Topic: Mirak/Kzinti confusion!!!! (Read 13999 times)

DestinyCalling · « **on:** November 02, 2003, 06:29:40 pm »

Are these guys the same or what??? They appear to be, and I've GOT "Prime Directive" and no mention at all about the "Mirak"..... So are they one and the same or am I missing something???

Khalee · « **Reply #1 on:** November 02, 2003, 06:50:44 pm »

Yes they are the same thing.

They were in one episode of the star trek animated series.

And I guess the person who invented them would not give his blessing on the name being used in the game, hence Mirak instead of Kzinti.

And there were probably other reasons as well.

IKV Nemesis D7L · « **Reply #2 on:** November 02, 2003, 08:42:24 pm »

Niven had already licensed the Kzinti for use in the Ringworld game and was contractually unable to consent to their use in SFC.

nx_adam_1701 · « **Reply #3 on:** November 03, 2003, 01:08:07 am »

ahhhhhh, finally i know lol lol, i was wondering the same thing

adam out thx

Fluf · « **Reply #4 on:** November 03, 2003, 01:17:05 pm »

Almost all long term players and the two main SFC fleets, KAT and KOTH, consider themselves to be Kzinti, not Mirak. D2 Campaigns such as SFC2.net and the Litterbox servers always change the name in the gf files for servers to Kzinti Hegemony instead of the Mirak StarLeague.

KAT and KOTH both use the Kzinti language, racial traits, and terms in roleplay for all SFC related things, such as fleet organization, (ie:Patriarch being the leader, Dukes being his assistants ect).

Long live the Kzin!

762 · « **Reply #5 on:** November 03, 2003, 02:37:29 pm »

Quote:

Long live the Kzin!

Arf! Arf!

TalonClaw · « **Reply #6 on:** November 03, 2003, 03:23:11 pm »

Long live MiraKzinti !!!!!!!!!!!!

DestinyCalling · « **Reply #7 on:** November 03, 2003, 05:16:38 pm »

Thanks for clearing that up.... Just one thing though, I thought Task Force had the whole "ownership of names business" sorted...

Oh well

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #9 on:** November 12, 2003, 09:05:43 pm »

Are the Mirak/Kzinti canines or felines?

Pestalence · « **Reply #10 on:** November 12, 2003, 09:07:55 pm »

Feline.... and IMHO.. Never trust a Kat... JK.. everyone playing has a great sense of humor here..

IMHO (in My Humble Opinion) For those who don't know the abbreviation..

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #11 on:** November 12, 2003, 09:31:50 pm »

LOL! IMHO is one of the abbreviations I am familiar with.

So the Lyran and the Mirak are both felines?

What about the Andromedans? Are they humanoid?

mathcubeguy · « **Reply #13 on:** November 12, 2003, 10:00:39 pm »

So the Kzin are feline yet the Mastiff is named after a DOG?

That doesnt make much sense

Kaenyne · « **Reply #15 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:13:23 am »

Cool sig, TalonClaw

Jim · « **Reply #16 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:48:29 am »

In SFB, there are nasty rumors that the Lyrans and Kzinti actually evolved from the same race...

Never mention this theory when there are any Lyrans or Kzinti around... they seem to be very sensitive to this subject.

Jim

Bistrogamer · « **Reply #17 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:57:10 am »

That was one f the things I was most dismayed about wen I bought SFC-I... The "Lyran" pictured looks more like some sort of bat-lizard than Lynx-like feline (as described in SFB IIRC).

Besides, Lyrans have nicer afts than those @$%# drone-swarming rat-tailed Kzin ayway.

Raise ESGs! (H)

TalonClaw · « **Reply #19 on:** November 13, 2003, 12:28:06 pm »

In SFC1 Lyrans ruled. Wait for the enemy to fire and then rush in with 0 ESG's. Goodbye enemy.

Bistrogamer · « **Reply #20 on:** November 13, 2003, 04:12:53 pm »

Timing is everything.

