Topic: OP+ shiplist 2.2 now up!

[Holocat]

How about:

  The first installer install OP+, and the *structure* needed to add models, ie, the directory trick that's being talked about here.

  The second installer not install OP+, but just the models that will be produced to support OP+, meaning that it would fill the structure created by the first installer.  So long as the default models in use now match up in size to the models that replace them, I'm hoping that the siz file won't have to be adversely affected.

Other than HD size requirements expanding, this should allow peaceful intergration of OP+, OP+ with models, maintain the newfound ease of installation, and allow them both to play on the same dynaverse/gsa without problem.

A simple suggestion,

Holocat.

[Cleaven]

That suits me. All I want is a couple of models to differentiate the Romulan Kestrels from the Klingon ships.  

[FireSoul]

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1- The current shiplist kit is around 250kb. Modem users LOVE that. I intend to maintain support to these users. That means I will probably have 2 downloadables.

That's why I was pushing for just copying the existing folders and leaving it up to modders to work with or not.  Only 1 download needed, then, and it would still be small.

I wouldn't want to see 2 downloads of different shiplists (one with new models, one without).

Just let me do my stuff.

There's going to be 2 downloadables.. and the two will have EXACTLY the same shiplist.txt, etc.. and will be fully compatible to each other. Yes, the small one would be copying Models files from the current SFC stuff to compensate.

This is already happening, so please don't try to convince me otherwise.  

[FireSoul]

Quote:
How about:

  The first installer install OP+, and the *structure* needed to add models, ie, the directory trick that's being talked about here.

  The second installer not install OP+, but just the models that will be produced to support OP+, meaning that it would fill the structure created by the first installer.  So long as the default models in use now match up in size to the models that replace them, I'm hoping that the siz file won't have to be adversely affected.

Other than HD size requirements expanding, this should allow peaceful intergration of OP+, OP+ with models, maintain the newfound ease of installation, and allow them both to play on the same dynaverse/gsa without problem.

A simple suggestion,

Holocat.  

Hey Holo..
.. I have the installers already figured out... and working.  

[FireSoul]

Quote:
That suits me. All I want is a couple of models to differentiate the Romulan Kestrels from the Klingon ships.  

Elaborate?

[Holocat]

I should type my replies faster next time.  

Ah well.  Since Emerald Edge is picking up the ball on this, i've offered my support.  That comment about 'cruisers with boxes behind them' isn't in reference to my unfinished version of that tug is it?  

Ah well.  His is better anyway.  

Will replacing textures be a problem for multiplayer capability?  I'll probably have to do this to save some processor time if I get the yet-to-come model pack for OP+.


The-cat-who-is-slow-on-the-uptake-today,

Holocat.

[FireSoul]

Quote:
I should type my replies faster next time.  
Ah well.  Since Emerald Edge is picking up the ball on this, i've offered my support.  That comment about 'cruisers with boxes behind them' isn't in reference to my unfinished version of that tug is it?  

I found your work good.. don't worry.
.. although the Gorn ship isn't applicable to me anymore since I've switched their looks completely. :P~

Quote:

Will replacing textures be a problem for multiplayer capability?  I'll probably have to do this to save some processor time if I get the yet-to-come model pack for OP+.

It shouldn't. Models are loaded at mission-start.

[Holocat]

You switched out all the gorn models?

*THUD*

The-cat-who-has-been-given-a-lurid-hint-at-what-is-to-come,

Holocat.

[FireSoul]

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You switched out all the gorn models?

*THUD*

The-cat-who-has-been-given-a-lurid-hint-at-what-is-to-come,

Holocat.  

 Gorn Heavy Cruiser  

[Holocat]

For the sake of my videocard's sanity, does anyone know how many polys a standard taldren G-CA is?

pawing at the wave of OP+ future,

Holocat.
 

[EmeraldEdge]

Quote:
That comment about 'cruisers with boxes behind them' isn't in reference to my unfinished version of that tug is it?

 I doubt it, has Doug seen your work?  I don't seem to recall seeing it before, but perhaps I just don't remember.  I think the comment was generally in reference to the way the "standard" tugs tend to drop a pod beneath and slightly behind and then additional pods behind even that, so it looks like they are streaming pods out the back.  At least that's what I took from that comment.

OH, those gorn!  I love those so much, I need to download them again in case anything happens to them.  They are about as close to perfection as can be, imo.  

[FireSoul]

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OH, those gorn!  I love those so much, I need to download them again in case anything happens to them.  They are about as close to perfection as can be, imo.  

You're telling me! .. I mirrored that site. You know, just in case.
.. and if you can make a tug based on those, I will help you with any details you may want. Of course, you'll have to contact the author(s) there to tell them you used his/her/their material..

