taldren's work.  I'm a fan.  

[Draco]

There is a very good reason for targeting all systems. If you only target a warp core it will be the only thing under repair, thus the target only uses one or two repair parts, provided you are hitting it while it is still under repair. If you target all systems then in order to keep at near maximum effectiveness your opponent will have to spend more repair parts. Their only other real option is to hold back on repairs incase you start firing on the warp core, if they stick with this then you will quickly find a target with a nice blind spot for you to sit in. Once they are out of spare parts you can damage and destroy their weapons, and they can?t do anything to stop you. Plus it is more fun, try it on an AI a few times. Spread the damage across as many systems as you can, but make sure you do at least one alpha strike to knock down their armor. This is most easily done if you have a speedy fast firing phaser boat, leave the heavy slots for what ever happens to fit in the space left over. I would recommend mines if your ship is faster that 40.  

[Robb Stark]

You definitely shouldn't start targeting subsystems until you have a downed shield and have eaten through the enemy's armor - you lose accuracy when you don't target Hull, and it isn't doing you any good until you get those defenses down.  

Personally, I think the subsystems are too durable right now.  I would love to see the results of a mod where the health of all the subsystems was reduced - except perhaps the Warp and Impulse cores.  Right now, there's hardly any benefit to targeting a specific weapon, for instance, and I think there should be.  The weapons simply take too long to destroy.  

[theRomulan]

To start off, I love SFC3.  However, having played SFC2 for a while, and getting used to how the combat system works, I just have a few questions about how SFC3 has changed.  

First, is it just me, or is alpha striking really the only way to go?  Being on the dynaverse, playing one on one, etc., it seems like the age of picking your opponent apart from a distance is gone.  Perhaps because the shield reinforcement system is different, etc., it just seems like hitting someone lightly doesn't make much a difference.  

Second, but what about targetting other components of a starship.  I mean, I can understand how we wouldn't want a game where it's very easy to just destroy the warp core.  As it stands now, it can be done at a reasonable span of time, but I don't think it's too easy.  However, what's the significance of even targetting the other weapon systems?  I mean, it's actually harder for me to destroy the sensors than it is to hurt the warp core. Also, why target single weapons when you can hardly stun them unless you alpha strike something to death?  I mean, mizia always had a place in SFC2, and I wonder if it still exists in SFC3.  I try mizia, I even try to destroying parts of the ship other than the warp core, but unless I've got a legendary crew with multivolley torpedoes smacking into something, I hardly produce results.  In my opinion, we should be given at least some good reason to target weapon systems, right now it's not worth the time and energy compared to more vital things.  Or at least that's what it seems like.

Otherwise, I like the game.  But, oh, wait, just one more question.  What's the use of the erratic maneuvers in this game? I mean, ECM stuff is gone, and everything works on the angular velocity, and I understand that system pretty well, but I'm not quite picking up the usefulness of using EM.  

Either way, I really enjoy the customization and such.  I was never a fan of the 180+ ships in SFC2, because regardless of the hardcore fans opinions, I rarely encountered variety of ships, and there was always a hot 8-10 from each race.  Different looking hulls are cool... but I can live without them.  The cloaking is good, so long as it is tweaked to be just a smidgen better, yada yada yad.  Someone please just post back with some information as to whether mizia strikes, targetting smaller weapon systems, and using EM is useful or not, and how it's done.  That'll make me happy.    

[Vysander]

Quote:

First, is it just me, or is alpha striking really the only way to go?  Being on the dynaverse, playing one on one, etc., it seems like the age of picking your opponent apart from a distance is gone.  Perhaps because the shield reinforcement system is different, etc., it just seems like hitting someone lightly doesn't make much a difference.  

agree... while with the top of the line weapons I can sometimes register a good hit in at range 20+, nothing is decisive unless it's at range 3.  Not to mention running away is ridiculously easy in this game.  Patch should help the shield reinforcement as it drains the other 3 shields by some 30%.

Quote:
Second, but what about targetting other components of a starship.  I mean, I can understand how we wouldn't want a game where it's very easy to just destroy the warp core.  As it stands now, it can be done at a reasonable span of time, but I don't think it's too easy.  However, what's the significance of even targetting the other weapon systems?  I mean, it's actually harder for me to destroy the sensors than it is to hurt the warp core. Also, why target single weapons when you can hardly stun them unless you alpha strike something to death?  I mean, mizia always had a place in SFC2, and I wonder if it still exists in SFC3.  I try mizia, I even try to destroying parts of the ship other than the warp core, but unless I've got a legendary crew with multivolley torpedoes smacking into something, I hardly produce results.  In my opinion, we should be given at least some good reason to target weapon systems, right now it's not worth the time and energy compared to more vital things.  Or at least that's what it seems like.

there's 3 things I target... warp core, impulse, tractor.  Mostly the warp core and the other two as needed...  I've never seen mizia to work to any extent.. I will blow apart the ship before I nail even one weapon when targetting hull in general.  Patch will help with that as it actually decreases damage of the weapon as it goes yellow and red.

Quote:
Otherwise, I like the game.  But, oh, wait, just one more question.  What's the use of the erratic maneuvers in this game? I mean, ECM stuff is gone, and everything works on the angular velocity, and I understand that system pretty well, but I'm not quite picking up the usefulness of using EM.  

i'd only use it as a smaller nimble ship... anything over CA size and it doesn't seem to help a bit.  I think it just adds a bit to AV.

So yep... we're all waiting for the patch

[Whiplash]

Alpha strike is definitely the primary tactic these days. You can be further out and still be effective compared to SFC2 alphas, but its still basically an alpha strike.

I only ever target warp core. I tried targeting impulse engines for a while on small ships, but they never slowed down. I'm not sure what good it does. Warp core seems to hurt their power, and power is still critical for fighting in this game. I have not yet seen anything else really worth targeting.

W.
 

[Firestorm]

I've seen many go after my cloak first, then the warp core.

[grey one]

Re picking you opponent apart from a distance. I haven't tried this online (my game machine isn't on the net
{I know, for shame}) but it works in single player, both campaign and conquest.
  A ship with 3 forward Quantum Torps, and at least class 5 shields can sit at about 40 from a star base
and take it down. Having 3 XIIF phasers also helps. Obviously first you have to take out the mobile opponents,
 then the defenesive platforms. The platforms can be treated like the star base.  

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Quote:
Re picking you opponent apart from a distance. I haven't tried this online (my game machine isn't on the net
{I know, for shame}) but it works in single player, both campaign and conquest.
   

No human with a clue would let you do this. This is another tactic that works well (particulary against Borg) against AI. A human will anticipate and use warp to close.  

[D. Boon's Ghost]

Quote:
Re picking you opponent apart from a distance. I haven't tried this online (my game machine isn't on the net
{I know, for shame}) but it works in single player, both campaign and conquest.
  A ship with 3 forward Quantum Torps, and at least class 5 shields can sit at about 40 from a star base
and take it down...

I am sure I am wrong on this, but no other race has anything that resembles the Federation Q-torps.  A respected player mentioned last evening, that he sits out at a range of 60 to snipe.  60!  (ugh)
As a Romulan, I can only dream... and stick with alphas.