I actually won a couple times at GenCon a dozen years ago with a Lyran TCC when dum-dums tried to do overload-overruns on me. If the ESG didn't kill them outright the Mine did.

Imagine the shock when they realized I hadn't even charged my disruptors.

Gotta love massive shield reinforcement, high speed and zero-radius ESGs.

(H)

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #21 on:** November 13, 2003, 04:26:17 pm »

Do the Andromedans have allies? If so, has anyone talked to the ally or allies and lived?

Bistrogamer · « **Reply #23 on:** November 14, 2003, 02:11:42 pm »

RE: Andys

IIRC they introduced themselves in TOS by turning Kirk's crew into styrofoam decahedrons.

Extras in Red Shirts got "crush me" embossed into theirs....

(H)

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #24 on:** November 14, 2003, 09:10:46 pm »

No one bothered to look at the remains floating around in space after a ship was destroyed?

The Andromedans never tried to board a ship during the war with the alliance?

How did the war end? I assume the Andromedans were not wiped out completely. So there would have to have been a peace treaty signed or at the very least a cease fire.

Forgive me. I had never heard of the Andromedans until I started reading the posts on this forum. I also have no idea where to find more information about them. Surely my questions are legitimate questions. Even the enemies in Babylon 5 eventually showed themselves.

Thanks for your time.

Rod O'neal · « **Reply #27 on:** November 15, 2003, 12:00:28 am »

Andromedans had robots that were used for BPs. They did have some *dealings* with pirates, on occasion. Evidently though there was no face to face or even voice contact with them. the physical make up, or lack there of, just isn't known.

[insert]"Theme music from Outer Limits"[/insert]

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #30 on:** November 15, 2003, 09:06:28 pm »

Thank you all for your replies and more importantly thank you all for not flaming. I am glad you all understood that I was just trying to understand the concept of the Andromedans. And now thanks to your replies I do have a much better understanding of the Andromedans. They are truly mysterious. SFB covered all the bases with the use of robots. It makes me want to see what they could do in SFC. Even against an X-ship the Andromedans have the superior ship given equal numbers in my opinion. Thanks again.

Rogue · « **Reply #31 on:** November 16, 2003, 12:27:11 pm »

Yer welcome. Don't worry about not being familiar with Andy. Those of us who flew him or against him from SFB know many of the ins and outs with this race. That's part of the attraction to this whole SFC experience as it evolved directly from SFB which has a rich storyline. Some of that is pretty interesting fiction.

If you never had to contend with the Andromedans your in for a rough ride. Conceptualy they operated fairly large vessels that give new meaning to being a carrier. Their satelite ships played somewhere between destroyer and light cruiser in capability. Most alpha sector ships can't match the mother ships to start with, much less that and the support ships. The races matched differently with Andro technology and the BPV got skewed depending on what the match was. Races that had a more direct fire damage capability tended to fair better than those that relied on seeking weapons and faster fire rates. Worst of all is the Andromedans had an answer for most any tactic you tried. The only thing I can think of that worked perfectly is the stasis device that never appeared in SFC. Even then you had to get in range which a good Andro captain won't let happen.

Note. Even in SFB there were rule changes to reduce the Andromedan capabilities and make them more expensive. Those that played the original rules were either delighted or baffled depending on which end of the gun you were.

Aldaron · « **Reply #32 on:** November 16, 2003, 05:12:07 pm »

Yeah the Andromedan Terminator was a nasty little destroyer. What didn't kill it was in turned killed as all that energy that was poured into the PA panels was channeled into it's mauler and fired back at the ship.

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #33 on:** November 16, 2003, 10:02:29 pm »

What does the PA in PA panel stand for?

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #35 on:** November 16, 2003, 11:16:44 pm »

They sound more intimidating than the Borg! If there is ever an SFC game that has the Andromedans as enemies I will be extremely cautious engaging them in battle!

TargetDrone · « **Reply #36 on:** December 21, 2003, 07:49:27 pm »

The funny thing is, the Andros in SFB have been toned down. All ships used to have heavy TRs, and panels that didn't degrade. While all ships had 12 T-Bombs, the Andros got more use out of thiers since they didn't have to drop PAs to use them.

