Topic: Star Trek Franchise in Trouble?

[Lieutenant_Q]

"Journey to Babel", since someone brought it up.

"Photon Torpedoes 2, 4 and 6, full spread."  Kirk

"Full spread Missed Sair." Chekov

Might as well also mention "The Changeling"

"Our screens have just absorbed energy equal to ninety of our Photon Torpedoes" Spock

[James Formo]

I have not been able to watch an entire episode of Enterprise yet.  I made an effort to a few times,  but I didn't like how they changed ST to action packed. In one show I watched I was actually rooting against Capt. Archer. They made him out to be insensitive and the bad guy imo, at least in the show I was watching.  He took offense to the guy who was piloting the 1st ship that broke warp2. Then actually cold cocked the pilot with his fist with no provocation.  It just made him out to be a jerk and he is suppose to be the hero of the show?

I guess I watched the other ST shows as a diversion from reality. With the fist fighting now in Enterprise the show seems to mirror reality. Thus it is not a diversion anymore.  Plus They rely on showing that Vulcan chick too much.  They are trying to sell it with sex and violence. To me this signifies a lack of creativity.  

[Johanobesus]

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they need it to get as far away from the upn network as possible and get it into syndication.. if tng was only on upn, it would have flamed as well.  

Syndication isn't the breadwinner that it used to be.  Market share is in decline in part, of all things, infomercials.  ...
   

Another problem is that there are fewer independent stations now than there were ten years ago.  With the FOX-CBS dance and then WB and UPN, just about every station is spoken for.  That means they have network programming to run in prime time, and sports on the weekends, so syndicated shows get sent to late night.  That's what happened to DS9 and B5 in Atlanta when the station showing them went to CBS.  If Enterprise went into syndication, who would show it?  

Gosh, I remember when I was a kid we got to watch TNG and all sorts of other syndicated shows on Saturday nights, Friday the 13th and that Freddy Krueger anthology show and that monster show and that awful War of the Worlds series.  Most of those pretty cheesy, but they were fun for a 13-14 year-old
 

[Tulwar]

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"Journey to Babel", since someone brought it up.

"Photon Torpedoes 2, 4 and 6, full spread."  Kirk

I stand corrected.  Thanks.  

[Blyre]

Mr. Braga's comment emphasizes the severe shortsightedness that he and Mr. Berman has displayed since taking over the day to day controls of the franchise. Going off the hope that attracting new fans while driving off the old fan base is, in my opinion, a recipe for disaster.

Wallace
 

[Scipio_66]

Quote:
Another funny:  I don't remember the name of the episode, "Road to Bable..." something like that, where Spock has to give his father a blood transplant, Kirk gets stabbled, ship full of diplomats, ect, they catch an infiltratraiter.  He was not an Orion, but DISGUISED AS AN ORION!  Ha!  Ha!  

He was an Orion.  He was disguised as an Andorian.

-S'Cipio

[Tulwar]

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He was an Orion.  He was disguised as an Andorian.

-S'Cipio  

Maybe I shoule subscribe to the SF channel.  I haven't seen TOS in a long time.  Thanks for the correction.  

[Rogue NineCH]

Not according to Rick Berman and Brannon Braga.

Hmmm, let's review the facts:

Enterprise lost a third of its audience last season,  down to 4 million viewers a week.  ST-TNG attracted 20 million plus viewers in its heyday.  Losing the UPN network and going back to syndication would a wise move.

The latest Trek movie (Nemesis) did only 43 million at the box office.  I think it was the fact that it focused once again on Picard and Data instead of trying a new direction, but that is my opinion.  I'm sure others could point out more problems.  I did like Nemesis, but it was lacking in storyline and Romulans as well.

Activision, the sole publisher of trek games, has filed suit against Viacom accusing them of allowing the franchise to "stagnate and decay."  I'm curious to see how this will play out, if Activision wins, then what will the consequences be for any other movie studio/game developer deals in the future.

Now after the writer brings up all these facts to Berman, let's hear what Berman has to say:  (Brace yourselves)

"I don't think the Trek franchise is in trouble."

WOW!!  We can all rest easy!!!  Berman has quelled all fears about the vaunted Trek franchise!!

Now lets hear what Braga has to say:  (Once again, Brace yourselves)

"There are alot of people out there who have yet to discover Star Trek, that's our hope."

