Topic: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation  (Read 15689 times)

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EmeraldEdge

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #80 on: January 19, 2004, 01:04:49 pm »
To tell you the truth, TNG didn't really do it for me.  I was a huge TOS fan and anxiously awaited TNG, but it was just OK most of the time and rather stuffy.  After the first season or two I didn't even make sure I watched every week (although I caught most of them, I didn't plan my calendar around it).

I do for Enterprise though.  I like it much better than any trek post TOS, although some of the continuity "issues" do bother me, especially since a lot of them don't really advance the plot in any way, and could easily have been looked up.  They just didn't care.

I definitely agree that B&B have to go.  Some fresh blood is desperately needed.  Perhaps even a show that doesn't focus on Starfleet's best and brightest, but has an "original" concept that happens to take place in the Trek universe.  B&B are just rehashing old stories most of the time though, and have very little to offer in the way of intelligent storytelling, unfortunately.   Their time has long since past and if the companies in ownership of the franchise wish to continue making money off the property, they need to realize what an ever growing number of people have been saying for years.  

Javora

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #81 on: January 19, 2004, 01:05:59 pm »
Quote:

Uhm, is there a greater instult to a show than being cancelled from UPN?  




Being cancelled from the "Fishing" channel maybe??!?  

I found a good article here that shows what is going on with TV today.  With computer games, Internet, and DVD's it's no wonder why broadcast TV is losing out.
 

JMM

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #82 on: January 19, 2004, 01:11:17 pm »
Good article Javora, I agree, I hardly watch tv and prefer my time on the P/C. I think is is fact already that more Americans are online than watching the tube? Just hope the networks do not try to take over the Internet    

Ravok

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #83 on: January 19, 2004, 01:20:26 pm »
Quote:

Question: Do any of you care?

Do you feel the same way about missing an Enterprise episode than you did about missing a new TNG?

I don't. I used to ensure I didn't miss the first showing of a TNG episode, less so with DS9, even less with Voyager....

Enterprise??!? Heck, I barely remember what night it's on.

I'm curious....
<FORM METHOD=POST ACTION="http://forums.taldren.com/ubbthreads/dopoll.php"><INPUT TYPE=HIDDEN NAME="pollname" VALUE="1074535984Death_Merchant">
<p>Do you watch Enterprise regularly?
<input type="radio" name="option" value="1" />Yes, I see every new episode (I might skip repeats)
<input type="radio" name="option" value="2" />No, I watch occasionally but not regularly
<INPUT TYPE=Submit NAME=Submit VALUE="Submit vote" class="buttons"></form>
 
If the numbers aren't high HERE, that's bad for Enterprise. This is a essentially a Trek gaming forum afterall....  



 This is a verry good idea !! after you get the results all in we can find out why people arent watching, Then ask what theay want to see!!!! & send it in to UPN?  

Scott Allen Abfalter

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #84 on: January 19, 2004, 01:27:50 pm »
The current producers and writers play it too safe with the show.  

As a sci-fi show, it kinda stinks.  I still watch it, but wish for a new show.

My guess is that the "Expanse" thing was the attempt to fix the ratings problem.  That was B&B's best shot, and it failed because they have no vision and are risk-adverse.

Now that they have failed on their best shot, I think it's time for the show to get dumped and a new one developed with new producers and writers.  

 
« Last Edit: January 19, 2004, 02:27:31 pm by Scott Allen Abfalter »

jualdeaux

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #85 on: January 19, 2004, 01:46:48 pm »
I don't really watch Enterprise anymore but I wouldn't like to see it canceled. On the other hand, I've said for a while that there has been too much trek on the tube for too long. There just isn't that much demand for it. Let it rest for a while and then, when there is a lot of people wanting to see trek again, bring it back.  

Alidar Jarok

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #86 on: January 19, 2004, 07:24:46 pm »
I grew up to The Next Generation, but I find myself not watching Enterprise (I didn't watch Voyager much either).