Only psychopaths like myself considered playing the Operation Unity campaign.

RockoWillis · « **Reply #40 on:** December 22, 2003, 12:18:58 am »

I would like to think of Lyrans and the Kzinti/Marik as both Feline... I mean think of this .. That is why they hate each other so much.. Cats always seem to fight so much and Kzinti in the original table top game ruled in the early era since they where the first to develop and employ drone shuttles (ie the Scatterpacks whe have come to love/hate). I still have all my original stuff from the "Book Shelf Game" version and I also have a few "Captains Logs" that have even more fun to play with.... I also agree the Andro's where a tough bunch to take out... 1v1 was a hard thing to do.... An Andro ship could, depending on its weight class, easly take on a ship one or even two weight class above it thanks to the PA panels and that god aweful Mauler.... You try to destrot a PA equipted ship and all it seemed to do was feed that Mauler energy to fire right back at you.... the best way to kill a Andro ship was to overload a PA panel and watch the excess power start a explosion that then in turn made the other PA panels absorb that energy and if they were full they would exploded... therefor you get a very nice chain reaction

As a Andro player you had to make sure to use as much power as you could out of the PA panels because any self respecting Andro Captain knew this was what they were gunning for!

Rocko

Speaker to Aliens · « **Reply #43 on:** December 24, 2003, 03:01:17 pm »

The "Temporal Elevator". It can move a base *up*, up to 9 hexes. In order for a unit to operate one it has to have positional stabilizers activated. That's what limits it to use only on bases.

Thanks. It's been more than 15 years since I really played SFB. My memory is getting a little hazy. I used to play twice a week, but we were expecting twins. The twins are 15 now, both girls (

). Maybe once they start university I can get back to playing again.

Glacier · « **Reply #45 on:** January 15, 2004, 12:48:00 am »

I think the original Dispalecement Device (from 20 years ago - before the Temporal Elevator name) could be used against ships. But that's beside the point.

I was just curious - does anyone know why Task Force Games/ADB chose not to use the proper name for the Andromedan's given in the TOS episode 'By Any Other Name'? They were from the Kelvan empire.

On appearance - they gave Spock the impression of 'immense beings with hundreds of tentaclelike limbs'. And they had no concept of physical sensation.

Magnum357 · « **Reply #46 on:** January 15, 2004, 10:41:05 am »

Actually, we really don't know if the Andromadans from SFB are the same people as the ones in that TOS episode. ADB never mentioned anything what an Andro looked like in SFB or what type of beings they are. For all we know, they could be intelegent robots. I have seen that episode you are talking about, but their might be no relation between that race and the Andros in SFB.

Kadh2000 · « **Reply #52 on:** January 20, 2004, 09:43:24 pm »

We finished it and discovered that the Andros really didn't have much of a chance. We've done some talking with ADB and the forum there came up with a list of things to try. Because it's the only true epic campaign in SFB, we're going to try it again and see what works and what doesn't.

Toward's the end, our Andro player finally developed a strategy that, had she implemented it sooner, would have posed a major threat to the Galactic success. She started going all out to kill the biggest ship in our fleet no matter what the cost. I don't think it would have secured victory, but it would have been a lot tougher fight.

DestinyCalling · « **Reply #53 on:** November 02, 2003, 06:29:40 pm »

Are these guys the same or what??? They appear to be, and I've GOT "Prime Directive" and no mention at all about the "Mirak"..... So are they one and the same or am I missing something???

Khalee · « **Reply #54 on:** November 02, 2003, 06:50:44 pm »

Yes they are the same thing.

They were in one episode of the star trek animated series.

And I guess the person who invented them would not give his blessing on the name being used in the game, hence Mirak instead of Kzinti.

And there were probably other reasons as well.