Way to go guys, when all else fails, denial, denial, denial.

I love Star Trek, have been a fan since I was a kid, and whether they want to admit it or not, Trek is in trouble.  It needs a transfusion of talent and creativity five minutes ago.  Then it needs what perhaps would be the best thing to ever happen to the franchise, the firing of Berman and Braga.  Of course we all know that's not going to happen anytime soon.

When questioned as to what Enterprise needs to revitalize the series, Berman went on to explain the changes, I'll paraphrase:

They seem to think that making Enterprise more action-oriented, and fast-paced will bring back the viewers.  This is how they plan on winning back viewers?  By turning Trek into an action show masquerading as a prequel to the TOS series?!  What's next?  The Enterprise crew learns all forms of martial arts, and charges the enemy, while yelling a Xena warcry?  We know that Trek is not about action, it never has been, it has always been about resolving problems without conflict whenever possible,  if that doesn't work, then we kick ass!!  You don't change the formula that has carried the franchise this far.  I guess we'll see how much action they tend to include in the upcoming season.

They are also going to focus the entire season on the mission to the Delphic Expanse, now this might be an interesting concept if they do it right.  As long as they don't start doing what happened regularly on Voyager, "We are almost succesful, oh no it failed!  Now we are back to square one!"  I liked Voyager but the whole "They might make it home till the last two minutes of the episode" got old really quick.  Oh, and trashing the Trek timeline more will not help matters, you want to gain viewers not lose your core fans by not staying true to Trek.

Well I'll stop typing now, I had to get that off my chest.  Lets hear what you have to say.

[NannerSlug]

they need it to get as far away from the upn network as possible and get it into syndication.. if tng was only on upn, it would have flamed as well.

[Magnum357]

Hey dude, what can I say, B & B are not helping the franchise.  If anyone hasn't noticed, I usually refer the two idiots... I mean, genetlemen as "Bevis and Butthead" (not sure which ones which though... does it matter?).  

I just saw at my local grocery market a new TV guide that said Stargate was the top SiFi program in america.  Well, I don't know if that is true, but I must admit I'm liking the Stargate stories much better then ENTERPRISE.  Uh oh, maybe I shouldn't have said that.  Maybe B & B will try to copy concepts from that show, UHG!  Berman can say he wants about Star Trek not being in trouble, all I know is that the show is severly different from the normal Star Trek time line.  If that was the intention, then B & B should have explained that long before the series got off the ground.  If that wasn't the intentions, then B & B where fools not to know that their are A LOT of die Hard Trekkies that like consistancy (as best as the show can offer), and to fly away from what had been well established with TMP, TNG, and DS9 was completely idiotic!  Come on, TNG and DS9 shows are not THAT old!  

I had a feeling Enterprise was not going to be very good when I saw the "Akiraprise" flying out of spacedock on the first episodes.  I will give credit to B & B for using awsome interior sets, neat uniforms, and even letter box veiwing, but to have the Enterprise as an upside down Akira was just wrong!  Even some people on this forum can make some outstanding Pre-TOS ships look cool for modern day SiFi.  Heck, even the old TOS Enterprise could be given a face lift so that it doesn't look like a toy.  Heck, that is what I'm doing with many SFB ships.  

Oh well, I guess I will go watch Star Gate now.  

[EmeraldEdge]

I'd like to read the full context, but this just worries me:

"There are alot of people out there who have yet to discover Star Trek, that's our hope."

So, what he's saying is.  Yes, veiwership amongst the fans and hardcore have dropped off severely, but there are a lot of other people out ther in the world and maybe they'll watch?   Geez, why not try and get the core back, they are much easier since they WANT to watch trek.  The way these guys think and create just worries me.

That having been said, I think Enterprise is some of the best Trek (overall) since TOS.  Yeah, it bugs the hell out of me when there are major continuity issues that a blind man could see.  I don't even mind the Akiraprise (kinda think it looks cool) because I was always hoping that it would all tie into the temporal cold war thing (has that been abandoned now?).  I just think this crew has miles of chemistry above some of the others.  I like them and reall feel they work together, it's just too bad they had to be on a show that will probably go down as the show that killed (temporarily of course, it will always be back) Trek.  There are so many things that have been done right in a series full of wrong turns, it's all the more tragic.