However, that being said, I hope they don't cancel Enterprise (what I watch doesn't effect the ratings anyway, plus I do try to find out what happened every so often).  I think it has had good moments.

The only irony is that if this show gets cancelled after the third season, it will have run the same amount as the Original Series.

Dash Jones

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #87 on: January 19, 2004, 09:17:51 pm »
If it gets cancelled, at least let them make a show which sets certain things right again in the universe, even if it's cheap with the characters having to go back to the beginning or something.

B&B probably won't even try to redeem themselves that far though.

digi

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #88 on: January 20, 2004, 04:23:54 am »
Hopefully ENT will continue, we'll see the end of the Xindi arc this season and the start of the Romulan War next season.

I watch ENT every monday on SKY at the moment - although last nights episode (extinction i think) was complete pants.

Hopefully there won't be many more like this this season.

LongTooth

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #89 on: January 20, 2004, 05:44:17 am »
Quote:

If they really want to save it from cancellation, the first thing to do is fire Rick Berman.  




Yeah in a kilm  

Scott Allen Abfalter

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #90 on: January 20, 2004, 09:31:10 am »
Quote:

If it gets cancelled, at least let them make a show which sets certain things right again in the universe, even if it's cheap with the characters having to go back to the beginning or something.

B&B probably won't even try to redeem themselves that far though.  




Oh, you just KNOW that it's going to be a cheap-ass ending to the Xindi arc:  they will end up time travelling back to the start of the Xindi attack and destroy the probe.  

 

Rob Cole

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #91 on: January 20, 2004, 10:13:38 am »
Well now we can hope to get that show with Sulu as the captian on air now.....well at least I will.

Ravok

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #92 on: January 20, 2004, 12:58:55 pm »
 Never thought of it before but that would be a great idea!!!!!  

762

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #93 on: January 20, 2004, 01:21:10 pm »
Quote:

As much as I don't like B&B, cancelling the show outright will kill Star Trek.  This needs to be handled carefully if the franchise is to have a future.  




I would rather they kill Star Trek than see it go on in the hideously deformed, brain-dead state it's in right now.

Paging Dr. Kevorkian!!!!!

P.S. What you watch weekly on UPN is  not Star Trek. The last thing even remotely resembling Star Trek was  First Contact, and before that the pilot episode of DS9 (which plummeted like a lead brick afterwards).
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by 762 »

Dogmatix!

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #94 on: January 20, 2004, 04:38:35 pm »
Quote:

Quote:

Question: Do any of you care?

Do you feel the same way about missing an Enterprise episode than you did about missing a new TNG?

I don't. I used to ensure I didn't miss the first showing of a TNG episode, less so with DS9, even less with Voyager....




The last show I watched that I took care not to miss any episodes of, was Babylon 5.

I am a fan of TOS, and liked a few episodes each of Voyager and DS9.  Never liked TNG, and don't watch Enterprise.  





I've pretty much liked every show you have listed here (even the ones you didn't).  For me, there is so very little even mildly watchable TV on these days that I even watch Enterprise and Andromeda religiously.  If Enterprise goes away, that leaves two (Andromeda and Angel) Sci-Fi/fantasy shows left that I watch, having lost Farscape and Buffy last year.


It kinda sucks.  There's no end to the completely inane reality drivel on the air but they cant find the resources to keep airing a Star Trek show on UPN.



Anyone heard whether or not Battlestar Galactica was getting picked up?



Heh, I guess that's why I'm buying a lot of these series on DVD (Farscape, B5, Buffy, Angel) so I can keep watching them rather than the crap thats on telly.

TOCXOBearslayer

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #95 on: January 20, 2004, 07:42:47 pm »
Quote:

Well now we can hope to get that show with Sulu as the captian on air now.....well at least I will.  




Does anyone remember that there was 3 possible choices with the 'next' ST show?