IKV Nemesis D7L · « **Reply #55 on:** November 02, 2003, 08:42:24 pm »

Niven had already licensed the Kzinti for use in the Ringworld game and was contractually unable to consent to their use in SFC.

nx_adam_1701 · « **Reply #56 on:** November 03, 2003, 01:08:07 am »

ahhhhhh, finally i know lol lol, i was wondering the same thing

adam out thx

Fluf · « **Reply #57 on:** November 03, 2003, 01:17:05 pm »

Almost all long term players and the two main SFC fleets, KAT and KOTH, consider themselves to be Kzinti, not Mirak. D2 Campaigns such as SFC2.net and the Litterbox servers always change the name in the gf files for servers to Kzinti Hegemony instead of the Mirak StarLeague.

KAT and KOTH both use the Kzinti language, racial traits, and terms in roleplay for all SFC related things, such as fleet organization, (ie:Patriarch being the leader, Dukes being his assistants ect).

Long live the Kzin!

TalonClaw · « **Reply #59 on:** November 03, 2003, 03:23:11 pm »

Long live MiraKzinti !!!!!!!!!!!!

DestinyCalling · « **Reply #60 on:** November 03, 2003, 05:16:38 pm »

Thanks for clearing that up.... Just one thing though, I thought Task Force had the whole "ownership of names business" sorted...

Oh well

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #62 on:** November 12, 2003, 09:05:43 pm »

Are the Mirak/Kzinti canines or felines?

Pestalence · « **Reply #63 on:** November 12, 2003, 09:07:55 pm »

Feline.... and IMHO.. Never trust a Kat... JK.. everyone playing has a great sense of humor here..

IMHO (in My Humble Opinion) For those who don't know the abbreviation..

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #64 on:** November 12, 2003, 09:31:50 pm »

LOL! IMHO is one of the abbreviations I am familiar with.

So the Lyran and the Mirak are both felines?

What about the Andromedans? Are they humanoid?

mathcubeguy · « **Reply #66 on:** November 12, 2003, 10:00:39 pm »

So the Kzin are feline yet the Mastiff is named after a DOG?

That doesnt make much sense

Kaenyne · « **Reply #68 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:13:23 am »

Cool sig, TalonClaw

Jim · « **Reply #69 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:48:29 am »

In SFB, there are nasty rumors that the Lyrans and Kzinti actually evolved from the same race...

Never mention this theory when there are any Lyrans or Kzinti around... they seem to be very sensitive to this subject.

Jim

Bistrogamer · « **Reply #70 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:57:10 am »

That was one f the things I was most dismayed about wen I bought SFC-I... The "Lyran" pictured looks more like some sort of bat-lizard than Lynx-like feline (as described in SFB IIRC).

Besides, Lyrans have nicer afts than those @$%# drone-swarming rat-tailed Kzin ayway.

Raise ESGs! (H)

TalonClaw · « **Reply #72 on:** November 13, 2003, 12:28:06 pm »

In SFC1 Lyrans ruled. Wait for the enemy to fire and then rush in with 0 ESG's. Goodbye enemy.

Bistrogamer · « **Reply #73 on:** November 13, 2003, 04:12:53 pm »

Timing is everything.

I actually won a couple times at GenCon a dozen years ago with a Lyran TCC when dum-dums tried to do overload-overruns on me. If the ESG didn't kill them outright the Mine did.

Imagine the shock when they realized I hadn't even charged my disruptors.

Gotta love massive shield reinforcement, high speed and zero-radius ESGs.

(H)

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #74 on:** November 13, 2003, 04:26:17 pm »

Do the Andromedans have allies? If so, has anyone talked to the ally or allies and lived?

Bistrogamer · « **Reply #76 on:** November 14, 2003, 02:11:42 pm »

RE: Andys

IIRC they introduced themselves in TOS by turning Kirk's crew into styrofoam decahedrons.

Extras in Red Shirts got "crush me" embossed into theirs....

(H)

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #77 on:** November 14, 2003, 09:10:46 pm »

No one bothered to look at the remains floating around in space after a ship was destroyed?

The Andromedans never tried to board a ship during the war with the alliance?