Btw, I am considering a few ships from Fleetdock 13 also.. notably the D5s. With these, I can cover for the D5s, D5Hs (LTT), D5Ws (NCAs), and Romulan versions of the previous. I am pleased with the results there.

Also, a little bit of model.siz magic: use the same model 3 times, but copied to different directories. All would have identical content, but different filenames. What am I talking about?!?

Here's the extract of model.siz:
ASSETS\MODELS\RCA\RCA.MOD   8.10
ASSETS\MODELS\RCA\RCA_BRK.MOD   8.07
..
OPPLUS\MODELS\RKR\RKR.MOD   7.50
OPPLUS\MODELS\RKR\RKR_BRK.MOD   7.50
OPPLUS\MODELS\RKRC\RKRC.MOD   9.00
OPPLUS\MODELS\RKRC\RKRC_BRK.MOD   9.00

The RCA's the original Taldren model. It's the Romulan Klingon CA hull conversion. It covers all RCA variants, from the KR to the KCR. .. what I did is simply have it copied to a new set of directories, and gave the new models different sizes by stating the wanted size in 'models.siz'. I made sure the sizes matched ships of same size elsewhere in shiplist. A K-D6 is same size as a Y-D6 and a R-KR.
.. Don't you see? The ships using the RKR model are now just slightly smaller than the standard RCA ones. Also, the RKCR ships are just slightly larger.

.. the possibilities are interesting. I could have different sized-classes using same models data. I think the G2s, E3s and E4s are next. The Bird of Prey model is nicer than others I've seen for these ships, so having different sized BoPs works nicely.

-- Luc

PS. No, I am not including Taldren raw material. The installer's copying them from Assets/Models/ and manipulating them at install time. But whatever the method, the result's nice.

[FireSoul]

In order, from left to right: KR, K7R and KCR .. in a family gathering, of sorts.
The sizes aren't that noticeable, but look again: compare the KR (left) with the KCR (right)

   

[feargusf]

Just to add a little note of praise, FireSoul, you are a godsend! What you have done for this game already is a tremendous boon. Everythig just feels so right with all of the resources that you have available at your site. The "Gold Standard" version of OP is now, IMO, 2.5.4.10 with the EAW campaigns, the Evil Dave Missions, and the OP+ 2.2 shiplist. For you to go further and add models to break up some of the visual gaps that remain is almost too much to even hope for. This game now feels complete, it has become the great expansion to EAW that it always should have been. Thank you for your continued efforts to make something that was already great into something truly spectacular.

BTW, there's a shy little kid inside of me that just loves the fact that, if I so desire, I can fly an R-SEX now.  

[FireSoul]

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BTW, there's a shy little kid inside of me that just loves the fact that, if I so desire, I can fly an R-SEX now.  

.. heh.. is she too young to understand that there's also a R-SUK?

[jdmckinney]

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Quote:
That comment about 'cruisers with boxes behind them' isn't in reference to my unfinished version of that tug is it?

 I doubt it, has Doug seen your work?  I don't seem to recall seeing it before, but perhaps I just don't remember.  I think the comment was generally in reference to the way the "standard" tugs tend to drop a pod beneath and slightly behind and then additional pods behind even that, so it looks like they are streaming pods out the back.  At least that's what I took from that comment.

Yes, I'm specifically talking about SFB tugs as pictured in ADB's publications. I am not much of a model collector, so I haven't seen 90+% of what's out there, and in fact the last time I went looking for tugs, there weren't more than a handful available among all the races.

[IndyShark]

Firesoul, I love what you have done to the Pirates! They have some nice ships now and with engine doubling, I can see people flying them once in a while.

 

[dderidex]

Think I'll wait for this next update, then, before replacing my shiplist.

Looks good.

Here's hoping I can still use the 'D2 Model pack' (all those FASA ships) to replace models with without any problems!

Nice work - and the Gorn, especially.  I wasn't looking forward to having to replace all those ships myself!  

[FireSoul]

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Firesoul, I love what you have done to the Pirates! They have some nice ships now and with engine doubling, I can see people flying them once in a while.
 

Just better variants with weapons.. They've been there for a while.
.. with AI engine doubling, it makes them challenging opponents too.

[FireSoul]

Quote:
Think I'll wait for this next update, then, before replacing my shiplist.
Looks good.
Here's hoping I can still use the 'D2 Model pack' (all those FASA ships) to replace models with without any problems!
Nice work - and the Gorn, especially.  I wasn't looking forward to having to replace all those ships myself!  

I won't necessarily be using FASA ships.. (or most probably not, actually).. but it will make it much easier for you to plug them in without triggering cheat-detection errors. Just don't touch the model.siz file and shiplist.txt file with the next release.

.. but the release needs time to complete.
-- Luc