The three options were:

Sulu & the Excelsior
Enterprise (ie begining of the Federation)
ST:TN(N)G (ie) the next next generation with time jumping and all sorts of stuff)

B&B favored the time jumping one....

Paramount choose Enterprise.  

Isn't it amazing that B&B are using time jumping in Enterprise?

To date, I have seen about 2 hours and 15 minutes of the entire run of the series.... but from what I have heard.... it is not good.

I hope they kill Enterprise and fire B&B.  Then hire someone with some real vision and start a new series.  

Javora

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #96 on: January 20, 2004, 08:27:28 pm »
Quote:


I hope they kill Enterprise and fire B&B. Then hire someone with some real vision and start a new series.





I don't know about the "kill Enterprise" part, but with everyone who watches Trek agrees that B&B need to go.  Why hasn't Paramount given B&B the boot?  What is it going to take to get Paramount to listen?  Maybe we should all (Trek fans everywhere) get together and do a mass write-in to Paramount.  Maybe then Paramount will finally get the message.
 

Mariner

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #97 on: January 20, 2004, 09:12:22 pm »
Trek, as a whole, needs one thing only, in most cases, to survive. Just look at recent Trek, from TNG onwards, and you can see that somethings gonewrong in the past decade..


TNG: Good overall execution, still my favortive of all of the series (though thanks to SFC, that opinion is shifting ). Much better consistency, more characeters, but there seems to be a lack of equal "depth" between Riker, Picard, Data, Troi, Worf, Geordi, Wes (Yeah, he WAS a regular ), Yar (She should've stayed IMO), Pulaski, and Crusher. It seems as if the writers decided to focus on Data and Picard the most in terms of "fleshing out", and the others' personalities suffering slightly as a result. But, everyone has something to be proud of in their backround, like Geordi's VISOR or Pulaski's relationship with Kyle Riker.

Overall, a worty companion to TOS.


DS9: N/A Truthfully, I haven't seen enough to give a full opinion. But, from what I have seen, it's a refreshing change. Although we have familiar elements scattered about, TNG and DS9 coudn't be more different. Sisko seems a little darker than Picard, which isn't bad, but he still has strong values behind him, just bigger problems to face. I nearly die of a heart attack from watching Odo and Quark dance around one another, both balancing the line between "Law" and "Crime". Bashir and Garak make an interesting pair, yet they both have their own unique histories and qualities (which is true for all). As for Kira, well, let's just say she's a little...uhh, "confused" in terms of what her place is, Very human, which gives DS9 bonus points!

Overall, another proud bearer of the "Star Trek" name.


VOY: Can we say "WEEEEEEEE'VE LOST IT!" in terms of purpose and direction? Aside from the advancements of "secondary characters" like Seven and the Doc, I couldn't give a damn about Capt. "Lameway" and the Mega-übership Voyager. There's just too much PC and "ascaredness" in the excecution of...EVERYTHING. It's as if they don't even want to change the characters, the surroundings, or have long lasting plot arcs. It's "Hey, it's THE BOOOOOOORG! LET'S KILL THEIR F**KING A$$ES!!!" every week, with treknobabble and guest stars spread about here and there, as a distraction. Sometimes, the protagonists are often much more worthy of their own series, and yet VOY is still bland as cafeteria food?

Overall, "I think I'm gonna be sick.." is the best description.


ENT: Thank god VOY died in 2001, atleast replaced with something more deserving of the "Trek" banner. I must honestly say, the setting of the story is quite interesting, and has the potential to be as intricate, interesting and detailed as the TOS-TMP era. Not only are we treated with an attempt at decent episodes, we actually care about the main characters this time around. Sure, Archer's a bit screwloose, but who woudln't be, considering that he's supposed to be melting under the spotlight? That's intriguing enough to watch regularly. T'Pol has a bit of conflict inside her, which is typical Vulcan. Again, interesting and intrugiung. But, although the writers have made good attempts at making good, edgy conflicts and stories, those episodes are often separated bu crappiness of VOY-grade level (aka Toddler-on-steriods-and-Ritalin grade).