How did the war end? I assume the Andromedans were not wiped out completely. So there would have to have been a peace treaty signed or at the very least a cease fire.

Forgive me. I had never heard of the Andromedans until I started reading the posts on this forum. I also have no idea where to find more information about them. Surely my questions are legitimate questions. Even the enemies in Babylon 5 eventually showed themselves.

Thanks for your time.

Rod O'neal · « **Reply #80 on:** November 15, 2003, 12:00:28 am »

Andromedans had robots that were used for BPs. They did have some *dealings* with pirates, on occasion. Evidently though there was no face to face or even voice contact with them. the physical make up, or lack there of, just isn't known.

[insert]"Theme music from Outer Limits"[/insert]

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #83 on:** November 15, 2003, 09:06:28 pm »

Thank you all for your replies and more importantly thank you all for not flaming. I am glad you all understood that I was just trying to understand the concept of the Andromedans. And now thanks to your replies I do have a much better understanding of the Andromedans. They are truly mysterious. SFB covered all the bases with the use of robots. It makes me want to see what they could do in SFC. Even against an X-ship the Andromedans have the superior ship given equal numbers in my opinion. Thanks again.

Rogue · « **Reply #84 on:** November 16, 2003, 12:27:11 pm »

Yer welcome. Don't worry about not being familiar with Andy. Those of us who flew him or against him from SFB know many of the ins and outs with this race. That's part of the attraction to this whole SFC experience as it evolved directly from SFB which has a rich storyline. Some of that is pretty interesting fiction.

If you never had to contend with the Andromedans your in for a rough ride. Conceptualy they operated fairly large vessels that give new meaning to being a carrier. Their satelite ships played somewhere between destroyer and light cruiser in capability. Most alpha sector ships can't match the mother ships to start with, much less that and the support ships. The races matched differently with Andro technology and the BPV got skewed depending on what the match was. Races that had a more direct fire damage capability tended to fair better than those that relied on seeking weapons and faster fire rates. Worst of all is the Andromedans had an answer for most any tactic you tried. The only thing I can think of that worked perfectly is the stasis device that never appeared in SFC. Even then you had to get in range which a good Andro captain won't let happen.

Note. Even in SFB there were rule changes to reduce the Andromedan capabilities and make them more expensive. Those that played the original rules were either delighted or baffled depending on which end of the gun you were.

Aldaron · « **Reply #85 on:** November 16, 2003, 05:12:07 pm »

Yeah the Andromedan Terminator was a nasty little destroyer. What didn't kill it was in turned killed as all that energy that was poured into the PA panels was channeled into it's mauler and fired back at the ship.

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #86 on:** November 16, 2003, 10:02:29 pm »

What does the PA in PA panel stand for?

NightStalker-SFC3 · « **Reply #88 on:** November 16, 2003, 11:16:44 pm »

They sound more intimidating than the Borg! If there is ever an SFC game that has the Andromedans as enemies I will be extremely cautious engaging them in battle!

TargetDrone · « **Reply #89 on:** December 21, 2003, 07:49:27 pm »

The funny thing is, the Andros in SFB have been toned down. All ships used to have heavy TRs, and panels that didn't degrade. While all ships had 12 T-Bombs, the Andros got more use out of thiers since they didn't have to drop PAs to use them.

Only psychopaths like myself considered playing the Operation Unity campaign.

RockoWillis · « **Reply #93 on:** December 22, 2003, 12:18:58 am »

I would like to think of Lyrans and the Kzinti/Marik as both Feline... I mean think of this .. That is why they hate each other so much.. Cats always seem to fight so much and Kzinti in the original table top game ruled in the early era since they where the first to develop and employ drone shuttles (ie the Scatterpacks whe have come to love/hate). I still have all my original stuff from the "Book Shelf Game" version and I also have a few "Captains Logs" that have even more fun to play with.... I also agree the Andro's where a tough bunch to take out... 1v1 was a hard thing to do.... An Andro ship could, depending on its weight class, easly take on a ship one or even two weight class above it thanks to the PA panels and that god aweful Mauler.... You try to destrot a PA equipted ship and all it seemed to do was feed that Mauler energy to fire right back at you.... the best way to kill a Andro ship was to overload a PA panel and watch the excess power start a explosion that then in turn made the other PA panels absorb that energy and if they were full they would exploded... therefor you get a very nice chain reaction

As a Andro player you had to make sure to use as much power as you could out of the PA panels because any self respecting Andro Captain knew this was what they were gunning for!