I think I'd like to see the dismissal of B&B because they seem to live to rehash some really tired stuff (and if I see the Borg one more time... ugh!).  They really need someone who actually repsects the franchise above their own bloated heads.  

[**DONOTDELETE**]

   

[Hertston]

Maybe it's just time to let it die ?   IMHO, although DS9 had it's moments, Voyager and Enterprise were at best very, very average, especially when compared to something like Babylon 5.   Sure, B5 ran out of steam to at the end,  but before that there was four years of excellent and creative storytelling.  Everything has it's shelf life.  I enjoyed both Insurrection and Nemesis, but in both cases because of the interactions between the crew and the actors who portray them... the actual STORIES had nothing new at all.

It might even be fun to have the next SFC game (or something resembling it) set in a completely different SF world.... licensed or (gosh), original.

 

 

[Rogue NineCH]

The news story was in the San Jose Mercury News, and it was written by charlie mccollum, I don't know if he is a local writer or is syndicated or not, anyway I am sure it's on their website.  It's sad because I remember Trek in its heyday, and now look what it has become.

 Mercury News Web Site  

[sandman69247]

The best thing that Enterprise could do is find a fatal flaw in the design of the ship and have to scrap it...then bring in a new Enterprise, Daedalus Class. Then have the Earth-Romulan War start up. Then, after winning back the core Trekkers (not trekkies, yuck, I hate that term), end the show and immediately go with a new show, centered around Enterprise-B and Cpt. Sulu.

Oh, and get a whole new set of people to run the franchise. Personally, from the ideas I've seen here, I think that the Taldren people would be great. They want to keep to the story/time lines and I'm sure they have some cool ideas for what a good episode would be. Think about it...David Farrell as the new creative genius behind Trek.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[vsfedwards]

yeah just say..err that the temperal cold war was a trick by the romulans to lure them into their space..the romulans have rights to start a war with earth because enterprise entered its territory..o no the enterprise gets destroyed en route to home crew transport to wing ship they build a new flagship..still archer as captain(reminds me off kirk for some reason...maybe the way he speaks) start building an earth-vulcan fleet big war, action but not centered around it fully- like ds9 but dont mention prophets or im likely to kill someone and voila you have a pretty damn decent show IMO anyway ...shame that the big guys dont read this and realise hey ,,,good ideas sandman and ed....but ofcourse that would never happen now would it  

[**DONOTDELETE**]

IMHO, both Voyager and Enterprise had a good premise. But in both cases, it was a premise the producers didn't stick with.
It's as if both shows felt uncomfortable in their own skins....

Voyager: Alone and far from home, with no backup, no resupply, and no crew replacement. Wonderful idea: think of all the storylines as they loose crew and equipment and have to make do. What choices must they make to survive. What ideas will they abandon?

This entire premise was almost completely ignored by season 2.

Enterprise: First human foray into deep space ("primitive" equipment, no backup or communication, every contact a first, buildup to Kirk's era and the birth of the Federation).

I see an Archer Enterprise with effectively the same capability as Kirk's (phasers, transporters, grapple=tractor, soon to have P torps, scanners that can pinpoint one human among millions of aliens on a planet) and subspace communications with Starfleet that appear faster than Kirk's.

Each "first contact" is not portrayed as humanity meeting a new race, but as Archer talking to a small group of aliens. There is no wonder, no excitement, no mystery. It just doesn't feel like Enterprise is all alone in deep space....  

[Tulwar]

Maybe it is time to let ST die for a while.  While I watch Enterprise every week they run a new episode, TNG had a very long run, and it is quite stale.  It looks as if they are trying to have fun with "the Birth of the Federation," and they do not seem to have the aversion to the SFB storyline like the rest of ST, (TOS not included).  I should mention that they do have an aversion to following the TOS storyline.  At least, "the Birth of the Orion Pirates" is well on track.  The whole "non-trekiness" of SFB can be linked with the ST aversion to following TOS.  SFB had it so right, and thus, completely wrong.

Ya Know, the Enterprise never fired a single photo torpedo in TOS?  We all assume it did, but listen to the dialog, they always said "phasers," no matter what came out the buisness end.  Isn't ST funny?  

[vsfedwards]

dude whats a photo torpedo? i dont think thats been used in any st series or film  hehe  

[ActiveX]

Kirk never had Magic Photons?!?

Time for Magic Phasers!