Overall, "The worst has passed...We think." My opinion is still hanging, along with most Trekkies.


What does this mean? Well think about it for a second. TNG and DS9, while benifitting from fresh new ideas, also had one extremely vital compnent. The core spirit of TOS. The will and desire to "go boldly where no one has gone before," often to very tarred and taboo groud (I can't even begin to list these), but still delivering powerful messages of hope, opportunity, and overall optimisim.

I think that other have pretty much explained VOY and ENT elsewhere, so I shall now conclude.

It doesn't matter if ENT was instead set in the 25th or 57648565th century, time and setting are subject to choice. What truly defines Trek is quality storytelling and clear messages, which cannot be comprimised, not by law, not by studio policy, not by the mighty Rick Berman himself...  

Scott Allen Abfalter

  • Guest
Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #98 on: January 21, 2004, 08:33:21 am »

Exactly.  It's bad writing.  

Enterprise could be saved as show by hiring good writers and giving them freedom.  

B&B write most of the episodes and retain creative control over the rest.  Therein lies the problem.  

 

Karnak

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Re: Rumors swarm of ENT's cancellation
« Reply #99 on: January 21, 2004, 10:15:19 am »
Once when I was touring the small naval museum in Vancouver, B.C. where they store the ship that made the Arctic passage in the early 1940s, I saw a display of TNG memorabilia.  The display pointed to the fact that the core theme of naval exploration in Star Trek mirrored the real-life exploration done in the 18th and 19th centuries by the Royal Navy with famous captains like Captain Cook.  So, it is little surprise to me that Star Trek writers and directors that draw on the  Horatio Hornblower series for inspiration in their Star Trak writer and direction exploits produce the best and most profitable Trek shows/movies.  Ronald Moore wrote many good episodes in TNG, did most of the writing of First Contact and really took off with the Dominion war arc in DS9.  He just currently did the writing for the new BSG mini-series and brought the special effects people from DS9 to the BSG initiative.  Nicolas Meyer was the director of probably 2 of the best Trek movies ever in ST2 and ST6 and he too used Horatio Hornblower as a key reference.  Currently, Master and Commander is doing well in the movie theaters to show that there is a stable niche market for this naval exploration theme against the background of geo-political struggle.  For example, the TOS Federation and Klingons mirrored the global power struggles of England and France in the Napoleonic wars, the continuing struggles of Western Nations with Germany in WW1 and WW2, and the Cold War struggle of NATO and the USSR.

Is it any surprise that writers like B&B that totally disregard the core naval quality and geo-political struggles of the core Star Trek by continually messing with the timeline in serious matters are harvesting smaller and smaller ratings while those that embrace it like N. Meyer and R. Moore do well?  When will B&B understand that the only timeline shows that will work in Trek are of the non-serious comedic variety with regards to global politics like what was done in Star Trek IV that was basically a funny ST intro movie that the GreenPeace party would love.  Or, time-travel episode where you have to repair the timeline marred by aliens or baddies or loonies like the deranged McCoy in the TOS time travel episode to 1930s USA. But, start making key arc episodes based on time travel is ludricious and makes the Star Trek fan base refuse to take such a series seriously. There is nothing to look forward to when the rules are constantly changing or could be changed at the time-traveling magic machine's whim.  It almost feels like one of those nightmare Software projects where the users were never told to freeze the requirements and there was not enough process analysis done. The project invariably gets in big trouble by missing deadlines repeatedly and someone eventually gets fired over it.  So, B&B should not be surprised if it happens to them.

Right now, it looks like the chances are good that B&B Enterprise is cancelled while the Ronald Moore  BSG series is picked up.  I call that market forces dispensing with justice in the Sci-Fi genre and it's about time.    
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 pm by Karnak »