Rocko

Speaker to Aliens · « **Reply #96 on:** December 24, 2003, 03:01:17 pm »

The "Temporal Elevator". It can move a base *up*, up to 9 hexes. In order for a unit to operate one it has to have positional stabilizers activated. That's what limits it to use only on bases.

Thanks. It's been more than 15 years since I really played SFB. My memory is getting a little hazy. I used to play twice a week, but we were expecting twins. The twins are 15 now, both girls (

). Maybe once they start university I can get back to playing again.

Glacier · « **Reply #98 on:** January 15, 2004, 12:48:00 am »

I think the original Dispalecement Device (from 20 years ago - before the Temporal Elevator name) could be used against ships. But that's beside the point.

I was just curious - does anyone know why Task Force Games/ADB chose not to use the proper name for the Andromedan's given in the TOS episode 'By Any Other Name'? They were from the Kelvan empire.

On appearance - they gave Spock the impression of 'immense beings with hundreds of tentaclelike limbs'. And they had no concept of physical sensation.

Magnum357 · « **Reply #99 on:** January 15, 2004, 10:41:05 am »

Actually, we really don't know if the Andromadans from SFB are the same people as the ones in that TOS episode. ADB never mentioned anything what an Andro looked like in SFB or what type of beings they are. For all we know, they could be intelegent robots. I have seen that episode you are talking about, but their might be no relation between that race and the Andros in SFB.

Kadh2000 · « **Reply #105 on:** January 20, 2004, 09:43:24 pm »

We finished it and discovered that the Andros really didn't have much of a chance. We've done some talking with ADB and the forum there came up with a list of things to try. Because it's the only true epic campaign in SFB, we're going to try it again and see what works and what doesn't.

Toward's the end, our Andro player finally developed a strategy that, had she implemented it sooner, would have posed a major threat to the Galactic success. She started going all out to kill the biggest ship in our fleet no matter what the cost. I don't think it would have secured victory, but it would have been a lot tougher fight.

News:

Topic: Mirak/Kzinti confusion!!!! (Read 13999 times) var addthis_config = {"data_track_clickback":true};

DestinyCalling

Khalee

IKV Nemesis D7L

nx_adam_1701

Fluf

762

TalonClaw

DestinyCalling

IKV Nemesis D7L

NightStalker-SFC3

Pestalence

NightStalker-SFC3

Rod O'neal

mathcubeguy

Rod O'neal

Kaenyne

Jim

Bistrogamer

DaveyE

TalonClaw

Bistrogamer

NightStalker-SFC3

Aldaron

Bistrogamer

NightStalker-SFC3

jimmi7769

jimmi7769

Rod O'neal

Rogue

Aldaron

NightStalker-SFC3

Rogue

Aldaron

NightStalker-SFC3

Bonk

NightStalker-SFC3

TargetDrone

Rob Cole

Pestalence

Corbomite

RockoWillis

Speaker to Aliens

Rod O'neal

Speaker to Aliens

SSCF Hooch

Glacier

Magnum357

Hstaphath_XC

TargetDrone

Hstaphath_XC

TargetDrone

FatherTed

Kadh2000

DestinyCalling

Khalee

IKV Nemesis D7L

nx_adam_1701

Fluf

762

TalonClaw

DestinyCalling

IKV Nemesis D7L

NightStalker-SFC3

Pestalence

NightStalker-SFC3

Rod O'neal

mathcubeguy

Rod O'neal

Kaenyne

Jim

Bistrogamer

DaveyE

TalonClaw

Bistrogamer

Topic: Mirak/Kzinti confusion!!!! (Read 13999 times)